Sarcasm

[Vort]

Interesting. While i don't consider sarcasm the downfall of thought, i think the rest of the description is fairly accurate. Mr. Laraty's comment is exactly what i'm referring to. It was a completely inappropriate response. Christ would never had said such a thing. We need to respond in more Christ-like ways if we want to be called His followers

It was a joke, Connie. Actually it was more of a metajoke. The humor lies not in the over-the-top sarcasm of the response, but in the fact that it was a sarcastic reply to an argument against sarcasm. It was basically a self-referential response. It wasn't meant to be taken seriously; the response itself was the joke. On the surface, the response was belittling the argument; but in point of fact, the response was confirming the argument and belittling itself. Hence, funny.

[Connie]

I agree that in person we can watch for clues in the persons face here we can use the "smiles" to the right.:D:D The only thing about those is you are limited to eight per post.

I also think it's fair to say that some of us who have been here awhile know how some people are and when things are meant as a joke or meant to offend. I always say that if you are unsure you need to ask and maybe in a PM would be best. Some of the people I thought were so rude have actually become some of my better friends after we had gotten past a misunderstanding. :):):):)

Yes, thank you, which is why i say be careful, especially with some of the newer people who may not know.

[Connie]

It was a joke, Connie. Actually it was more of a metajoke. The humor lies not in the over-the-top sarcasm of the response, but in the fact that it was a sarcastic reply to an argument against sarcasm. It was basically a self-referential response. It wasn't meant to be taken seriously; the response itself was the joke. On the surface, the response was belittling the argument; but in point of fact, the response was confirming the argument and belittling itself. Hence, funny.

See what i mean! I just don't understand sarcasm. I don't even understand this explanation.

[Misshalfway]

Using sarcasm at a joke.....to add humor is all fine in my book. But when it is used to belittle or humiliate or against another in anyway, it becomes a weapon. Perhaps we need to be the Anti-Nephi-Lehi's in this regard and bury our weapons of war. :)

[Connie]

Using sarcasm at a joke.....to add humor is all fine in my book. But when it is used to belittle or humiliate or against another in anyway, it becomes a weapon. Perhaps we need to be the Anti-Nephi-Lehi's in this regard and bury our weapons of war. :)

I agree, but it needs to be clear it was a joke at least for the benefit of the slow ones like me. Sarcasm makes me feel like such a dunce! This is probably part of why i dislike it. Maybe you're right, Islander, you and me, my friend, must have an atrophied sense of humor.

[Misshalfway]

I agree, but it needs to be clear it was a joke at least for the benefit of the slow ones like me. Sarcasm makes me feel like such a dunce! This is probably part of why i dislike it. Maybe you're right, Islander, you and me, my friend, must have an atrophied sense of humor.

Or perhaps a more evolved one!!!

[Vort]

See what i mean! I just don't understand sarcasm. I don't even understand this explanation.

For example, look at the silly joke I posted earlier:

"In languages like Italian, a double negative means no. In languages like German, a double negative means yes. But there is no language in which a double positive means no."

"Yeah, right."

The "Yeah, right" is sarcastic, but that's not why it's funny. It's funny because the sarcastic reply proved the statement wrong, but in a totally unexpected way. It's humor of form rather than humor of content.

Humor of content:

- Knock, knock.

- Who's there?

- Boo.

- Boo who?

- Hey, it's only a knock-knock joke, you don't have to cry about it.

Humor of form:

- Knock, knock.

- Who's there?

- Impatient cow.

- Impatien-

- MOO!

The first one is funny because it makes a pun; "Boo who?" sounds like "boo hoo", which is how we represent crying. That's typically what a knock-knock joke is; a corny pun. The second one is funny not because it's a pun, but because it violates the way a knock-knock joke is supposed to work; the responder never gets to ask "Impatient cow who?", because the cow is too impatient to wait and so interrupts him. The self-reference of the joke ("Impatient cow" really is impatient) and its violation of the normal structure of that kind of joke is where the humor derives.

[Connie]

For example, look at the silly joke I posted earlier:

The "Yeah, right" is sarcastic, but that's not why it's funny. It's funny because the sarcastic reply proved the statement wrong, but in a totally unexpected way. It's humor of form rather than humor of content.

