SpiritDragon

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  1. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from Anddenex in Requiring a COVID-19 Vaccine (shot/s)   
    While I would prefer to agree with this statement there are some parallels worth considering. Things moved along a similar trajectory in the early years of the NAZI regime.
    https://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/1933-1939-early-stages-of-persecution/

     
    There are certainly emergency powers being used around the world to shut down freedoms of assembly, speech, and a fully free press. Lockdowns influence all of these to an extent and social media censorship steps things up.

    As for ending democracy, there are certainly questions the world and many Americans have about the legitimacy of the last election in the USA. Perhaps it's not as overt as the German Chancellor's moves, but that may make things more sinister. Whether the election was a free and fair election or not, there is a serious problem when likely half the world thinks it was suspicious at best and stolen at worst. Is the power no longer vested in the people? It seems more like we have rulers than public servants in what's supposed to be the free world, but there may yet be hope to reclaim the broken system.
    At this point the science is clear that the available vaccines are not stopping infection or transmission of Covid-19 so to continue to blame the unvaccinated as a risk to anyone but themselves is preposterous, and yet here we are with people getting worked up into such a feverish frenzy that they agree the unvaccinated should lose jobs and become second-class citizens. Which mirrors 1930s Germany...
    Yikes... Is it really so unfair to look at history and see the striking resemblance? "Achtung, vaccine papers please"
  2. Thanks
    SpiritDragon reacted to clwnuke in Media parading unfortunate Covid victims - who could have been treated!   
    @SpiritDragon there is too much money at stake for Big Pharma, and too much power at stake for Big Government, to allow any cheap, widely available, and safe alternatives to the current vaccines.
    America is built on profit. Ivermectin threatens profit therefore it is un-American and dangerous.
  3. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from clwnuke in Media parading unfortunate Covid victims - who could have been treated!   
    Interesting review of Ivermectin Toxicity:
     
    TL:DR Ivermectin has been concluded to have an exceptional safety profile that is better than many over-the-counter meds available. No deaths have been attributed to Ivermectin use in humans, with it being widely available for nearly 40 years as a human prescription drug, and longer for veterinary use. That's not to say it shouldn't still be approached with caution, but it is certainly safe enough to try out.
  4. Thanks
    SpiritDragon reacted to NeuroTypical in 20 year anniversary of 9/11   
    20 years ago tomorrow, I was working in one of the tallest buildings in Denver. They emptied the building out within the first hour or two I was there. I called my wife, who was at home with our not-quite-1 year old. I told her I was ok, that I was coming home, and she should turn on the TV. Later, my boss sent us this story that his brother gathered from a co-worker. I dig it out and read it every year.    
  5. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from SilentOne in Doctrine Fallout   
    I don't believe the most recent statement to be doctrine of any kind. It has no direct bearing on salvation one way or the other whether one masks or vaccinates (and following the guidance of government and health authorities varies greatly by area), but it does make a difference if one follows the 1st Presidency's counsel. Prophetic counsel can simply be specific to a situation or individual without being canonized into any doctrinal umbrella. Consider counsel given to a leper to bathe in the River Jordan or other such acts (that were likely not necessary, but either bolstered faith or tested obedience) and yet they were never taught as something that others needed to do for healing, salvation, or anything else. However, these instances do showcase the outpouring of blessings available to those who follow the prophet, even in matters not tied to doctrinal teaching.
  6. Thanks
    SpiritDragon reacted to clwnuke in Biden's Mandate may be a tad too far   
    The historical trend for Presidents (Rep and Dem) to issue more and more Executive Orders and administrative rules, often with dubious legal foundations concerns me. In other countries those types of actions have often been a prelude to the rise of a dictator or a coup - who often justify their actions by saying that they needed to act without checks and balances because it was an emergency.
    Politics & Power 101: Create the crisis, then solve it by taking away people's freedom and independence.
  7. Like
    SpiritDragon reacted to Backroads in I was the loving, patient, long-suffering person and it paid off   
    Just wanted to share a bit of job success.
    I teach for one of the virtual schools.
    Last week, I got a nastygram from a parent. Like, insulting my intelligence and skill. After letting myself imagine lots of delightfully  nasty and unprofessional responses in my head, I responded with nothing but empathy and sorrow and offers of help. I did this to about half a dozen more nastygrams. 
    Turned out that while the parent and I were talking over how to solve problems A, B, and C, it turned out the real problem was in an entirely different universe. Coworker in charge of separate universe helped and matter was resolved.
    Parent has been nothing but supportive and polite and friendly since. Like, freakishly polite and kind. 
    I think, though, we may become good partners over the year. 
  8. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from Just_A_Guy in 3.5 Trillion spending bill   
    It's not just a problem in the USA. The problem lies in the fact that we've raised people to believe the day of reckoning will never come and so voting for fiscal responsibility isn't a priority. The fact of the matter is that cuts and austerity don't win elections so no party that wants to actually get in power seems able to pull this off.
  9. Haha
    SpiritDragon reacted to mirkwood in Requiring a COVID-19 Vaccine (shot/s)   
  10. Like
    SpiritDragon reacted to Anddenex in Requiring a COVID-19 Vaccine (shot/s)   
    One thing we can say with the Spanish Flu, there wasn't any discussion pertaining to, "Well, you may not know you have it." It definitely isn't "supposed" also, the Spanish Flu was more lethal and it didn't have a particular "high risk" group to worry about. If you contracted the Spanish Flu, no matter your state of health, you had to worry. First year the Spanish Flu killed between 20 million to 40 million individuals (with a population around the globe much lower than it is now - 1.8 Billion in comparison to 8 Billion). If I am remembering correctly, the first year with Covid was around 1.3 million. We have nearly 7 times greater population -- worldwide -- with nearly 20 to 40 times less the death rate.
    With the Spanish Flu there wouldn't have been any memes saying, "Imagine a virus so dangerous you have to be told you have it," or asymptomatic. So the idea of what virus was more deadly is easily seen in the statistics. I am also more concerned about how many doctors -- who practiced medicine and saw patients -- were shut up, and how in the beginning (can't find the videos anymore) of doctors concerned with how it was being treated. Some even saying that the treatment was causing more harm then the virus.
  11. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from mirkwood in Requiring a COVID-19 Vaccine (shot/s)   
    This is where things get pretty well impossible to compare effectively across time. We can't compare apples to apples because we are simply under different circumstances. The spanish flu had the opportunity to be spread by overstressed, overtired, undernourished soldiers coming home from war to all parts of the world under different guidelines and understanding than we have now. Today, while we didn't have to compete with soldiers coming home from a world war, we dealt with world travel on a scale never before seen to bring this to/from all parts of the world. But because we used the measures we did in our era and they used the measures they did in their era and the measures aren't identical and perhaps more important to the point of lethality neither were the treatments offered, we can't accurately determine if we did a better or worse job or were simply up against a more ferocious or more tame enemy.
     
