MobyMule

I think you are right with that. Again this comes down to just like any other issue someone might disagree with the Church its about how that person shows that disagreement. If they actively try to bring members to their way of thinking and go against the Church it will always be some sort of discipline there( ie. loss of recommend, probation etc..)

Well I can kinda see that rationale but being a Southern Baptist growing up I don't buy it. I still don't see why it would not work. It is common sense and simple. It allows the individual Churches to govern marriage in their churches and like I said just about all Christian churches have some form of good/bad standing and so forth.

Actively campaigning against the Church stance and trying to persuade other members from their beliefs. Opinions are one thing. Even voting against prop 8 I don't think would constitute not giving a recommend but actively fighting against the will of the brethren will almost always get you in hot water and probable loss of recommend/discipline. Again this isn't just disagreement. We are talking teaching and persuading other members to go against what the Church is fighting for. Again this issue isn't about equal rights. Sadly the way our current system(marriage in the states) is set up is a lose-lose situation imho. I think members feel sympathy for the equal right issue and it isn't without merit but this issue is deeper than that. It is about the Institution of Marriage. The Church has an obligation to fight for that and is doing so in the bounds of the current system. Hopefully we can have a day where the Institution of Marriage is protected but everyone can have equal rights under the law in their contractual state relationships(whatever that may be).

LOL. Yeah we just have to remember that we need to love everyone and just agree to disagree and not get nasty or uncivil. We are all so unperfect in vey many different ways.

I think if someone is actively going against the Church on this issue then there is a possibility a recommend could be denied. To me the simplest solution to all this is all states change all "marriage" contracts to civil unions. Allow any 2 adults to enter into this contract for legal purposes of property etc. Let the individual Churches decide on who they will recognize who is married for various church ordinances and so forth and to remain in good standing. But then we get to the heart of the matter. A civil union isn't good enough now is it. We have to say Marriage for gays and lesbians because that will make them feel better and on equal standing in their eyes with straits in their relationship with God. This isn't really about equal rights when you get down to it. It's about trying to downgrade the Instituion of Marriage to a worldy standard so that others can feel good about their lifestyles. Of couse this encompasses other deviant behaviors and I think we all fight with this in our own lives with various weaknesses we have. Don't we all try to rationalize our sins at some point and try to downplay how serious they really are before God. Which can turn into us trying to campaign that weakness into being ok.

May the Lord bless you.

Yes it can be done. And yes the adult getting sealed must be endowed and have a temple recommend. This falls under pretty much the standard things for proxy sealings. Same procedure except the parents don't have to be sealed together first.

LOL I stand corrected. Never said I couldn't be wrong. It has been known to happen.

Yeah I know when I joined the church is wasn't said you couldn't but more of counsel to be careful because of the difference of culture and what the children from that union may have to endure. Now I think in some areas it is wise counsel because the backward thinking of some is still around in parts of the country. But good thing people have freedom and attitudes are changing. Again this is a matter of personal revelation. Get good advice and counsel then go the Lord after you have pondered it. An answer will come just be humble and patient.

If he is a ward clerk he doesn't have Book 1 with those policies. Only Bishops and SP do. And no the former spouse doesn't have to be deceased for a man to be sealed to another woman he has to apply for a sealing clearance though to the First Presidency. Usually this happens when a man is divorced to a former sealed spouse. It is a pretty involved process of interviews, letters from the ex-spouse and man seeking clearance. Goes to Stake President then onto the First Presidency. Sometimes it takes a few months sometimes alot longer depending on the issues involved. Now when a man or woman is deceased they can be sealed to everyone whom they were civily married. Since this may be the only way children can get the blessings of that ordinance. The policies are good and work. The thing to remember here is that all the what if's and different scneario's will get worked out before the Judgement. Of that I have no doubt.

Which is what I think everyone is trying to get them to do together. The only way she will be taught is to put herself in a position to feel the spirit and be taught. There is no doubt truth in what you say. I agree principles and doctrine are what bring change to people's lives. I just think that in order for them to open up to it they must feel love from those teaching. You can be loving and compassionate and hold true to the doctrine at the same time. That being said we have all had the occasion where people just will not accept it for whatever reason at that time. We don't know the heart of those people. All we can do is still love them and teach at the same time and pray the spirit will touch them if they will just open up to it. MoE I do apologize if I came across as being negative about leaders. That was not my intention. I have the utmost respect for those that serve. It is truly a sacrifice and a commitement to do so whatever that calling is. We are blessed by so many who are willing to do the will of the Lord instead of their own.

