Traveler

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  1. Okay
    Traveler reacted to JohnsonJones in Okay...which one of you Utahns put this up??   
    Apparently it disappeared over the weekend as mysteriously as it appeared, at least according to the news.
  2. Like
    Traveler reacted to Still_Small_Voice in Life, Death and an Isotropic Universe:   
    Likely there was no death in the Garden of Eden or just Adam and Eve were immortal beings until they ate from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.
  3. Thanks
    Traveler got a reaction from prisonchaplain in Sometimes the Big Name Preachers are just what we need   
    I do believe if we want to learn to love our enemies - somehow we must find some good in them.
     
    The Traveler
  4. Thanks
    Traveler got a reaction from prisonchaplain in Sometimes the Big Name Preachers are just what we need   
    I do believe if we want to learn to love our enemies - somehow we must find some good in them.
     
    The Traveler
  5. Love
    Traveler reacted to prisonchaplain in Sometimes the Big Name Preachers are just what we need   
    I've met some awesome clergy of other faiths, as well. My interactions with a United Church of Christ (very liberal) minister, with an Orthodox rabbi, with a Sunni Muslim imam, and with a Buddhist monk have all been fascinating. Of course, like @Traveler, I believe these men would be even more compelling if they had the abiding presence of Christ within them.
    That said, I've also seen forms of Christianity that sucked the life out of people. One friend of my older brother's became a Christian, and he seemed to be almost running on auto-pilot. His humor was gone, his perspectives calcified, and sadly, I doubt many would have been compelled by his changes. Yes, he behaved better. However, our faith should make us more alive, not less. It should bring out the positive aspects of our individual personalities, not suppress them. So, while there is not doubt that wealthy, celebrity preachers suffer from some flaws (we can discuss the errors without condemning the persons, imho), I suspect that they often provide desperately needed positivity to those who have become downcast, despite their faith.
  6. Okay
    Traveler reacted to Suzie in Sometimes the Big Name Preachers are just what we need   
    It reminds me to that old song from Genesis "Jesus He knows me".
    @prisonchaplain not sure how I feel about the example you gave, but it disturbs me deeply (good message or not) if desperate people are used in the process, if they are asked to show their 'gratitude' through financial "gifts" or donations in order to support a lavish lifestyle.
  7. Like
    Traveler got a reaction from JohnsonJones in Isaiah Translation   
    It is my understanding that the single greatest impact on modern Biblical textual criticism was the discovery of the Dead Sea Scriptures and Scrolls.  This would play directly into the textual criticism of Isaiah for several reasons.  Perhaps most important is that all the other Old Testament scriptures were maintained not as single text of each book but rather multiple versions of texts.  As I understand they are basically divided into a large and small (abridge) version of texts - one being more verbose than the other.
    This introduces another problem into understanding what you call "the intended message of the text".  That the intended message is not singular but rather as put forth by Isaiah - a plural message of line upon line upon line and precept upon precept upon precept here a little and there a little.
    But it also seems to me that the perspective of a Latter-day Saint is somewhat superior to others despite that there are scholars with generations of secular insight.  For example we know that a prophet such as Mormon and Moroni can abridge the revelations of previous prophets.  And that such abridgements can modify the underlying message that in essence can either add to or remove spiritual insights concerning a particular scripture, in part dependent on the loyalties to covenants of a specific "generation". 
    Thus it is my understanding that a Latter-day Saint is charged to study (from the "best" resources) all that is possible - come to a conclusion and then seek conformation through the power and Gift of the Holy Ghost.  And even then the confirmation is not singular or a end to seeking an "intended meaning" but as prophesied by Isaiah - the new line and new principle.  Not even then not as an end to be argued but rather a cherished insight to be added upon at some future time.
     
    The Traveler
  8. Like
    Traveler got a reaction from MrShorty in Life, Death and an Isotropic Universe:   
    My question here - for those that believe in a young earth ---- Why would a G-d of truth create the "heavens" and the earth in a shorten amount of time and then leave a preponderance of empirical evidence  that it was not done in such a short time?  If it was to "test" our faith - why would a G-d of truth test our faith based on deliberate discerptions? 
     
