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    DennisTate reacted to Traveler in Could the Utah drought force the Church to move?   
    It is unlikely that the western drought will placate plans and preparation that will effect the necessary events of the "End of Times".   However, for decades the Church has been acquiring land in Missouri and is now the single largest holder of land in that state.  I personally believe that when the time is right that all the Saints necessary to relocate to Missouri will be able to do so within the time needed - which I believe would be counted in weeks and months rather than years or decades.   For those that keep their covenants with G-d; all things necessary are ready or are being prepared.   And like so many things in history concerning G-d marvelous works and wonders - will likely come about in ways that seem unlikely and inconvenient and an exercise of faith.
    The Traveler
  2. Like
    DennisTate reacted to Just_A_Guy in Could the Utah drought force the Church to move?   
    80% of Utah’s water goes to agriculture.  We don’t need people to move out, or even to let their lawns die.  We just need the state’s farmers to figure out that this is not California or Iowa, that our climate is naturally hostile to farming (and always has been), and that the rest of us Utahns do not owe them a living.  
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    DennisTate reacted to laronius in Could the Utah drought force the Church to move?   
    I could be wrong but I don't know of any prophecy that says "the Church" is going to relocate to Missouri. Build up a Zion City there? Yes. But that doesn't mean everyone has to move there. I think it will be a gathering point at some future time but only for certain people to accomplish certain responsibilities. Otherwise, the Lord needs us all over the world to do his work.
    Now concerning the drought it very well may be one of the many signs of the times. But if you think escaping to Missouri is to escape the less fun signs of the times I would think twice about that. I think that place is going to get "purified" like nothing we've seen before.  To be the Lord's Zion it's got to be.
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    DennisTate reacted to scottyg in Could the Utah drought force the Church to move?   
    Yep. Something terrible would have to happen there to drive out the hundreds of thousands of current residents in the greater Independence area. I personally think much of it will be from man made evils...not just "natural disasters".
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    DennisTate reacted to LugiaLvl138 in Could the Utah drought force the Church to move?   
    I am most certainly not planning to leave Utah anytime soon. But if I had to go to Missouri, well at least I can still have arch plates, assuming cars are still a thing and I didn't have to walk or push a handcart there. The Gateway Arch in St Louis is a special place to me and, unlike Utah's Delicate Arch, the public is allowed to go atop it. I am also aware that currently, the command for all the saints to gather to a physical Zion such as Utah or Missouri is not in effect. Only sending certain people, like say certain priesthood leaders and their immediate family to do specific things makes sense and avoids most of said logistical problems.
  6. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to Emmanuel Goldstein in Could the Utah drought force the Church to move?   
    “On Sunday night (April 26, 1834) the Prophet called on all who held the Priesthood to gather into the little log school house they had there. It was a small house, perhaps 14 feet square. But it held the whole of the Priesthood of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints who were then in the town of Kirtland, and who had gathered together to go off in Zion’s camp. That was the first time I ever saw Oliver Cowdery, or heard him speak; the first time I ever saw Brigham Young and Heber C. Kimball, and the two Pratts [Orson and Parley], and Orson Hyde and many others. There were no Apostles in the Church then except Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery. When we got together the Prophet called upon the Elders of Israel with him to bear testimony of this work. Those that I have named spoke, and a good many that I have not named, bore their testimonies.
    “When they got through the Prophet said, ‘Brethren I have been very much edified and instructed in your testimonies here tonight, but I want to say to you before the Lord, that you know no more concerning the destinies of this Church and kingdom than a babe upon its mother’s lap. You don’t comprehend it.’ I was rather surprised. He said ‘it is only a little handful of Priesthood you see here tonight, but this Church will fill North and South America—it will fill the world.’
    “Among other things he said, ‘it will fill the Rocky Mountains. There will be tens of thousands of Latter-day Saints who will be gathered in the Rocky Mountains, and there they will open the door for the establishing of the Gospel among the Lamanites, who will receive the Gospel and their endowments and the blessings of God. This people will go into the Rocky Mountains; they will there build temples to the Most High. They will raise up a posterity there, and the Latter-day Saints who dwell in these mountains will stand in the flesh until the coming of the Son of Man. The Son of Man will come to them while in the Rocky Mountains.” (Wilford Woodruff, Conference Report, April 1898, p. 57.) 
  7. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to Fether in Could the Utah drought force the Church to move?   
    Do I think this drought will trigger a mass exodus east? No. Do I think that this drought and other events may lead to some people moving east? Sure! Are these moves inspired by God? Perhaps. 
  8. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to LugiaLvl138 in Could the Utah drought force the Church to move?   
