kyrie_eleison

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    Ottawa, Canada
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    Catholic

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  1. I think Jesus said, "Whoever does not love me more than his mother or father or brothers or sisters cannot follow me." I certainly feel that tension in my own very secular family.
  2. My field of study in university was classical studies with a minor in comparative religions, so I understand this completely.
  3. Yes. It is not enough to just know the truth. You must also live it. Yes. I walked into a Catholic Church and feel on my knees and told God that I could not believe. But I would give him nine months to guide my heart to learn from him. I allowed myself to be lead by him, I read scriptures, and learned about the Catholic Faith. And I believe he lead me to learn about the post Christian writers to help me understand how the apostles handed down the faith and what structures they established, and how we should understand the sacraments, the Eucharist, the offices of bishops, priest, deacon, and laity. I agree fully. Faith seeking understanding. There is the initial moment of faith, then it is a matter of seeking to understand the contents of revelation. God bless, Daniel
  4. Agreed. I think that we must reject radical skepticism. But the Christian faith is at its root, a historical faith. Questions like "Did Jesus actually exist" or "Did the Apostles or the other Apostolic writers actually write the Gospels", and "Did they provide fairly accurate details about the sayings and words of Jesus", are important for us to be able to answer with the same rigor as we do for other historical texts. Does this prove the contents of Jesus' revelation of himself as the son of God? No. Even the miracles documented in the new testament do not necessarily do this. At some point, we must make an act of faith. Having said that, the historicity of the new testament writings is an important factor in that leap of faith. It creates a groundwork, so to speak. The church calls them the preambles of faith. These preambles are not to be confused with the faith itself, but they should not be overlooked. Faith is a gift of God that we cannot earn for ourselves. Catholics are no Pelagians. But we must not confuse that gift of faith with adherence to a specific holy book. I honestly believe that there are Mormons who have true faith. Likely many Mormons. But the faith has an emotional and intellectual component. When I first came to faith in God, my understanding of my Catholic Tradition was extremely limited and in many cases, serious erroneous. We have the hard, but joyful and fruitful task of searching the scriptures and coming to know God more and more. God bless, Daniel
  5. Thanks. This is number 7. LOL I will need a new car now. .................................................. so many diapers.......................... God will provide.
  6. Hi Jane, I'm going to eventually respond to your posts, but I've been broad sided by an announcement from my wife that involves two red lines. This will take me some time to process.... ] Blarg~!~~~~~~!!!
  7. I happen to agree with this, although I think the problem dates back to the enlightenment thinkers like Descartes, Lockes, and Hobbs. Thomas Aquinas saw revelation as superior to what can be gleaned from philosophy and the natural sciences. I believe in revelation, but, along with the Catholic Church, I believe that public revelation ended with the last New Testament apostle when God revealed his Son. God bless, Daniel
  8. I mean no offense. I sincerely pray that if Mormonism is the truth of God, that he will make this clear to me. But as anatess so rightly said, sometimes God needs to tear down what is already in place before he can rebuild. And I don't see him doing that.
  9. Love the Filipinos! When I was in university, one of my best friends was a local Filipino priest. We do Karaoke together. He would also take me to the local Filipino restaurant. He was treated like royalty! He is helped me survive in a very secular environment. And God bless your mother. I'm sure her prayers come from a good place. About the "ripping apart" - I experienced that in my early life. My agnostic secularism had to be ripped apart, so to speak. I had to make an act of faith against reason. My "I will trust you for now, for a little," was a window of opportunity that I wanted to give to God to convince me that the scriptures were true and that the Catholic Church was true church. I would liken it to an intellectual suicide. But as I learned more about history I learned to trust in at least the factual reliability of the Old and New Testament, and my faith in the church was solidified through my studies of the post new testament writers and the ecumenical councils. Now it is clear to me that my "Intellectual suicide" was my path to a solid knowledge. I no longer feel irrational in my faith, but I feel that my faith is a perfectly reasonable faith. I have attempted to do so a few times, but it has been difficult for me to shake off the impression that the writings are not historically factual. I would need to have some kind of reasonable account of the great apostasy first that I felt could explain how the post new testament writers could get it so wrong so soon after the apostles. I would need this before I could seriously look at these writings. My historical work is too much a part of my faith. This is a reasonable explanation, if it is true. Thank you for your post. I appreciate it. God bless, Daniel
