rampion

Maybe a lot of it is that people have not learned how to plan a meal that is not based on meat. That's easy to remedy. And tofu does not need to be included. We have plenty to eat - vegetables, fruit, bread, milk, .... In less affluent times, meat was used for celebrations and when needed - not everyday (red meat in particular). People ate vegetables and grains. Now, people eat meat because they can, and they waste it because they no longer have a close connection to the source of their food and its true cost. People used to drink primarily beer because it made the water safe to drink. Now we have enough safe water to drink, and don't need to drink beer. Prophets just might know what is best for one time even if not the same as another time, just maybe. And the majority of the people interpret directions to make them closest to what they want to do. The Doctrine and Covenants also tells us that we should not have to be commanded in all things. Why doen't the WoW tell us not to use marijuana, meth, cocaine, etc.?

There is this stuff simply called Barley Tea. It's just barley, in a paper tea bag. You pour water over it and let it sit in the refrigerator for 15 minutes or more. It's pretty good. Barley doesn't need to be fermented any more than grape juice does. Smells much better fresh, too.

A lot of what people actually do becomes more cultural than doctrinal. Utah was a pretty good environment for a ranching culture to develop, and ranchers grow beef, and so that gets eaten and marketed. Maybe people weren't so sure about the division between "strong drinks" and "mild drinks," and decided to go with no alcoholic beverages at all. In the society that has developed, we can see that beer is sometimes over-used, and can lead to significant problems. Wine and alcohol weren't prohibited in earlier scripture either, but we can see that alcohol doesn't mix well with cars and modern stresses and responsibilities. Anyway, eating meat became such a big part of the culture that we are thought peculiar among the LDS people if we choose to avoid meat. I'm vegetarian, and I dread ward dinners and such, because there is little likelihood of there being much that I can eat there, and almost no willingness to understand why I don't eat the same food as everyone else, let alone to accomodate. Once someone called me to ask if my family would attend a Cub Scout banquet. I said that we would be there, and that two of us are vegetarian. The reply from the caller was, "Well, I don't think that matters. We have to put chairs out anyway." Every food available was meat-based at that banquet, except for thinly-sliced oranges used as a garnish. Someone offered me a large bowl of garnishes (I think that was my husband, though). I never know if I'll be able to make do, or if I need to eat before events like these so that I don't go away starving. I probably wouldn't have such a problem with meat if it were used in moderation, but the wide over-consumption has led me to the conclusion that a meal for me is not worth taking an animal's life. Please don't kill any creatures on my behalf.

There is so much that we can do ourselves to manage and control our mental and physical health. Support from others, including professionals, and sometimes including medications, can help. But it won't as long as we expect someone else, or even God, to take away our problems. The key is that we have to be willing to accept our challenges and decide to deal with them effectively. Whatever that means for you. Many things can help, including priesthood blessings, medication, therapy, herbal supplements, diet and excercise, ... For me, St. John's Wort is helpful for depression (I favor it over prescription meds because I have control, there are no side effects that bother me, and it costs much less. It works the same way that SSRIs like Prozac do, and people have been using it for millenia. Maybe God knew what he was doing in creating that plant. It will interfere with the pill for birth control though, so might not be an option for everyone. Light therapy works too. We are designed to need sunlight. It helps to regulate the chemicals in our brains, including serotonin. Getting outside in the sunlight in the morning would work just aw well, if you actually do it. Sometimes that's a challenge, especially in the winter. DBT is another thing. It was developed for borderline personality disorder, and also works for bipolar disorder, addiction, depression, anxiety, eating disorders, and the list goes on. I am convinced that Marsha Linehan was inspired whether or not she knows it. Prayer and meditation are even part of the skills set. I'm sure that these are not the answers for everybody, but I'm a lot saner with them than without them. Again, the key is that each of us takes responsibility for ourselves and we do what works for us. God didn't send us to earth to be rescued. He'll help us find what works, and the people who can help us, but He isn't going to do it for us, and nobody else can do it for us. This work is something we have to do for ourselves.

