Traveler
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Posts posted by Traveler
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On 4/17/2024 at 4:01 AM, MarkJedidiah said:
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Jesus granted his disciples the authority to do miracles, as an additional source of divine credentials of sorts. This is proof that he authorizes true believers to perform supernatural feats. However there are some rules that seem to come with this gift.
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Greetings @MarkJedidiah:
I am going to speculate a little with the assumption that you are not a member or very well acquainted with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Never-the-less welcome to the forum and thank you for your contribution. It is always interesting to have points of view outside the usual box of LDS posters. We have a few non-LDS posters – but with the cacophony of LDS that post, many non-LDS are a little shell shocked from diving deep into religious themed discussions – especially if there are scientific ramifications.
There really is no theologian class within the LDS society. Even our current Prophet and president made his living (profession) as a world-renowned heart surgeon. There are some that study scholastically into our divine prophetic based theology, but our belief and ordinance structure is not based on scholarship (including scholarship of ancient scripture) but rather on a direct line of priesthood authority to ancient apostles and prophets chosen by Jesus Christ (which was the source anciently of scripture).
As a scientist I believe that I can speak concerning the elements of our universe as unsustainable without intelligent manipulation on at least level III of the Kardashev scale. As a covenant member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints I was ordained to the Melchizedek Priesthood through a line direct to Jesus Christ. I have a complete line without any gaps or missing pieces or even speculations. A line of authority necessary to prepare a people for the inevitable return of the Messiah. Those Christians of the Protestant movement are of necessity ignorant of lines of authority direct to Christ, based instead, in claims of inspiration through the Holy Spirit in the name of Christ. We LDS believe that Christ prophesied of such claims from those that would say they did their deeds are in the name of Christ but that he (Christ) never knew them - meaning that he never authorized them through an ordaining by the laying on of hands as he did for his apostles.
We are instructed in our temples that order is brought to this universe through a divine power hierarchy. That this divine power has it source in G-d the Father and is made available to mankind through Jesus Christ the Son of G-d. That Jesus Christ is the Word by which our earth and solar system was created and prepared for life as we currently know and experience life. We LDS also believe that Jesus Christ (Word) has created (ordered and organized) many worlds and solar systems. We are instructed through modern revelation that such authority (priesthood) is inseparable from the powers of heaven and can only be exercised upon principles of righteousness (meaning by covenant with G-d). This means that one must be loyal and obedient to divine covenants with G-d that begin with the covenant of Baptism – not any baptism claimed to be in the Name of Christ but that baptism that was divinely authorized as was that of the Prophet, John the Baptist that baptized Jesus in the waters of Jordan.
The Traveler
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19 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:
Is this the drop you're referring to?
If so, I'm having a hard time getting worried about a coming depression. I'd love to see 10x the size of that drop, to get us back to 2020 levels before we shut down the economy and made the money printer go brrrrrrt...
Hmmmmmm --- I would think that graph ought to indicate even greater concern.
The Traveler
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What can you do with an elephant on the freeway?
Almost 21 miles an hour.
How do you know if you just passed an elephant?
The toilet won’t flush.
The Traveler
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3 hours ago, mikbone said:
Gold is down
The NASDAQ is up
Crude oil is down
The market is not impressed with Iran’s counter.
The economy and commodities are such a weird confusing mixed bag of conundrum in my mind – I am not sure how good of an indicator (especially in the short term before the election) such things are. In the entire history of civilization there has never been a drop in money supply that was not followed by a depression – I must emphasize a depression not a recession! We are currently experiencing a drop in the money supply. With war looming something very serious must give in our economy and supply chain.
I am not an expert, nor do I pretend to understand all possibilities, but it sure looks to me like all efforts are being made by both political parties (as well as the corporate and financial structures) to kick the can down the road and blame the other party for everything and definitely not to take any responsibility (even a minor responsibility). I am concerned that any give that arises in either the economy or supply chain will result in a cataclysmic seismic shift. And with our borders open I am concerned that the first effort of terrorists will be soft targets on our infrastructure which will exacerbate any financial or supply chain problem.
My hope and trust is in the revelations given recently (in the last few years of General Conference). I am counting on the miracles President Nelson spoke of. (woops sorry about the ending with a preposition). I am of the mind and impression that things are so already in motion that the coming election will not matter much one way or the other.