    The Traveler
  9. Like
    Traveler reacted to Still_Small_Voice in Life, Death and an Isotropic Universe:   
    It might have taken that long.  It possibly could have taken ten of thousands or hundreds of thousands or millions of years for the Earth to be formed and placed where it is.  We do not know.  There is so much theory we cannot solve about the origin of the Earth because of our minute amount of time we have been studying and keeping records.
    But I do not like it when people preach that the LORD formed the Earth in six twenty-four hour periods.  The physical evidence on the Earth simply does not show that.
  10. Like
    Traveler got a reaction from MrShorty in Life, Death and an Isotropic Universe:   
    Background noise (like from a star) is going to be much stronger than a regular intelligent signal.  However, it is not that difficult to filter out the kind of frequencies that occur from various kinds of stars and other background radiation.  This kind of filtering is done naturally by various predictor and other life forms.  For example, there is evidence that migrating birds and aquodic life forms use faint electromagnetic radiation for location.  In fact the background radiation can be very helpful as a "carrier wave".  This technology is also used to determine the elemental composition and age of various stars.  When I was working for the defense department (anti submarine warfare) we used similar sonar detection systems.  The ocean can carry a lot of sonic information and with triangulation we were able to determine; the identity, location, speed, bearing and load of a vessel from hundreds of miles away - even if such a vessel was in a convoy of several vessels.
    The theory in SETI is that there is a probability of intelligent life that has evolved to our level or greater among the billions of stars just in our milky way  galaxy that we should be able to detect something of a repeating nature.  There have been a number of electromagnetic burst of interest but in theory the signal would be repetitive.  But for all the theoretical probabilities - nothing has been found and there is no good explanation for that.
  11. Like
    Traveler got a reaction from JohnsonJones in Isaiah Translation   
    Does your opinion include the evidence of Isaiah in the Book of Mormon? - that references Isaiah from about 100 years before the Lehi migration took place. (that predates from 100 to 200 years prior to you reference to unified models?   So that the time between Isaiah and king Ahaz to  Lehi is half the time you are assuming it took to evolve the current Isaiah.  BTW all this is less than half the time between us and the creation of most revelations in the Doctrine and Covenants.  
    It is also interesting to me that it would evolve for 300 years and then suddenly stop between then and the copy of Isaiah we have from the Dead Sea Scriptures????  Why is it not possible that the literary forms come from the license of Scribes transcribing the work rather than individual authors?  I realize that we do not have any autograms beyond perhaps what was part of the Brass Plates.
     
    The Traveler
  12. Okay
    Traveler reacted to prisonchaplain in Prisonchaplain retiring...from prison chaplaincy   
    @Traveler  Traditional Christian seminaries would require a doctorate-holder, and LDS ones would require many qualities I lack (such as an authorized LDS baptism). On the other hand, I found out that the school I'm applying to has a chaplain and offers concurrent classes with Northwest University (A/G) for its high school students. So... maybe.
    Then again, God may see fit to have me serve public schools, in which case I would be considered a community chaplain. As long as its His first choice, I'm all in. 
  13. Like
    Traveler reacted to MrShorty in Life, Death and an Isotropic Universe:   
    True, but it seems arguable that science has not been able to penetrate very deep into the universe. According to the Planetary Habitability laboratory (http://phl.upr.edu/projects/habitable-exoplanets-catalog/top10), the farthest exoplanet (not even considering planet type or habitability) is about 30 kly away. For comparison, it is estimated that our planet is about 30 kly from the center of our galaxy, so our "bubble" of observing exoplanets consists of only a small portion of our Milky Way. I don't know what it would take to detect intelligent life outside of our solar system, but it seems almost certain that we have barely even begun to search and we are severely limited in our ability to search. At present, I'm not sure science can even begin to answer the question.
    I guess it depends on what characteristics you consider when you say "unique". Clearly, within our observation limits, Earth is the only one with confirmed life, but there are several "rocky, Earth size planets" within our observation limits.
    As much as I despise semantics, I get hung up what we mean/scripture means when it says "world" in this context. Is a star/solar system considered a world? A galaxy? A universe?
    I'm not sure how to answer the questions of how hostile other environments would be to life without assuming isotropy. Assuming life on other worlds is similar to our life, then I would hypothesize that all life exists under similar hostile conditions. Would life existing under non-hostile conditions be similar enough to us to be recognized as having the same Father?
  14. Like
    Traveler reacted to askandanswer in Life, Death and an Isotropic Universe:   
    33  And worlds without number have I created; and I also created them for mine own purpose; and by the Son I created them, which is mine Only Begotten.
    34  And the first man of all men have I called Adam, which is many.
    35  But only an account of this earth, and the inhabitants thereof, give I unto you.  For behold, there are many worlds that have passed away by the word of my power.  And there are many that now stand, and innumerable are they unto man; but all things are numbered unto me, for they are mine and I know them.
    (Pearl of Great Price | Moses 1:33 - 35)
    Elder McConkie and Elder Callister have both taught that Christ's infinite atonement covered all of God's creations, no matter which world they lived on.
  15. Haha
    Traveler got a reaction from askandanswer in Prisonchaplain retiring...from prison chaplaincy   
    Perhaps you ought to consider becoming a seminary teacher in Utah.   😎
     
