beefche

Really, Hemidakota? Our bishop conducted a 5th Sunday meeting and did some "housecleaning" so to speak. He talked on a variety of subjects, but one thing I remember was he instructing the ward that only baptized members should bear testimony. He asked that parents help their children to understand this and asked the full time missionaries to assist their investigators. That said, we had small children and investigators get up and bear testimony and the bishop did not publically do anything about it (I don't know if he said anything privately to anyone). I thought he said it was in the CHI, but hey, I've been wrong before. Not often, but it happens.

A couple of thoughts. First, I believe the CHI teaches us that only baptized members of the church should bear testimony. Again, it should be up to the bishop on whether to follow that to the letter or not. So, children who are not baptized shouldn't be testifying in sacrament meeting--they have ample opportunity in Primary and at home. And what better place than in the home to learn how to bear a testimony! Secondly, for anyone--children, adults, converts, life time members, etc.--it is difficult to get up in front of others and speak. Some get very nervous and can only ramble. Others can only repeat oft heard lines. Still others can only stammer. I, again, am reminded that we are all on a spiritual journey. I remember one sister who was a recent convert. She got up to bear testimony and went no further than introducing herself. All she could do was cry. After 2 minutes of watching her try to compose herself and fail, she stated, "In the name of Jesus Christ, amen." For her, she bore a firm and strong testimony. Some wriggled uncomfortably in their seat. Others cried with her. Did she bear testimony? I think so. Although no real words were spoken, she allowed us to see the feelings of her heart. That took courage. Should it be the standard? Nope, but again, if directed by the Spirit, something like that can be powerful.

Well, of course you are entitled to your opinion and we can't very well judge you for that. Wait....we are on a public forum which means OF COURSE we can judge you. I understand what you're saying, but I also think someone can become more attractive to us as we get to know them. I always think of the geeky boy I knew in high school with whom I was friends. He was not someone considered attractive and I certainly didn't think of him in those terms. I just enjoyed being around him. As time went on and I got to know him better, he became more and more physically attractive to me. Taught me a lesson that physical attraction does not have to be a "love at first sight" type of feeling--at least for me.

So, what are you trying to say? That because we are ruled by emotions that we cannot/won't use reason? I think at some point, we all have to grow up (about a lot of things). When it comes to dating, I think we all need to tone down our want list. I remember when I was a lot younger, my list of requirements for a husband included some of the dumbest things--must be able to sing, court me with romantic words, have blue eyes, etc. Pluh-leeze. That is just dumb and immature on my part. As I've gotten older, I realized how shallow and narrow minded that was. I am of the opinion that you should always have a 2nd date (unless the 1st date was too horrendous; horrendous meaning some grievous error was committed). Why? Because all of us are nervous and unsure when we first go out with someone. I am not my complete self on a 1st date. Not even on a 2nd date, but at least I've gotten over the initial nervousness and can relax more.

There are some guidelines for bearing testimony in a formal setting. I use guidelines because as people have expressed, it should be guided by the Spirit. Having said that, I believe that most members (especially those who did not attend Primary or Mutual) don't know how to bear a testimony. Unfortunately, a lot of people do not have a venue to express themselves except for testimony meeting and take that opportunity to have the undivided attention of others. I am of the opinion that everyone is on a spiritual journey and some are further along than others. For this reason, whenever I think that someone is giving a travelogue or other long-winded story, I have to remind myself that 1) for them it is important to express themself in that way at that time and 2) if it was too inappropriate, then the bishop will bear the responsibility to take care of it.

<snort> Keep on keeping on.

One thing to keep in mind, when the bible was written, it wasn't compiled as we have it now. It was simply epistles and recordings placed together (sometimes). Furthermore, the Bible as we have it today, is not compiled into chronological order.