The Traveler
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I believe that had the Abraham accords been continued under Biden all this would not have happened. Our country has become so divided (especially with a hatred of Trump) that the democrats were not willing to give Trump any credit for anything (especially in the Middle East) and this is the result. I wonder how soon that the left wing blames Trump for this whole problem. From revelation of the restoration, we are told explicitly that although we hear of wars in foreign places – we know not the hearts of men in our own country.
The Traveler
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4 hours ago, CV75 said:
Which United Order was it connected with, and when? I understand there were a number of local iterations.
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/history/topics/united-orders?lang=eng
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/history/topics/united-firm-united-order?lang=eng
Brigham City.
The Traveler
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On 4/7/2024 at 8:52 AM, Emmanuel Goldstein said:
My impression and opinion is that the withdrawal in Gaza is to prepare themselves for a defensive position from a possible Iran backed invasion of Israel.
The Traveler
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On 4/8/2024 at 10:44 PM, Maverick said:
I recently discovered that it’s likely that the brother of Jared was practicing plural marriage, with what would appear to be at least two wives at the same time. While Jared likely only had one wife.
40 And it came to pass that the Lord did hear the brother of Jared, and had compassion upon him, and said unto him:
41 Go to and gather together thy flocks, both male and female, of every kind; and also of the seed of the earth of every kind; and thy families; and also Jared thy brother and his family; and also thy friends and their families, and the friends of Jared and their families. (Ether 1)
20 And accordingly the people were gathered together. Now the number of the sons and the daughters of the brother of Jared were twenty and two souls; and the number of sons and daughters of Jared were twelve, he having four sons. (Ether 6)
This is noteworthy because there are a growing number of members of the church who are rejecting the legitimacy of D&C 132 and the early practice of plural marriage in the restored church. One of their arguments is that the Book of Mormon is strictly against any form of marriage other than strict monogamy. These verses would appear to show that there is at least one example of plural marriage having been practiced by a very righteous man in the Book of Mormon, with whom God spoke face to face.
Though I would agree with some of your assessments of confusion over plural marriage in the early Church of the restoration – It is my opinion that that your assumptions of Ether 1 are not well founded. My great grandfather was a polygamist late in the era of Utah polygamy. He noted in his journal that most of the polygamists of his era were in error and disobedient to covenants concerning their plural wives (among his references of those disobedient was his brother). He also referred to his entire family as singular.
I speculate that it was more likely that the brother of Jared had married children and thus the reason for plural reference to his families. Or another possibility is that his first wife had died, and he remarried a woman that was previously married with children and then had more children. This is only my opinion and I have nothing other than my opinion to reference. There are other references like Jacob 1 verse 15.
While we are on the subject of plural wives. Anciently the difference between a wife and concubine was that a wife entered the marriage with a dowry and a concubine had none. The dowry was considered the property of the wife and if the wife was divorced the dowry had to be given back to the wife. The same goes if the wife died – her dowry was to be returned to her family or children.
Early in the restored Church there was never a distinction between a wife and concubine – all were considered wives. Many in modern western civilization think of concubines as illegitimate – akin to current standards of living together or common law wives.
The Traveler
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11 hours ago, Maverick said:
I completely agree.
This appears to contradict your previous statement. Can you please clarify?
Woops It should read all that G-d commands to be included, should be included in scripture. Sorry for the confusion - and thanks for asking to be clarified.
The Traveler
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There are numerous debates in our society about the need to eradicate (as much as possible) toxic masculinity. Some would hint that it does not really exist while others are certain that it is standard practice though much of our society. I would add to all this my personal opinion that toxic masculinity does indeed exist and that it is a growing problem in our society.
First, I would define toxic masculinity as those of that are biologically of male gender that torment and dominate those that are biologically of the female gender, forcing them to be shamed by the masculine dominance over them. What is odd to me is that many that argue about the problem of toxic masculinity are unable to recognize the very worst cases of it.
As near as I can determine every definition of toxic masculinity is manifested by masculinity dominating in female (feminine) sports. From depriving women (the biological feminine) from achieving recognition for their athletic achievements to the sexual harassment in the locker rooms where the toxic masculine and their supporters are forcing women to be unwillingly required to undress naked in front of them – often themselves (the toxic masculine) also displaying themselves naked forcibly before women.
I cannot think of a greater display of toxic masculinity that what is being perpetrated by certain masculine individuals and their supports in the arena of women sports.
The Traveler
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On 4/7/2024 at 9:18 PM, Maverick said:
One of the boldest claims the church makes is that the church is led by continuing revelation from God to the President of the church, who along with his counselors and the Quorum of the 12 apostles, we sustain as prophets, seers, and revelators.