    The Traveler
  16. Like
    Traveler got a reaction from MrShorty in Life, Death and an Isotropic Universe:   
    The universe we live in is believed to be isotropic.  Some claim that science has not proven this notion but is there anything in religion that rejects our universe as isotropic?  The essence of an isotropic universe is that the principles that are true are universal (the same everywhere).  The terms of universe and universal are obviously tightly connected.   In theory, if principles change then it is thought that we have traversed from our universe into another.  For the sake of understanding – if a hydrogen atom is coupled with two oxygen atoms we will have a water molecule – and it does not matter where in our universe we are – the result will always be the same – both in time and space.
    One of the questions surrounding the Big Bang theory has to do with the universe being isotropic.  In short – there are no “bangs” that are isotropic, let alone a “Big Bang”.  Bangs are anisotropic.  But in our universe even anisotropic materials and events are evenly or smoothly spread.  Thus the creation of that which is anisotropic in our universe becomes isotropic.  Are you confused yet?
    One of the great spiritual questions concerns life.  Most individuals are convinced that earth is not the only place in the universe where life (as we know it) exists.  There have been great debates between science and religion that center around and deal directly with life.  The truth is that our universe is very hostile towards life.  Science has not found a trace of intelligence life anywhere.  The big question coming out of all this is – are we alone?  Is life in this universe an abnormality and mistake?
    From our scriptures we are told that prior to the fall of Adam and Eve there was no death.  That all things, in essence, were in an eternal state that did not change or deteriorate over time. But from all the existing evidence – our universe is not only in a state of change – but change that is best described as violent and hostile to life.   That because of the fall – man was exiled to a very unique world described as “the loan and dreary world” where death was unavoidable and enviable.
    So here is my question – How unique is earth to this universe?  We are led to believe that G-d has created many worlds – are such other world hostile to life as we know it?  Is life here unique in that in order to survive we must live off of other life?  Is death unique to our earth?  How violent is life on other worlds?  Why dinosaurs? And why are they gone?  Why are most species (over 90%) that once lived on this planet now extinct?
     
