scottyg

Perhaps these parents just don't understand what education really is. Or, they just want school to be done because they are just fed up with actually taking care of their own kids for once. Who ever thought a parent was more responsible for their child's education than the teacher?  7 year old's don't belong in 3rd grade unless they are a true genius...those types of kids are reading Charlotte's Web at age 4 and doing long division in 1st grade...very rare. Some parents who are now teaching their children for the very first time may think that because their little one knows 2+3=5 they are at the top of the class. These parents have no way to truly grade and judge their child's development because they have no one to compare them to. Kids also miss out on developing many soft and social skills when they don't interact with kids their own age. Advancing children grades should be a rare event.
Many parents view their children with rose colored glasses that are, let's just say, very rosy. Some parents also try to live through their children to make up for past failings and/or insecurities. You see this behavior in youth sports all the time...dad wants little Timmy to make it to the major leagues because dad loves baseball, and so he enrolls him in traveling competitive baseball teams and spends thousands of dollars getting him professional equipment and coaching lessons. What dad doesn't want to see is that Timmy truly sucks at baseball, and will never play beyond high school. Better to even out the eggs than to put them all in one basket with a gaping hole in it.
Now, are some education classes worthless...absolutely. I work in the medical field, and it is a common joke amongst doctors and nurses that none of us ever use the advanced algebra we were "required" to take in order to graduate college. It is true that y=mx+b, but no doctor in the world today actually needs that information to treat patients. I do think it would be better for schools to focus on information that is truly applicable to everyday life, and save the specialized stuff for college. College should be more specialized then it currently is as well...yet so may worthless "general education" courses will always be required because it is such a cash cow for those universities.
Can education be gained outside of school and university walls...yes. However, having a diploma matters, more so for the hard work and sense of accomplishment than the knowledge in my opinion. Kids should not graduate high school without actually learning something. Many millennial parents are setting up the future generation for failure due to a sense of entitlement, lack of work initiative, and an inability to cope with defeat. So many kids and young adults are afraid of the world and just want to stick their head in the sand because they don't know how to apply knowledge and/or think critically. 

If these kids were reading extremely advanced material, doing advanced math, then yes, I'd be all over advocating for them to the skip or accelerate. But the kids I've seen are extremely typical. Not bad students, mind you, just perfectly average for their age. 
As for living through their children, I am seeing one such case where the parents are very much trying to advocate for the schooling they wish they had. It's "well, Mom and Dad did this, so of course the students will be able to achieve such greatness."

Perhaps these parents just don't understand what education really is. Or, they just want school to be done because they are just fed up with actually taking care of their own kids for once. Who ever thought a parent was more responsible for their child's education than the teacher?  7 year old's don't belong in 3rd grade unless they are a true genius...those types of kids are reading Charlotte's Web at age 4 and doing long division in 1st grade...very rare. Some parents who are now teaching their children for the very first time may think that because their little one knows 2+3=5 they are at the top of the class. These parents have no way to truly grade and judge their child's development because they have no one to compare them to. Kids also miss out on developing many soft and social skills when they don't interact with kids their own age. Advancing children grades should be a rare event.
Many parents view their children with rose colored glasses that are, let's just say, very rosy. Some parents also try to live through their children to make up for past failings and/or insecurities. You see this behavior in youth sports all the time...dad wants little Timmy to make it to the major leagues because dad loves baseball, and so he enrolls him in traveling competitive baseball teams and spends thousands of dollars getting him professional equipment and coaching lessons. What dad doesn't want to see is that Timmy truly sucks at baseball, and will never play beyond high school. Better to even out the eggs than to put them all in one basket with a gaping hole in it.
Now, are some education classes worthless...absolutely. I work in the medical field, and it is a common joke amongst doctors and nurses that none of us ever use the advanced algebra we were "required" to take in order to graduate college. It is true that y=mx+b, but no doctor in the world today actually needs that information to treat patients. I do think it would be better for schools to focus on information that is truly applicable to everyday life, and save the specialized stuff for college. College should be more specialized then it currently is as well...yet so may worthless "general education" courses will always be required because it is such a cash cow for those universities.
Can education be gained outside of school and university walls...yes. However, having a diploma matters, more so for the hard work and sense of accomplishment than the knowledge in my opinion. Kids should not graduate high school without actually learning something. Many millennial parents are setting up the future generation for failure due to a sense of entitlement, lack of work initiative, and an inability to cope with defeat. So many kids and young adults are afraid of the world and just want to stick their head in the sand because they don't know how to apply knowledge and/or think critically. 

