Melissa569
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Posts posted by Melissa569
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Everyone always says you go to hell if you commit suicide. But I really don't understand why that is. I mean... Punish someone because they are so sad that they don't wanna live anymore? Or because they kept trying to think of reasons to live and they couldn't find any?
I mean even here on earth, we tend to give these people therapy, rather than throwing them in prison. I just don't understand why in heaven, its not also understood that such people need help more than punishment.
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Thank you everyone, I am such a mess right now... I'm still trying to get out there, because I need to help. I do have brothers and sisters (5 of them, half of us are Dad's biological kids, and half are not (I am), but he still raised even the kids who weren't his own, as if they were. And they see him as their Dad too.
not all of us can go though (maybe half) because we are still recovering from Mom's death financially, and the traveling we did for that. None of us really have money.... The VA (he was a veteran) will only cover like $300 of the final arrangements because he didn't die in a VA hospital (had it been a VA hospital it would be $700). So we are probably looking at cremation... It was 750 for my mom. So hopefully we will be able to scrape up enough for Dad, I don't know.
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he's gone, my dad is gone my brother just called and told me he was sitting by dads bed for like 9 hours and he just flat lined a few minutes ago. this can't be real.
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Thank you for your support, its just really hard. I'm only 32 and I still feel 18. My only actual HOME was with Dad. I went to live with him after my divorce. So now I am on the east coast, to visit with a guy from a marriage website I was considering marrying, and this happened while I was out here. So ... I pretty much feel homeless, because I can't afford to keep Dad's place up and running by myself. I am unemployed right now. My "potential fiance" paid for my ticket here. So other than being here, I feel like I have nowhere to go.
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Hey everyone. First, even if all you can do is pray or offer a blessing... Please do, because heaven knows I need it right now. I haven't been here in ages... But in times like this you need all the godly fellowship, prayers and help you can get.
I am really at the end of my rope, emotionally, like my whole life is just falling apart. This is really all just too much for me. I lost my mom of a heart attack in July, 2013. Then last night (December 5th, 2013) I got a call from my brother saying our Dad was in the hospital on life support, because he had pneumonia, a seizure AND a heart attack all at once! I mean this is BOTH of my parents in 5 months!
Both of them were LDS.
I'm currently staying on the east coast (USA). Dad is on the West coast. My friend Grace set up a fund raiser page to help me scrape up enough to get a round trip ticket to go out there and be by his side. Maybe even help with some final expenses... Every little bit helps, so if anybody here wants to help out, it would be greatly appreciated. Here is the page:
[Moderator removed link]
It kills me he has pet dogs who depended on him, and a new house he was trying to build (his dream home, its unbearable that he won't even get to finish it or live in it). Just NOBODY is ready to lose him, so much is unfinished. I don't understand how he could go...
Thank you in advance. I don't know what we will do about his unfinished house, or his funeral expenses, or his dogs, or anything... But I have to be there.
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Well, I wasn't really active the last place I lived. And here, they don't really have a ward. So I guess I don't really have a "ward clerk" or "bishop" that I could talk to. That's why I was trying to see if there was another way. I have no idea what my "membership number" is, or anything.
As for why the VA needs a church record--- Hahaha, well I was applying for VA education benefits, to pay for college. My dad has 100% service-connected disability, and they will cover college expenses for any children who were your dependents, while you were on active duty (but you had to be LIVING with the veteran while you were a minor).
The VA said that one of the documents they would accept as "proof" of this--- is a baptism or church record, because it states your legal guardians from that time.
We have moved around so much (and I as an adult have moved a lot too)-- I just don't have any records from when I was under 18, anymore. Of all the options-- Church records seem like they would be the easiest thing to track down.
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*sigh*......
I'll bit my tongue on this one.
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Hello all,
I need a copy of my baptism/membership records, for VA education benefits purposes. But I recently moved to an extremely rural area, not much in the way of LDS churches around here. We live VERY far from town. We only go into town to go grocery and supply shopping like once or twice a month. So simply talking to a local clerk or bishop is not so easy for me, lol.
Is there another way I can get copies of them? Email correspondence with church records, maybe? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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I am sorry if this offends anyone, but I believe that unless it is 100% necessary for survival-- a polygamous marriage is NOT healthy. Not at all.
For two reasons-- nearly all of the time, the following is true:
1. One person believes that they deserve a faithful spouse... But their spouse does not not deserve the same. That is a sign that the person in question thinks lowly of their spouse in some way, and that's not good.