    The Traveler
  17. Confused
    Traveler reacted to maklelan in Isaiah Translation   
    I think it's a creative reading, particularly in the way he divides the text, but I don't think it has much to do with what was intended by the authors or editors, or what was understood by the first several generations of the text's readers.
  18. Like
    Traveler got a reaction from Just_A_Guy in Spiritual Bypassing   
    It is really good to see you back in for forum.
    This post may be longer that it should - for that please for give me.  When I was in high school we had a ping pong table in our basement activity room.  It was part of the competitiveness among friends and family.  I developed a killer serve that no one could handle.  I was guaranteed a point every time I used it.  I began to rely exclusively on this serve - the more I used it the better I got at it.  But I was not aware of something else that was happening.  Those that I was playing against were getting better at returning the serve.  Eventually, I went from winning every game to loosing every game.  I was much surprised at how quickly that transition happened. 
    So why this little story?  I believe it is just one of lives great lessons.   It does not matter how effective we are at a single task - we cannot rely on our own devises.  Our opposition is better at whatever "game" or "strategy" we may think to employ of our own intelligence and abilities.   
    I am not an expert at reading people but my impression of you is that you are very good a discipline and commitment.  I like to think of myself in such terms - I believe such to be of great honor.  Where I have difficulty is caring about others (with some few exceptions).  I struggle with emotional attachments - especially to things but it also includes people and ideas.  When I say emotional attachments I am referencing emotions mostly without logic.  I struggle even with spiritual things that I cannot connect to logically.
    Why this post to you?  I am not sure but what comes to mind is Moroni chapter 10.  Moving beyond verses 4 and 5 we get into an interesting and strong reference to spiritual gifts.  It is my understanding that every person in this mortal existence has a quiver of spiritual gifts.  I believe it is that person's genus - the spiritual gifts with which they excel to greatness.  But it seems that Moroni is suggesting (exhorting - which is a very strong word that he uses many times) to rely on the spiritual gifts of others - and not just our own.
    The trick - at least for me - is recognizing the spiritual gifts - both within ourselves and others - especially under conditions that we become completive or in opposition.  At least for me it is more exciting and fun to explore differences but the reality is that there is wisdom in finding supplementary and complimentary ways to work with others of differing views and opinions.  Obviously I lack certain spiritual gifts and the more we (as Latter-day Saints) can see beyond ourselves the better off we will all be.  Especially in dealing with our common opposition and accuser.
     
    The Traveler
  19. Thanks
    Traveler reacted to Jonah in Who is G-d that I should know Him.   
    I have never met these beings, but I was thinking about those who are considered to be the one-third of
    Heavenly Father's spirit children who rejected his plan of salvation. I think these are classified as the sons
    of perdition, destined for outer darkness.
  20. Like
    Traveler got a reaction from pam in Make the Forums Great Again   
    I believe there is a greater need for a forum such as this one - more than ever before.  But I am not sure that something needed is something utilized.  We live in a culture of intolerance that is becoming more and more dominate.  I started posting on forums many decades ago (Dr. Laura) because of the anti LDS posts.  I was asked to become involved.  What has happened is that in "efforts" to become more tolerant we have become less tolerant of opposing ideas.  Some call this current trend - the cancel culture.  Which is:  If someone disagrees with you it is because they think you are evil crud and one must respond in kind.  
    As a culture it is becoming an act of inferiority or stupidity to allow alternate opinions.  Of course there are always the opposite examples (like @prisonchaplain).  I have personally experimented with him to see where his boundaries of tolerance may lie but he has never taken that challenge.  And through it all he seems to see more similarities than differences in our religious faiths.
    There is a old saying:  "If you can not say nothing good about no body - it is more better you no say nothing!"  We do not have to respond to every challenge or answer every question.  I would personally prefer that the forum be more liberal concerning toxic posts - but the problem is that someone feel that they have to set trolls right.  Which is exactly what the trolls want and why they post.  If no one responded to such posts - they would no longer post. 
    It does seem to me that if someone posts a truthful and inspired post - it may be read by many but few will respond.  Say something offensive, foolish re unusually stupid and everybody will jump in with anger and things will quickly spiral out of control.  Which is exactly the purpose of trolls - and may I add Satan and his followers?
    I think Jesus said some interesting things about trolls when he said, "Love your enemies and do good to those that despitefully use you."  But then Jesus was quit strong in his rebuke of the Pharisees. 
    So here is my advice - never respond to any post in anger.  If you want to tell someone off - take a day off, pray about it then write a response.  If you heart is not full of love towards those you are addressing - save your post for another 24 hours - pray again about what you have written.  If you are still upset - then do not respond - rather find a post with which you agree and post a thanks.
    BTW - @pam Thanks for starting this thread.
     
    The Traveler
  21. Haha
    Traveler got a reaction from askandanswer in Make the Forums Great Again   
    Or anywhere else with a strange accent. 
     