  10. Yes. God's truth is ultimate and infallible. He is the guarantor of the truth of scripture. But I would argue he is also the guarantor of the office of the papacy as per Matthew 16:18. For Catholics, scriptures, tradition, and the magisterium are authoritative, with lots of caveats. Its a big topic. Academic work is at best an input to the magisterium in its deliberations, however much the academics would like to think of themselves as a kind of parallel magisterium. Maybe your concept of modern day revelation as given by his modern day apostles is somewhat analogous to the catholic magistium, except that we consider public revelation to be closed after the death of the last new testament apostle. The magisterium works on providing official authoritative interpretations of the new testament and that becomes the part of tradition. Hmmm... I guess the concept of the great apostasy would be a stumbling block for me then. Not that the catholic church sees the post-new testament writings as authoritative like scripture, but it does testify to the growing body of tradition. But there is not much room to dialog when your view is that everything fell apart after the apostles until Joseph Smith appeared 1800 years later. No offense taken at all. Perhaps I could focus on the LDS academic view of the progress of the great apostasy. What was its chronology and how did the church end up with the likes of Polycarp, Ignatius of Antioch, and Clement of Rome. God bless, Daniel
  11. Agreed. I also think that truth cannot contradict truth. Because whatever is true is from God. One of the key aspects of my journey was a need to know that the old and new testaments were historically reliable. That was one of the reasons why I wanted to do classical studies in University. I was also able to understand the limitations of the historical critical method and how radical skepticism about the scriptures was not reasonable when compared with how other historical documents are treated. This was a matter of faith seeking understanding. And I found more than enough evidence to justify my original act of faith. But the next big question in my journey was the question of whether I was in the right church. And that took me to the post New Testament writers. Clement, Polycarp, and Ignatius of Antioch were key in confirming to me that I was in the right church, at least in terms of sacramental and ecclesial structure. The office of bishop, priest, deacon, and laity was very much in evidence and their focus on baptism, the Eucharist, and so on. But I will also admit that my intellectual journey was as a lapsed Catholic. Mormon literature never crossed my path. The closest I ever came to discussing these topics with a Mormon was when I was working the front desk of a hotel. One of my co-workers was a nice old guy who was very much on fire for his Mormon faith. I tried to get him to read 1st Clement, but he kept on interpreting things from a Mormon perspective. We also talked about celibacy and we looked at 1st Corinthians 7. He said my translation was faulty and his translation was the correct one. Anyway, I was frustrated and the conversations soon ended after that. So I thought there must be a Mormon academic take on these subjects. Something that can explain how a Mormon might intellectually incorporate these writers into their view of history. Even if it a list of errors that slowly accrued as early as 1st Clement and the writings of Ignatius of Antioch. God bless, Daniel
  12. Thanks for your response Jane. I suppose it boils down to a faith and tradition? Faith = Referring to God directly for answers in terms of personal revelation. Tradition = Referring to the prophets of God. But in that order, not the other way around. Does that sound right? I suppose in my conversion/reversion, I had a similar experience. My initial move towards God was an act of faith despite all my doubts. Sort of like, "I'll trust you God for a little." And that faith slowly grew and I made more acts of trust. With that trust, my understanding also grew. Especially the idea that God is Truth, with a capital T. So anything that is true comes from God. I love that about him. God bless, Daniel
  13. Hi, I am wondering if there are any good Mormon web sites or books that deal with post New Testament Christian writers like Didache, Clement, Polycarp, Ignatius of Antioch, Clement of Alexandria, Origen, Tertullian, Cyprian of Carthage, Gergory Thaumaturgus, Hyppolitus, Irenaeus, and so on. I'm looking for content that shows how these pre-council of Nicaea writers harmonize with current LDS doctrines and writings. I'm looking for something positive, not reactive, and presents a consistent view of history. Something academic would be good, but popular is OK too. My background in university was classical studies, so Greek and Roman history. Later on I started reading post New Testament Christian writings, mainly from a Catholic perspective, but I also read Anglican and Calvinist views as well. So it has been a hobby of mine for the last 15 years or so. Anyway, thanks in advance for any help you can provide. God bless, Daniel
  14. Thanks for the warm welcome! Yes. I'm Catholic. Looking forward to some good conversations.
  15. Hi Folks, My name is Dan. I'm looking for some light conversation and fun topics to talk about. I'm interested in getting out of my online bubble. I tend to visit the same blogs and the same forums every day. I'd like to mix things up a little. I'm not Mormon, so I hope that will be OK. I don't want to argue with anyone. I just want to get to know how you see the world. Cheers, Daniel