Fether
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Posts posted by Fether
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18 minutes ago, Just_A_Guy said:
I haven’t seen his latest video (and frankly, am not likely to, if it’s really 45 minutes long).
In the last few months or so I do remember hearing that he had said he was going to date guys, but also keep the law of chastity. That . . . didn’t strike me as the wisest course of action. If you’re struggling with porn, then justifying your perusal of a Sports Illustrated swimsuit issue on the grounds that “they aren’t naked, and this lets me pursue my God-given desires without crossing the line into unchastity” is, at minimum, a darned foolhardy thing to do. Absolute denial—to “cross ourselves in all these things”, as Alma put it—is harsh and unpopular medicine these days; but I am increasingly persuaded that it’s the only medicine that works.
I wish him well. It sounds like he, along with most youth today, is being seduced by the idea that an unsexed life is not worth living. We (the Church) certainly didn’t teach him that . . .
Good news, it isn’t 45 minutes. It’s 58 minutes.
This is actually a fairly heated topic right now. David Archuletta, Tom Christofferson, and Stacey Harkey have all announced they will start dating. It seems to be a new frontier that the Latter-day Saint lgbtq community is pushing.
Additionally, BYU removed the “dont participate in homosexual behavior” phrasing from their honor code and there were some professors who felt they could make some commentary on it. This lead to some clarification but not reinstating the phrase in the honor code. Since then there had been a ton more people asking if it is ok to date the same gender as long as you keep the law of chastity (which I always thought any homosexual romantic act was against the LOC but apparently that isn’t widely accepted).
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I don’t think David and the many many other LGBTQ saints are looking for doctrinal explanations for what they ought to do. It seems to me that they are in immense pain, have tried everything they can to get through it, and haven’t seen the light.
It seems more to be a cry for help. David himself said that his post was more about getting things off his chest.
I know what the prescribed doctrinal answers are… but I don’t know how to help David, and others in his situation, overcome these immense feelings he is facing. I think the best thing one can do is mourn with those that more and comfort those that stand in need of comfort.
- NeuroTypical, MrShorty, carlimac and 2 others
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35 minutes ago, Traveler said:
I do not believe such a scripture exists (If I am wrong I would be most glad to learn otherwise). I do not think D&C 88:32 applies beyond a single individual. As far as a public celebration for anyone other than the Celestial Kingdom - I am skeptical of any celebration other than Satan and his followers - and I doubt that even they would celebrate except for those of whom they would have gained power over. If anything those that fail to make and keep covenants (loyal to G-d in every way) I see only regret - except the the individual exercising their agency.
The Traveler
It’s not o e of those direct scriptural phrases that makes a specific message clearly and plainly. It wasn’t a deliberate “all decisions will be. celebrated equally and we are all the same” type scripture (which I get the feeling you think that is what I’m looking for). It was more like a message in passing that there would be some sort of joyous call that we are happier now than on earth… or something like (or nothing like) that.
I have been trying to find that reference for a while but I listen to at least one talk and podcast a day… along with regularly listening to “church” biographies and the likes
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28 minutes ago, CV75 said:
The "DMCR Version" of the Bible is the Dean Marin Celebrity Roast version
Went way over my head and still does haha
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Follow up question… where does the concept that we will all be happy regardless of which degree of glory we go to? I did a little looking and could t find anything solid.
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I read a scripture not that long ago that I can no longer find. The theme of it was something to the effect of "Everyone will be celebrated regardless of which kingdom of glory they go to".
Does anyone know which scripture that is? -
2 hours ago, Traveler said:
You are a much better man than me.
The Traveler
I dont always succeed, just to clarify. But I’ll give some examples of things I’ve gotten rid of or changed.
- Sleeping longer than 8 hours. 6 1/2 - 8 hours is perfect. Anything less is insufficient and beyond that is unnecessary and almost always is a catalyst to a lazy day. Lazy days don’t make me happy so I no longer sleep longer than 8 hours. I use this rule instead of the “wake up early” rule. I still end up waking up really early most mornings, but the 8 hour rule gives me room to adapt when needed
- Studying controversial church topics. Regardless as to whether the article is faithful or not, it drains my energy to read those things. It’s intellectually stimulating, but fails to feed me spiritually. In fact it starved me more. I choose to love longer read those unless it is necessary to help someone. This is one I fail at often, but I am working on it
- Playing video games when I have other more important things to do. I save all video games for when my other tasks are done (like scriptures, journaling, preparing for the day, etc.) and only when my kids are asleep.