    As the drought in many Western states intensifies, and as places like Seattle and Portland see triple digit temperatures, my eyes have been turning towards Jackson County Missouri. Specifically the prophecy about the Church moving there in the last days. I have always wondered about the sheer logistical challenge of moving several million people to one place. As crazy as Utah's house prices have gotten in the last year, that would be nothing compared to what would be happening if several million people suddenly tried to move to or even near Jackson County. Additionally I wonder if they all specifically have to move to Jackson County, or if it could be nearby, given that the Wasatch Front in Utah is made up of 4 main counties plus about 6 or 7 smaller secondary counties. Or perhaps I am simply overreacting and Utah's weather cycle will end up flipping around. While I wasn't alive in 1983 when State Street in Salt Lake became a river, I do remember ten years ago as a missionary serving in Midway, spending most of my service time making sandbags to help against potential flooding nearby.
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    DennisTate reacted to e v e in Can a Christian who takes the idea of reincarnation seriously...   
    the heart of the earth is destroyed eden in the other world, not this earth, 
  10. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to NeuroTypical in Queer sister speaks at 2021 BYU Women's Conference   
    She speaks for about 6 minutes or so.   Interesting stuff.
  11. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to dprh in Hi. My name is dprh and I'm an addict.   
    I found this forum a couple weeks ago and have posted a few times.  I like this community and figure I'll stick around and check in every so often.
    I am in my late 30's, married with three kids.  I've been a missionary, financial clerk, ward clerk, YM's adviser and councilor, den leader, primary and Sunday School teacher in church.  Recently excommunicated, but working hard to repent, change, and be re-admitted into the Church. 
    I am trying to develop more healthy connections with more people instead of isolating myself.  I figure an anonymous forum would be a good place to reach out.  My wife and I aren't comfortable yet with most real-life people knowing of our situation.  She's changed the setting for our family on the directory to private so most people can't see us. 
  12. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to e v e in I took a test to determine which religion I was closest to and my score was LDS!   
    LOL. I matched most closely with Orthodox Quakers. I can't imagine that is accurate. I don't know what quakers believe.
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    DennisTate reacted to e v e in The trinity = the family   
    thank you prisonchaplain for this. I don't know i I gave you a proper thanks originally.  Michael is not Jesus, but is the 144k sons...
    I can expand up on that if you were interested. So the 144k themselves are Michael. They are sons and daughters but the sons being the legal representatives are the ones mentioned in rev. 
    The 144k are the originals of eden restored, who will return with Christ to this earth after it went dark
    to save many millions more believers who had to suffer trib.
  14. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to e v e in Near death experiencer given "God's Peace Plan for the Holy Land."   
    the usa is also a disaster,
    not just israel. 
    capitals of Babylon. 
  15. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to e v e in Can a Christian who takes the idea of reincarnation seriously...   
    when i see something signatureless to me that is a clue. 
    i believe dreams can be living dreams from Him… but they are not be jumbled or vague . 
  16. Like
    DennisTate got a reaction from e v e in Can a Christian who takes the idea of reincarnation seriously...   
    You could well be correct.......
    this is a rather important question that may not be the easiest question that somebody can answer even if they did have a near death experience.  
  17. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to e v e in Can a Christian who takes the idea of reincarnation seriously...   
    the light is described as an IT. 
    no signature…
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    DennisTate reacted to e v e in THANK YOU to all LDS for building the set for The Chosen!   
    Is the program a general christian themed series? I have been watching Michael Landon's Highway to Heaven series the last few weeks. Its lovely and very kind the christian point of view in the series. But then I liked little house on the prairie too.
  19. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to LDSGator in I took a test to determine which religion I was closest to and my score was LDS!   
    Dude, this is the same test I took before I joined the church! That is so cool!   
    thank you for finding this @DennisTate
  20. Like
    DennisTate got a reaction from JohnsonJones in Comparing Prophet Joseph Smith and Howard Storm Ph.D?   
    I was just reading in Alma 36 and wow... but this so reminds me of the near death experience of former skeptic Howard Storm.

    CHAPTER 36
    Alma testifies to Helaman of his conversion after seeing an angel—He suffered the pains of a damned soul; he called upon the name of Jesus, and was then born of God—Sweet joy filled his soul—He saw concourses of angels praising God—Many converts have tasted and seen as he has tasted and seen. About 74 B.C.
    1 My ason, give ear to my words; for I swear unto you, that inasmuch as ye shall keep the commandments of God ye shall prosper in the land.
    2 I would that ye should do as I have done, in remembering the captivity of our fathers; for they were in abondage, and none could bdeliver them except it was the cGod of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob; and he surely did deliver them in their afflictions.
    3 And now, O my son Helaman, behold, thou art in thy youth, and therefore, I beseech of thee that thou wilt hear my words and learn of me; for I do know that whosoever shall put their atrust in God shall be supported in their btrials, and their troubles, and their afflictions, and shall be clifted up at the last day.
    4 And I would not that ye think that I aknow of myself—not of the temporal but of the spiritual, not of the bcarnal mind but of God.
    5 Now, behold, I say unto you, if I had not been aborn of God I should bnot have known these things; but God has, by the mouth of his holy cangel, made these things known unto me, not of any dworthiness of myself;
    6 For I went about with the sons of Mosiah, seeking to adestroy the church of God; but behold, God sent his holy angel to stop us by the way.