My reaction on seeing your thread title was, "Absolutely." But on reading your actual OP, these parents are insane. They are the poster parents for the "Why Homeschooling Is Evil" movement.
Of all people, homeschoolers—the real ones—know that performance is the ultimate and only true indicator of educational effectiveness. The attitude you describe is so Out There that I'm tempted to say it's not an appalling travesty at all, but merely a highly localized example of parental insanity that has no bearing on the larger world.

I have pondered what it means to judge and have come to the conclusion that this principle is one of the most misquoted and misused principles in scripture.  I believe it would be better termed as condemn not rather than judge not.  In a sense even "not judging" is a form of judgment.  Likewise - so is ministering, helping and having compassion, a type of judgment.  It is impossible to trust, honor, make a friend, being a support or to be aware of someone without some level of judgment.  Just caring is a level of judgment.
There are other problems with the attitude of not judging that has to do with "Agency" and choice or if you will freedom and liberty.  Agency is not just a choice between possibilities.  Someone is not exercising agency unless they are selecting outcome as well - and that requires judgment.  The human brain is wired to project a desired outcome as part of a choice.  The layman term for this is expectation or dream.  Sometime (quite often) our human expectations (dreams) are unrealistic and based in falsehoods. 
In our society a new term has started to be used - it is called "shaming".  What any particular person sees as shaming can be very revealing.   Often it is an effort to shame someone else that recognizes poor judgments in their personal lives. 
I believe that judgment or condemnation that we are commanded not to conduct is in essence the "Final Judgment" to which one is confined to whatever glory in the resurrection.  This is why  using "damning"  references or terms is considered swearing or a lying tongue and a sin unbecoming a Saint of G-d - even we we are "damning" things we are unhappy with.
And now I wish to make a most important point in the conclusion of this post.  The single most common denominator in the recognized genus of our society it not the abilities of a particular genus - the most common element is that geniuses are mentored.   Genus is created and  made better by someone breaking down and teaching them what to do and accomplish (achieve) and what not to do and not accomplish.  Those that cannot abide criticism will never achieve greatness but will muddle instead in mediocrity and failure.   Jesus Christ is the example of how to mentor.  
I have had many mentors in my life.  The best mentors are examples.  They know and understand the better choices because they have made better choices and repented of the poorer choices.  But sadly most are inclined to look for mentors that will tell them what they want to hear rather than what the should or could hear to improve.
 
The Traveler

Holy goodness that is a great quote

Yup. Both my Father and Mother grew up in households with 8 and 9 people in the house. Each home had only 3 bedrooms. Everyone slept with their siblings. Each home had only 1 bathroom. In my last ward our Bishop had 5 kids...and they lived in a 3 bedroom home with only a minivan for transport. He took the bus or walked 2.5 miles to work every day. 
I am 34 years old with a stay at home wife and 4 kids at home, and my family is surviving on my modest income alone. Our 4 kids share rooms, our home is small, our vehicles are used, and our vacations consist of going camping. We do not spend our money frivolously. We make a budget and stick to it. There is no "standard of living" outside of what we choose the standard to be. We do not have to move our measuring stick to fit the world's ideals. Numbers and charts can be doctored to fit any narrative. The fact remains that people need to stop expecting to live beyond their means; that certain goods are required in today's society...because they aren't. Cuts should be made before a wife has to leave the home to work...she should only do so if truly necessary, as rearing her children always takes priority. Counsel from a man who became a prophet of God is below...yet there will always be those who continue to kick against the pricks..."what he said certainty doesn't apply to me...I am the exception". I would certainly work overtime if need be before I had my wife go to work and leave the children with someone else.
 