While I don’t doubt that our leaders have often received inspiration and guidance in their callings, my question is why there hasn’t been a single revelation where the direct words of the Lord have been quoted added to our scriptural canon since the revelation Brigham Young received in 1847 in Winter Quarters (D&C 136)? This is literally the last “thus saith the Lord” type revelation quoting the words of the Lord directly added to our scriptures. This was 177 years ago.
Why hasn’t there been any more revelations like this since?
I understand that revelation doesn’t always have to come this way and that making prophecies of the future and declaring “thus saith the Lord” first person revelations isn’t all true prophets, seers, and revelators should be expected to do. But why hasn’t there been any of this in such a long time?
This is not a criticism of the brethern. It’s an honest question that has puzzled me for some time now. Any thoughts?
It is important to understand that not all that is spiritual or is revelation or that leaders have received for the people needs be or should be recorded in what is sometimes called the “standard” works of scripture. In the Book or Mormon the Book of Jacob chapter 1 verses 2 though verse 6 (more if one intends to maintain the context) Jacob is commanded what to wright as scripture.
What Jacob commits to scripture is not all what was revealed to the Prophets of his day. Note in verse 5 that Jacob indicates that there were things revealed concerning things that would happen to the people that were not included for preserved scripture. Note what is not included in scripture was still revelation and important to the people. Every 6 months the prophets and seers of our generation extend to the people of the Church and world things revealed and commanded concerning the next 6 months to the next Conference. Often in Stake or regional conferences a sustained prophet and seer may attend to make known revelations received concerning those that are intended to listen.
The most important thing to understand is that all that G-d commands or reveals is recorded in scripture.
The Traveler
- zil2 and askandanswer
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Thouth I would add - during the totality there was a red dot at the bottome of the eclipse. I do not know what it was but I am assuming that it was a solar flair.
The Traveler
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The wife and I went to visit our daughter and family in Indianapolis to experience the eclipse. The last bit of it may still be going on but the totality is over. It has been worth the trip. My iPhone camera did not work well at all. As long as just one point of the sun was exposed the amount of light was amazing and is most likely why iPhone camera will not work. Totality is a little creepy.
I am impressed that in the search for extraterrestrial life there has not been another planet located with a moon large enough and in the right place so that anyone can experience an eclipse anywhere except on this earth. So I got to experience something quite rare in this universe.
The Traveler
- SilentOne and NeuroTypical
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On 4/5/2024 at 9:50 AM, NeuroTypical said:
The notion of being "in error" has always interested me. We're humans for pete's sake. Being occasionally wrong is part of our mortal probation. God does not take the humanity of His prophets/seers/revelators away, just because they get called to the work. From what I can tell, the brethren have spent decades taking great care to make sure their opinions are presented as opinions, and their prophetic declarations are presented as prophetic declarations. And even taking that into account, I've done better aligning with the brethren's opinions than I have being out of alignment with them.
I would add a little thought. It is written that a testimony of Christ is the spirit of prophesy. There are many in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints that prophesy – even children. I believe that the greatest error (as prophesied by the Book of Mormon) of the Saints of these Last-days is hearing and seeing through the spirit – much more than it is being mislead by the L-rd’s anointed. Note that all that covenant and worship at the temple of G-d are anointed by the power and authority of G-d.
The Traveler
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On 3/29/2024 at 6:58 PM, LDSGator said:
Same question. Aren’t all police civilians?
It is my understanding that in the USA police are obtained from the citizenry of our country. But when acting in their duty that they are not acting as citizens but rather as officers of the law.
The Travelert
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On 4/3/2024 at 8:50 AM, Jamie123 said:
Yup... I never much liked the beads. In fact hair styles like that have always bugged the heck out of me. What do these women do when they wash their hair? Undo every last pleat and remove every last bead, and then put them all back again? By the time you're done with all that palaver it'll be time to wash your hair again! Still...women will be women.
I have learned that it is not so much what a person (or lady) wears or dose as it is the reason that they do so. I had a native American (Crow) companion on my mission. After his mission he had long hair with beads as part of his culture, heritage and position.
Generally, I believe that those in our culture with tattoos are so because they are not comfortable in their own skin. However, I have among my friends Polynesians that have tattoos because of their culture, heritage and position.
Usually those with poor reasons are a bit put out when asked why they are doing something. Usually those with strong purpose and conviction are honored to be asked why they are doing something.
