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  1. Like
    scottyg reacted to Still_Small_Voice in socialism   
    When the government takes by force all or most of private property from citizens to try to make everyone equal everyone ends up in poverty.  President David O. McKay said:  “The position of this Church on the subject of Communism has never changed. We consider it the greatest satanical threat to peace, prosperity, and the spread of God’s work among men that exists on the face of the earth.”
    Consecration is the system that will lift everyone from poverty but it requires a good and pure people.  All people need to be willing to work diligently and productively and be honest.  The rich need to be willing to share their excess with the poor and not live lavishly.  The common people need to be content with their substance and possessions.  
    Capitalism is the system that presently distributes more wealth to every person and is better than anything else out there now.  And we can live consecration now by paying our tithes and offerings and giving our excess wealth to help lift others.  
    Edit: Also, avoiding debt will enable us to give more to others spiritually and temporally.
  2. Like
    scottyg reacted to NeuroTypical in Stopping COVID   
    Oddly enough, the same thing happens with wars.  We all knew the daily death toll of our engagements in Iraq and Afghanistan, and heard about every stubbed toe and sunburn at Guantanamo Bay when there was a Bush in charge.    Then Obama won on promising to close Gitmo and friendly up with the world and end wars, and suddenly we didn't hear a peep about wars or Gitmo for 8 years.  And Obama became the first US President in the entire history of our nation, to exit office 8 years later in the exact same wars as when he entered office.   These days, the antiwar left gets ticked and screams bloody murder whenever Trump brings troops home from places like Syria.
    Yes indeed, if Biden wins, I expect all my hard left buddies will suddenly get behind reopening schools and the economy and businesses.  And they'll start publicly opining about how we need to stop violence in the streets.
  3. Like
    scottyg reacted to estradling75 in Reverse Boycott   
    In physics we learn that it requires effort to create and maintain a vacuum.  If you do not put forth the effort to maintain it, it will quickly become corrupted by whatever it can pull in.
    It seems in  that psychology we have something similar.  Ask anyone trying to break a habit or addiction if they just stop they create a type of "vacuum" that makes it very very hard to break free.  They almost always have to substitute something else in.
    It seem that boycotts that are a simple "stop doing something" fall into this "vacuum" category.  Therefore they do not last unless they are very well organized and can maintain the effort or they switch something else in.  Boycotts against things like Goya, Target or Nike, if they are not part of your life then you have already boycotted them, if they are then to start boycotting them you really have to replace them.  Stopping would only last as long as an individual's will power.
    Which is why I think the more effective ways do not appear to be ones that ask/tell/demand that we stop, but rather ones that redirect and replace. 
  4. Like
    scottyg reacted to Traveler in Temples And Protection   
    You think so?  Where in Jerusalem is anyone exchanging their swords for plowshares, spears into pruning hooks and the thoughts of war being removed.  Or are you saying that these are not "the last days"?  And this thread is about temples - where in Jerusalem is there a temple?
    Keep in mind that Isaiah was in the northern Kingdom prior to the fall of the northern Kingdom.  Jerusalem was built upon mountains but is obviously not at the top of the mountains.  Isaiah introduces another word in verse 3 - the word is Zion.  The particular ancient poetic structure of Isaiah is written in a bifid structure of Near Eastern Literary patterns and is the most complex example in all Hebrew scripture - which by format suggests parallelism (among other literary techniques) - meaning that the verses are intended to be understood to mean more than is expressed.  - - If you like I can provide references from experts in ancient Hebrew and Jewish traditions.  
    Jesus used parallelism as well in his parables and teachings with examples of living waters that do much more that quench thirst from the desert sun.
    The Traveler
  5. Confused
    scottyg reacted to romans8 in Sabbath Worship from Home   
    The chorus for this song has
    Hail to the Prophet, ascended to heaven!
    Traitors and tyrants now fight him in vain.
    Mingling with Gods, he can plan for his brethren;
    Death cannot conquer the hero again.
    Did some revelation lead the church to believe he ascended to heaven or is this a theoretical 
    song?  Did the NT church also sing a similar hymn of Peter or Paul?
  6. Like
    scottyg reacted to Midwest LDS in What would you have done if you'd seen the ark wobble?   