"It is a human tendency to want the things which will give us prominence and prestige. We live in a time when borrowing is easy. We can purchase almost anything we could ever want just by using a credit card or obtaining a loan. …The day of reckoning will come if we have continually lived beyond our means.
My brothers and sisters, avoid the philosophy that yesterday’s luxuries have become today’s necessities. They aren’t necessities unless we make them so. …I urge you to live within your means. One cannot spend more than one earns and remain solvent. I promise you that you will then be happier than you would be if you were constantly worrying about how to make the next payment on nonessential debt."
Thomas S. Monson, Apr 2006 General Conference

First, Don't confuse saving the Constitution with saving the United States Government. The time of the Gentiles will pass just as every civilization has.
Second, I consider this a time for preparation. Food, Shelter and knowledge. Weapons are important to a small degree as well, but remember that the Lord said that "those who live by the sword will die by the sword." Many seem to think they need a lot of firepower to overthrow a tyranny, but what we need is wisdom. To this end, I am collecting books, actual paper books, that have historical, cultural and spiritual importance. I encourage everyone to do the same. I think a time of massive censorship and rewriting of history is at hand. We need to be able to teach the rising generation the truth.
Third, we must be mindful of our surroundings. We need to purify ourselves to the point where we can hear and understand the voice of the Spirit. We will need Him more than ever in the coming days.

I completely agree with this statement here.  Presently I am pondering on printing out some spiritual writings I have gathered over the years.  Right now they are only in digital format with multiple copies on hard drive and flash drives.  I do not like storing data on the Internet cloud because of your lack of control of it.

MoE, with all respect and brotherly love, this is why people talk about lies and darned lies and statistics.
—The median income figure you cite is for all workers, whether part or full time.  Can we at least acknowledge that three-bedroom houses are inherently expensive, and that it is entirely proper that a couple who wants to live in one should at least be working forty hours between the two of them?  And can we therefore also agree that when we are taking about median incomes in the context of home-buying, the median income we should be talking about is the median income for *full* time workers ($865/week, or $44,980/year, or a little over $3700/month) rather than the slimmer figures you cite that are apparently diluted by all the part-time workers?
—Can we acknowledge that a single-income family of three with household income of $44,980 are nominally in the 22% federal bracket, but will also be getting deductions and child and earned income tax credits such that their effective federal tax income rate will be near zero?  And can we then further acknowledge that their state taxes and social security, while not insubstantial, won’t be anywhere near 24%?
—Can we acknowledge that most people don’t save for retirement and a first-home down payment simultaneously?
—Can we acknowledge that a 20% down payment on a house is not at all normal; and that 5-10% is more typical these last few years?
—Can we recognize that I ordinarily feed a family of 8 on under $1K/month in groceries ($788/month, as per the budgeting program on my phone), and that $300-$500/month in groceries for a family of three is probably pretty darned generous?
I mean, I want to be compassionate and understanding when people say “we just can’t do it on one income”; but when I see people justifying themselves with proposed figures like the above—I am sometimes tempted to wonder if we are even living in the same universe.  People keep telling me “JAG, it’s just not possible”—and then there’s me and my family, over in our little corner, just quietly doing it.
The one thing I suspect gets missed in these conversations a lot—and I don’t mean this as a moral condemnation, just as an observation—but, I don’t think our society likes children as much as it used to.  Sure, we fetishize them, we throw taxpayer funds at them, we make an academic discipline of their development, and in the political arena we bludgeon each other with ideas about the kind of world we want to build for them.  But we don’t actually like them.  When push comes to shove, we consider child-rearing to be full drudgery that should be someone else’s priority.  We don’t make children, we don’t sacrifice our personal interests and resources to raise them, and on Friday nights we don’t say “hey, forget the bar/the movies/the night club/touch football/Call of Duty; tonight the cool thing to do is go play peek-a-boo and watch Thomas the Tank Engine reruns!”
Again, I don’t mean this as a moral indictment; just an observation.  There are people who temperamentally just aren’t suited to being around kids (or being around a lot of kids).  Heck, in many ways I’m one of them; and ultimately that should be between each of us and God as we work out our own salvation.  The stickiness comes from the fact that our theology links salvation/exaltation with child rearing so integrally, that it’s hard to openly eschew the latter without seeming to voluntarily renounce the former.  So I suspect a lot of us in the Church do feel some social pressure to overplay the financial cost of child-rearing; because it’s much easier to tell ourselves and others that “I want to but I can’t” than to admit that “I just don’t want to” and be cross examined/judged about the fact that we just don’t want (very many) kids.