I agree with you. I think what your gf is feeling is natural and she should be looked on with compassion. Which is why I shared with you my experience. As I said you will do better by praying about it as a couple and learning to feel the spirit together as a couple. As a couple go to your leaders and be specific with your issues. Let them know you are working to have the spirit to be with you. No person here or church leader can recieve personal revelation for you. Only you can recieve that. And as a a couple your both can know what the Lord would have you do. Do the things to bring that into your life together as partners.

I apologize and yes I believe a joint appt. with the Bishop/SP would be appropriate.

Maybe I don't but the issue is can a Man request a Sealing Cancellation. I see nothing on page 85 of the CHI that indicate he can not. In fact it appears to me to be at the discretion of the SP and Bishop. The only clear instruction is for a sealing to take place there must be a clearance for a man and a cancellation for a woman. No mention that a cancellation for the man can not be done. I will print the form out Wednesday night and read the instructions again to see what the fine print says since I don't have that with me. Again I think it is wrong to state for a fact that a man can't request it. Nothing says a request can't be made. Of couse the clearance is first. I will double check but again If I was wrong in the 2 cases I have been apart of then It wouldn't have got past my SP. He interviewed and looked at the application of these brethern.

You can guys can call me wrong all you want. I'm fine with it. I'm only letting you know that it has been approved. These things go to way above me. If it was not allowed they would not be granted. But they were. Again I'm not saying it's normal or regular. I'm just saying that it isn't a procedure that is prohibited. Again it takes alot of evidence of transgression. If that is this mans situation I was just sharing my experience with him. Whether or not his local leaders will allow him to even request it is not my decison.

And I'm saying that it isn't prohibited. It has been done. I do instruct what the Handbook says. If they ask if they can get one I say for them to ask the SP or request it. Why would the Church approve a Man's request if it wasn't allowed? What I'm saying is it allowed maybe it isn't a normal procedure but like I said earlier unless there was major trangression involed by the woman it won't be granted. If it was not allowed at all it would state it.

No because I have seen it and it has been approved. I'm saying it doesn't deny a Man from doing it. It is not prohibited. I am currently serving as the Man's Bishop and did the paperwork.

Well I know for a fact in our Stake I've had 3 men get cancellations. They requested it. On the form or in the handbook it does not deny that to a Man. I feel like your Bishop and SP need to read the instructions instead of going by tradition. But that is just me. That being said if there were not major trangressions that led to the divorce it won't be granted.

Sealing clearance has been reported acurately. Cancellation can be requested by either party. Man or Woman. Doesn't matter. And yes for there to be approval for a Cancellation some type of major wrongdoing must have had taken place such as previously mentioned. I've done both and you still have to get the ex-spouse to write a letter about their feelings toward the other one and their feelings about the request in either circumstance. It sometimes is not a pleasant thing to administer. All I can tell the brother is to go to Heavenly Father in prayer individually and as a couple. Also speak to your Bishop. He will have the forms and all the info you need. Let the spirit guide here. As a couple you will need to learn how to feel it together anyway. This is just a precursor into all those other big decisons you will have to make when your married. And yes the children are not affected. They are still sealed to the parents.

Correct. Tempatation and your tendancies doesn't equate sin. Action on them does. But even then it is not the end of the world. The Atonement surely is a miracle for us all. Strait/Gay it all comes down to learning to do the will of the Lord over our own will/desires. Sexual tendancies to break the law of chasity it just as strong in everyone regardless of their sexual oreintation. Lords will or our own. Whom truly do we serve?

True and also please remember it isn't death strait to Judgement. There is alot that will happen in between. I promise that anyone who is faithful will find all the happiness they ever hoped/dreamed of during the millennial reign. All things will be made perfect by Christ who will oversee the work personally in preparation of the Judgement. All of these what if's and all these uncomprehendable situations will be resolved to everyones satisfaction. The question comes down to do you have faith/trust in the Lord or in yourself to know better.

Bishop. The most rewarding and the most challenging call I've ever had.

I give ours the same amount and primary more. On fundrasiers it is only for camps. Girls camp or scout camp. That includes the cost of the camp and possibly supplies needed for said camp. I wouldn't consider Youth Conference a camp.

Also I think that the interview itself is the best place to let the leaders and the person being called all the info that affects the calling. Being honest about situations, current trials and expectations curbs issues that may arise.