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I don't think anyone is saying tobacco farming isn't an honest living. We're talking about spiritual shoulds, not legal cans. And yeah, I'm also having a hard time figuring out why you're not getting that mormons would have an issue with a mormon growing tobacco. True story: I was assigned to go home teach a guy who was sort of hard to find at church. He came mainly because his wife wanted him to. As we got to know him, we found out that he had been rather turned off church due to a bad experience involving a bunch of people passionately arguing at each other about some fringe point of contentious doctrine. But he did love his wife, so he was trying to make church work. He let us know a buddy was offering him an opportunity to own a bar, and wanted to know what we thought of that. I told him that bar or no bar, he and his wife were welcome to sit with my family at church. He might have a hard time getting a temple recommend, but ultimately, it was up to each of us to choose the roads that life presented us, and all I would do was ask him to think about what choices God wanted him to make. He didn't buy the bar, and did several years as a temple worker with his wife. We've become good friends. He's had many spiritual ups and downs, but even at his low points he tells me he made the right choice.

I hope you realize all your questions, at least most of them, can be turned toward the member and not the bishop as well? 1) Why isn't their a standardized training for members on how to approach leadership with difficult situations? (Because it seems to me that "too often" members use counterproductive and non-Christian methods to talk to the bishop) 2) As members, we all represent Christ (Baptismal covenant), and we should all be people who we can trust. The bishop should be able to trust you the same way you expect trust from him. 3) I don't know of any members in the congregation who are required to learn ways of effective communication with leaders. 4) For instance, there appears to be a tendency for members to blame the bishop's or stake presidents for lack of good communication, then to come in with acceptance and respect of the office they are visiting. 5) With how many different opinions there are as to what is right and wrong communication and how to treat people, the leaders aren't going to get it right every single time. How do you know the bishop hasn't been reading books on good communication, tries it, and the member is still upset? 6) Yes, why aren't members required to take a course on how to communicate with leaders, which will help them to communicate with people who are there to "help" with our final judgement? In all my experiences in speaking with leaders (bishops and stake presidents) I only had one unfortunate encounter. My percentage of bad encounters would be below 5%. Since that bad encounter, I have never experienced another. I have also experienced the same people having issues constantly with leaders. The bishop's monthly, will typically meet with the stake president for training. What would be nice is if we all exercised more faith, hope, and charity toward those who serve us and those we serve.

My bishop is awesome... In fact in all my 40+ years (and possibly a hundred bishops [No I do not know the number other then alot]) I have no recollection of a "bad" bishop.

Unless you're thousands of flies on the walls of thousands of bishops all over the world, I suspect you are projecting and assuming things which aren't warranted. If we were to look at the numbers (which no one is collecting, and therefore no one knows), we'd probably find that for every person who has a complaint about their bishop, there are 500+ people who don't have a complaint about their bishop. But if one were to go listening to / reading various complaints about bishops, or if one had their own complaint about a bishop, one would probably come away with a skewed idea of those numbers because people who don't complain about their bishop don't generally share their non-complaints, and people with complaints tend to think their experience is the normal one (and that they're in the right and the other party is to blame). Therefore, I would like to share my non-complaint - my bishop is fabulous; a better person than I am, by far. And like normal humans, I'm going to assume that all my fellow ward members except one or two, also think our bishop is fabulous!

I'm just an investigator so I dont really know what I'm talking about LOL, but when I read D&C 89 I decided to try my best to live it. I eat a small amount of meat once a week (some weeks not at all) and I try to eat all whole grains where possible (brown stuff not white) I also dont eat chocolate or drink soda anymore (I'm terrified of putting any caffeine in my body), I also gave up sugar because I was addicted to it, I don't know if I'm doing it right but I can tell you, I feel the healthiest I ever have and I've lost about 8 kilograms so I'm pretty happy with the health code put forward by Joseph Smith

Hey Grunt, I'm an investigator just like you! I've questioned just about everything! Keep researching fairmormon is a great place to go with questions. One of the best videos I have seen that actually answers the hard questions in a way that no one can argue with is on youtube (even the mainstream christian admits at the end that he can't disagree with any of Pauls points of view). It's an interview of a LDS man Paul Gregersen, I know it will help your testimony if you watch it, he is so well educated, an absolute credit to the LDS church. Here's the link for part one (I think there are 12 or 13 in all - I've watched it so many times - its truly amazing) Anyway I hope it helps you. Blossom

A few years ago on the Catholic Answers Forum he and I had quite a few debates about the Book of Mormon and the LDS church. He told me on that forum that he had decided to come back to church. This was a complete shock to me. We had a few conversations and then I didn't here much until Elder Uchdorf's talk. Right after his talk I sent him an email telling him that it sounded very similar to his story. He wrote me right back and confirmed that it was about him. He is a testament to me that anyone can come back to the church.