  12. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from Anddenex in Requiring a COVID-19 Vaccine (shot/s)   
    This is where things get pretty well impossible to compare effectively across time. We can't compare apples to apples because we are simply under different circumstances. The spanish flu had the opportunity to be spread by overstressed, overtired, undernourished soldiers coming home from war to all parts of the world under different guidelines and understanding than we have now. Today, while we didn't have to compete with soldiers coming home from a world war, we dealt with world travel on a scale never before seen to bring this to/from all parts of the world. But because we used the measures we did in our era and they used the measures they did in their era and the measures aren't identical and perhaps more important to the point of lethality neither were the treatments offered, we can't accurately determine if we did a better or worse job or were simply up against a more ferocious or more tame enemy.
     
  13. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from JohnsonJones in Doctrine Fallout   
    I don't believe the most recent statement to be doctrine of any kind. It has no direct bearing on salvation one way or the other whether one masks or vaccinates (and following the guidance of government and health authorities varies greatly by area), but it does make a difference if one follows the 1st Presidency's counsel. Prophetic counsel can simply be specific to a situation or individual without being canonized into any doctrinal umbrella. Consider counsel given to a leper to bathe in the River Jordan or other such acts (that were likely not necessary, but either bolstered faith or tested obedience) and yet they were never taught as something that others needed to do for healing, salvation, or anything else. However, these instances do showcase the outpouring of blessings available to those who follow the prophet, even in matters not tied to doctrinal teaching.
  14. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from JohnsonJones in 3.5 Trillion spending bill   
    It's not just a problem in the USA. The problem lies in the fact that we've raised people to believe the day of reckoning will never come and so voting for fiscal responsibility isn't a priority. The fact of the matter is that cuts and austerity don't win elections so no party that wants to actually get in power seems able to pull this off.
  15. Like
    SpiritDragon reacted to mirkwood in Doctrine Fallout   
  16. Like
    SpiritDragon reacted to clwnuke in Doctrine Fallout   
    @mikbone I believe that one source of confusion for your brother is when the issue is boiled down to the basic statement above. The question is follow what? Let's condense the two statements down to the possible "what" portions:
    January 12th 2021
    In word and deed, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has supported vaccinations for generations. As a prominent component of our humanitarian efforts, the Church has funded, distributed and administered life-saving vaccines throughout the world. Vaccinations have helped curb or eliminate devastating communicable diseases, such as polio, diphtheria, tetanus, smallpox and measles. Vaccinations administered by competent medical professionals protect health and preserve life.
    As this pandemic spread across the world, the Church immediately canceled meetings, closed temples, and restricted other activities because of our desire to be good global citizens and do our part to fight the pandemic.
    Now, COVID-19 vaccines that many have worked, prayed, and fasted for are being developed, and some are being provided. Under the guidelines issued by local health officials, vaccinations were first offered to health care workers, first responders, and other high-priority recipients. Because of their age, Senior Church leaders over 70 now welcome the opportunity to be vaccinated.
    As appropriate opportunities become available, the Church urges its members, employees and missionaries to be good global citizens and help quell the pandemic by safeguarding themselves and others through immunization. Individuals are responsible to make their own decisions about vaccination. In making that determination, we recommend that, where possible, they counsel with a competent medical professional about their personal circumstances and needs.
    _________
    August 12th 2021
    We find ourselves fighting a war against the ravages of COVID-19 and its variants, an unrelenting pandemic. We want to do all we can to limit the spread of these viruses. We know that protection from the diseases they cause can only be achieved by immunizing a very high percentage of the population.
    To limit exposure to these viruses, we urge the use of face masks in public meetings whenever social distancing is not possible. To provide personal protection from such severe infections, we urge individuals to be vaccinated. Available vaccines have proven to be both safe and effective.
    We can win this war if everyone will follow the wise and thoughtful recommendations of medical experts and government leaders. Please know of our sincere love and great concern for all of God’s children.
    ___________________
    Now let's analyze the action words "urge" and "recommend". Is this a mandate, or a command to "follow"? No, not in the strict sense. I think you could possibly classify it as an "instruction", but if you call the Church office building and ask that question you will be given a clear statement that there is no requirement for members to be vaccinated. They will refer you back to the portion in red above. So per the statements and church instruction:
    #1 - The Church is not responsible for your health care, you are.