2. The other person has some kind of issue, causing them to believe that they only deserve HALF a spouse, or less. Whatever that issue is, said person has some MAJOR self worth and security issues. And again, that's not good.
Anybody who only wants to take on half of a marriage (its incomplete because neither of you are experiencing complete faithfulness, either from yourself or from the other person)-- they must not be complete on the inside.
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If your husband is already trying to control you with the "I won't love you anymore if you ___" routine after only eight months of marriage, then you guys have bigger issues than religion.
That's also true. I hope he really didn't mean that... Well, I'm SURE he didn't, but maybe you could just say this is something for your own personal growth, and he doesn't have to feel threatened by it.
You don't have to answer if you prefer not to say, I'm just curious, but... Is he non-denominational? Non-Christian? Or is he perhaps an atheist? If he's an atheist, that might be a bit more difficult... Because in that case, its not just this particular church, or churches in general that offends him-- its faith in God all together. In that case, you'll need to take a long, hard look at things. Whether or not God exists, is a lot more profound a difference than one religion vs. another. Despite their differences, all religions at least have the belief in God in common.
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SpringGirl-- Agreed.
Just as another example of how two people from VERY different walks of life can still make it work-- There is actually a Muslim man who is somewhat interested in me now. He is currently my best friend in the whole world. He's an English teacher, very intelligent, very educated, and very kind to everyone. But I told him that I need "time" before I try any other relationships, which is understandable, lol. Anyway, we have our conversations, and its good to make and example of them, I think.
We were discussing what would happen if we did become a couple in the future. Like children and such... He said that in his religion, it is actually strictly FORBIDDEN to allow your children to be raised as non-Mulims, and there are serious consequences for allowing this. So he would have to raise them Muslim, and it was NOT something he was permitted to negotiate about.
I said, "Well, I don't mind that... But they would have a Christian/American mother. So try as I might, they will be exposed to some bits of Christianity. I decorate my house during Christmas. I make Christmas and Easter dinner... I got o church on Sundays. And if they ask me about god or heaven, I can only tell them what I know..."
He said, "I don't mind if you decorate for Christmas, or make religious meals. I don't care if you keep a holy week end. Muslims do as well, only for us, it is Friday, not Sunday. The Qur'an says we must honor ALL prophets and significant religious figures. Its says there are only 3 religions that God will accept as valid-- Islam, Christianity, and Judaism. Our book contains all the same old testament stories and names as the bible does. And some new testament as well. We do believe that Jesus (peace be upon him) was born to a virgin named Mary, and that he performed great miracles, through the will of god, such as healing the sick and raising the dead. We do believe that he was sent to earth to teach and spread the word of God. So naturally, I do not mind if you want to celebrate his presence on earth. He is a sacred soul. But it is little things like calling God "father". We do not do this, for us its forbidden. Our relationship with God is not a father/child relationship. It is a master/servant relationship. We submit to his will, even if we do not like it, or agree with it. We also believe that Jesus was saved by God and drawn up to heaven without dying, the way Elijah was. But that another man was thought to be him, and was crucified. So when you speak to the children about religion, you would have to be careful about little things like that. Just say things that would apply to ANY faith. And they would not be allowed to attend Christian church functions. Muslim children are not allowed to be directly exposed to other temples, until they fully and completely understand their own faith."
And to me, that's no big deal, really. I can just learn to say "God" instead of "Heavenly father". And just say "when Jesus ascended to heaven" instead of "when Jesus was crucified" (because even we believe that in the end, after being resurrected, he ascended to heaven). So its not that far of a stretch. But its all about working with each other. Working around differences.
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I just got divorced. But not because of religion. Although my ex and I were of different faiths. I was raised LDS, but rarely attended most of my adult life. He was Catholic, but never attended.
We NEVER fought about religion. It was just never a problem.
First piece of advice-- DO NOT place a lot of value on him "coming around". Do not demand it. Do not try to make him. just because he doesn't go to your church, does not mean you can't be together, and be perfectly happy. Really, DON'T start this out with the the expectation, or even the HOPE that he will join. That will only lead to disaster .
I personally think that in a healthy relationship, you can be from different planets, and it will still work if you are both good people, leading a clean life, and are very tolerant. And it helps if you naturally enjoy learning about and experiencing other lifestyles/cultures/religions. Which I do! I'm naturally inclined toward exploring that, and always have been. That's why I don't mind other faiths.