My concern is not about some non-member that grows tobacco – my concern is someone that criticizes someone that has not yet made any covenant with G-d concerning how their money is made and then themselves think themselves better off because they have made a covenant – that is broken with what they see or think of as minor infractions of that covenant that is much less then growing tobacco. As an additional note – I was working (some years back) for an automation and robotics company that sent me as their employee to a Philip Morris tobacco processing plant to help them make more money creating tobacco products. I had a long discussion with my bishop and was (in essence) counseled to keep my job, continue to support my family, pay my bills and continue to pay my tithing. I took every opportunity to let our customer know I was not happy with their product. Also my bishop was well aware that I was paying tithing on money made from the tobacco industry - not a penny was rejected and given back to me. The Traveler

:: shakes head :: go back and re-read until you catch on - it's not about whether he chooses to grow tobacco; it's not about how much money he does or does not make growing tobacco; it's about saying that "more money" justifies the choice to grow tobacco. If you cannot distinguish between those three things, then just agree that you don't understand the point I'm making.

Thank you for this! I watched part one and I'll go look for the others later.

Yes. They can be handy for specific savings goals.

Back a decade ago, we used to pay attention to interest, because it existed. Around 2008 banks kind of stopped offering much in the way of interest-bearing accounts. But that's slowly changing as we're emerging from recessions and qualitative easing and whatnot, and the economy is starting to grow more, and inflation is picking up a bit. So short answer, yes, there are many such things, and they're starting to make a comeback. http://www.bankrate.com/cd.aspx - looks like a 5 year CD is paying upwards of 2.4%. Bank savings accounts are maybe 1.3%. Haven't seen stuff like that in a decade. As Godless said, CD's are good if you want better interest than a bank account, and you don't need the money. Back 20 years ago, I had CD's paying 5%. Maybe we'll see stuff like that again in the next 3-5 years.

Are you trying to tell me you don't see how LDS would view another LDS selling tobacco as not making an honest living? *smh*

Interesting. Thank you for sharing. I think Pres. Eyring is such a humble man.

I would just like to clarify, in case the court thing gets misconstrued, that I have always been a member in good standing, no problems and a member of society in good standing, always too.

I assume my state of opposition is the generalization of "many" and "too often" toward bishops. Yes, there are cases where members are kind, seeking to be meek and humble, trying to be understood and their bishop/stake president doesn't respond very kindly. There are just as many cases, if not more, where the bishop is being kind, meek, honoring the Lord and his prophets through Handbook guidance, and the members take them wrong. I would venture to say, less than 5% of ALL the one-on-one meetings bishops have with members do not end well. Out of the 50 or more interviews in a month, only 1-3 didn't go as well as both thought it would. So, we would have disagreement regarding this being a problem; however, would additional training and insight on communication skills be beneficial. Sure, we all could use better social and communication skills. In some cases, I can also see members being more judgemental toward a bishop knowing what training he has received. I can hear the gossip wheel now, "Oh my, you know bishop said this! Yes, he did! AND he even had training on how to be a good communicator." This is why I shared as my last statement, "What would be nice is if we all exercised more faith, hope, and charity toward those who serve us and those we serve."

Even if you are honest and it seems the counselor is sometimes not seeming to be. I think it would be harder to judge appropriately with all the information going against each other. I guess it will all work out, and of course prayer, scripture study, etc help people to have a more hopeful reason for a fair outcome. I guess I've seen or heard and experienced too many earthly judges, in and out of the church (not that I have ever needed court for anything, but others have) to wonder how its going to be so different. And how everyone communicates is so vital. I think everyone involved to judge especially, needs to have skills that don't cause an unnecessary problem for the person being judged, where they may have to end up in a lower kingdom because they feel they can't speak up for themselve, that it won't do any good, and that they are being mistreated and or misunderstood. Of course our memory will be better there, and we will be able to remember all things that we may forget at times now. I guess it will be fair in the Lord's eyes.