    #2: - If people choose to be vaccinated it should not be because President Russell M. Nelson was vaccinated, it's because you read his urging and recommendation, and you discussed the matter with your spouse (which was mentioned in the original release letter reporting), sought competent medical advice, and determined what was correct for your "personal circumstances and needs".
    Everything else is pride loudly proclaiming "I'm more righteous than you because I don't need to be commanded in all things!"
    IMHO, there would have been no reason to add the language "In making that determination ..," to the original statement if it was pre-determined what the "correct" outcome should be.
    The bottom line to me is that everyone who considered the issue carefully, and reached a personal decision to either be vaccinated or not, has followed the Prophet. So when you brother says "Your either follow or don't" I believe he is mistaken in what we were actually supposed to do.
    Joseph Smith still had an occasional beer or wine after the Word of Wisdom was revealed, because it was not yet a requirement of the Church to follow. That doesn't shock me, but it does sometimes shock other people until they understand the Spirit in which the Word of Wisdom was given. It wasn't black or white.
    I firmly believe that I have followed the counsel given, and I am at complete spiritual peace with my determination to be vaccinated once the Covaxin or Novavax vaccines are available in the United States. Until that time, I mask, I wash, I respect others - and I have not infected a single individual (if the antibody tests are reasonably accurate) - which is more than many vaccinated people can say. At some point I'm sure I will get Covid, and when I do I will isolate. I feel that I am doing my part. I don't know your brother, but I think most people can see the issue in a broader perspective if given the chance.
    I share your hope that your brother might feel God's love once again and return to the safety and peace of the True Shepherd's fold.
    Curiosity question: Of your family members who are currently inactive, do any of them still believe in the doctrine that they are sons and daughters of God? I find that this specific doctrine seems to have a particular holding power among many who have left Church activity.
  17. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from scottyg in Doctrine Fallout   
    I don't believe the most recent statement to be doctrine of any kind. It has no direct bearing on salvation one way or the other whether one masks or vaccinates (and following the guidance of government and health authorities varies greatly by area), but it does make a difference if one follows the 1st Presidency's counsel. Prophetic counsel can simply be specific to a situation or individual without being canonized into any doctrinal umbrella. Consider counsel given to a leper to bathe in the River Jordan or other such acts (that were likely not necessary, but either bolstered faith or tested obedience) and yet they were never taught as something that others needed to do for healing, salvation, or anything else. However, these instances do showcase the outpouring of blessings available to those who follow the prophet, even in matters not tied to doctrinal teaching.
  18. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from Grunt in Doctrine Fallout   
    I don't believe the most recent statement to be doctrine of any kind. It has no direct bearing on salvation one way or the other whether one masks or vaccinates (and following the guidance of government and health authorities varies greatly by area), but it does make a difference if one follows the 1st Presidency's counsel. Prophetic counsel can simply be specific to a situation or individual without being canonized into any doctrinal umbrella. Consider counsel given to a leper to bathe in the River Jordan or other such acts (that were likely not necessary, but either bolstered faith or tested obedience) and yet they were never taught as something that others needed to do for healing, salvation, or anything else. However, these instances do showcase the outpouring of blessings available to those who follow the prophet, even in matters not tied to doctrinal teaching.
  19. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from MrShorty in Doctrine Fallout   
    I don't believe the most recent statement to be doctrine of any kind. It has no direct bearing on salvation one way or the other whether one masks or vaccinates (and following the guidance of government and health authorities varies greatly by area), but it does make a difference if one follows the 1st Presidency's counsel. Prophetic counsel can simply be specific to a situation or individual without being canonized into any doctrinal umbrella. Consider counsel given to a leper to bathe in the River Jordan or other such acts (that were likely not necessary, but either bolstered faith or tested obedience) and yet they were never taught as something that others needed to do for healing, salvation, or anything else. However, these instances do showcase the outpouring of blessings available to those who follow the prophet, even in matters not tied to doctrinal teaching.
  20. Like
    SpiritDragon reacted to mirkwood in Requiring a COVID-19 Vaccine (shot/s)   
    @JohnsonJones the Covid death numbers are inflated and we all know it.  That is a huge part of the problem with this whole mess.
  21. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from Anddenex in Requiring a COVID-19 Vaccine (shot/s)   
    It seems that if there had been a known safe and effective treatment than the vaccines couldn't have been given emergency use authorizations and the developers of those products would be out a lot of money waiting for properly vetted approval before a single shot could go into any arm and people couldn't be scared into taking them as much if an effective alternative were widely known to be available.

