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ldsguy422 last won the day on July 22 2020

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About ldsguy422

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  1. ldsguy422

    Are Latter-day Saints unified?

    I wrote this a couple weeks ago. I feel like it's relevant to the discussion, especially as it relates to contention: One of the more underrated teachings from the Savior is the admonition to, “agree with thine adversary quickly (Matthew 5:25).” This is a very practical teaching about disarming ourselves, so to speak, from sensitive topics which often arouse negative emotions. It’s natural to want to defend our beliefs and positions. That’s okay. We absolutely should have convictions, and not bend to whatever the popular whims of the day might be. It can become problematic, however, when we become so rigid in our stances that self-righteousness, arrogance, and contention overpower our better senses. Contention isn’t what happens when people disagree. It’s what happens when we lose trust and respect for one another. Contention is what happens when, “the love of many shall wax cold (Matthew 24:12).” Many people naturally enjoy engaging in civil discourse from time-to-time. And many people enjoy discussing a myriad of different topics. Unfortunately, the discourse nowadays isn’t becoming so civil. We are sometimes consumed with the need for being “right.” And we want others to know we’re right. The Savior’s counsel reminds me that there are more important things than being right. We could have peace of mind, we could have mutual respect for others, and we could build on commonalities. The aim of any discussion should not be victory, but progress. A protestant minister once said, “God cares about people more than he cares about truth in the abstract. Jesus didn’t die on the cross to make a point. He died on the cross to save people whom he loves. We too must represent our Lord, with love to God and our neighbor, always foremost in our concerns.”
  2. ldsguy422

    Liberals in the Church

    I feel like the ward I live in is pretty close to 50-50 on Democrats and Republicans. Members bring up politics far too often, IMO. Whenever I'm teaching a Sunday School class and someone interjects with a political comment, I usually respond by saying, "Hey, if you have something political to say, please save it for a testimony meeting." Politically-charged comments are inevitably going to irritate someone in the class. Most people can see that my comment is facetious, and it quickly diffuses an otherwise tense situation.
  3. ldsguy422

    Carb's Take on Racism

    How could defunding the police possibly make the public more safe ? Who is more likely to be impacted by that kind of reform?
  4. ldsguy422

    Carb's Take on Racism

    The poverty level in the United States for a single person is considered $12,490. That would actually put you in the 89th percentile for all salaries around the world. Sometimes privilege is a matter of perspective.
  5. ldsguy422

    Carb's Take on Racism

    We are one of the least racist countries in the world. Yet, you wouldn't know any better if you were watching cable news. If I were from another planet, and I only knew our culture by what I saw on TV, I'd probably think our country has become significantly more racist over the past 20 years. Race, race, race. It's a constant talking point. Why does every bad thing have to be attributed to race? We easily and quickly impute motive on others. And the reality is, no one really knows why someone did something or said something, except the offender - and sometimes they don't even understand their own psychological motives. Sometimes it's just poor judgement. According to this study from two Swedish economists, less than 5% of Americans would be bothered by having a neighbor of a different race. Looks like the OP was correct in that Asian nations are actually significantly more racist than western countries. Japan and China are both in the 15-20% range. India exceeds 40%. That is kind of eye-opening. The study took place in 2013, FWIW.
  6. ldsguy422

    A bunch of memes I just made!

    I've never heard any complaints about cops targeting women. And yet, men are 24 times more likely to die at the hands of a cop. Stop the sexist cops already!
  7. ldsguy422

    Are LDS open to Theistic Evolutionary Theory?

    With a denominator of 64, we'd be tracing it back to great-great-great-great grandparents. Each individual has 4 grandparents - and those 4 grandparents have 16 great-great grandparents. -If one grandparent is full blood, they would be 16/16. Diluted twice, the blood quantum becomes 16/64 for the grandchild -Another grandparent would be 4/16. Diluted twice, it becomes 4/64 -Another grandparent would be 1/16. Diluted twice, it becomes 1/64 -Another grandparent is white So 16/64 + 4/64 + 1/64 + 0/64 = 21/64 I'm guessing anyway. Seems kind of strange. I just can't imagine the math coming out any other way. But, I've never verified the figures myself. Her grandmother that is 21/64 actually has blood from another tribe. She's more Native American than Caucasian.
  8. ldsguy422

    Are LDS open to Theistic Evolutionary Theory?

    lol yeah, that's not a typical fraction. So, my wife's maternal grandfather is full blood Cherokee. Her maternal grandmother's Cherokee bloodline is 21/64. So, her mom was then 85/128. Wife is 85/256. My kids are 85/512. That's what it says on the Indian Card, at least.
  9. ldsguy422

    Are LDS open to Theistic Evolutionary Theory?