The Traveler
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In my youth I had a personal relationship with Apostle Hugh B. Brown. It has always been my nature to seek out and ask the most difficult questions – at least the questions I considered the most difficult to me. Like some that have posted I was aware of leader that were obviously in error. And so I asked Apostle Brown the question – Do we still sustain our bishop even if we know absolutely that they are wrong? This answer has stuck with me for decades. Brother Brown looked me squarely in the eyes and said, “You sustain your bishop, especially if he is wrong because he will need your support more then than at any other time.”
Perhaps we do not understand what it means to sustain (support). There are two parts. One is to be agreeable, to help, to love, to honor and respect. The other is like unto the servants of Elijah that held up his arms when he was weak. When our leaders (or fellow members) are weak or failing – we hold them and their mission and purpose up. This second part is known in the covenant to not speak evil of the L-rd’s anointed.
My friends @mrmarklin , @ZealoulyStriving , @Maverick and other Saints of G-d:
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not just the L-rd’s Church. The Church also belongs to the Saints of G-d and is why the Saints are included in the name. I would suggest that if anyone is aware of anyone or anything that is a problem in the Church that they humbly pray to G-d concerning that problem and inquire what it is that they can do (or sacrifice) to assist G-d in his mitigation of the problem. As I have done this myself - almost always in such things, the first thing I am commanded to do is to repent.
The Traveler
- zil2, NeuroTypical and laronius
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On 1/20/2024 at 9:25 PM, mrmarklin said:
Traveler,
While not in the original group, two Witnesses came back: Namely, Oliver Cowdery and
Martin Harris.
A note - if Oliver and Martin had not fallen and left the saints then it would have been Oliver first and Martin next that would have been the prophet to take the Saints west (like untio Moses) and not Brigham Young. It was a benefit to both them and the Church that they repented and returned but the benefit would have been greater to both them and the Church had they remained loyal. The lesson is that when we sin - there are blessings that are forever lost. When we repent there are blessings that are given. Sometimes the blessings that are given are similar to those that are lost but they can never be the same blessings that were lost. The one example we have of someone that never sined and never lost a blessing is Christ. There are many examples of great men (or women) that sined and repented and their lost blessings were forever lost (like King David, Oliver Cowdery and others).
The Traveler
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I recently was talking to a fellow scientist about climate change, and he brought up some interesting facts that I had not encountered before. He pointed out that at the equator the angle of the sun is orthogonal to the earth’s atmosphere which gives the greatest possibility for climate change based on greenhouse CO2 gas. At the polls the angel of the sun approaches zero or a minimum which gives the least possibility for climate change based on greenhouse CO2 gas. In addition, CO2 is heavier than most other atmospheric molecules. Because the earth is rotating the heaver molecules will congregate at the equator. All of this would indicate that the effects of greenhouse gases casing global warming or climate change would be greatest at the equator and less at the polls. However, what is happening is the exact opposite. There is zero climate change at the equator and the greatest climate change is at the polls.
The Traveler
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4 hours ago, JohnsonJones said:
Isn't Negative income tax just another coin, or another side of the coin of Universal Basic Income?
Experiments showed (on a quick look up) that it only returned a postive $1 for every $3 taxed on it.
It may be different if we restricted it only to those who were able to qualify for Social Security, but we'd still need a Social Security Tax in order to provide for it.
However, it is a considered by some a form of UBI, which many also consider another form of Socialism.
Personally, I'm not sure what I think of UBI or other ideas similar to it right now. Some of the ideas sound off to me, so I don't think I'm in favor of it, but at the same time...in regards to Social Security, that's the only form of income some people have.
ON the otherhand, if we instituted Negative Income Tax, I probably would still be taxed on SS in my paycheck, but may not get a check from the government anymore in that sort of payment scheme.
Thanks for your interest. For best results and understanding I suggest you get your answers directly from the source – Milton Friedman. Google will provide you with better information than I can. When and if implemented properly there would be an immediate (at a minimum) surplus of 28% taxes. The main idea of a negative income tax is that it is not an all or nothing. Rather there is always an incentive to work and earn money in order to have an increase in disposible income. The negative income tax would be on an sliding scale. Also as I understand Milton Friedman there would still be opportunity for private charity in extreme cases. This would help prevent an intitlement attitude.
