Need for advice/reassurance in dealing with an ex

[checkerboy]

So because my situation and yours are so similar just with younger kids on my part I wanted to say that the last few days I have been trying to talk to my boys at night on the phone and they haven't wanted to talk to me. Is it frustrating? Yes. But I am gonna keep calling them every day even if they just tell me I don't want to talk tonight. They need to know that I am always gonna be there for them. I think that is the one thing, as fathers that don't get primary time with our kids, we can do. I know it sucks now but 10 years from now they will remember that I never stopped calling.

[MrNirom]

My heart goes out to you.

My ex and her boyfriend put a wedge between my children and me.

When she died in 2000 from cervical cancer.. I had to fight the boyfriend for custody of my children. This was when they were 11, 13, 15. My 11 year old (who is now 19) still wants nothing to do with me.

My prayers are with you.

[prospectmom]

Because of hearing about all your stories ( ones like it ) and living through my mothers version,,, bad....... when I divorced I bent over backwards to not be that kind of X............ It was hard but worked............. Keep working towards the positive...... For yourselves and the kids

[unixknight]

Since I'll be picking up my eldest tomorrow morning for a brief weekend visit I'll have plenty of time with him on the long drive back and forth to talk about these issues.

Now if I can get similar 1 on 1 time with the ot hers on a regular basis, I think we'll be alright.

[prospectmom]

Just know that your children will remember all you do all the positives and if you are honorable they will see it ... may take awhile but it will work out

[unixknight]

You know, on a recent visit when the kids were over for about a week, all 3 of them sat down with me to vent their frustrations about their mom. It seems each one has his or her own reasons to be frustrated with home life, and all of them feel shunted ever since the boyfriend entered the picture.

Now, I know it's perfectly normal for kids to feel a little competitive when a new romantic interest enters mom's or dad's life, but during this same conversation the kids commended me on how I'd handled bringing my new wife into the picture. They suddenly started commending me for a lot of things and it felt really good...

But maybe too good. I don't want it to go to my head that my kids seem to be far more comfortable coming to talk to me about things than their mom. (She already blew my 12 year old's confidence by taking a very personal thing he told her and sharing it with the boyfriend.) I have to struggle not to feel vindicated at these things but man... It's hard.

[Stacey_Jay]

Worry is at tool of Satan.... .

Im not sure I agree with that prospectmom. Worry is a natural part of being a parent, and you are bound to worry about people you love. I worry all the time about my husband getting home safe etc. Are you saying thats Satan??

Unix...sounds like you are doing all the right things. Ultimately, you should want your children to be happy with or without the church. Would it be such a bad thing if they didn't go so long as they were happy? I think thats whats important.

[unixknight]

Im not sure I agree with that prospectmom. Worry is a natural part of being a parent, and you are bound to worry about people you love. I worry all the time about my husband getting home safe etc. Are you saying thats Satan??

Unix...sounds like you are doing all the right things. Ultimately, you should want your children to be happy with or without the church. Would it be such a bad thing if they didn't go so long as they were happy? I think thats whats important.

The problem is, if they lose their enthusiasm for the church due to their mother's lack of it, then they're giving up their best chance at true happiness.

[Islander]

Im not sure I agree with that prospectmom. Worry is a natural part of being a parent, and you are bound to worry about people you love. I worry all the time about my husband getting home safe etc. Are you saying thats Satan??

Unix...sounds like you are doing all the right things. Ultimately, you should want your children to be happy with or without the church. Would it be such a bad thing if they didn't go so long as they were happy? I think thats whats important.

Without getting into a legalistic mode, I think worry relates to recurrent preoccupation that can fuel anxiety. I am not referring to critical thinking and analysis of a certain situation for problem solving.

In Matt. 6: 25, 31, 34 the Lord admonishes us not to worry much our material things. We must have our house in order and lean on the Gospel as means to address all spiritual things. Faith and prayer should be the primary weapons. Challenges are designed to teach, to strengthen and to forge, not to rack your soul with anxiety and grief.