    7 And behold, he spake unto us, as it were the voice of thunder, and the whole earth did atremble beneath our feet; and we all fell to the earth, for the bfear of the Lord came upon us.
    8 But behold, the voice said unto me: Arise. And I arose and stood up, and beheld the angel.
    9 And he said unto me: If thou wilt of thyself be destroyed, seek no more to destroy the church of God.
    10 And it came to pass that I fell to the earth; and it was for the space of athree days and three nights that I could not open my mouth, neither had I the use of my limbs.
    11 And the angel spake more things unto me, which were heard by my brethren, but I did anot hear them; for when I heard the words—If thou wilt be destroyed of thyself, seek no more to destroy the church of God—I was struck with such great fear and amazement lest perhaps I should be destroyed, that I fell to the earth and I did hear no more.
    12 But I was racked with aeternal btorment, for my soul was charrowed up to the greatest degree and racked with all my sins.
    13 Yea, I did remember all my sins and iniquities, for which I was atormented with the bpains of hell; yea, I saw that I had crebelled against my God, and that I had not kept his holy commandments.
    14 Yea, and I had amurdered many of his children, or rather led them away unto destruction; yea, and in fine so great had been my iniquities, that the very thought of coming into the presence of my God did rack my soul with inexpressible horror.
    15 Oh, thought I, that I acould be banished and become extinct both soul and body, that I might not be brought to stand in the presence of my God, to be judged of my bdeeds.
    16 And now, for three days and for three nights was I racked, even with the apains of a bdamned soul.
    17 And it came to pass that as I was thus aracked with torment, while I was bharrowed up by the cmemory of my many sins, behold, I dremembered also to have heard my father prophesy unto the people concerning the coming of one Jesus Christ, a Son of God, to atone for the sins of the world.
    18 Now, as my mind caught hold upon this thought, I cried within my heart: O Jesus, thou Son of God, ahave mercy on me, who am bin the cgall of bitterness, and am encircled about by the everlasting dchains of edeath.
    19 And now, behold, when I thought this, I could remember my apains bno more; yea, I was harrowed up by the memory of my sins no more.
    20 And oh, what ajoy, and what marvelous light I did behold; yea, my soul was filled with joy as exceeding as was my pain!
    21 Yea, I say unto you, my son, that there could be nothing so exquisite and so bitter as were my pains. Yea, and again I say unto you, my son, that on the other hand, there can be nothing so exquisite and sweet as was my joy.
    22 Yea, methought I saw, even as our father aLehi saw, God sitting upon his throne, surrounded with numberless concourses of angels, in the attitude of singing and bpraising their God; yea, and my soul did long to be there.
    23 But behold, my limbs did receive their astrength again, and I stood upon my feet, and did manifest unto the people that I had been bborn of God.
    24 Yea, and from that time even until now, I have labored without ceasing, that I might bring souls unto arepentance; that I might bring them to btaste of the exceeding joy of which I did taste; that they might also be cborn of God, and be dfilled with the Holy Ghost.
    25 Yea, and now behold, O my son, the Lord doth agive me exceedingly great joy in the fruit of my blabors;
  21. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to Emmanuel Goldstein in President Nelson vaccinated   
    I'll wait until the vaccine is actually aproved by the FDA. Currently it is only authorized for emergency use. They have skipped all of the testing protocols, making the people the testing group. No, thanks, I am not a lab rat.
  22. Thanks
    DennisTate reacted to NeuroTypical in President Nelson vaccinated

  23. Okay
    DennisTate reacted to e v e in Prisonchaplain's lesson on Judas--warning against gossip   
    each apostle represented something related to the fall, in the other world, and playing out that aspect. just as each soul of His has a job to win back their attribute, attributes entrusted to them by God. 
    judas threw thirty silvers back to the temple, thirty silvers representing the astray house after the fall that went to the gods of the satan realm. again, in the other world where eden is. not upon this earth. and which those gods now considered as theirs.
    these are archetypes played out by souls, legally. 
  24. Okay
    DennisTate reacted to Jonah in The Three Witnesses see sacred items   
    Would someone clarify this section.
    D&C 17
    Introductory notes - 1–4, By faith the Three Witnesses will see the plates and other 
    sacred items; 
    "Behold, I say unto you, that you must rely upon my word, which if you do with full 
    purpose of heart, you shall have a view of the plates, and also of the breastplate, 
    the sword of Laban, the Urim and Thummim, which were given to the brother of Jared 
    upon the mount, when he talked with the Lord face to face, and the miraculous directors 
    which were given to Lehi while in the wilderness, on the borders of the Red Sea".
    Is there a record of the 3 Witnesses ever seeing the sword of Laban or Lehi's 
    Which of the mentioned items (plates, breastplate, sword, Urim and Thummim) were 
    given to Jared's brother upon the mount?  When I read Ether 6:1-2, he goes to the 
    mount and comes back from the mount with only the stones.
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    DennisTate reacted to Carborendum in The Three Witnesses see sacred items   
    I guess he got tired of people not jumping onto the elephant.