The faith comes in willingness to accept what the Lord blesses you with. When Jesus prayed on the cross, he prayed "not my will, but thine." The answer may not be to take away the affliction, but to strengthen you to be able to manage it, to be given medications that work for you, and to be directed to professionals who can give you effective treatment. The answer might not come immediately, but maybe in time and with your own best efforts. Whether it is sin, sickness, or mental or emotional unwellness, we are saved by grace after we have done all that we can do for ourselves. Bipolar disorder is much more manageable with the correct medications. But there is still a lot that you can do to manage the illness yourself. Be aware of your moods, and keep track of ups and downs. Maintain a healthy diet and regular sleep schedule (having 8 hours of dark every night, whether or not you sleep that long, has been shown to control mania - google "Dark Therapy" and "Light Therapy."). Counseling helps with Bipolar Disorder too. Especially if you get manic or depressed, talk to someone - a friend, a therapist, your bishop or home teacher, .... I have struggled with depression, anxiety, and personality disorders for my whole life. I have had blessings when things were especially dark and hopeless. I never expected to be cured - only to be able to get through the hard times, and to know that Heavenly Father cared about me. It does help.

Moderation in all things. Even good things can be taken to excess. I'd suggest taking a portion of the time that you spend praying and pondering, and spend it having fun with your wife and your family. Can you do that? If that would be hard for you to try, then perhaps this has become an obsession/addiction, and is out of control. When something in your thinking, behavior, or emotions is causing you pain and trouble, and interfering in your life, it becomes a disorder. Counseling may help. You might also try an ARP program.

As a teen I used to stop eating and see how long it would take for anyone to notice. Then when a guy in school whose attention I didn't want, I kept doing it because even though someone noticed, it wasn't who I wanted to notice. Yes, I needed something from someone, but didn't get what I needed that way. My parents probably thought that I wanted to be left alone, especially since if they had commented on my lack of eating, I probably would have told them to mind their own business even though it was what I wanted from them. I understand wanting to be noticed, and to have someone demonstrate how much they care. And that it's hard to go to someone and say, "I'm struggling and I need help." I also know how easy it is to quietly fade and disappear and become invisible and send the message that it is nobody's business. Whose responsibility is it to check up? It would be great if anyone who thought about it would say something, give you a call, tell you that they miss seeing you there, etc. Who would you like to have check up on you? Would you take the initiative to give them a call and tell them that you would like to hear from them? Who is responsible for your attendance and participation? We believe in agency, and you are the one with a choice about your priorities and your actions. You're more aware than anybody else of your level of participation. Do you really want to leave it all up to anyone else?

Sacred and secret are not quite the same thing. Think of the temple - it's not secret, it's sacred. The secret combinations in the Book of Mormon were conspiracies to commit murder and to overthrow the church and the government and to cover up who was involved. Neither the Masons nor temple attenders have anything to do with that.

Yes, Joseph Smith was a Mason. And so were, possibly, the people in the mob that killed him. They were angry and felt threatened and probably felt that they had good reason. We know who was leading them. The Masons do a lot of good though, and we are told that we are to judge things by their fruits. Some of the older Masons, at least in Utah, remember having ill feelings towards the Mormons, but we can't judge a whole group by the actions of a few. Now they are welcoming and accepting, and there are Masons who are also Mormons. It's possible that the Masons served God's purpose and helped to preserve much of the temple ordinances. Their history goes back to the temple of Soloman. But the gospel was taken from the earth, so the Masons didn't remember the entire significance of what they had.

Low-Nurturance Families - Break the Cycle -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- An introduction to the non-profit < Break the Cycle! > Web site. I just found this, and it makes so much sense to me. From my experience and what I observe in working with other people, this guy really seems to know what he's talking about. I haven't read it all yet, but wanted to share it. It looks like the site includes a free online course to increase awareness of the problem and how to heal ourselves, our families, and society too. Anybody interested in exploring/discussing it? Even in LDS families, we don't all have our needs met, know how to nurture each other, etc. When I work with families, too often I find that they fall into two groups - those that appear to be functioning pretty well, and don't think that they need help; and those that aren't functining well, and can't admit that they need help. The more people who are aware of basic needs and how to make sure they are met, the better off everyone will be. I wish that my parents had known this stuff, and that I had known it much earlier in life. The site is so packed with information and links to more information, that it looks overwhelming to me at first, but it feels so true to me that I'm going to keep going back until I can absorb at least most of it. Here's a summary:

What type of job are you hoping to get? As in, what would you consider doing? In my field, I've had to accept that there is work that has to be done no matter what day it is. And I have never felt that it compromised my beliefs when I had to do essential work on Sundays. I worked at residential care facilities of various kinds. It's Sunday there too. And I figured that if only the people who don't have religious values are willing to work on Sunday, then the atmosphere for the people receiving care on that day won't be a reverent, sabbath-like atmosphere. When I worked on Sunday, often there was a peaceful, relaxed atmosphere and I was still able to keep the sabath. And also help to influence others positively. I'm not saying to give up your values and responsibilities, and I did have a hard time with jobs that expected me to work every Sunday. When I could, I arranged to switch off with someone, because going to church is important to me. And I wasn't willing to work at places that didn't need the work done on Sundays and wouldn't respect employees wishes to keep the sabath. But maybe you can expand your options just a bit and find a job that will work for you.