So I think maybe you should explain to your husband that you converting to a church, is not going to mean that you will be trying to convert HIM at every turn. That you're not gonna be trying to dominate the upbringing of any kids, and leave his opinions and influence out of the parenting. I think he's just afraid of that. Maybe he wants things between you and him to be the same, and he wants to continue being free to be whoever he is.
Some people are afraid of churches/denominations. They feel like it takes away your individuality, and your own opinions. And some denominations actually do! lol. But you gotta reassure him that you are not joining to put a wedge between the two of you. And that nothing in your relationship is going to change. This is just something that makes you feel better.
Live up to that promise too, above all else.. Don't come home and talk "church this, church that, scripture, scripture, scripture". Because that is really going to drive him away. I know when you are having great feelings and experiences, and you are discovering amazing spiritual things, you just want to tell everybody about it, and get them wanting what you have... But that's just not a good idea in some situations.
My suggestion-- if someone from the church invites you to go anywhere (RS get-togethers, VT stuff, lunch, play dates, etc.), or any church functions... Just say those people are your "friends" and you're gonna go do something fun to get out of the house. Its not necessary to mention to your man that its a "church function", or that you know those people from the church-- because that just makes it look like its taking over your life. That will scare him too. Let all the members in the ward know about your delicate situation, and ask them if they come by your house, to please not amplify that their relationship to you is purely church-related. Ask them to introduce themselves simply as "your friends", or perhaps, friends of the family.
The only condition I have in relationships for religion, is that neither of us tries to convert the other. A man can tell me about his beliefs all he wants, and I will tell him mine. Just so we can learn about where we are both coming from. But we do not argue about which is "better". Everything else-- I know that God will sort it all out later. So I don't worry about it.
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Dahlia-- Thank you :)
Yeah, I think Community Colleges are better. The DI website says they partner with community colleges for education, so I will ask them if I can do training at a CC. I spoke to a woman over the phone at DI, and she says "We always have our trainees work while they go to school". So that will be good.
I guess the only advice I can give other women out there is-- whether you want a career, or you want to be a homemaker-- always have a backup plan. Seriously. Go to school, get some training, and work for a while BEFORE you get married or have kids. I don't mean you should be constantly paranoid about losing what you have... I just mean never let yourself to get caught in a position where you would end up like me, if something WERE to happen. Because it is possible no matter who you are, where you are from, or how involved in the church you are.
And if like me, you didn't do that before you got married-- start doing it now, lol. At least the schooling part.
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Iggy-- Yeah, I was thinking about drawing blood as a career... Or maybe going with my natural talents, like any kind of office job training, because I'm actually really good on the computer and I type pretty fast. So I figure if I got brushed up on all the office programs commonly used, and had some kind of certification or training course to list on a resume, that would look pretty good. :)
Haven't heard of CSC yet, but I will check them out too :) The reason I figured the church might be a good way to go, is because California's state budget for such programs is really going down the drain, lol.
At the welfare office, they have a "welfare to work" program, much like DI's program... But they have restricted it to people with children only (don't have any, lol). And even that, the Governor is trying to have that program canceled, to save on budget costs... Which I personally think is counter productive. hmmm.....
A lot of people told me try R.O.P., because that place used to have like a dozen training courses for free. Even thing slike Medical Billing and Coding. So I checked their website, and state budget cuts have limited them to only things like "welding"... I went to the employment offices, like my dad suggested (both LDS and regular state employment office). But except for some resume building and interview workshops (which I might do, just to help with confidence), they mostly just point you to the computers, and have you do internet job searches, which I can do from home. I guess its a good place for people who don't have a computer though.
Wow, sooooo much has changed from the budgets, let me tell you... My dad said when he needed help 8 years ago, all those programs had SEVERAL vocational training and placement assistance opportunities. They used to pay your gas to the training or classes, pay for the schooling, buy your uniforms and tools (like if you wanted to work in government jobs, or construction or something). They did a lot to get displaced people trained up and ready, back in the day. But now there is almost no funding for them to do this with... Sad, really.
If the church still offers something like that, then I'm gonna jump all over it! lol. I think the church probably has better funding than a lot of state programs, because they don't depend on state budgets. I believe they use things like tithing, or fast offerings, or maybe profits from their thrift stores and the mall and such, to keep their programs going. And that's a little more dependable. Then it gets circulated too, because when they hire you in the thrift stores, or help you get placed anywhere else, you pay tithe with your income later. So its a pretty good self-supporting system they have going.
