askandanswer got a reaction from Jane_Doe in known unknowns about the atonement
In church today, the Stake Presidency circulated a letter and lesson guide they have prepared. They have asked that the members of the stake focus their personal and family scripture studies and lessons on the atonement for the next six months and have given us a reading guide for every week. I think it’s a good idea and it got me thinking. All the important stuff you need to know about the atonement you learn before you finish Primary and I think that one of the main purposes of further study is not so much to increase understanding, but to increase appreciation. However, if we were to study the atonement for the purpose of gaining additional knowledge, it raises the question of what it is about the atonement that we do not know. What are the known unknowns about the atonement and what role might a study of existing materials play in helping us to reduce the number of known unknowns about the atonement?
To partially answer my own question, one of the known unknowns that I’ve sometimes thought about is who/what determines the price of sin, ie, who, and by how, is it determined how much sin will generate, or result in, how much suffering?
I’d be interested in hearing of any other “known unknowns” or unanswered questions about the atonement that people have thought about as well as responses to the question about how the sin to suffering ratio has been determined.
askandanswer reacted to prisonchaplain in Using titles vs. first names
My church's nomenclature has changed in the last few years. The "District Superintendent" is now the "Network Leader." Our top fellow is still the General Superintendent. In private conversations will usually use the full name. In a public setting, even a church class, we'd probably say, "Our Network Leader."
Then again, I was THAT GUY, back in the 80s, when all the profs invited us to call them by first name, who'd still say, "Dr. Last Name." I just couldn't bring myself to address them that casually. Ironically, I was never chastised for that.
So, when in doubt, go formal. Even if you are wrong, you'll never be rude.
askandanswer reacted to pam in Using titles vs. first names
I can't even imagine calling any of the general authorities by their first name even in a casual conversation with a friend or a spouse. For some reason that just seems disrespectful to me. It would have to be President Monson or Elder Perry for example.
askandanswer got a reaction from Str8Shooter in Married in a week
Ophelia, you are new here, so you don't really know these people who have responded to your question. But I've been reading their posts and watching their discussions for several months now, and I can tell you that they are strongly rooted in the gospel with excellent insights into a broad range of matters, and their responses to your question are well worth listening to.
askandanswer got a reaction from Str8Shooter in Married in a week
If you're not contemplating your coming wedding with joy and excitement, something is wrong. And most of the time there is nothing too wrong with over analysing a situation (other than the lost time it takes, and the stress and confusion it can generate) as long as you then humbly, sincerely and faithfully seek for divine confirmation of whatever conclusion you come to, and are willing to abandon that conclusion if no divine confirmation is forthcoming.
askandanswer reacted to Just_A_Guy in ROBERTS: If Sue loves Joe and Tom loves Joe, Sue could marry him and Tom can't. Why isn't that a straightforward question of sexual discrimination?
Yes, because it is the courts' job to interpret and apply the tax code. In fact, this has happened before (to a religious university, not to an actual church, that discriminated based on race). The case was Bob Jones University v. United States, decided by the Supreme Court in 1983.
The Bob Jones court held as follows:So the question isn't whether the institution discriminates in allocating a government benefit (like marriage); the question is whether the institution discriminates at all. And the Church does.Now, the Court did limit the application of the ruling to educational institutions; but I think the public and judicial mood is now right for extending that ruling to churches as well since anti-religious sentiment is on the rise and the underlying IRS nonprofit statute specifically encompasses both types of institutions.
askandanswer got a reaction from mordorbund in Moving to Utah
The Lord's preferred method of cleansing is baptism by full immersion. This should take care of your whole computer, not just the screen. If you let it soak for a while, you'll probably never need to clean that particular computer again. :)
askandanswer got a reaction from mordorbund in Modern day "Book of Mormon"
An interesting question, Yes, my OP assumed that whoever might read this latter day book would also have read the Book of Mormon. I'm not talking about a future book that replaces the Book of Mormon, but a latter day Testament of Christ made up of teachings from latter day prophets, just as the Book of Mormon is made up of teachings from ancient American prophets, with a few additions from Isaiah and Zenos.
