NeedleinA

So, Needle, which of these political systems would you like Calgon to take you to?
FEUDALISM: You have two cows. Your lord takes some of the milk.
PURE SOCIALISM: You have two cows. The government takes them and puts them in a barn with everyone else's cows. You have to take care of all the cows. The government gives you a glass of milk.
BUREAUCRATIC SOCIALISM: You have two cows, which are cared for by ex-chicken-farmers. You have to take care of the chickens the government took from the chicken farmers. The government gives you as much milk and eggs as the regulations say you should need.
FASCISM: You have two cows. The government takes both, hires you to take care of them, and sells you the milk.
NAZIISM: You have two cows. One of them denounces the other for "Non-Aryan Ruminations".
STALINISM: You once had two cows but nobody seems to know where they are now.
PURE COMMUNISM: You share two cows with your neighbors. You and your neighbors bicker about who has the most "ability" and who has the most "need". Meanwhile, no one works, no one gets any milk, and the cows drop dead of starvation.
RUSSIAN COMMUNISM: You have two cows. You have to take care of them, but the government takes all the milk. You steal back as much milk as you can and sell it on the black market.
CHINESE COMMUNISM: You have two cows. You have to take care of them, but the government takes all the milk. You steal back as much milk as you can and sell it on the open market.
PERESTROIKA: You have two cows. You have to take care of them, but the Mafia takes all the milk. You steal back as much milk as you can and sell to the Chinese government.
GLASNOST: You have two cows. They emigrate to Israel.
CAMBODIAN COMMUNISM: You have two cows. The government takes both and shoots you.
CAMBODIAN DICTATORSHIP: You have two cows. The government takes both and drafts you.
PURE DEMOCRACY: You have two cows. Your neighbors tell you who gets the milk.
REPRESENTATIVE DEMOCRACY: You have two cows. Your neighbors pick someone to tell you who gets the milk.
PURE ANARCHY: You have two cows. Either you sell the milk at a fair price or your neighbors will try to take the cows and kill you.
BUREAUCRACY: You have two cows. At first the government regulates what you can feed them and when you can milk them. Then it pays you not to milk them. Then it pays you not to feed them. Then it shoots the cows to keep them from starving. Then the government requires you to fill out forms accounting for the missing cows.
NEW-DEALISM: You have two cows. The government takes both, shoots one, milks the other and pours the milk down the drain.
MCCARTHYISM: You have two cows. The government investigates you for "Animal Husbandry".
REGULATED CAPITALISM: You don't have any cows. The bank will not lend you money to buy cows, because you don't have any cows to put up as collateral.
FREE CAPITALISM: You have two cows. You sell one and buy a bull.
SURREALISM: You have two giraffes. The government requires you to take harmonica lessons.
LBJ NEW SOCIETY: You don't have any cows. The government gives you a lot of bull.
REAGANOMICS: You have two cows. You have to take care of them, but the government milks them and takes the milk. Anything that trickles down onto the barn floor is yours.
CLINTON TOWN MEETING: You have two cows. One of them is actually quite attractive.

SUPERMANISM: You have two cows. You sell one and buy a bull. Breed them and produce all the cows (ribeye, milk, cheese) you like. Sell off your excess. Pay a fair tax and get left alone to repeat the cycle again and again. Someone messes with your cows and Superman's eyes heat up nice and toasty like!

Geezzzzzz! Why can't Superman run for president? This feels hopeless sometimes. Our options are Curly, Larry or Moe. We all seem to be talking about who is the least worse of the worst. ughhhh, "Calgon! Take me away!"

The real killer is mortality.  Nobody who's tasted of it ever gets out alive.  Still, it beats the alternative.. Just ask Legion.