Yup. Both my Father and Mother grew up in households with 8 and 9 people in the house. Each home had only 3 bedrooms. Everyone slept with their siblings. Each home had only 1 bathroom. In my last ward our Bishop had 5 kids...and they lived in a 3 bedroom home with only a minivan for transport. He took the bus or walked 2.5 miles to work every day. 
I am 34 years old with a stay at home wife and 4 kids at home, and my family is surviving on my modest income alone. Our 4 kids share rooms, our home is small, our vehicles are used, and our vacations consist of going camping. We do not spend our money frivolously. We make a budget and stick to it. There is no "standard of living" outside of what we choose the standard to be. We do not have to move our measuring stick to fit the world's ideals. Numbers and charts can be doctored to fit any narrative. The fact remains that people need to stop expecting to live beyond their means; that certain goods are required in today's society...because they aren't. Cuts should be made before a wife has to leave the home to work...she should only do so if truly necessary, as rearing her children always takes priority. Counsel from a man who became a prophet of God is below...yet there will always be those who continue to kick against the pricks..."what he said certainty doesn't apply to me...I am the exception". I would certainly work overtime if need be before I had my wife go to work and leave the children with someone else.
 
"It is a human tendency to want the things which will give us prominence and prestige. We live in a time when borrowing is easy. We can purchase almost anything we could ever want just by using a credit card or obtaining a loan. …The day of reckoning will come if we have continually lived beyond our means.
My brothers and sisters, avoid the philosophy that yesterday’s luxuries have become today’s necessities. They aren’t necessities unless we make them so. …I urge you to live within your means. One cannot spend more than one earns and remain solvent. I promise you that you will then be happier than you would be if you were constantly worrying about how to make the next payment on nonessential debt."
Thomas S. Monson, Apr 2006 General Conference

Yup. Both my Father and Mother grew up in households with 8 and 9 people in the house. Each home had only 3 bedrooms. Everyone slept with their siblings. Each home had only 1 bathroom. In my last ward our Bishop had 5 kids...and they lived in a 3 bedroom home with only a minivan for transport. He took the bus or walked 2.5 miles to work every day. 
I am 34 years old with a stay at home wife and 4 kids at home, and my family is surviving on my modest income alone. Our 4 kids share rooms, our home is small, our vehicles are used, and our vacations consist of going camping. We do not spend our money frivolously. We make a budget and stick to it. There is no "standard of living" outside of what we choose the standard to be. We do not have to move our measuring stick to fit the world's ideals. Numbers and charts can be doctored to fit any narrative. The fact remains that people need to stop expecting to live beyond their means; that certain goods are required in today's society...because they aren't. Cuts should be made before a wife has to leave the home to work...she should only do so if truly necessary, as rearing her children always takes priority. Counsel from a man who became a prophet of God is below...yet there will always be those who continue to kick against the pricks..."what he said certainty doesn't apply to me...I am the exception". I would certainly work overtime if need be before I had my wife go to work and leave the children with someone else.
 
"It is a human tendency to want the things which will give us prominence and prestige. We live in a time when borrowing is easy. We can purchase almost anything we could ever want just by using a credit card or obtaining a loan. …The day of reckoning will come if we have continually lived beyond our means.
My brothers and sisters, avoid the philosophy that yesterday’s luxuries have become today’s necessities. They aren’t necessities unless we make them so. …I urge you to live within your means. One cannot spend more than one earns and remain solvent. I promise you that you will then be happier than you would be if you were constantly worrying about how to make the next payment on nonessential debt."
Thomas S. Monson, Apr 2006 General Conference

Yup. Both my Father and Mother grew up in households with 8 and 9 people in the house. Each home had only 3 bedrooms. Everyone slept with their siblings. Each home had only 1 bathroom. In my last ward our Bishop had 5 kids...and they lived in a 3 bedroom home with only a minivan for transport. He took the bus or walked 2.5 miles to work every day. 
I am 34 years old with a stay at home wife and 4 kids at home, and my family is surviving on my modest income alone. Our 4 kids share rooms, our home is small, our vehicles are used, and our vacations consist of going camping. We do not spend our money frivolously. We make a budget and stick to it. There is no "standard of living" outside of what we choose the standard to be. We do not have to move our measuring stick to fit the world's ideals. Numbers and charts can be doctored to fit any narrative. The fact remains that people need to stop expecting to live beyond their means; that certain goods are required in today's society...because they aren't. Cuts should be made before a wife has to leave the home to work...she should only do so if truly necessary, as rearing her children always takes priority. Counsel from a man who became a prophet of God is below...yet there will always be those who continue to kick against the pricks..."what he said certainty doesn't apply to me...I am the exception". I would certainly work overtime if need be before I had my wife go to work and leave the children with someone else.
 