So, what to include in the latter day Testament of Christ, from existing standards works? hmm, The Sermon on the Mount. Nephi's prophecies in 1st and 2nd Nephi. Sections 84, 88, 20, 107, 134, 135, JS-H, most of Moses, Abraham 3, Mormon 8 and 9, Mormon 7 and 10.
askandanswer got a reaction from Maureen in No refreshments allowed in baptisms?
I've never come across any restriction on post-baptismal refreshments. I agree with those who have said its for the Ward Mission Leader, with the approval of the bishop, and not the RSP to decide how baptisms should happen. In our ward, the question of whether or not there will be refreshments is usually up to to organiser of the event. In the case of convert baptisms, that's usually the WML, and he sees post baptismal refreshments as a great way for any non-members the baptismal candidate may have invited to mix with the members. In the case of member baptisms, then its usually up to the parents, and most, but not all parents, will organise for refreshments. Even when the baptism is taking place on a Sunday at a time when the other ward is using the chapel, there will still be post baptism refreshments.
askandanswer reacted to Pa Pa in Must converts serve missions?
Serving a mission is not required to be a member. As a people we are supposed to live per this quote; "every member a missionary". As such we come out of the waters of baptism into our calling as a missionary, and are released upon our death here on earth. However we also know that our mission field will then be to administer to those who never had the opportunity in this life...that mission will not end until the "final judgement. I try to go out once or twice a week with our missionaries, as a convert who was already married, I could not go. But now that I am retired so I try to help the missionary cause and calling.
askandanswer reacted to mordorbund in Kate Kelly, ashamed, openly admits the Church's actions have actually helped her
The LDS version is to compare something to Satan's plan.
askandanswer reacted to Capitalist_Oinker in And It Has Come to Pass ...
Just keep one thing in mind as you move along and progress in the gospel.
The Church isn't just a nice religion with nice people and a nice choir.
It isn't just a nice social club with nice bylaws.
It IS in fact God's Church and Kingdom on the earth today, and HE does in fact preside over it; directing it through modern-day prophets and apostles.
The Church is TRUE, and that's all that ultimately matters.
askandanswer got a reaction from Just_A_Guy in Baptism required for all kingdoms
I agree with you - hence my use of the quotation marks around the word "refined" in my post. perhaps I could have used the more twisted or distorted, but I did not want to be disrespectful to Elder McConkie. I'm more inclined to believe the way Joseph Smith used the word salvation than the way Elder McConkie did.
askandanswer reacted to tubaloth in quick replies needed
Glad your lesson went well. For our opening exercises once our bishopric counselor wrote all the announcements on the board. He kind of goes over them, but you don't get all the back and forth questions. "What time does it start" "Where is that at"
We went to our Elders Quorum and hardly anybody was there, and no teacher. We all discussed where everybody was at. Then I looked at my watch and realized we were 8 mins earlier. So now I push our counselor to write the announcements on the board each time. Now it doesn't really help that half the time the Elders Quorum Pres goes over the same thing again. Doh!
askandanswer reacted to The Folk Prophet in Good news from General Conference!
I don't feel that catering to the selfish and weak by way of compromise according to their demands and interests is the best course of action. In fact, I think it's a bad idea. Essentially it sounds like you're saying that if people are snotty, immature, self-centered, and un-Christlike then it's partially the leaders' faults for not accommodating the membership's interests better. Seriously. How far would we take such an idea. Video game hour instead of Sunday School? That'll get more people there, right? And massages. Maybe have snacks handed out in every class. Movies too! On big screens in darkened theaters. Yeah...that's my kind of church!!
Alright, alright...I'm being ridiculous and extreme again to make a point.
I don't deny that some better efforts in this regard should be made by some leaders some of the time. But more-so, I believe this is a gospel of sacrifice, and if people are not willing, catering to that isn't going to strengthen them, but only hurt the institution. Yes -- it's a balance. But we aren't given callings primarily to please us. We are given callings to serve the Lord, build up Zion, and to help us learn how to forget ourselves.