BTW, I don't think the Lord always waits for us to be ready for something in order for Him to reveal it. In particular I'm thinking of when Bro. Joseph introduced polygamy (please, please don't let this thread get into a polygamy discussion)--most people weren't ready to live that, but they lived it anyway.

Someone more experienced than I on this forum should post a poll for the LDS women. I'm curious on how many want to be ordained to the priesthood.

Think of all those muscles you'd build and the great conversation starter it would provide!

NormalMormon, is your basic question regarding why women do not/cannot have the priesthood? From my reading of this thread, I think all of your questions boil down to the perceived suppression of women by men (in the church). BTW, I used spell check just for you. I have a B.A., but informal forum typing makes me lazy sometimes.

The OP was taken from an article written by Orson Scott Card. You can read the full article yourself here. Form your own opinion what what Bro. Card is meaning to say.

Ok, I'll say it. I care about looks and money. Looks as in if they at least try to care about how they look. I'm not talking about looking like Brad Pitt, but rather not dressing in dirty, wrinkled clothes, combing or styling the hair, etc. Just caring for basic hygiene and outside appearance. Sorry, but stained white shirts at church just doesn't do it for me. I care about money in that I want to see him having/wanting a job that can support a family. Doesn't have to be rich, but if he is happy in his job and able to financially support a family (even in a small house with no cable :)) that would do for me. I just have a problem with someone who chooses to work at Walmart and not even try to find a better job. If he's working at Walmart and going to school to get more education for a better job, then that's a different story. I've worked hard in my career, yet I'm not wealthy and don't expect to marry someone wealthy. But I need financial security (as much as one can have in this day and age). Again, struggles happen to all of us--that's to be expected. But, I would also expect him to struggle to find a better job or to find a solution to the problem. I really think too many people have grown up to Disney over the years. Too many frogs looking for Prince Charming or "insert princess of choice--Ariel, Cinderella, Jasmine, etc."

I'm with you on this one, checkerboy. She's 17 y/o and needs guidance still. The parents have the right and responsibility to guide her and do what they can to help her. That isn't to say it won't be difficult and you can bet she's going to get made at anyone who she perceives "told" on her or even supports the parents in the decisions. Society is trying to take parental rights away more and more. It's a fine line for the parents to help and not push her into the boyfriend's arms. But that is their problem to fight and solve.

Can you please tell me who the trolls are? I don't like trolls......... Hey, LostOne, I had a friend who had to go through the same thing to get re-baptized. I know she kept in close contact with the Bishop and Stake President. Maybe you've already done this, but discuss your concerns with the bishop and possibly the stake president. Another suggestion is attend all the acitivties that you can. You serve 2 things with that one--first, you get to know other members and make friendships, and second, it allows to you to "active" and find opportunities where you can serve. My friend served in YW long before she was ever re-baptized. Never an official calling, but she helped out at most of the activities. Just some thoughts.

I don't understand what you mean by "have their children in this life." A sealing is not about possessions. I am a single woman who has never married. My parents are not members. I am not sealed to anyone. I know that being sealed to a family is essential for the highest level of CK and I am confident that the Lord has made provisions for me and others (like the OP). He knew that there were would be less than ideal situations happening in this life.

Tomk, the scriptures tell us it was a war. Perhaps not like the wars we see here on earth, but I believe it was a war. I looked up the meaning of "war" in the dictionary. It states that it's a conflict, contest, or active hostility or contention. IMO, that describes the war in the pre-mortal life. I imagine Satan and his followers were trying to persuade us to join them, to agree with them, to believe they were correct. I would imagine that their arguments and persuasions were like what is used here on earth--appealing to our intellect, power, passions. Some of us who chose Christ may have had conflicts and I imagine some missionary work on our side was going on as well. I would think Satan and his followers would be hostile when their efforts were being countered by Christ's followers. I do agree that Satan's leave may not have been dramatic. We are told that we cannot abide being in the presence of good when we have done sin/evil. Kind of the opposite of God--Who cannot abide sin. I'm thinking it was a mutual agreement for leave taking. You said something that is interesting. HF abides by laws. Satan was rebelling against living by a law(s). He wanted to ensure (force) everyone to accept HF plan--thus breaking the law of agency. (I suppose I always knew this, just didn't "know" it.)