"It is a human tendency to want the things which will give us prominence and prestige. We live in a time when borrowing is easy. We can purchase almost anything we could ever want just by using a credit card or obtaining a loan. …The day of reckoning will come if we have continually lived beyond our means.
My brothers and sisters, avoid the philosophy that yesterday’s luxuries have become today’s necessities. They aren’t necessities unless we make them so. …I urge you to live within your means. One cannot spend more than one earns and remain solvent. I promise you that you will then be happier than you would be if you were constantly worrying about how to make the next payment on nonessential debt."
Thomas S. Monson, Apr 2006 General Conference

Here is what you are referencing
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/broadcasts/face-to-face/oaks-ballard?lang=eng
Again, this was a specific case where it was wise. They were too poor to even get married and the. He “went off to school” while she stayed to finish hers. It isn’t being taught that this should be the standard, but rather this is a response to a question about trying to balance getting an education and starting a family.
 
HOWEVER... The most important part here is that she got her degree before having a family. It is said nowhere that women should not be educated. What is taught is that it’s the mothers duty to nurture the family and it is the fathers duty to provide. A mother who has the option to either raise her kids or work for financial comfort and let a day care raise their kids (by standard) should choose to raise her kids full time.
The standard of living is sky rocketing. A three bedroom house you say?? Most of us grew up sharing their room with their siblings. At one point it was me and 2 siblings being raised in a 2 bedroom house. What you are suggesting is waiting to be comfortable before raising kids. Its been done for generations and it can be done today.
 
I’m doing it right now actually and my wife and I are doing it on purpose. We are in a great financial situation. We have a 3 bed home and About to have 3 kids. We are choosing to put 3 kids in one room and save the 3rd room as a play room. Having 3 kids on one room is not a sacrifice. My sister in law has 4 in 1 room despite there being a whole different room available in the home.

I don’t even have to go back to pioneer times to prove people can raise a family with little money. Go back one generation and you will see countless examples of families having 1 car and raising 3-5 kids on a two bedroom home.
 
 
And to drive this home one last time. This is the STANDARD. Not the law. There are plenty of cases where this is not wise and individuals can make the standard decision. 
 
My complaint is that it is being taught and believed that everyone should be waiting for an education and a job before starting a family.

I saw the Church's post and the reactions to it.
I find it confirmation that there are many in the chuch that practice idolatry.  They worship Trump as their prophet and deity and have the Republican Party as their TRUE religion.
There have been two incidents recently that seem to go hand in hand with this.
The First was when an apostle of the Lord came out and said he was speaking AS AN APOSTLE and asked (didn't command or demand, but did heavily suggest if we want to be more like the Lord) people to wear masks.
The comments that were made towards him and the statement were tantamount to calling him false, that the church was false, and that he was speaking as a man.  I may not agree with that, but I can actually see where people were coming from and wouldn't hold that against them.  We all have things we may see differently, and though I don't agree on that point, there are also many points they may not agree with me on as well.
HOWEVER...
The Church then has come out with a congratulations of Biden for being his victory.  They have done this congratulations to every president-elect in the past, many times far sooner than they did with Biden.  It is NOT an unusual thing, and something that is basically an apolitical item in that they are simply trying to be good neighbors towards the leaders of the world and the elections that are held.
The thing that alarms me, and especially when considering the comments made previously that align more towards Trumpism than anything else are the numbers of comments that called the Church fallen, false, and worse.  If the Church comes out with a third statement later on that goes against the Trumpist dialogue, and people follow Trump instead of at least withholding their statements against the Church I think that would be three strikes there where we see what their true religion is.
The thing is, the Church always has offered congratulations.  It's not something unusual or new.  This is actually a later letter of congratulations than they have made in the past in some instances.  It is no reason for people to freak out or start the type of accusations they have.  The fact that they are triggered this easily over something so normal in the way the church has done things in the past is a little (I'm not overly alarmed yet) alarming. 
I'm not saying it makes me happy (it doesn't make me sad either, it's just a press release and it normally doesn't make me feel any real feelings about it in the past or the present), but I don't see why people are flipping about something so general or typical in the Church's actions.
It's like suddenly getting upset because the church is having conference in April.  The church traditionally ALWAYS has Conference in April, so why flip out about it when it occurs again?  The comments towards the Church over something the Church has always traditionally has done says more about those commenting in this instance (to me) than the Church itself in this instance.  I think it would be more of a break in tradition if the  Church did NOT offer congratulations.
IF, for some reason, the electoral vote is not certified and instead it goes before  Congress and Trump gets another term as President, it is possible the church would also congratulate him on his selection at a later date as well.  As such, I find it more unsettling the comments that are against the Church in recent posts because it does not align with Trumpism far more than anything the Church itself has done in regards to the current situation/turmoil in the US.