I have had wonderful bishops, mission president, state presidents and other leaders too. I don't think if a bishop or a member makes a "mistake" that that makes them a "bad" bishop or a "bad" member. I just want to clarify here. It seems that if a person says something on one side of a spectrum (ex. a bad experience with a bishop) than it is assumed , perhaps, that they would label their bishop as "bad". I don't think that is a good thing to do. And that's not what I meant. But I do think we should have sympathy for anyone, be he or she a bishop, a RS Pres, a regular member who has had an unpleasant encounter that he or she didn't see coming. I think a counseling session can often have some good moments of respect both ways, even if there is a "glitch" in part of it. We are all human. It s just that leaders have a sacred obligation, even more noticeable to others, than others do. (even though members also have an obligation too) I just think it is good when the church upholds that standard for leaders to assist them in leading in righteousness. I am not trying to take away or lessen any responsibility a member has. Its just that a member may be feeling vulnerable and is going in for help, whereas hopefully, the leader is feeling ready to help at that moment. I do appreciate my bishop and current and past leaders. They have helped me & my family in many ways. Sometimes we just have to forgive, forget, pray, and move on.

Maureen, you are on an LDS board and you already know the answer to this. Give it a rest.

Dear @jewels8. Hi there! Are you having a tough time? Do you want to share? Hugs! Thinking of you....

Previous posters already great answers to this. Again, the key is respect and communication. You need to be all-for-nothing-right-now. In fact, as a person in an interfaith marriage I would highly advise against that. You're both part of this marriage, and you need to respect both faiths. I'll break this down into a few parts. You respecting him and his faith -- You need to love him as he IS, not as a potential Mormon. Do *not* bug him about reading the Book of Mormon or doing anything LDS-y. Respect his choice to be how he is now and love him now. If he chooses later chooses to read or participate, that's fantastic (trust me, I get that desire in my own marriage), but he needs to do it out of the desire of his own heart, not to make you happy. Him respecting your faith - He should indeed respect your faith and by no means forbid *you* from attending or reading or anything else. You have the right to follow Christ as your heart desires. The kids are another conversation. Aunt / Uncle -- they sound great! I'm so happy they've supported you thus far in your marriage. True family love is not based just on a person's faith, and you can indeed continue to embrace them and love them in your life, regardless of which faith path you take. Regardless of your faith path, you can continue to invite them over, go swimming, and have a great time. Same with rest of the family (yours and his). Don't make this about "going to my church is supporting my family and going to yours is supporting your family". Family is family, regardless of faith.

Turtle, I'm not LDS, but I attend an LDS church with my family. Has your husband been to an LDS church? If you're asking him to convert, that is a mistake in my opinion. Just ask him to support you. He doesn't NEED to believe LDS is the true church. It doesn't matter. He can worship in his way AT LDS church. Start small. What time is his church? If they aren't at the same time, ask if you can go to both. Don't make him sit through Principles and Priesthood. Ask if you can go, attend Sacrament, then leave. He can participate in Sacrament. He can even call it communion if he wants. He can do what my family does is not participate in Sacrament. Nobody in my ward says a thing to me. If his service is the same time as Sacrament, ask if you can split the times. One day a month go to Sacrament. Get your children involved in mutual (maybe? I'm not sure what that is, honestly). Ask him to help with service projects. These are all ways you can participate in LDS and still respect his belief. This shouldn't be a "one or the other" scenario. It should be an opportunity for mutual respect and support. Compromise.

Howdy! I am also Mormon lady married to an Evangelical guy. We have a great family, beautiful daughter, and this has been the happiest 5 years of my life. This biggest thing in any marriage is to have mutual respect and communication. That applies just as much to inter-faith marriages. Have you tried communicating with your husband about the emptiness you're feeling? Have you asked him what his specific concerns with you attending LDS church?

I agree with both mdfxmd and my two cents: You can't expect a spouse to be ok with a 180 degree turn after after 12 years. If the situation were reversed and you both were attending the Mormon church for 12 years and he suddenly told you he didn't want to go anymore and wasn't going to - I'm sure that would be a huge upheaval in your life (and honestly, many many marriages have broken up over such). So while it's unrealistic to suddenly turn the table on your spouse and children after 12 years when they are happy where they are; this is where I agree with my two cents. You certainly can attend both. My friend has a similar compromise in her family. It works out very well for the most part and they've been married now for about 24 (?) years.

Hmmm. I think I don't quite agree with either of the first two answers. On the one hand, your marriage is sacred, and you are duty-bound to protect it. You have gone along for over a decade, so you can't expect your husband to be happy with you changing course midstream. On the other hand, one's conscience is sacrosanct; any loving spouse understands that and ultimately must support the exercise of it. I think you proceed with much caution, but proceed nonetheless. Help your husband to understand that this is a matter of conscience, of you doing what you deeply feel is right. I don't know, this is tricky territory. Be gentle and loving, but do what your heart tells you is right. That's my advice.