- Playing games online. This is one I am working on myself with. I’m trying to teach myself to not get angry when I lose to someone else online. This is similar to the sports thing you mentioned earlier.
- Vort and JohnsonJones
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Just now, Traveler said:
I never competed in the usual team sports beyond church ball - but back in the 60's I was on a softball team that won the all church wide tournament - but it was not because of me. I do have a bronze in armature competition for skiing and cycling. Currently cycling is a little bit of a disappointment - for the over 70 (I am 75) there is a guy that is 80 that always beats me and after my accident last year my wife has insisted that I quit competition. Since I love her more than competing it looks like I am left with skiing and cycling for pleasure.
As for support for college teams - I have always been somewhat of a BYU fan. Across all sports that BY U competes in - accumulatively they are ranked in the top 10 - but the football team laid and egg in their bowl game. In basketball we lost our two centers for the season and thus struggle with national caliber teams.
Even professional teams struggle. There is only one champion so there the other 31 teams will disappoint their fans (some more than others). And the team that is the champion will disappoint their fans more over the next 10 years than win championships. So unless you enjoy routing for a looser (which I don't) reality will bring more disappointment than the joys of bragging rights.
But @LDSGator is right about lesson learned through sports. For example - in the ancient Grease Olympic games, the title of those officiating the competition to make sure everything was fair was cheaters. That term has a most interesting evolution in the longest existing sports on this planet.
The Traveler
I do agree completely, just poking fun.
I’ve started to become hyper sensitive to things that drain my energy and make me mad. If I find something that does that, and I can’t change how it makes me feel, I remove it from my life.
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17 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:
The new inflation numbers are out, we’re now running a little more than 7%.
I also remember reading somewhere that last year, or some year before that, the federal reserve stopped trying to keep annual inflation around 2-3% and are not trying to keep the decade long average to 2-3%.
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16 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:
The new inflation numbers are out, we’re now running a little more than 7%. Is anyone besides me feeling it?
In related news, there’s a family of traveling minstrels that show up at the grocery store parking lot with their cardboard sign and a violin and a speaker. They are quite talented, and I enjoy their performance, so I don’t mind giving them a buck.
Today, however, the guy argued with me. He said “A dollar? This is for food! For rent!” I told him it’s what I had, he just looked at me with scorn and refused to take it.
I guess I can see his point. Fast food joints around here pay 15 bucks an hour, the minimum wage keeps going up, rents keep increasing. Inflation stinks. A dollar is the new small pittance of coins to a street beggar. Suddenly, raking in about 200 bucks in a couple hours just doesn’t go as far as it used to.
My wife pointed out that she doesn’t remember our grocery bill ever being as high as it is.
Its going to be VERY interesting to see what the next few years bring. Another crash followed by a return to normal? Or are the conspiracies true (and the last few years have quite the track record of conspiracies) and this is the new normal?
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6 hours ago, Comp said:
I've never heard of it. What are some reasons you would you recommend it?
David O McKay had a VERY strong journaling habit and because of this we have a large amount of records of his day to day dealings and inner thoughts. He helped bring the church world wide and he was one of the Prophets alive during the civil rights movement. I’m sure there is more coming because it is like a 25 hour long audio book and I’m only 3 hours in.
So far it has shared David O McKays dealing with public slander from a family member, him eating rum cake and tell everyone to chill out, problems Bruce R McConkie and Joseph Fielding Smith caused for the church, the birth of non-doctrinal teachings that still permeation in the church, some of the things the brethren were concerned with in their meetings, the racist views he held, and a statement from him where he says he has never seen Christ (which isn’t a big deal, but you don’t see much of)
It does an incredible job of painting a picture of what our leaders are like and how just like us they are. There are a ton members today that hold on to these unrealistic views that the Prophets are somehow ascended to a higher plain than us and speak with God face to face every day. I think everyone should read this book and stop mystifying the brethren that lead us. Let’s follow them to the end, but don’t expect them to be something they are not.