Pretty smart, I think.
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Interesting clown-like face in in the mushroom cloud. :)
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Thanks, your replies make me feel like it is a good thing.
I suppose when I get to speak to the bishop, I will ask him if there is any way I can perhaps stay closer to DI while I work there... Like if they know any single young women who might be ok with a short-term room mate, until I get a little studio apartment or something. I'm really quiet, and I mostly mind my own business and keep to myself (not in a grouchy way, I'm just sorting myself out is all), and I'm neat. So I'm not one of those "nightmarish" roomies you can't wait to get rid of, haha.
Or maybe if there is an empty-nest couple with the church, who don't mind letting someone rent a room until they get their own place, or something. I hear they sometimes do that for missionaries, but maybe someone would for a decent young woman who is simply "displaced", I don't know.
I am doing well on my own terms, considering everything. But I would do A LOT better if I left my mother's house, lol. First to be closer to work or school, and second-- to have peace and reduce my stress levels. I suppose its nice of Mom to let me stay here, but I'm afraid it comes at a VERY big price. See, I never was much for drama. So I don't share the sentiments she's always been well-known for-- having loud arguments, and profanity contests 24/7 with anybody unlucky enough to be within 30 feet... I'm already going through enough, as you can imagine. So I don't need that too.
All I want right now is a peaceful, healthy environment, while I concentrate on work and school.
Hopefully if I explain that to the bishop, he will agree. :)
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Hey everyone! Boy, its been a long time since I have posted here, lol.
Just wanted to ask-- has anyone gone through the work placement and career training that Deseret Industries offers? Did it help you? Did you like doing it?
Situation:
I got divorced, because Shawn just would not give up the gambling, no matter what I did, what help I tried to get for him, or what the good people at the church did to help. He lost everything to the casino, and got us evicted from our apartment. So I divorced him, and moved back to my home town. I'm currently staying with my mother, until I can get back on my feet around this area.
Anyway, during the marriage (if you can call it that, lol), I ran a part-time business from home on the internet. It was ok, with my husband's income. But now.... I have very little "regular" work or training experience. I know I'm gonna have to be totally independent now, like maybe go to career school, find where I belong job-wise, get my own place, etc. Which sounds like a healthier change of pace, while I get my head and heart sorted out. Even if it is going to be an extremely bumpy ride... :)
So I visited the local LDS employment office... But really they mostly just allow you the use of their computers, to do internet job searches (which I can do from home, and which I've applied for everything local for someone with my skills and experience, but.. No luck, lol). Maybe they do a few workshops to boost your self confidence, etc. But that's pretty much it.
But I went to the Deseret Industries website here: Training and Placement , and they say that at the nearest Deseret Industries (for me its Sacremento, CA, about an hour's drive away), they will put you to work in one of their thrift stores, while they train you in whatever skill you would like to learn, and you can even go to school through the vocational training they sponsor, in local community colleges. You have to get a referral from the bishop to go there, and I'm gonna make an appointment to see our bishop tomorrow, while I'm at church.
So yeah, just wanted to see if anyone else has done it and what its like.
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I like to have fun with people, so knowing me, if I were asked why I suddenly wasn't participating, I would probably say something like,
"You're better off not knowing."
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Well in those quotes, rather than "brow beating", I more consider it simply "disagreeing with execution of plans", which is not a bad thing, or wrong.
But we're getting side tracked here. The main focus was that its something we can all learn from in the future.
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Oh I wasn't trying to brow beat the family with "shoulda, coulda, woulda's" over the past, or anything (I was worried it was going to sound like that, lol). And I know they've been through a lot.
I was just making the point that this is a good moral for the rest of us in the future. We can be kind to our fellow man, but we gotta keep one eye on them too.
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I've had a little more time to think about this, and of course I feel that Elizabeth is 100% an innocent victim. I also understand that Jesus Christ would teach us to be kind and charitable to the homeless, which I agree with.
But I also think this is a good lesson for drawing certain lines between kindness, and just plain unwise decisions...
Of course NOTHING excuses the absolute (in my opinion voluntary) guilt of the kidnapper, and the fact that it was HIS choice to commit a crime, and nobody else's. But I personally feel that the parents (as good and nice of people as they are) perhaps should not have been so trusting.