So, please, do not worry. The Lord knows your thoughts and he hears your prayers. He will answer you.

[FayetteIA]

I cannot be much help except offer a My husband and I went through nightmare breakups of our previous marriages. He lived in so. UT I lived in so CA but our situations were so parallel, it is uncanny. We have been married 14 years now. The efforts of our exes has resulted in all of our living 8 children, that we share, being a varying levels of inactivity. Along with the inactivity comes the mistrust of "Dad" my husband, by his children. Because Mom so cleverly distorted things and we will not stoop to her level.

It was the same with my previous marriage. My ex did not want me any longer, he found someone else (yes we were married in the Temple) but after he left the home, he did not want our children, who remained with me to want me either. Now we have 8 adult children who some will not speak to us, all have lived in our home for a time, or are outright enemies to our household. One son thought Gang-banging was attractive, one daughter has been excommunicated X2, one is convinced that her father did some sort of intimate abuse to her (now this idea came to her after she lived our home 2 yrs, and her Mom was unhappy she was with us, so suddenly she was the victim of abuse from around the age of 4) We have always remained active, even when we drove truck for 10 years, we would do our Sunday meetings on board the truck, not sacrament of course. Our ex spouses? my hubby's remarried soon after we did, was sealed in the St. George Temple, then a few years later dumped him for an Indian wedding on the side of a hill in Prove...we do not even know if it is legal? My x is so angry at the church..when my son died 3 years ago, he was at the memorial service, I gave a talk..I could feel the heat of his anger...after 10 yrs of being div from him plus 11 yrs of being married to my current husband. Our exes are still so embittered. I do not get it. They tried every trick in the book to sabotage custody arrangements, convince the kids that we, my husband and myself are the real "Lowlife's" I am never surprised anymore when someone talks about this kind of estrangement. We have been through a Refiners Fire of it. It continues even today.

All I can give for advice is this: You. stay strong in the church, You keep your Covenants, no matter what. And remember, the Lord does not release us from the calling of "parent" you cannot allow yourselves to be intimidated by angry exes and offspring where you might try to "Release yourself" Is is easy?.No it is the toughest path I have ever walked.

Something within me won't allow me to give up. I have to love and parent them, when I feel impressed to do so, even if they do not love me back or even like me. My heart goes out to you. Last. It is sooo important to stay close to the Lord, you never know when an opportunity, no matter how Small will arise, and you get a chance to make a lasting impression on your children, for Good. If we leave it all up to the embittered exes, it is pretty much a guarantee they will not get these "teaching/learning" moments. If you stay strong, in the Gospel, at least there is a hope in that.

Joni

[Misshalfway]

Just a note on worrying.....I think Islander has it right. Worry is the fuel to anxiety and the opposite of faith and trust and is not a place of proactive power. I think we deal with crisis or challenges better when we are in a state of peace and faith and trust. We trust ourselves and others to be able to deal with the realities of our lives. Worrying puts us into dealing with 'what if's' which is most of the time our imagination and makes us controlling and panicky and over-reactive. Dealing peacefully with reality is more powerful. Taking steps to keep children safe and educated and then trusting their own strengths and talents and agency. We trust ourselves that we CAN handle the difficulties of life and relationships and struggle and we trust God with the rest. That doesn't mean that worrying isn't human or normal to some degree. What parent hasn't worried about their child at one time or another, especially when that child is making creative choices. But, dealing in our struggles with worry doesn't help the situation or bring about effective solutions. It just makes us and everyone else more crazy and teaches our children that we don't trust them or people or God.

[unixknight]

Update:

Well there's good and there's bad.

The good:

I've spoken with all 3 kids and they have expressed a desire to keep going to church on weekends when they're with their mom. I called their maternal grandfather and asked if he'd be willing to take them to church on Sunday and he said he'd be more than happy to, as long as they're up and ready to go. I'll do what I can from my end to keep them motivated.