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David O McKay and the rise of modern mormonism
Im not even half way through this and I would recommend every Latter-day Saint read it
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2 hours ago, LDSGator said:
It’s interesting you say that because some of the biggest mistakes I've made were when I trusted my gut over my mind. It’s not just me either. I’ve seen people “trust their gut” and lose money, burn relationships, and ruin their lives.
Trusting your gut is nice, and I’m glad it works for you, but often times I hear people say that and get into massive trouble. Someone can “trust their gut” and run off with their secretary, leaving a long term relationship. Or, they can “trust their gut”, dislike a new co worker, and never give that guy or girl a chance, even if the new person does literally nothing wrong. I could go on. Your gut/instinct can lie to you too, but if you (generic) have a big/fragile ego you won’t be able to see it.
I think most people should trust their mind and think things through rather than their gut.
I would add that it works when I trust my gut while following the commandments and it’s on important matters. I remember times in my life making bets (not with money) based on a gut feeling and it too didn’t work out.
If I were to explain the confirmation I had in dropping out of college to move to Vegas (ok ok… this doesnt sound good so far) to work, I would describe it both as spiritual confirmation and as a gut feeling. I don’t know how to distinguish the two. Our experience there and since has been nothing but blessings.
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I subscribe the Darren Daily, which is a daily video from Darren Hardy about success and excellence in life.
This morning he had a video about following your gut and he pointed out he never ever once regretted following his gut, nor had he ever heard someone say they regretted following their gut.
I shared his experience and it got me thinking. My gut feelings tend to be extremely reliable and I know in the past I have defined that “gut feeling” as being from the spirit. Can that feeling, in some way, be related to the spirit?
- Just_A_Guy, Anddenex and Vort
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In the Old Testament times, there were two events that were almost identical, yet the solution to these two events were very different.
Daniel and the Lion’s Den:
A law is sent out that men should not pray to God. Daniel ignores the law and is thrown in the lion’s den. Because of his faith, he witnesses a miracle and his relationship with the king grows.
This story seems to suggest that we act in faith in the face of death. Doing so brings miracles.
People of Alma in bondage:
Alma and his people are under the rule of Amulon. Amulon says “if you prayer, we will kill you”. Alma tells his people to pray in your hearts to avoid death. Crisis averted.
Thisnis a story about prayer and how it can be done without the traditional forms we tend to us. It also seems like praying in Your heart is a lesser form of prayer since it is only prescribed as a complete replacement when normal prayer is no longer an option.
So why the difference in application? Could Daniel not have just started praying in his heart to avoid the lion’s den? Could the people of Alma just continued to pray in faith and expect a miracle?
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1 hour ago, LDSGator said:
Honestly? How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie. Sure, it’s dismissed as self help and vapid, but it’s anything but.
It does not take great insight to see that many adults are sad, angry and lonely, looking for meaningful relationships. I truly believe that if more people read that book it would give them the tools needed to go out and form meaningful friendships.
It’s true that nothing will make everyone like you, and haters will always find reasons to hate. But this book can truly change your life for the better
I read 1-2 “self help” and “vapid” books every month and they keep me feeling excellent and giving me energy to be an incredible husband, father, Saint, and provider. 70% of who I am today has come from those types of books.
- NeuroTypical and LDSGator
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3 hours ago, Ironhold said:
For fun -
You're tasked with helping to stock a brand-new library that will be open to the public.
The usual items - an encyclopedia set, a dictionary, a thesaurus, local newspapers, holy books, and such - are already taken care of.
What's the first book you order to put in there?
The Book of Mormon…
… There, now that I got the required (yet true) answer of of the way…
Self Help: Atomic Habits
Fiction: Ink Heart (followed by the rest of the series)
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On 1/2/2022 at 4:03 PM, Suzie said:
Yesterday, I finished watching the last season of Cobra Kai. Obsessed is an understatement!
Greatest series I have seen in a LONG time. It’s an original story that doesn’t lean on its origin series. It uses the nostalgia and fan service cards in a very classy manner
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They use to come out fairly regularly.