It’s not a matter of letting people decide. Yes we should absolutely leave individual decisions to the individual. However what is happening among many Saints (particularly millennials and younger) is they are teaching the exceptions as being the rule. Whether it is gender roles, child bearing, word of wisdom, serving a mission, accepting callings, or obeying counsel from leaders, there is a mindset among many my age that the exceptions for each of these are actually the standard.
If an individual young man says “I’m not going to serve a mission because I have a major heart condition” then great. What’s happening is now is virtually any reason to not serve a mission is becoming acceptable. It’s being taught at the lower levels of the church that it isn’t that important for young men to serve missions.
Its being taught at the lower levels of the church that there are no gender roles. That our leaders are only inspired when we agree with them. That wit is appropriate in Gods eyes to wait for education to finish, a good paying job, a yearly visit to Europe to become stale and a Bugatti or two before having kids. 

The “standard” seems pretty clear. If it isn’t clear enough for you, here are other resources.
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/eternal-marriage-student-manual/womens-divine-roles-and-responsibilities
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/the-eternal-family-teacher-manual/lesson-10-the-divine-roles-and-responsibilities-of-women
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/marriage-and-family-relations-instructors-manual/part-b-parents-responsibilities-to-strengthen-families/lesson-10-the-sacred-roles-of-fathers-and-mothers-part-1-fathers-roles
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/1974/01/the-role-of-fathers
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/1977/10/father-your-role-your-responsibility
There are exceptions to the rule of course, nobody is arguing that. But the standard is set and that is what we should be teaching. We should not be teaching the exceptions as being the standard.

I'm in the position where I am working full-time from home. It's pretty cool. 
I, like @Suzie, enjoy using my education and training. 
However, I do have some issue with what I'm seeing as almost some sort of prosperity gospel. I recently chatted with a woman who would love to be a stay-at-home mom. She has a professional job that makes quite a lot of money, and her husband makes well into six figures. However, they have so much lifestyle debt they honestly can't afford for her to quit. 
On another note, I've often wondered what the desire to be a stay-at-home mom has cost some families. Don't get me wrong, I really will argue the stay-at-home mom thing as a worthy ideal for many, but I've seen many women (probably men as well) who want to "have it all". They want to be the pious and maternal stay-at-home mom, but they also want the fancy lifestyle. This leads to what I view as gold-digging.
I'm not saying a woman must marry a jobless lazy bones who still lives in his parents' basement and can't hold down a pizza delivery gig or basic adulting, but I a seeing women panicking a bit too much over their husband's income. Living comfortably but fairly modestly is no longer acceptable. I'm actually seeing women discussing hefty price tags of income attached to potential husbands. It's not just "find a husband who will support your desire to be a stay-at-home mom while providing for the needs of the family". It's "find a husband who will support your desire to be a stay-at-home mom while making sure you live in the best neighborhood and have multiple annual vacations and this and that".
I actually have heard of women crying that their home doesn't "look like they're being blessed". There's some prosperity gospel right there for you.
I know I am now going off on a tangent, but it may be part of a bigger problem. I love a good comment section, but I see people in the church boasting about how hard they work and how well they provide for their families. Now, keep in mind I do not condemn hard work and even money and lots of it and if your dream career pays extremely well all the better for you and yours, but I do wonder about the growing attitude that "good members of the church make lots of money".