    The natural man part of me would have wanted to try and steady it. I would hope my spiritual sensitivity would have been strong enough to resist that urge, all of the Israelites and especially the Levites knew God had said he would protect the Ark, but the flesh is often weak. But then that is the point of the story. We have to learn in life to avoid "steadying the ark" in situations where, just like Uzzah did, we "know" God's church is failing and we are the only one's who can fix it. I put know in quotation marks to represent that we are wrong but are convinced we are right. That's what makes ark steadying such a tempting sin and why the Lord was so clear in warning us against it.
  7. Like
    scottyg reacted to Plein Air in .   
  8. Like
    scottyg reacted to Anddenex in Your thoughts please?   
    Nothing you don't already know, "Simon, lovest thou me.... Feed my sheep." In as much as you have done it unto the least of these my brethren you have done it unto me.
  9. Confused
    scottyg reacted to Jonah in Temples And Protection   
    Through Jesus our High Priest or do we require an earthly high priest?
  10. Like
    scottyg reacted to Colirio in Liberals in the Church   
    For myself, while I tend towards ideals that most would consider conservative, the truth is that I pretty much view politics as a distraction from what is most important: The Plan of Salvation. 
    It’s why we are here in mortality. 
    It seems to me that many of us spend so much time debating which political ideology has the greater merit that we forget that living and sharing the gospel of Jesus Christ has infinitely more merit than all other ideals. 
  11. Like
    scottyg reacted to Traveler in Liberals in the Church   
    When it comes to labels - I do not know what I am.  Not knowing how I fit into labels often causes we to wonder how it is that others have been able to resolve such things for themselves.  I have had major disagreements with dissenters of our church.  I have also had major disagreements with various stake presidents, bishops and others that were called to give me direction according to the order of the priesthood.   As G-d is my witness I have also had major disagreements with my parents and my beloved wife.  In fact I believe that I can honestly say I have had some disagreements with everybody I know - I have even had some confusion and disagreements with myself.   In my prayers, there are times I have challenged the wisdom of the G-d I worship.  I am trying to figure out all the things I ought to repent of.  This idea of disagreements - is causing me to wonder about disagreeing with disagreeing.  
    Here are some thoughts which can spark more disagreements:
    #1. I am tempted to dislike anyone with whom I disagree - but worse --- I am more tempted to dislike anyone that disagrees with me.  I wish I could just apologize and move on but I have discovered that often my critics will disagree with my apology.  I am sure it is for the same reason that I disagree with certain others insincere apologizes.  
    #2. I am convinced that most disagreements are the result of misunderstandings.
    #3.  I tend to believe that the overwhelming causes of misunderstandings are the other person's fault.
    #4. I believe a lot of disagreements are the result differing points of view or perspectives.  This creates arguments where no one know what is going on in the disagreements.  These kind of disagreements can be humorous for anyone on the outside and quite bitter for those on the inside. 
    #5. On extremely rare occasions there are disagreements where two people understand each other and actually disagree.
    For myself - I can best mitigate a disagreement I have with someone if they will explain their logic by which they came to their conclusion.   But this is most difficult because it seems that very few that disagree with me care why.  In religious disagreements often "Faith" is played like a trump card such that those that do not so think are evil and lack faith in G-d and that any attempts to employ logic or sense; is the natural man that should be cast off.  I wonder if such is more emotional than intelligent light of truth or spiritual.  But what worries me the most is that because we are fallen - we are in a state outside of G-d's justice, grace, his light and and his understanding --- Which means that in all disagreements - I have fault and need repentance.  How can I repent when I am sure I am right?  I find part of the answer in realizing that repenting is seeing from a different point of view.
    The Traveler
  12. Okay
    scottyg reacted to MarginOfError in Liberals in the Church   
    It wasn't just you, but there were moments that if you had been in the same room I might have broken your nose. You've been better since I've returned to the group, as evidenced that I'm actually willing to engage in discussion with you. 
    I won't claim I'm perfect, nor will I claim I've never acted with animosity towards others here. I've been learning a lot of patience. Apologies are probably in order toward you as well, and you may consider this my apology. 
    Replying to Carb and scotty, I actually did take a three year or so hiatus from the forum beginning in 2015. 