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- Covid will no longer be a concern for anyone
- Russia will continue being Russia and will probably claim Ukraine and stop all their Russiaing with respect to their border
- China will lay a stronger claim on Taiwan then stop their Chinaing once they have it
- Middle East will keep middle easting, but nothing major done against the US itself.
- Major conflict continues to grow around Israel, perhaps this will be where our military focus will go
- economy blows up and life gets better. But the housing market will be entering a new phase of existence. Owning homes will no longer be part of the American dream. Only people who own homes will be people who inherit their homes and the rich. Renting will become the national standard.
- Internet 3.0, Meta Verse, NFTs and crypto currency will slowly creep in until we really cannot function in society without have digital property of some sort. We will all slowly start spending more and more time in virtual reality until Ready Player One, the Matrix, Jumanji, Tron, Twilight Zone, and Black Mirror are no longer seen as science fiction.
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43 minutes ago, LDSGator said:
It’s a fair question though @Fether, especially at first. Two people can “just know” something and come to diametrically opposed conclusions. So when coming from a converts POV, saying you “just know” something based on nothing but feelings-it can be very confusing. Especially when you’ve been taught your entire life to trust reason over feelings.
I think it is a great question to consider! It can lead to some great introspection and becoming more deliberate with what you believe. It’s when people start debating over whether someone “knows” something or not that the conversation becomes tiresome
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21 minutes ago, Anddenex said:
we are unable "to know" anything.
This topic of what it means to “know” is incredibly frustrating. If you debate it enough, it always ends up with “do we really know anything?”. At which point the philosophical thinking loses all practical merit and is nothing more than making castles in the mud.
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3 hours ago, Carborendum said:
I don't blame you for this. I had a very similar philosophy at your age. But as I got to really understand the nature of "knowledge" and "faith", I began realizing that having such rigid ideals was quite limiting. This mentality was actually stifling both my spiritual and intellectual growth.
The realization I came to was that "I believe" and "I know" are not the separated conditions that we tend to think they are. It could EASILY be said that we NEVER "know" anything (Enter: The Matrix). If so, why bother ever having such a word?
Instead, I see that they are simply two sides of the same coin. If you believe, you also know. I don't see it (as many do) as a graduation from one stage to another. I see them as different aspects of the same concept. And within that concept (a coin) we can increase the value of the denomination. (I use the term "denomination" purposefully).
The point most tend to miss is that we never know "EVERYTHING". So, if we come across some factoid that tends to threaten our belief system, we begin to doubt everything. That isn't even how we approach scientific knowledge. Why would be do that with deeply held religious convictions?
In the scientific method, we see the Michelson--Morley experiment shook the scientific world. But we still taught the same Newtonian physics in schools, Research continued merrily along without any change. But a branch of scientific research went aside to explain it. Then came the birth of relativistic physics. It didn't really change what we knew before. It just added to it.
The Lord teaches us line-by-line and precept-upon-precept. He works that way from dispensation to dispensation. He works that way from generation to generation. He works that way from individual to individual.
Just because there is something we don't "know" doesn't mean that we need to throw out what we DO "know".
I’m familiar with the different meanings behind what it means to “know”. We have had similar conversations on this in the past that have gone quite in depth.
I also do not see knowledge as a graduation from faith. I see them as separate. Knowledge is something that we can test and record scientifically. Faith comes from choosing to believe something that is not seen. Knowledge is thrust upon us. Faith is chosen. Knowledge is a matter of fact that we cannot manipulate. Faith comes from character.
For the purpose of bearing my testimony, I say “I know following the word of wisdom brings joy” and “I know we receive answers to our prayers”. I also make statements like “this is God’s church upon the earth” and “The Book of Mormon is the word of God.” I feel, however, that if I were to say “ I know the church is true”, the word “know” doesn’t seem to fit the message I am wanting to convey.
Gays and the church
in LDS Gospel Discussion
Posted · Edited by Fether
There also seems to be this idea that it is the church’s duty to punish all acts of immorality. Everything from rape down to eating too much food and not exercising.
If the church doesn’t have a corporal punishment for an act, it must be ok to do.