If God is all-powerful, is he capable of creating a being like himself? (Ignoring the "uncreated" idea, for the moment.) If so, cannot the Bible be construed as teaching us that we may become like God -- indeed, commanding it? (Matt 5:48)
I understand that creedal Christianity disbelieves this idea, and I have little desire to try to talk them into my own beliefs. But though they may disagree with the idea, how can such Christians argue that it is against Biblical teachings, or that it is impossible? The first is demonstrably false, and the second demands that we limit God's power in a manner that I think we cannot do.
(It is worth noting that LDS doctrine does indeed teach the Biblical doctrine that we, along with Christ, will inherit all the the Father hath and that we will be "like him", but does not explain exactly what it means to be like God. That is more a matter of assumption and inference.)

http://www.upi.com/Health_News/2016/03/11/Study-links-Splenda-to-higher-risk-of-leukemia/3741457711872/?src=FB
Feeding mice far higher concentrations of sucralose than humans would ever eat causes a statistical increase in leukemia. Therefore, it's unsafe in any quantity and should be completely avoided.
But don't worry about alcohol. No problem for the moderate user. Nothing to see here, folks.

Thinking out loud, purely from a miracle stand point. Apart from any safety aspect of wine vs. water in ancient times...Jesus could have changed the "dirty" water to "clean" water, but how would he have proved it was now "clean" to his audience? Changing clear water to a darker colored wine would seem visually helpful, simply to prove that he just preformed a real miracle. 
Wine or Grape Juice (New Wine):
As to our use of water in place of grape juice ("new wine"—see Isaiah 65:8), it is important to note that initially grape juice was used in the sacrament both in the early church (Matt. 26:28-29) and in the latter-day church (D&C 20:79).[2] As a precaution against enemies of the Church poisoning or adulterating the grape juice sold to the Saints, a change was authorized by the Lord.[3] The Lord revealed, "that it mattereth not what ye shall eat or what ye shall drink when ye partake of the sacrament, if it so be that ye do it with an eye single to my glory—remembering unto the Father my body which was laid down for you, and my blood which was shed for the remission of your sins" (D&C 27:1-2).

In this context, it's "call for references". Typically,. it means the requester doesn't believe what the other has said, and wants proof of the claim.
In this claim, however, it is impossible to prove a negative, and the person holding the opposite idea is the one who has the burden of proof.
Lehi

Because we have learned a great deal about the healthful effects of alcohol in the last decade.

I'll admit, my picket sign "Booze iz fo Fooze" has cobwebs on it, time to get it out and use it more often.
Ah, the new slogan for delicious "Turd Cakes". 
Sure, it is all made from turds but there is a super healthy vitamin pack in the middle. 
Just having a little fun
 
 
 

I read your articles. They convince me not a whit.
Every "benefit" touted can be achieved otherwise, and it is not the alcohol the provides the benefits, but the other compounds in, say, the grape skins. Drinking the grape juice, or just eating the grapes would give the same (or better) result.
Beer and wine have actual nutritional value, and, were it not for the alcohol, would be beneficial. But there is alcohol, and that limits or negates the value. That fine line they talk about (between one or two drinks and too many) is a very fine line indeed.
I reiterate: alcohol is a poison. It destroys cells in every organ of the body with the first drink (see my post in the "other topic"). From cognition to estrogen, it does nothing good for you.
Someone(s) brought up Christ and His drinking wine. I believe it to have been esterling who noted that there was no safer alternative; water in those days being polluted and dangerous. So, it's a balancing act: you choose the best option from what is before you. In today's world, alcohol is not that choice.
Lehi

I could probably find benefits to about anything if I looked hard enough.