Humor of content:

- Knock, knock.

- Who's there?

- Boo.

- Boo who?

- Hey, it's only a knock-knock joke, you don't have to cry about it.

Humor of form:

- Knock, knock.

- Who's there?

- Impatient cow.

- Impatien-

- MOO!

The first one is funny because it makes a pun; "Boo who?" sounds like "boo hoo", which is how we represent crying. That's typically what a knock-knock joke is; a corny pun. The second one is funny not because it's a pun, but because it violates the way a knock-knock joke is supposed to work; the responder never gets to ask "Impatient cow who?", because the cow is too impatient to wait and so interrupts him. The self-reference of the joke ("Impatient cow" really is impatient) and its violation of the normal structure of that kind of joke is where the humor derives.

Okay, maybe i'll understand one of these days. I actually did get your silly post, though i had to read it through twice before it sunk in (it was very funny). i feel like crying now for some reason. I think i'll go do that just to get it out of my system.

[Vort]

Okay, maybe i'll understand one of these days. I actually did get your silly post, though i had to read it through twice before it sunk in (it was very funny). i feel like crying now for some reason. I think i'll go do that just to get it out of my system.

Huh?? I know the knock-knock jokes were bad, but I didn't think they were THAT bad!

Please, don't ever cry or get upset on account of anything I post. I'm just talking to have some fun conversation, even when I might sound "argumentative". I actually hate arguing, but I enjoy a good discussion.

[skippy740]

Okay, maybe i'll understand one of these days. I actually did get your silly post, though i had to read it through twice before it sunk in (it was very funny). i feel like crying now for some reason. I think i'll go do that just to get it out of my system.

Have some fun and read some of these articles. They're funny and they have sarcasm in them.

Dave Barry - MiamiHerald.com

Humor is an art, but it can be elusive if you weren't brought up with it.

[Connie]

Phew...i hope i'm not pregnant. i've been a bit over emotional today, and that's not like me. i'm usually under emotional. don't worry, Vort, it's not you, it's just me. it's not fun being a girl sometimes. Though the knock, knock jokes were pretty bad. ha,ha

Thanks for the articles, skippy. The ones i read were really funny.

[lilered]

What ever!

[Connie]

Okay, maybe i'm starting to get it a little. Here are some links for ya'll:

Sarcasm - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Sarcasm, Sarcastic Comments, Quotes, Remarks, Dark Sarcasm

Wow, there's even a sarcasm society. I found this sentence interesting. Sarcasm usually requires a quick wit (that would rule me out), and the ability to extract the minutest points of weakness in a conversation. (i don't even have the desire to do this, so that rules me out too).

Psychology Today: Field Guide: Sarcastic Masters

This was an interesting read and may give us all a better understanding of each other--those who have the affinity for sarcasm and those who don't.

YouTube - Sarcasm at its best, or worst.

And a fun video.

But i still don't understand your megajoke, how it was really agreeing and belittling itself.

[skippy740]

If you find "The Simpsons" funny, then you understand sarcasm. Just listen to Homer. He's full of it (Pun fully intended).

[BenRaines]

I did a quick search at lds.org on sarcasm. I could not find one good thing said about it.

I gave a talk a couple of years ago and in it discussed sarcasm and how it has become so common place today. In almost all the comedy shows on television, in most conversations, even in my own home. I made it a goal to reduce the amount of sarcasm coming out of my mouth because, while I was good at it, I could not see anything positive coming from it.

Working hard to overcome the habit of being sarcastic has made an improvement in the attitudes in our home and how we interact with each other.

Ben Raines

[Connie]

Well, the more i read, the more convinced i am that i am mostly right about sarcasm and have very little use for it. Here are some more links:

LDS.org - New Era Article - A Serious Look at Humor

Last 3 paragraphs pertain to sarcasm but the whole article is great.

LDS.org - New Era Article - True Believers

My new favorite talk, i love Neal A. Maxwell. The section beginning True believers are happy is the one that discusses sarcasm.