Yeah, fear of failure can be very paralyzing. It makes sense to just try, because when we don't try, we fail for sure. But it isn't so easy. I'm reading a really good book for this. Feel the Fear and Do it Anyway by Susan Jeffers. Susan Jeffers :: Home Amazon.com: Feel the Fear and Do It Anyway: Susan Jeffers: Books

How a person feels can't be wrong. It is simply how that person feels. Depression is real, and the feelings are real. They aren't permanent, but they often feel that way. Acceptance is the first step to change. You wouldn't tell a person with cancer or diabetes to stop putting themself first, would you?

I wonder if you're trying to fit a mold that doesn't fit you. I relate to much of what you wrote. Don't know how our trials compare, but I'm married almost 20 years, have 3 kids, was about the same age as you were starting my family. I don't know about you, but I grew up never questioning that a woman's role is to get married and raise children, and that's what you do because it's expected. Back then, I didn't really think about what I wanted to do, or what I was ready for. I didn't really grow up or figure out who I was. I felt so trapped, especially after so many years as a stay at home mom in a little house that didn't have room for us, and that felt like a prison to me because I didn't think I could ever go anywhere without taking the kids, which I didn't have enough energy to do. I lived with depression my whole life. Looking back, I can positively identify it as early as age five. It never went away. The pressure, and the guilt, just trying to fit that mold and be what parents, and the church, and everybody, all seemed to think that I should be was enough to crack me. I went off the deep end when my oldest was 11. I was trying to home school, and live up to that image, but I was failing. There were a series of things that helped me to start to get free. I had to hit the bottom first. I was so desperate I almost decided to kill myself because everyone would be better off without me. Never actually attempted, but was close several times. A neighbor or someone turned me in to DCFS because I was scary. The DCFS worker came on a day that the kids had their math books all set out all over the living room, and the house was in respectible shape that day, for us that is, and it was obvious that I was trying, but I was so stressed out. She asked me if I ever got a break, and I said no, and she said my kids were old enough that I could leave the oldest in charge, and go for a walk by myself. I never knew that I could do that. Now the youngest is 11, and they are all pretty independent, and I get out when I want to. Another thing was realizing that other people have options and go after them and they are ok, even if they have the same challenges that I do. Moms with kids who are also respected professionals, and some even who battle depression and they still do it. I gradually started to change my life. I went back to school and started a career. I'm a better mom now than I was when I was stuck and didn't think I had choices. Some of the talks by church leaders and others still hurt, because I remember how stuck I was, and I still have relapses, but not as bad as it used to be. And the church is true, even if we aren't all cut out with the same cookie cutter. I know you're not me, but I wonder how much control you have in your life, and if you know that it's up to you to change what's not working and that you can make your life your own. If you're trying to live a life that isn't you, no meds or blessings or anything else is going to relieve your depression until you listen to it and see what it is that you need. I hope you find something that helps you, and hope I didn't assume too much with this post.

Yes, go to your bishop. You are still a really great and special person, and God loves you no matter what. Yes, bishops are there to help. None of us can know how your bishop will react, but they have heard so many things, and they are there to help you back to where you need to be. It isn't going to be easy. You will need to feel something, and that is part of the process of repentance. But it isn't forever, and this doesn't have to keep you away from the blessings that Heavenly Father wants to give you forever.

The war in Heaven was about agency. God will not force anyone to follow Him. Satan wanted to do that. When people are baptized for the dead, the person the ordinance is performed on behalf of has a choice about accepting it or not. People will always have a choice. Not everyonone on the earth during the Millenium will be LDS. In the end, they will know what the gospel is, and they will know that there are keys that they need, and they will have a chance to accept those keys and all that comes with them. But it will always be their choice.