I for one would NEVER hire a non-professional stranger off the streets to come do work at my home, around my children. I wouldn't even do it if I were single. Perhaps giving them food, or a ride to a shelter, or helping them clean up and putting in a good word for them somewhere to help them get a job could be just as kind as inviting them home to work for you, if you really wanted to help them. But something about inviting them home just doesn't feel right, or safe to me. Even if they do seem like a kind person.
What really disturbs me about this case is how familiar the kidnapper seemed to be with the inner layout of the family's house, and where everyone's rooms were. They were a large family, having 6 children and probably a few bedrooms. How did the kidnapper know exactly where to go to find Elizabeth, when the entire house was dark, and all the family members were in bed, covered up with blankets?
I don't know, I'm just worried that they may have allowed a stranger to become too familiar with them. Again, it doesn't excuse the kidnapper. And no, they did not deserve for this to happen. NOBODY does. But it probably could have been avoided... So its a good moral for the future.
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Oh ok, well in that case, I hope she can finish it too. France, that must be amazing. That's a brave young woman to face all this.
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Finally the Elizabeth Smart trial is under way.
Oh my gosh, I almost forgot all about this case! I think it was like 8 years ago. Little Elizabeth Smart was kidnapped from her bedroom in the middle of the night, by the homeless preacher her parents charitably hired as a handyman. He snuck in through the kitchen window and into her bedroom, threatened the lives of her and her family, and kidnapped her at knife point. Then made her follow him miles away to some kind of polygamist camp, where he and his "other" wife made her change into robes, and a forced "sealed" marriage was performed. Doesn't take a lot of imagination to guesss what Elizabeth said happened right after....
You know, its people like him who make nice families afraid to show charity.
She just served a mission in France, and it sounds like she may have had to come home from it for the trial..?? I feel so bad for her, but I really respect how she moved on. Here's the article:
Elizabeth Smart says she awoke to knife on neck | General Headlines | Comcast.net
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I find this to be an intriguing subject as well. There are a lot of religions represented in my little area. They all, barring Catholics, claim that they will see their loved ones again and will continue relationships in the next life. While their church doctrines teach the opposite.
My uncle was a Methodist minister and I asked my aunt about it. She said that their church teaches that they might see one another, but will never recognize each other again. She knew some scripture passages that mentioned it. Most every Methodist I know does not believe this.
The same goes for the Baptists that I ask. The church teaches xyz, but we believe abc instead.
With many of the smaller congregations in the area, it depends on the current preacher, or minister. Many people will often switch from one denomination to another based upon whether or not they like the minister, how close the building is to their home, or possibly if they have friends that go there. Also, with many churchgoers in this area, if they want to know something, or have a question about the gospel, instead of reading the Bible and praying for an answer, they will simply ask their preacher.
Though when I ask Catholics about families for eternity, the response is uniform. They do not expect to carry on their relationships in the hereafter, that the love they have and express in God's presence will transcend anything we can imagine, and that we will not have time for any relationships outside of praising and worshipping God.
But, I am not worried, we will each receive a place in the kingdom that we fit best in.
That's what I'm saying, hardly anybody likes to believe what almost EVERY old doctrine teaches, in alsmot every religion, that "If you're entire family is not a member of OUR church, they won't be exclusive to you in heaven."
Since they all say that, it sounds to me like one of those "We want everybody to join OUR church!" type of competitions / ploys. And that's probably why a lot of people, including myself, choose not to place very much value on it. As far as I'm concerned, its just an organization's vanity.
I (and the rest of my family) personally think that when you really peel back all the layers-- believing that God and Christ are real, and that Jesus died for our sins, and treating other people the way Jesus would treat them, is far more important than anything else in the grand scheme of things.
To me, the only truly important part of religion is the part that would survive if you and a group of people were on an airplane that crashed over an island, and you were all stranded there. As in rescuers never found you, and you had no choice but to just carry on living wherever you were. There wouldn't be all this fancy, complicated stuff. All there would be is your faith, and the way you treat each other. It may be an unlikely situation, but that's not the point. The point is to really break it down to basics.
Suicide Is A Sin? Why?
in General Discussion
Posted
True. I also think it depends what you did. I mean murder is a sin. But so is stealing. So hell is hell, but should someone who stole a pack of gum go to the same hell for the same length of time as someone who murdered an entire family? I think that mentality kind of gives off the impression of "Why stop at small sins, if all sinners get the same punishment?"
Haven't read much scripture in my life, but it kind of leads me to believe that there are just as many different degrees of consequence and duration of consequence in the afterlife as there are sins. Not just one.