It is a matter of how we see others. My entire life I have been amazed what individuals will do when what they make or can make is on the line. I have a good friend that is a doctor and I am very amazed at the compromises he is forced into every day for his practice and salary. I know another doctor that has moved his practice to Mexico because of what the laws of this country were forcing on him. As an engineer, I helped design and build curse missiles (among other things) for which I was paid much more than the tobacco farmer. Also, it is interesting how much manual labor is required to grow tobacco. Is it better to labor or to be on welfare handouts? It would seem that regardless of what we do – we could have done something better – or there is something that would have been much worse. We can always justify or condemn others on the basis that there are better or worse things. What I am suggesting is that we turn this concept upside down. Consider what we will for ourselves – but for others – think not so much on where they have been or even where they are – but on where they can go and what they can become. That is how we should judge others and how we should encourage them. The Traveler

Those that serve in the military do not make very much – at least I didn’t while I served during the Vietnam era – I made more on the side while serving in the military than what I was paid to carry a M14. As a side note – I have recently read several articles about good LDS kids coming home early from their missions because of depression. When I was called on a mission, I had already served in the military – some of the young men I served with were baptized – some were contemplating baptism and were killed in Vietnam. I faced difficulties on my mission but nothing like the difficulties of serving in the military. My mission was easy. For me – loving others is not so difficult – for me trust is what is what is hard to come by. I can love my neighbor – but trusting anyone is a challenge – especially when they have not yet proven themselves loyal. With this in mind – I am concerned – everyday – if G-d and my neighbor can trust me. President McKay said, “It is a greater honor to be trusted than to be loved.” The Traveler

I do not disagree - What you would do for your best friend or only child – you should do for everyone. Of course, we should not encourage anyone to commit sins but rather to repent and be baptized. What amounts to encouraging someone to repent and be baptized? I personally try to avoid making a list because what is necessary for a certain lost sheep may not follow conventional wisdom – as per what Isaiah looked for in marriage. The Traveler

It is my opinion that anyone that wants a relationship with G-d deserves my assistance. I believe that I am under covenant to do so. Part of my covenant requires me to encourage others to discipline themselves and live by covenant with G-d. Some think that “Christians” should not provide services for a LGBT community event – I am of the other mind – I believe anyone that comes to a believer of Christ – we should accommodate them as we would anyone and everyone else – standing as a witness of Christ. And as long as they are open to us and what we believe we should be open to them. I really do not believe that the LGBT community intends add profit to any business they do not believe support their lifestyle. So, if they come to me I will help. If they do not want my help – then they can choose who they will associate with. One point I would make. It is my experience that anyone with gender confusion that seeks a relationship with G-d will be cut off by those that support gender confusion. If they cannot find friends among the disciples of Christ and are treated instead with scorn – where will they turn and who will treat them with love and kindness? Their old friends will likely wish them dead and accuse them of all kinds of things – their only choice will be to commit suicide or return to old ways and forget trying anything else. The Traveler

It's hard to address specific problems one might have with any aspect of any given thing without the specific details of what's being struggled with. That being said, here's the dealio: And I suspect this is the same-ish answer you've gotten from the missionaries. There is only one way to know if the Book of Mormon is true or not. Only one way to know if Joseph Smith was a prophet. And that will not be answers by others. Any specific details can be explained. But not proven. Criticisms can be randomly leveled as well, but also not proven. None of the explanations by apologists and none of the accusations by critics have any bearing on the truthfulness of what comes down to the miraculous. Nothing that is a part of the Joseph Smith story and the coming forth of the Book of Mormon is beyond God's power. Some aspect or another may strike someone as odd or implausible -- but God has often worked in mysterious ways, and many of the Biblical stories are odd and sound implausible as well. But only God can reveal God. So the only way one can know for certain that the Book of Mormon is the word of God is by asking God. So how I reconcile any issues that strike me as difficult in any religious experience is by starting from a place of first finding out the truth of it from God, by doing as He has said we can, and asking Him, whereupon He gives liberally to those who ask. If one knows the Book of Mormon is the word of God because the Holy Spirit has told one so, then one can easily reconcile any concerning problems with that as a starting point. Read the Book of Mormon and then get on your knees and humbly ask God if it is true. He will answer you. The rest is just historical detail...which is sometimes unreliable, always imperfect, and heavily based on the bias of the reporter. But God has no bias, no imperfection and is perfectly reliable. Go to Him and ask.

Well, we tried swatting one on the nose with a rolled up newspaper, but eventually he hid all the newspapers and still wears jeans to Sacrament Meeting. And since most of them have opposable thumbs, they just take the shock collars off.