  13. Like
    scottyg reacted to Just_A_Guy in Liberals in the Church   
    Towards the end of his life Faust described himself as a fiscal conservative but a liberal on “social and human rights issues” (as defined in the late 1990s).  His activity as party chair was in the mid-1950s, and he was a GA (and mostly out of the political game) by the time Roe v. Wade was decided; two years after Roe he gave a conference talk in which he described himself as an “advocate for the unborn”.
    Faust served in the inner circle of Church leadership at a time when the priesthood ban was fully in place, supported the Church’s Indian Placement Program, endorsed the Church’s policy against elective abortion, was aware of the treatment of the September Six, was on the board of BYU when they were experimenting with electroshock therapy on gay people, and was a signatory to the Proclamation on the Family. “The dogma”, as Senator Feinstein would have said, “lived loudly in Faust”.  And under his watch the Church accrued massive financial reserves, a relative fraction of which went for directly humanitarian purposes.  He was an unabashed public admirer of that great liberal boogeyman, Brigham Young.
    *I* don’t have any problem with Faust for any of the above issues.  But then, I’m a conservative.  It seems spectacularly revisionist to try to characterize Faust as a “liberal” in the modern sense of the word.  The modern Democratic Party would have very little use for a man like that; he’d have been cancelled long ago.
  14. Like
    scottyg reacted to Grunt in Liberals in the Church   
    It SHOULD be harder to hold most liberal views in Church than it is to hold most conservative views.  It's also ABSOLUTELY necessary to call it out when seen.  I don't want you asking my children the hard questions to get them to consider alternative views.  I want you to teach them the gospel and teachings of the Prophets.  Period.   

    There were two groups of members that made my conversion more difficult than it had to be:  those who loved to sit in class and discuss things they "believed" were true but had zero teachings to support them and those who thought it was cool to be "edgy".  

  15. Like
    scottyg reacted to anatess2 in Taking Odds on the Election   
    A lot of people like to say this.  Yet, they have no idea who are making the guidelines and why.  "Wear a mask"... "Why?"... "Because the internet says you won't transmit Cov-19 if you wear one."... "But I don't have Cov-19."... "You don't know if you have Cov-19"... "I've been quarantined in my house for 4 months and have not come into contact with anybody close enough to catch Cov-19"... "You don't know're going to kill grandma"... "So, how do you know that wearing a mask will stop grandma from dying?"... "Because the internet..."
  16. Thanks
    scottyg reacted to Just_A_Guy in Temples And Protection   
    Art thou the only “Christian” in a forum full of Mormon heretics, and knowest not these things?
  17. Like
    scottyg reacted to Still_Small_Voice in CHAZ renamed again—the Seattle Police-free Autonomous Zone   
    I liked what someone said about these autonomous zones.  They said it was like someone moving into their parents garage and saying they were their own nation while demanding their Mom give them cooked meals, do their dirty laundry and also having their parents keep paying the home mortgage, water and power bills.
  18. Like
    scottyg got a reaction from Carborendum in Temples And Protection   
    I agree. One possible benefit of this inability to do temple work is that in our stake the first steps of temple work has increased, namely, family history. The number of people doing indexing and submitting names (especially the youth) has gone up.
    I too have "gone through" a session or two, and have not always been as alert, attentive, or reverent as I could have been. When it comes time for the Temple doors to reopen I will definitely have a different level of appreciation for it.
  19. Haha
    scottyg reacted to anatess2 in CHAZ renamed again—the Seattle Police-free Autonomous Zone   
    Yep.  Bikers for Trump is the name of the organization.  They planned on celebrating July 4th at Capitol Hill.  I haven't heard that the event is cancelled.  Hell's Angels was going to join too.
    Anyway, CHAZ came down because they realized they need a "white person who has a background in security"... check the vid below.  It's hilarious.
  20. Like
    scottyg reacted to Traveler in Temples And Protection   
    What impressed me was that the great and thorough thinker that Brother Nibley was - that he discovered something new and exciting with each visit.  I will share one of my own.  I have often wondered why the Book of Mormon talked about those that were "stiff necked" as if this is a special kind of stubborn.   And there is - when the nick remains unmoved and unwilling in covenant.
    The Traveler
  21. Like
    scottyg got a reaction from Traveler in Temples And Protection   
    Those would have been very rewarding would be interesting to know the things that those who are both so temporally and spiritually advanced, like Hugh Nibley, learn in the temple.