    The Traveler
  22. Like
    Traveler got a reaction from pam in Make the Forums Great Again   
    I believe there is a greater need for a forum such as this one - more than ever before.  But I am not sure that something needed is something utilized.  We live in a culture of intolerance that is becoming more and more dominate.  I started posting on forums many decades ago (Dr. Laura) because of the anti LDS posts.  I was asked to become involved.  What has happened is that in "efforts" to become more tolerant we have become less tolerant of opposing ideas.  Some call this current trend - the cancel culture.  Which is:  If someone disagrees with you it is because they think you are evil crud and one must respond in kind.  
    As a culture it is becoming an act of inferiority or stupidity to allow alternate opinions.  Of course there are always the opposite examples (like @prisonchaplain).  I have personally experimented with him to see where his boundaries of tolerance may lie but he has never taken that challenge.  And through it all he seems to see more similarities than differences in our religious faiths.
    There is a old saying:  "If you can not say nothing good about no body - it is more better you no say nothing!"  We do not have to respond to every challenge or answer every question.  I would personally prefer that the forum be more liberal concerning toxic posts - but the problem is that someone feel that they have to set trolls right.  Which is exactly what the trolls want and why they post.  If no one responded to such posts - they would no longer post. 
    It does seem to me that if someone posts a truthful and inspired post - it may be read by many but few will respond.  Say something offensive, foolish re unusually stupid and everybody will jump in with anger and things will quickly spiral out of control.  Which is exactly the purpose of trolls - and may I add Satan and his followers?
    I think Jesus said some interesting things about trolls when he said, "Love your enemies and do good to those that despitefully use you."  But then Jesus was quit strong in his rebuke of the Pharisees. 
    So here is my advice - never respond to any post in anger.  If you want to tell someone off - take a day off, pray about it then write a response.  If you heart is not full of love towards those you are addressing - save your post for another 24 hours - pray again about what you have written.  If you are still upset - then do not respond - rather find a post with which you agree and post a thanks.
    BTW - @pam Thanks for starting this thread.
     
    The Traveler
  23. Like
    Traveler got a reaction from pam in Make the Forums Great Again   
    I believe there is a greater need for a forum such as this one - more than ever before.  But I am not sure that something needed is something utilized.  We live in a culture of intolerance that is becoming more and more dominate.  I started posting on forums many decades ago (Dr. Laura) because of the anti LDS posts.  I was asked to become involved.  What has happened is that in "efforts" to become more tolerant we have become less tolerant of opposing ideas.  Some call this current trend - the cancel culture.  Which is:  If someone disagrees with you it is because they think you are evil crud and one must respond in kind.  
    As a culture it is becoming an act of inferiority or stupidity to allow alternate opinions.  Of course there are always the opposite examples (like @prisonchaplain).  I have personally experimented with him to see where his boundaries of tolerance may lie but he has never taken that challenge.  And through it all he seems to see more similarities than differences in our religious faiths.
    There is a old saying:  "If you can not say nothing good about no body - it is more better you no say nothing!"  We do not have to respond to every challenge or answer every question.  I would personally prefer that the forum be more liberal concerning toxic posts - but the problem is that someone feel that they have to set trolls right.  Which is exactly what the trolls want and why they post.  If no one responded to such posts - they would no longer post. 
    It does seem to me that if someone posts a truthful and inspired post - it may be read by many but few will respond.  Say something offensive, foolish re unusually stupid and everybody will jump in with anger and things will quickly spiral out of control.  Which is exactly the purpose of trolls - and may I add Satan and his followers?
    I think Jesus said some interesting things about trolls when he said, "Love your enemies and do good to those that despitefully use you."  But then Jesus was quit strong in his rebuke of the Pharisees. 
    So here is my advice - never respond to any post in anger.  If you want to tell someone off - take a day off, pray about it then write a response.  If you heart is not full of love towards those you are addressing - save your post for another 24 hours - pray again about what you have written.  If you are still upset - then do not respond - rather find a post with which you agree and post a thanks.
    BTW - @pam Thanks for starting this thread.
     
    The Traveler
  24. Like
    Traveler reacted to The Folk Prophet in Spiritual Bypassing   
    I'd go so far as to say that there is no remedy to emotional and psychological issues that isn't spiritual.
  25. Like
    Traveler reacted to Jane_Doe in Spiritual Bypassing   
    It’s way over generaling.  Are there some people whom like to avoid thinking: yes, the exist in all camps. It’s not remotely a spiritual only thing. 
     
    Now is is there any pint in responding: zero.