The bad:

During a conversation with me yesterday my ex started to express feelings of resentment at the Bishop and her Visiting Teacher asking about her. She doesn't say 'The Church' now she refers to it as 'The Mormon Church' the way a non-member might. I told her she's beginning to sound like an anti. She said she doesn't appreciate being treated like a teenager.

I think this is it, friends. I think she's laying the foundation for taking up a stand against the Church to excuse the inactivity. She *WILL* drag the kids down with her if she possibly can.

I'm planning on meeting with my Bishop on Sunday to talk to him about some other stuff, but I think I'll tell him about this situation as well to see if he can offer any additional insights.

[prospectmom]

From what I can tell from this post I see your x as knowing she is wrong and acting out in defense to attack the Bishop and Visiting Teachers, I feel such deep sadness for you and for her...... Mabey her Bishop and Visiting Teacher need to take a different approach..... I am not saying she is right I know she is wrong but she is caught up in behavior she knows is not right and to try and justify it she will push it away as the cause of all her misery. Satan is singing her a song and sadly she is listening.... I know its hard for you and not your place anymore to fix it . Your doing all you can and you can not control her. Keep up hte good things and pray for the bad.

[candyprpl]

So because my situation and yours are so similar just with younger kids on my part I wanted to say that the last few days I have been trying to talk to my boys at night on the phone and they haven't wanted to talk to me. Is it frustrating? Yes. But I am gonna keep calling them every day even if they just tell me I don't want to talk tonight. They need to know that I am always gonna be there for them. I think that is the one thing, as fathers that don't get primary time with our kids, we can do. I know it sucks now but 10 years from now they will remember that I never stopped calling.

THAT IS SOOOOOO TRUE!! PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE DON'T EVER FORGET THAT!!

I have a grown son who still grieves over not having his father be more involved in is youth. To his credit, HE has made sure to have that relationship now without making his father feel guilty about the past. To my credit, I never said bad things about his father and I never encouraged him (my son) to harbour bad feelings against his father.

The most important sentence and I will add an exclamation point ..."but 10 years from now they will remember that I never stopped calling."

[Marsha8]

Haven't experienced the same thing but you have to remain neutral and supportive to your children an their mother no matter what . You can't judge her and sadly even though she is falling away from the church at this time there is no reason no to hope she will return. Your influence on your children is stronger than you think...... Are they still going to church??? Can you take them???? Do the have the church magazines in their home???? ( another way to help keep them connected) Your right you can't judge .

I disagree with you. We can judge that people are not living the gospel. We cannot judge rather they will turn around or not or where they will end up in the eternities but we can judge their actions and it is so wrong that she is sleeping with someone rather they are actual doing anything or not. It is wrong. We can judge that a temple endowed person not wearing their garments is very serious.

I have an ex that does not live the standards and is even in a differant religion now and is teaching my daughter anti stuff. I totally understand. She just turned 13 and she wanted to live with him so he took me to court and now has custody. I totally understand. It is very hard. The spirit tells me that she will one day come to know the church is true and so I have to let that be my comfort.

[Marsha8]

It does not matter what you have done in the past as long as you have repented and are doing the best you can now. That is no excuse for other peoples bad behavior. You learn and repent and then go on doing and being the best you can.

[Marsha8]

See, that's the sort of thing I'd like to have happening, but it seems like my ex's relationship with our kids is being systematically disassembled and I feel like I either have to step in and make excuses for her, or somehow try to distract the kids.

I've already tried talking to her directly about this, but my words carry no weight whatsoever so I got nowhere. I've been thinking about talking to her parents for the kids' sake, but I have little hope that they'd do anything because it might be seen as "getting involved" which they have never done.

You should not make excuses for her. Your children need to be taught exactly what is right and what is wrong and then they can go from there. Making excuses for sin only teaches them that that is ok.

[Marsha8]

Im not sure I agree with that prospectmom. Worry is a natural part of being a parent, and you are bound to worry about people you love. I worry all the time about my husband getting home safe etc. Are you saying thats Satan??