    I certainly hope that's the case.
  22. Okay
    scottyg reacted to Traveler in Temples And Protection   
    I have wondered if I ought to respond with a certain thought.  There are "pieces" to our temple worship.   One piece is specific to prayers or perhaps I should say temple prayers.  I have received counsel that in seeking understanding to answers to specific prayers that the proper "order" and to be a part of temple prayer according to our covenants and worship and then to be still and quite and instead of continuing our personal prayer in the Celestial room that we listen, meditate and await the spiritual answer and shift from our spiritual utterances to listening to the L-rd. 
    The Traveler
  23. Like
    scottyg got a reaction from Midwest LDS in Utahns! With COVID numbers rising, would you cancel a reunion?   
    No, Bishops and Stake Presidents were asked by area authorities to begin prayerfully developing plans on how to hold meetings again. Stake presidents were then asked to have those meeting plans (created with Bishops) approved by their Area Seventy, and be incorporated into the area plan. The practices vary between church area and stake, but all of their plans are approved by church headquarters. Again, local leaders were told to start holding meetings again. They are not doing this on their own, but are given the freedom to develop some parts of their plan. Some aspects of plans have been approved, some rejected, and other aspects are requirements from the First presidency. The individual stake and area plans may be different, but all are approved by the General Authorities. We have one Bishop in our Stake who is very much opposed to meeting again, but he is following the guidance of his leaders to meet, and his ward has been greatly blessed.
    Other in-person Sunday meetings outside of Sacrament Meeting, such as Relief Society and Priesthood meetings, are not approved by the First Presidency at this time. Other church functions, such as Baptisms and Weddings, can be held if the maximum number of participants in less than 20, and weekly youth meetings/activities can be held if the number is also under 20, and if social distancing is practiced throughout the activity...this has not yet happened in our stake as we cannot trust the kids to practice social distancing yet.
    Wards here are not going rogue. Church leadership is fully aware of all meetings taking place. If you want to know why the church would open wards in certain areas, or want to comment on how legally stupid you think our leaders are, I recommend you write to church headquarters and share your feelings. Be sure to let them know how you know better than them, and how people in Utah want to do anything and everything to risk others.
  24. Like
    scottyg reacted to Carborendum in Temples And Protection   
    I would urge everyone to listen to and read this GC address by Elder Bednar. It was referenced in this week's CFM manual.
    I was acutely aware of this because of my calling as Temple & FH leader.  But as the speech went on, it became more and more apparent just how important temples are in this day.  TODAY.  Right NOW!  Specifically, he talks of the protection we receive because of "Temple Worship".
    But we are prevented from attending the temple.  A part of me wonders if our condemnation for "taking lightly that which we've received" includes the blessings of the temple.  And because of that, we've had our temples taken away from us.  Without our temples, we lose some of the blessings -- which include protections -- from the Lord.
    Speaking of taking lightly... I have to admit that I have no memory of this address when it was first given in 2009.  I'm so sad.
    1. CFM manual talks of the people of Ammon who "never did fall away".
    2. Elder Bednar is quoted (from the above linked talk) as saying.
    Applying that metaphor, it implies that the People of Ammon never fell away because they regularly worshipped in the temples.  The message then is clear.  If we are to never fall away, we must also regularly worship in the temple.  (Alma 26:6).
    This is an important point that I wish were taught more often.
    Now, you may have noticed how I bolded the phrase worshipped in the temple. Here's why.
    I know that I've been guilty of just "going through a session" quite often.  And, again, it is my wife who reminds me that I need to take time to ponder, pray, and listen to the Spirit while in the Celestial Room.
    I'm just now learning this and recognizing the great blessing of the temple.  But I'm denied entry (as is the world).  Why didn't I take more advantage of the temple when I could?
  25. Like
    scottyg reacted to Just_A_Guy in LDS Church donates to Utah Pride Center   
    This.  But let me emphasize, it was for a good cause, and I don’t begrudge the Church for doing it.  To my mind this just reiterates why the Church tends to move cautiously in partnering with outside agencies for humanitarian purposes (particularly when those partners—let’s be frank—hate our living, breathing guts).  And yes; I’m also guilty of more than a little schadenfreude, as @Vort points out.