The following is a quote from a talk given by Elder David R. Stone of the Seventy in the April 2006 General Conference. That conference was held while I was serving as a missionary, and it is still, years later, my favorite one.
"Because my wife and I have had the opportunity to live in 10 different countries, we have seen the effect of the ethos on behavior. Customs which are perfectly acceptable in one culture are viewed as unacceptable in another; language which is polite in some places is viewed as abhorrent in others. People in every culture move within a cocoon of self-satisfied self-deception, fully convinced that the way they see things is the way things really are.
Our culture tends to determine what foods we like, how we dress, what constitutes polite behavior, what sports we should follow, what our taste in music should be, the importance of education, and our attitudes toward honesty. It also influences men as to the importance of recreation or religion, influences women about the priority of career or childbearing, and has a powerful effect on how we approach procreation and moral issues. All too often, we are like puppets on a string, as our culture determines what is “cool.”
There is, of course, a zeitgeist to which we should pay attention, and that is the ethos of the Lord, the culture of the people of God. As Peter states it, “But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light” (1 Pet. 2:9).
It is the ethos of those who keep the Lord’s commandments, walk in His ways, and “live by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God” (D&C 84:44). If that makes us peculiar, so be it."
Living by every word that proceedeth forth from the mouth of God is what we should be doing as latter-day saints...not listening to  and trusting falsities spouted from children. If we believe D&C 1:38, then this includes counsel from the Lord's Prophets. I would trust Spencer W. Kimball, or any other Prophet, before I took to heart the opinion of a woke teenager who feels they are wise because of a social media platform. I get that she is just a kid, but her position on this issue, and blatant disregard for Prophetic counsel, is like storing dynamite in your home's foundation. She, and those who share her view, are on dangerous ground.

We no longer subscribe to LDS living magazine because of this same type of thing. Many far left ideals have become very commonplace in that publication, and I would rather me and my children just read the church news or official church magazines for uplifting stories without having to wade through garbage. The same is true for so many latter-day saint bloggers and facebookers...too many people are putting their faith in people rather than the Lord and His servants. I prefer scripture than the philosophies of men mingled with scripture.

"We of this Church know something of such groups. The Book of Mormon speaks of the Gadianton robbers, a vicious, oath-bound, and secret organization bent on evil and destruction. In their day they did all in their power, by whatever means available, to bring down the Church, to woo the people with sophistry, and to take control of the society. We see the same thing in the present situation." Gordon B. Hinckley, The Times in Which We Live

In an earlier post, Carborendum talked about the persecution of the LDS Church
and how it almost got snuffed out.  He said "so he set things up to be restored 
at a time when the world would be more prepared to receive the fulness of the 
Gospel.  Even then, it almost got snuffed out".
So my question was how prepared he believed the Jews and Gentiles were to receive
the fulness of the Gospel under Roman rule?
I have read literature describing the persecutions and murder of the Latter-day Saints
in the 1830's and beyond, but I would say it was much worse for the Christians under 
Roman rule before Christianity became acceptable under Constantine.
When NeedleinA said, "Ah, the classic 1997 GP reference", I made the comment that 
maybe the 2009 version would someday be viewed as a classic too.  I think the next 
version, whenever it comes out, will be just as valid as the previous versions 
though.

Wow.  Further evidence that you didn't come across it in honest study.  You only have the cherry picked snippet to work with.  Poor dear.
The answer to this question is in the very text that you pretend to have discovered all on your own in your "earnest" search for the truth.  Maybe if you actually read it, you wouldn't need to post such a question on an anonymous internet forum.
In other words, when the average Latter-day Saint doesn't have a copy handy to look up the context for themselves, you'll figure out what ways to cherry pick statements to twist their meanings again?
Thank you for yet again confirming your motivations.
And thank you for showing another tactic that you're using.  Once I point to the truth (the survival of the Latter-day Kingdom of God being preserved by the Hand of the Lord) you have to shift to divert attention from one weakness in your position to another weak position.

That's Pero, BTW.

Despite the empirical evidence brought forth it is still sad to see people denying fraudulent activity. I recognize, people dislike/hate Trump, and it is very sad to see such hate supersede integrity.
@NeedleinA - the case with the individuals pulling suitcases of votes (without supervision) is clear empirical evidence, and yet we still see people denying anything happened (calling it a circus), and yet I haven't seen the mainstream big tech firms (Facebook, Twitter, Google) help make this known like they would if the roles were reversed. That in and of itself should be sufficient, but people are still denying that happened and giving excuses (even with video evidence -- didn't happen -- its a circus) -- truly sad seeing integrity lost.
I don't really care if people like or hate Trump. But I do care when I see people ignoring overtly fraudulent activity simply due to their political platform, and act with an air of superiority denying what is at face value for all to see.

We no longer subscribe to LDS living magazine because of this same type of thing. Many far left ideals have become very commonplace in that publication, and I would rather me and my children just read the church news or official church magazines for uplifting stories without having to wade through garbage. The same is true for so many latter-day saint bloggers and facebookers...too many people are putting their faith in people rather than the Lord and His servants. I prefer scripture than the philosophies of men mingled with scripture.