    The sad part about this is that it's not the first nor the last time that treatments for "vaccine-preventable" illness have been largely ignored. Since vaccines are never perfect, it only makes sense to still make sure that treatments are available for all those who become sick regardless of vaccination history. Yet, historically once vaccines are entrenched as safe and effective for a particular illness state, further research into treatments is greatly inhibited, even though eradication is the exception and not the rule.
  22. Haha
    SpiritDragon reacted to Vort in Requiring a COVID-19 Vaccine (shot/s)   
    I hate that, especially when my tendons leave a gap between my shoulder and my armpit.
  23. Like
    SpiritDragon reacted to Traveler in What's a popular word, saying or phrase you can't stand?   
    You need to follow your heart.
    We need to follow the science - spoken by someone that has no background (interest) in science.
    Politicians that criticize those of a different political stripe for doing what they praise their fellow politicians for.
    Someone that thinks that scripture or the words of a prophet will solve differences of religious opinions.
    Saying something literally with the intent of symbolism - example a sports caster talking about a speedy receiver by saying, "He is literally flying down the field". 
    Thinking that something you have - it is mine, I can do with it what I want? - especially when the same complains of how wasteful others are. 
    Anyone gaslighting - Blaming others for their bad choices, bad behavior, mistakes or inabilities to accomplish lasting relationships.
    Sourer grape complaining - Especially those that fail to maintain religious covenants that blame religions for the world's ills.
     
    The Traveler
  24. Like
    SpiritDragon reacted to Grunt in Requiring a COVID-19 Vaccine (shot/s)   
    And yet people keep lining up to drink the government Kool-aid.  
  25. Like
    SpiritDragon got a reaction from Grunt in Requiring a COVID-19 Vaccine (shot/s)   
    It seems that if there had been a known safe and effective treatment than the vaccines couldn't have been given emergency use authorizations and the developers of those products would be out a lot of money waiting for properly vetted approval before a single shot could go into any arm and people couldn't be scared into taking them as much if an effective alternative were widely known to be available.

    The sad part about this is that it's not the first nor the last time that treatments for "vaccine-preventable" illness have been largely ignored. Since vaccines are never perfect, it only makes sense to still make sure that treatments are available for all those who become sick regardless of vaccination history. Yet, historically once vaccines are entrenched as safe and effective for a particular illness state, further research into treatments is greatly inhibited, even though eradication is the exception and not the rule.