Hi Maureen -
I realize that there are a lot of disparate voices here that aren't 100% on the same page about everything--and perhaps in past exchanges between the two of us, I have given you reason to suspect my motives in this particular interchange.  But, might I respectfully invite you to focus on what I have actually written in this thread?  My point is that any consumption of alcohol will impair one's intellectual/emotional/moral faculties to some degree.  If someone can limit that impairment through experience, self-discipline, etc--that's great; but where I take issue is with the suggestion that consuming alcohol,within a certain threshold, doesn't create any impairment at all. 
I have no problem with the concept that one can be a "moderate" drinker in the sense that one can drink responsibly and still function in most day-to-day activities (though, I would hasten to assert, such a person would not be functioning "optimally" so long as there was any measurable amount of alcohol in their bloodstream). 
That said, I don't think God's much of a fan of the process or the thought patterns that underlie figuring out just how much is too much. 
And given that it's relatively easy to overindulge in something we need daily, whereas it takes some degree of premeditation to overindulge (or even just plain indulge) in something we don't need at all--yeah, I do think that even moderate or even light drinking is (generally speaking) probably more of an issue than gluttony.  Your mileage, of course, may--and probably does--vary. 

At least in our area, unfortunately, there is almost zero talk about food storage or preparedness from any local level. If a new family joins the church in our area, they might not ever hear about food storage for several years at this rate. If the GA's have stopped talking because the older members have heard it enough, where does that leave all the new converts and younger rising generations?
The moment the area cannery closed to the public, our whole area went silent. Was that about 4 years or so ago...losing track now?

Awesome!  Health benefits means it can't be bad


And this one had morphine:

 
Source
 

I'll admit, my picket sign "Booze iz fo Fooze" has cobwebs on it, time to get it out and use it more often.
Ah, the new slogan for delicious "Turd Cakes". 
Sure, it is all made from turds but there is a super healthy vitamin pack in the middle. 
Just having a little fun
 
 
 

The problem with studies like that is people read them and conclude that the alcohol itself is the component of the beverages that provides the benefits.  This has been shown to be false, per the grape juice comment above.  That really makes the rest of the argument moot.  If it were the alcohol, then one would expect *any* alcoholic beverage to demonstrate some of the same properties. 
And even if they DID, what's the point?  That we know better than Heavenly Father?  Is that the point being made here?
And if you don't believe in the Word of Wisdom as a commandment from God, then what's the point arguing it here?  Validation?  Bragging rights?  "I'm such an awesome forum debater that I convinced a few Mormons that drinking wine ain't so bad.  Go me!"

The articles might be relevant to the thread. They are not relevant to the question you've been asked...which is...what's the point of the thread -- what's you're objective here?
LDS people don't generally give a hoot if alcohol has health benefits or not. Nor do we care if non-LDS people engage is it's usage -- at least not beyond the desire to convert.

Then they need to quit drinking water, because that sure looks like vodka.  No apple juice either, because it looks like their kids have sippy cups of bourbon.

I actually agree with you, but Maureen's little snit puts me in no frame of mind to find reasons to support alcohol usage.
Alcohol is a poison. I weigh over 200 pounds, yet if I were to drink just a pint of alcohol -- two cups -- I would probably die. The fact that people can survive lesser amounts of alcohol does not negate its toxicity.
Consider the enormous social toll of alcohol -- the children beaten and parentless, the people murdered by drunk drivers, the lives shattered from addiction, the neglect, the broken homes, the fights, the rapes, the wasted lives. Then compare it with statistical suggestions that moderate (= little) use of red wine seems to contribute to a small decrease in heart disease -- no mechanism proposed or even suggested, just a small statistical correlation.
Therefore, drinking alcohol really isn't that bad?
Barf.

I _love_ Postum.  I may be keeping them in business single-handedly.  But I don't think it's going to help you stay awake.
Appearance, schmearance.  I think you should buy that guy a Postum mug (available at Postum.com).