Thanks for pointing it out. I watched it, and shared it. :)

I also suggest some distance. And keep going with the therapy, so that you can heal. You need to develop healthy relationships and learn to build the healthy acceptance, love, and affection that you need. But you have to start with yourself. That's the only way it works. I escaped from a dysfunctional family my second year of college. They fought me trying to leave, but then when I got away they didn't contact me and I stopped contacting them either. It was lonely, and I went through a lot of depression. It isn't easy, and it hurts, but you can work through it and change the cycle, starting with you. It does get better.

On other sites I'm Rapunzel (Rap for short). I probably registered that name here and forgot, and didn't come back for a while, and couldn't even remember that I had registered before. I'm not sure. Anyway, I couldn't register here as Rapunzel, which I am used to being called and feels more like my name than my real name sometimes. So I found something related that has a similar sound. Rampion is the vegetable that Rapunzel's mother just had to have so badly when she was pregnant, that she stole it from the witch. The avatar is a picture of Rapunzel, of course. I had very long hair until I caught it on fire about a year ago and had to cut it. It's just now getting down to my waist again from shoulder-length a year ago. I relate to the Rapunzel story in more ways than just the hair, too.

You know what? It's normal. You are a 14-year-old boy, developing as most do. If you are thinking about it and doing it all the time, and it gets in the way of living your life, then you would have a problem. Worrying about it this much, and your dad not talking to you because of it, just makes it harder. The scripture does say that "the natural man is an enemy to God." You will learn to control your passions and the things that your body craves (including overindulgences such as eating too much, sleeping too much, etc.), but this is part of normal development, and the control will come.

You said you have depression and cyclothymia. What you are describing sounds like symptoms to me. No, it isn't "normal," and I'm glad that you are going to get some treatment. Those conditions are very treatable, and you deserve better than to have to live like that or feeling like that. When you said that "something seems not right about it in a deeper sense" do you think that could be a wise part of you, telling you that those feelings and symptoms are not you? Or maybe telling you that there is something wrong and it needs to be repaired? I haven't experienced exactly what you described, but some similar things, like apathy and not caring and not feeling like there is any hope for me or that anything is worth it. I have had depression and anxiety all my life. It's not as bad now as it was, but I still feel it sometimes. It does get better. There is one who understands completely though. Did you know that Jesus suffered for all your afflictions, including this? He felt what you are feeling, and more. He understands, and He offers healing. Part of that healing may be in the form of professional treatment, but that isn't everything. You will heal more completely when you can accept the healing that comes through the Savior. I also know how hard that is when you're stuck in depression and emotional distortions. So, go easy on yourself. And accept help and comfort where you can find it.

Mirium, you are doing the right things. Keep doing them. Try other relaxation techniques, prayer, meditation, yoga, a warm bubble bath, and anything that helps you. What I would add is that you are getting agitated for a reason, and if these things aren't helping, then you need to address the source of the agitation. That is likely to mean getting some therapy and working through the things that are stressing you, both now and if there is something in your past that interferes with your ability to cope now. Those things don't go away all by themselves. TC

Why is it just the women who are expected to take care of themselves? Growing up, it really embarassed me to have to see my dad running around the house in his garments. He at least wore pants. I didn't want to look at his undershirt all the time, or see my dad sleeping in his recliner in his underwear with his mouth open and flies investigating in there. I don't want to see my husband running around in his garments either, and I don't think the kids should have to be exposed to that. We try to convince the kids that we should act at least as well and present ourselves at least as well within the family as we do with outsiders. But then every time someone comes to the door we have to delay answering while dad runs to put clothes on or hide. It's a turn off. And women also need to notice when men do take care of themselves, when they get a haircut, lose some weight, etc. They need to know that it's appreciated too. Sometimes when either men or women let themselves go, maybe they are sub-consciously or intentionally communicating "I'm not feeling attractive, or I just want to be left alone." Courtship shouldn't end after the vows have been taken, on either side.

Hasn't it been said that it is one third of the Celestial Kingdom that will be exalted and become Gods and create other worlds? I'm not sure of anything here, but it seems to me that we know nothing about the other two thirds of the Celestial Kingdom. To say nothing of the Terrestrial and Telestial Kingdoms, which apparently do not include eternal marriage, and are lower kingdoms, but still will be levels of glory. Is it possible that we do not all have quite the same eternal purpose? Maybe there is more to Eternal Life than we are able to understand in our mortal state. Maybe it is best to trust in God and His ability to sort it all out somehow and place everyone where they will be the happiest and best suited.

Sorry, my other post is there again now. Hmm, and my therapist assures me that I'm not crazy. Go figure.