If I could add anything it would be that all income is taxed – even the income of the poor. The reason I believe this is necessary is because then all citizens would have skin in the tax game (similar to tithing) and DC would be held more to account whenever they asked for more taxes. I also believe that the extreme benefits that elected officials grant themselves would become much more unpopular.
The Traveler
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4 hours ago, JohnsonJones said:
It seems that Utah gets a LOT of temples comparatively to elsewhere. I think we need a few more in the East Coast and South East to balance things up a bit.
The world will be balanced (for sure) when the announcement is made for 24 temples in Independence Missouri. 🙂
The Traveler
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I will predict at least two in places I did not know there was even a ward there and one in a place I did not know even existed.
In my youth I could name all the temples – but back then there were only 12 and the year I graduated from high school they dedicated the 13th. I set a goal to visit al the temples. Currently I can’t even tell you all the temples in Utah. I am starting to take all the temples for granted. The wife and went to our assigned temple forgetting that it was closed for a week of deep cleaning. So we just went to another temple. We ended up finding out there 4 temples were closed for something before we found one (all within less than an hour drive of our home) was open. Now days that problem is solved because we make appointments. At the most recent Roots Tec I learned that on the Family Tree app I can find the name(s) of the closest relation to take to the temple.
I am guessing that we will be told that the Kirtland temple will soon be restored and rededicated. I would like to be there for that.
The Traveler
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Greetings @Sail:
As I ponder various epochs in scripture, I am not sure that the divine message or purpose is obvious. From the Biblical accounts there seems to be some contradictions. The reverences to G-d and divine society is always that G-d is the Supreme Suzerain (King) and that heaven is a divine kingdom. However, when it comes to G-d’s covenant peoples here in mortality on this earth – Making our human leaders kings and making ourselves subjects of our governments and governors have never worked out well. Not for ourselves nor our leaders.
To me the story of David very much portrays this great contradiction. Obviously, something very critical is missing. Perhaps some of what is missing is referenced in Doctrine and Convenance section 121 verse 39:
Quote39 We have learned by sad experience that it is the nature and disposition of almost all men, as soon as they get a little authority, as they suppose, they will immediately begin to exercise unrighteous dominion.
So prominent is the inclination to misuse authority that it seems to me that the only one worthy of authority is the person that does not want anything to do with it. Thus they will only use authority is when it is forced upon them and that only acceptance is as a temporary act of service.
So, in my pondering I wonder if we really understand G-d, his leadership and the divine society of heaven. Perhaps our view of heaven is not Celestial at all but rather more along with the glory and governance of the telestial or terrestrial, both because of what is expected of leaders and what is intended as our contribution.
The Traveler
Someone flirted with me…
in Advice Board
Posted
Dear Friend @SparksFly; (For some reason your handle is not registered with the forum?)
You are very lucky and fortunate to have dodged a bullet. Perhaps I should say a deadly fiery dart of the adversary. Scripture tells us that Satan flatters us into following a course that leads to destruction and bondage.
Though I am retired now I spent much of my professional life traveling. I would say about ¼ of my life. Sometimes for several weeks at a time. Joining me in my travels have been several good LDS serving in what many would call high positions. Also, I traveled with many rather shady characters. I think there is something about traveling that tends to get a person out of sorts and venerable to flattery. Especially from seemingly good looking and smart seaming others. I witnessed those that under such circumstances succumbed to the temptations of the moment. I would say that without a single exception (good LDS or wild heathen) that never did anyone falling for the flattery of predators and pursuing pleasures contrary to the Law and covenant of Chasity end in anything even remotely close a happy ending. Much more, if for any reason you would become the predator. It was (is) always a heartbreaking disaster for all involved – even for the remotely involved.
The guilty feeling for being flirty is nothing compared to the guilt Satan has planned for you. I personally do not know you nor do I know anything about your marriage relationship. I will not pretend I know how to advise you moving forward beyond the admonition to repent. Let the spirit guide you through the process as to what you should do and who to tell. It is possible that your husband could be devastated and unable to cope even though for now it seems quite harmless.
I can truthfully say that there is great rewards for remaining loyal and faithful to sacred covenant. There is spiritual strength and great happiness in keeping divine covenant – especially the covenant of marriage. I am personally grateful that in the few times my beloved wife has asked, that I can honestly look her in the eyes and say I have never strayed (though tempted) and remained loyal to our covenants to G-d and each other. I believe there would be joy in your life knowing that your husband is faithful to you.
I remember the Prophet David O. McKay saying that it is a greater honor to be trusted than to be loved.
The Traveler