That's so hard to imagine. I'm sure we lost many good friends because of this choice. It's hard to conceive that someone would make a conscious decision to rebel and lose any chance of blessings that HF has for us.

Ok, let me clarify...what should SINGLE women know about men? The full bellie I can handle. The come hither smile? Umm, nope, I won't tease a man like that. That'll be saved for my husband.

Umm, it's been at least 7 years since I was there last. I don't think anyone that I once knew is still there...except perhaps one of the counselors. At least I think he's still a counselor. He was the HP assigned to our branch. And I have many fond memories of branch activities at his house in the hottub or on his boat on Lake Michigan. Oh, and I hear ya about being too old. That's what happened to me...just grew up I guess. I love being in a family ward now. Although I miss the activities we used to have (see above paragraph...can't get much better than playing around on the yacht at Lake Michigan!).

Ha! Thanks, ska for that nice summary. So, what should women know about men? Seriously, someone (like one of the old married women) come up with a similar list about men.

This thread makes me laugh. We all have perceptions of what the opposite sex wants. It's silly for us to continue to feel that way. One of my friends did it right. He dated almost every girl in the single's branch I was in--and no one knew about it! How he managed that I'll never know. I found out when I was talking with some other girls and found out we all had a date with him that weekend. I asked him about it--was he interested in all those girls? How did he choose whom to ask? He told me that he didn't know if he was interested--that's why he asked them out. He said that he would date girls a few times to see if there was any interest on his part and if not, then he wouldn't go out with them again. I thought that was the wisest thing anyone could do. While we dated, he never mentioned the other girls or their time together. He focused on me and the time we had together. I wish he would teach a class to all of us on dating...men on asking all sorts of women on dates....and to women on not being so possessive of men they date and accepting them.

I'm going to disagree with MarginOfError on this one. I think Single's Wards are very useful and SAs need to determine for themselves if they should attend or not. I was in the single's branch (I believe the same one that Jbs2763 is in--but many years prior--I was in it when it first started) and loved my time there. Not only do you get the opportunity to meet people in the same state of life you are in, but you have a better opportunity to serve and gain experience in callings that you probably would never have in a traditional family ward. Although the CHI says that singles are best served in family wards, if there weren't a need for them, the church wouldn't allow them to happen. Hence, the Single Adult Wards (not the Young Single Adult wards) were done away with several years ago (although now there are some Mid-Single Adult wards, but I believe they are a unit within a traditional family ward). My advice is to go to the Single's Ward and see how you like it. Don't base your decision on one visit and do what you can to make friends with people there. One of the major cons of a Single's Wards are the tendency to be "clickish." Unfortunately, many people tend to form groups and it appears that "outsiders" aren't invited. I would say to avoid "belonging" to just one group and get to know as many people as you can.

I, too, am a little confused on that statement from Elder Oaks. Can you provide a link to it, MarginOfError? According to Elder Oaks in his Hanging Out article (Ensign, June 2006), he stated to date, then from those dates chose someone to court, then marriage. I wholeheartedly agree with PC. You will marry whom you date. If you choose to date/marry a non-member or non-believer, then you must make a conscious decision to give up certain things. And I would caution anyone going into a marriage thinking, "Someday he/she will be a member" that you are being completely unfair to your potential spouse. One cannot change anyone but oneself. To try to do so is unfair and against God's principles.

There has been some very good thoughts here. I think Satan has more power than this. I think God has allowed him powers. I'm thinking of that scripture that talks about Satan having power to "bruise his heel." Obviously, Satan does not have the power that God does (or even the power we have). Also, in the conflict with Job, Satan had a lot of powers.