So instead I propose the following:
Teach people how to patiently and reverently listen to a series of bad talks. Focus on members humbly loving their struggling teachers. Follow the curriculum as outlined by our leaders and teach members to sustain and support them by attending the classes they are meant to and participating with thought and care. Follow the Spirit in prayer and humility in all callings given If someone is overly comfortable in a calling, perhaps it's time for them to stretch and grow Continue spending money on socials - continue finding creative active socials with little cost (wherein do you not think this is happening?) Continue spending money on youth activity - or find creative active socials with little cost (off schedule sport activities) (Wherein do you think this is not happening?)
askandanswer reacted to sxfritz in Good news from General Conference!
I've been in caustic wards. I know what it is like.
With the commonly stated three fold mission of the Church being mission, temple, and edify the Saints (fourth is service, per the handbook), my personal philosophy is edify the Saints has to be primary. If the people coming to church are not filled with the Spirit then the other two missions will fail. I feel, a bishop should focus on needs internal to the active members of the ward and the mission, temple, and service missions will fill themselves. If a ward focuses on mission but you have a ward grumbling because they hate their callings or there is animosity toward leadership, or whatever internal problems a ward can have, they members are not going to invite people in and people coming in won't stay. Same with the temple. If people are not happy they will not be drawn to the temple. That doesn't mean not teaching the principles and of course people's happiness comes from obedience to the gospel, but a bishop can do a lot to focus on harmony within a ward rather than statistics of activity and conversions and endowments.
Some things I've thought of:
Teach people how to give talks. So many Sunday meetings are butchered by a series of bad talks. Focus on teacher development. Rotate in a good number of classes other that Gospel Doctrine - always have a choice of another class such as family relations. Maybe even classes on self-reliance. If someone hates their calling, release them. Waiting for them to change and find the Spirit could be driving people away. If someone loves being in Scouts, leave them in Scouts. Same with Primary teacher (they are hard to find). Spend money on socials - or find creative active socials with little cost Spend money on youth activity - or find creative active socials with little cost (off schedule sport activities) If people enjoy being at church on Sunday, or other days, it will be natural to tell their inactive friends about what's going on. It will be natural to invite people to come out or to listen to the missionaries.
askandanswer got a reaction from Jane_Doe in Is God all-powerful?
I agree with you Kirkko, I believe that even God is subject to a law of justice. Where the law comes from, and how it is enforced, I do not know, but I suspect it is a universal constant. It is perhaps the same law that enabled God to progress from man to God. Two reasons why I think God is subject to law:
1. I cannot think of any other reason why God would require His Beloved Son to endure the agonies that He did unless He was compelled to, in order to satisfy some sort of externally imposed requirement. Surely God would have done all in His power to avoid the suffering His Son went through if there was a way that it could have been avoided. He did not prevent the suffering of His Son, so perhaps it was beyond His power to do so. Somebody, or something, demanded that sacrifice. It's hard to see how it was the voluntary, free-will act of a Father who loved His Son and who could have achieved the same outcome - the atonement - through a less difficult approach. I think that because God was subject to a law of justice the atonement was the only way to satisfy the demands of this law. If there was an easier way, God would have done it. This argument is supported by:
25 What, do ye suppose that mercy can rob justice? I say unto you, Nay; not one whit. If so, God wouldcease to be God.
Alma 42:1313 Therefore, according to justice, the plan of redemption could not be brought about, only on conditions of repentance of men in this probationary state, yea, this preparatory state; for except it were for these conditions, mercy could not take effect except it should destroy the work of justice. Now the work of justice could not be destroyed; if so, Godwould cease to be God.
Alma 42:2222 But there is a law given, and a punishment affixed, and a repentance granted; which repentance, mercy claimeth; otherwise, justice claimeth the creature and executeth the law, and the law inflicteth the punishment; if not so, the works of justice would be destroyed, and God would cease to be God
2. I believe that where God lives could be described as a kingdom, possibly even the Celestial Kingdom. Every kingdom is subject to some kind of law because there cannot be a kingdom without law. It may be that this includes the kingdom where God dwells.
36 All kingdoms have a law given;
37 And there are many kingdoms; for there is no space in the which there is no kingdom; and there is no kingdom in which there is no space, either a greater or a lesser kingdom.
38 And unto every kingdom is given a law; and unto every law there are certain bounds also and conditions.