Unix...sounds like you are doing all the right things. Ultimately, you should want your children to be happy with or without the church. Would it be such a bad thing if they didn't go so long as they were happy? I think thats whats important.

I do not agree with what you said about happiness and the church. Wickedness never was happiness. Sure people think they are happy lots of times when they sin but it is not a lasting happiness. The gospel is going to be the ultimate happiness. Do you want your children to live this life thinking they are happy to live miserable for Eternity? The gospel is VERY important. I would rather be unhappy for a short period and have eternity to be truely happy in. I cannot express how important the gospel is.

Edited July 21, 2008 by Marsha8

[candyprpl]

Marsha8,

I agree with most of what you are saying. There is no excuse for not living the gospel. But you have to walk a fine line with how you approach your children on the subject. If it comes across that he is bad-mouthing there mother than nothing will be gained by that. Too many times I have seen children come to resent the parent who is always speaking bad of the other parent. I understand what you're saying and I agree that you need to teach children that the only true happiness is living the gospel -- you just have to be careful how you communicate that when they have a parent who is not living the gospel.

Does that make sense? I hope so. Sometimes writing rather than having a back and forth conversation doesn't always communicate what you want the other to understand.

[Marsha8]

I agree. You have to teach your children without talking bad about the other parent. That is the hard part, but it has to be done.

[prospectmom]

I disagree with you. We can judge that people are not living the gospel.[b]

Marsha I guess you haven't read all the articles about NOT judging about being loving and supportive to ALL of Gods Children..... If you can get past the hurt felings of a divorce it is in both your childrens and your best interest to be supportive and not judgemental to your X.......... I know this to be true and am blessed because I learned this long ago when I divorced. My goal is to be Christ-like to remember they are a child of God also no matter how lost they are.

Also if someone is not wearing their garments it is not your job to judge it is between them and Father in Heaven............... Judge not least ye be judged ..... remember that one :}

[Marsha8]

I disagree with you. We can judge that people are not living the gospel.[b]

Marsha I guess you haven't read all the articles about NOT judging about being loving and supportive to ALL of Gods Children..... If you can get past the hurt felings of a divorce it is in both your childrens and your best interest to be supportive and not judgemental to your X.......... I know this to be true and am blessed because I learned this long ago when I divorced. My goal is to be Christ-like to remember they are a child of God also no matter how lost they are.

Also if someone is not wearing their garments it is not your job to judge it is between them and Father in Heaven............... Judge not least ye be judged ..... remember that one :}

That is talking about not judging the person. I am talking about the actions of the person.

[prospectmom]

Same thing to me ............ what is the difference???????? Your caught on symantics to justify judging others ........... I think that is sad.............. I wish you enlightenment on this subject

[Marsha8]

Same thing to me ............ what is the difference???????? Your caught on symantics to justify judging others ........... I think that is sad.............. I wish you enlightenment on this subject

Who is judging other? I judged the act, not the person. I call evil evil not the person that has done the evil eivil. There is a HUGE differance. I am the one that needs enlightenment? HA

[unixknight]

I think you two really do agree with one another you're just getting caught up on phrasing.

I think we'd all agree that judging people is the place of the Lord, not us.

As for their actions, I think we'd also agree that we use discernment to determine whether or not those actions are in keeping with God's Will and whether or not they would be appropriate to emulate. One uses their good judgment as well as promptings from the Spirit to do this.

In the case of my ex and her actions, I need to make clear to my kids what's acceptable and what's not, but I need to do it by walking that fine line between explaining to them that the actions are wrong, and badmouthing their mother. Mostly by emphasizing that their mom isn't being malicious or deliberately selfish, she's just lonely and/or feeling insecure and is trying to cope. A better way to cope would have been to talk to her Ward leadership and pray a LOT but we do have freewill and as humans we don't always use it to the best result. She will have to find her own way and that it's my kids' job, as people who love her, to be there and be supportive of her should she decide to return to the light.