    The first reported sighting was in 1771. Why did it take so long? We don't know if they migrated in 1500 AD, or 500 AD, or 2,000 BC. I'll go ahead and assume it's been for several centuries. And I'm already questioning modern humans existing for 200,000 years - so yes, the appeal to authority approach carries little weight to me. How do you know the initial migration had 50 people? It doesn't change much, IMO. But, there's no way of knowing that figure. Noah's Ark would have been a much more ambitious undertaking, and presumably with only 8 individuals. If they were voyageurs who were seeking more fruitful land, they obviously came by boat. If you came by boat, then the logical conclusion is that you can also leave by boat. There easily could have been a small group of defectors at any time (1000 AD, 1000 BC, 3000 BC, whatever). And yes, they absolutely could have reproduced and mixed with others. Blood can become diluted very quickly. My kids are 1/6 Native American (from my wife), and I don't think many people would think they're anything other than completely white. Also, the island is 23 square miles, which is 14,720 acres. If there are 50 households on the island, you're looking at close to 300 acres per family. That is substantial. Do we know if the Indian Authorities have tried to come in from any other entry point? Looks like the Sentinelse were quick to show up on the beach when that crew came with the coconuts. It's sensible that you would want to live close to the beach, as that would make access to fishing much easier. So, I can't help but think more huts are lined up near the coast, meaning it's very, very possible there are many more people on the island. And it's not like we've ever had anyone go up and down the island and take a census. Close to 15,000 acres and we think the group is capped at 200 individuals? That is hard to believe. So in summary, I'm questioning the current population. I'm questioning the number of defectors. I'm questioning the total number of descendants. I'm questioning how long they've been there. You were wanting me to propose some hypothetical for how long I'd be willing to accept that the tribe has been there. Let me just be extremely generous and say 10,000 years And let's say the population has only increased from 50 to 200. Again, skeptical of the time elapsed and the population (very skeptical). But, sure, let's go with these figures. The population has only doubled twice in this scenario. Even still, that means it was doubling every 5,000 years. Are we ready to extrapolate data from arguably the least progressive community in all of mankind, and apply that standard to the whole world - and do so for 190,000 years? The rest of the world wasn't living on an island. In other communities, there would have been inevitable division due to the struggles of maintaining a hierarchy. Migrations would form, and groups would discover new lands. You can't do that on an island. But again, they came on a boat. They could also leave on a boat. I seriously doubt a group that is capable of leaving, would just sit there, and sit there, and not question anything for 55,000 years. Also, doubling every 5,000 years from 200,000 BC to 10,000 BC would lead to 550 billion people. For the math to be more favorable, A LOT of assumptions have to go in your favor. Believing that a group has been stable for 50,000 years with little variance in population is not just a big assumption - it's an astronomical assumption.
  10. ldsguy422

    Are LDS open to Theistic Evolutionary Theory?

    It's an interesting case. I'll grant you that. The biggest issue here, of course, is no one actually knows how long they've been there. I just read an article from Forbes, and it says that they're related to other groups in the Andaman Islands. So, there have been divisions. But, no one knows how many of the Sentinelese fled to other indigenous groups. No one knows how many integrated into modern society. Or how many got kicked out of the tribe for violating tribal protocol. It's hard to account for a group that doesn't have a documented history - and almost no contact with the outside world. Too many missing variables. Would love to know more about them. But there's very little we can analyze with that. While doing some research on them, I've found that the population estimates ranged from 50 to 400. You took the low end on that number. So, we know there have been divisions, which is important because we don't know how many actual descendants came from the original two. And We don't know how long they've existed on the island. And we don't know what the current population is. Let's go ahead and say the population is 256. That allows the tribe do double exactly 7 times. If they've been around for 6300 years, it means the population would double every 900 years. It's very possible that the total descendants is much more than 400. Could easily be in the thousands. So yeah, still hard for me to believe that any tribe would need 8,950 years to double. And remember it's not just 8,950 years. It's continuing with that razor thin population growth for 190,000 years.
  11. ldsguy422

    Are LDS open to Theistic Evolutionary Theory?

    You're not grasping how crazy it is for the world's population to double every 9,000 years. Let's just scale it back every so slightly and say 5,000 years. So the example you gave was stable for 1,000 years. Let's say that example was true - nothing happened to the growth for 1,000 years. And then it gets back on track and finally doubles after 5,000 years. And that pattern of doubling every 5,000 years continues 38 more times. Okay, so what happens when you double every 5,000 years from 200,000 B.C. to 10,000 B.C? You get an astounding number of 550 billion. A far cry from 4 million. It's amazing that you're doubling down and not conceding any ground. The numbers are not on your side. And like I said, yes, populations can go relatively unchanged for periods of time - but, not for 9,000 years. That is not feasible.
  12. ldsguy422

    Are LDS open to Theistic Evolutionary Theory?

    Using a tribe would make sense... if no one ever broke off from that tribe. We're talking about the world's population, not a single group. Divisions have always existed. And knowing little to nothing about the Sentinalese, I'm going to guess they've had members that have left the tribe. Have they been completely in tact for thousands and thousands of years without division? If people have left the group, then your example is completely irrelevant.
  13. ldsguy422

    Are LDS open to Theistic Evolutionary Theory?

    No one is denying that a civilization can yo-yo back-and-forth and be as volatile as a stock market. But, this doesn't happen time and time and time again for thousands and thousands of years. Since the beginning of dawn, tragedies of all sorts like the ones you just mentioned have been occurring. And they still occur. And yet, populations double quickly. I'm not denying that a population can remain unchanged for an extend period of time. Huge difference between 1,000 years and 9,000 years. And your previous example, with a tribe of 10,000, would absolutely go extinct. No question. I took the demographics of Lesotho and divided them in half, which seems reasonable since the life expectancy of Lesothans is 55. And cavemen allegedly lived anywhere from 25-35 years. So, a 0-7 year-old on my chart, would have been 0-14 years old for Lesotho. 31.84% of their country fits within that demographic. So what happens after a few years? Well, if you lose 1,000 people every year between these four demographics, and death is equitably distributed, then your 0-7 year old group will quickly become the majority... eventually you won't have enough fit men to father children, or defend themselves from other tribes. Time for another theory.
  14. ldsguy422

    Are LDS open to Theistic Evolutionary Theory?

    The population he provided is going extinct. Just a matter of time.
  15. ldsguy422

    Are LDS open to Theistic Evolutionary Theory?

    Great. So there must have been wide-scale genocide for thousands and thousands and thousands of years. Yes, tribes and nations can struggle to grow for a period of time. But, not for 9 millenia. What evidence is there for this? Has a nation or tribe ever struggled to grow for such a long period of time? A few generations. Sure. Okay. But it sure as heck didn't last for 9,000 years. And you've yet to touch on how there was little to no progression for 190,000 years.