Postum
Why has no one mentioned Postum. 
Postum is back on the market, you know, and was always a big seller in Utah.  Which is probably where you will find most of it today.
Someone in Gospel Doctrine mentioned Postum.  Quite a few didn't know what it was.   I used to see it advertised on tv all the time when I was a kid.  I believe my grandmother drank it for a while.
Then she went to Sanka.
I believe Sanka is decaf, but Postum, as you should all remember was a grain or wheat beverage.
Some people in Gospel Doctrine and Priesthood were saying that Postum would be immoral.  As it still gives the appearance of violating the wow. 
dc

That rocks, congrats again! My wife was a convert of about 2 years before we got married, so our early years had a lot of Gospel Principles (basic, fundamental) discussions. 
Our early years were highly informal FHEs. In fact it felt a lot more like date night with an appetizer of the gospel. Later in life with kids now, it is more formal: song, prayer, review of the week events, etc. 
Some ideas:
1. BYU TV or Mormon Channel show. Then discuss something about the gospel you saw/learned.
2. Join up with another couple for FHE, makes it a little more formal. 
3. Go to the church: Go play basketball or do service (clean the kitchen or foyers there) Probably need to borrow a church key, but hey, the building is a ghost town on Mondays.
4. Write down your experience at the temple being sealed. Write everything you can remember, felt, words by officiator, etc. before you forget them.
5. Go to a place with other Rockin members of the church and join in a discussion with questions/topics... psst, I now a place in particular... you are here now!
6. Invite a senior couple over from the ward. Senior couples are wonderful resources of knowledge and fun. You ask young married couples things/questions, well they are still trying to figure things out themselves. Invite a senior couple over and they have figured things out most of the time and have solid answers instead.
7. Nature hikes, hold hands and count your many blessings.
8. Sunday before, check out some videos from the church library. Watch some. 
9. Go through "Gospel Principles" manual and try to teach each other parts. Teaching someone else reinforces what you have learned.
10. Go on splits with the missionaries.
11. Service, service and more service. 
12. Skype a family member you haven't talked to in a while, saw hi and let them know about your beautiful sealing. 
13. Write the parents of the missionaries who taught you the gospel and say thanks for sending their children out. 
14. Try a new food and cook together. Simple Foods to Try thread
so on and so on... Have fun, enjoy each other. Yahooooo!

We are about 2-3 hours from a few temples, depending which way you go. We live in the St. Louis temple district, but as it was closed for cleaning we decided to go to Kansas City. It was very special, and a very happy occasion. 

Congratulations!  The Family Home Evening manual may have ideas that you could make work without kids.  Here are random ideas off the top of my head:
1) Start now to build a collection of lessons for when you have kids. (You may be too busy once they arrive...)
2) Play games (if you like playing games).  We played games in my family and I miss it (and it's not about the games, it's just about spending time together).
3) Spend time learning each other's hobbies - even if you don't like them - but with no contest or judgement, or expectation of continuing participation, just with the intent of appreciating each other's interests.  For example, maybe he likes some video game, so you play it with him (whether you want to or not), let him teach you how, and the things he enjoys about it, he has to understand that this round of play isn't about winning, it's about sharing.  Then another week, maybe you like scrapbooking, or something artistic or crafty, and you teach him what you do, why, how, what you like about it, what you don't like - again, it's not about getting it right, it's about sharing.
4) Have the difficult conversations.  Maybe this is too serious for FHE, but all too often I hear about couples having troubles later because they never talked about serious stuff early on - and if you're going to have serious conversations, starting them off with a prayer and an opening hymn sounds like a good idea to me.
5) You could study the scriptures together.  Maybe write your thoughts in a journal for your future children.  Or maybe any thoughts for them, not just about scriptures - random things that they can read before you die (as opposed to normal journals).
6) Do some genealogy.  At the very least, get yourselves and your parents in familysearch.org, but I'll bet you could do a lot more - it's much easier with FamilySearch than it was in the days of paper and microfiche...
7) Whatever it is that you guys think is fun and will help you be happy as a couple and a family.  Mix it up - do fun stuff, spiritual stuff, family stuff, project stuff, etc.  Variety can keep it interesting - it doesn't have to rigidly follow a pre-defined outline.
FWIW.