LDS.org - New Era Article - A Good Sense of Humor

How sarcasm damaged a friendship. I think i'll use this article as my base for developing my own sense of humor.

"Remember, too, that no matter what you see in the TV sit-coms and movies, put-down, cutting humor is not good humor. While it may be entertaining to watch, in real life, cutting humor and sarcasm are too unkind to be funny. They can only injure, never uplift."

The Simpsons is a good example of this. I've always found it disgusting rather than funny. I don't want my family to be anything like the Simpsons are to each other. I honor my good parents for not allowing it in our home when it was so popular.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - Barriers and Bridges to Communication

Sarcasm as a barrier to communication. Really good article.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - Getting Older, Getting Better

"We cannot use the psychological weapons of depreciation, manipulation, criticism, or sarcasm on others without bruising ourselves. Instead of bruising, mature people build themselves by building others, looking at the good qualities of those around them and expressing genuine appreciation. Peace of mind grows as we build others up."

LDS.org - Ensign Article - The Invisible Heartbreaker

Sarcasm as a form of verbal abuse.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - Mormon Journal

Evidence of sarcasm as verbal abuse but with a happy ending.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - Let It End with Me

More evidence of sarcasm as verbal abuse.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - The Continuing Pursuit of Truth

"I am suggesting that as we go through life we “accentuate the positive.” I am asking that we look a little deeper for the good, that we still voices of insult and sarcasm, that we more generously compliment virtue and effort."

Great article by Gordon B. Hinckley

[Connie]

Well, the more i read, the more convinced i am that i am mostly right about sarcasm and have very little use for it. Here are some more links:

LDS.org - New Era Article - A Serious Look at Humor

Last 3 paragraphs pertain to sarcasm but the whole article is great.

LDS.org - New Era Article - True Believers

My new favorite talk, i love Neal A. Maxwell! The section beginning True believers are happy is the one that discusses sarcasm.

LDS.org - New Era Article - A Good Sense of Humor

How sarcasm damaged a friendship. I think i'll use this article as my base for developing my own sense of humor.

"Remember, too, that no matter what you see in the TV sit-coms and movies, put-down, cutting humor is not good humor. While it may be entertaining to watch, in real life, cutting humor and sarcasm are too unkind to be funny. They can only injure, never uplift."

The Simpsons is a good example of this. I've always found it disgusting rather than funny. I don't want my family to be anything like the Simpsons are to each other. I honor my good parents for not allowing it in our home when it was so popular.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - Barriers and Bridges to Communication

Sarcasm as a barrier to communication. Really good article.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - Getting Older, Getting Better

"We cannot use the psychological weapons of depreciation, manipulation, criticism, or sarcasm on others without bruising ourselves. Instead of bruising, mature people build themselves by building others, looking at the good qualities of those around them and expressing genuine appreciation. Peace of mind grows as we build others up."

LDS.org - Ensign Article - The Invisible Heartbreaker

Sarcasm as a form of verbal abuse.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - Mormon Journal

Evidence of sarcasm as verbal abuse but with a happy ending.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - Let It End with Me

More evidence of sarcasm as verbal abuse.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - The Continuing Pursuit of Truth

"I am suggesting that as we go through life we “accentuate the positive.” I am asking that we look a little deeper for the good, that we still voices of insult and sarcasm, that we more generously compliment virtue and effort."

Great article by Gordon B. Hinckley

[BenRaines]

I found the same articles and would agree connerific. I work hard to find less and less room for sarcasm in my life. I consider it one of those shortcomings to overcome.

Ben Raines

[StrawberryFields]

Sarcasm can be very hurtful but it is also important to remember that this is just a message board.

If you get your feelings hurt think about this. "How important is this to me in my real life". This is a place where we can make friends and have a good time but it is also a place where people can take things out on us that have nothing to do with who we are as individials. If something really bothers you walk away and don't come back for a day or so. We have also been taught about being offended which is something we can control.:)

[Connie]

We further need to remember that this is a board where non-Mormons, ex-Mormons and members of other faiths come to learn more about the Church or where some members who may be struggling with their testimony come to be strengthened or where people like me come to learn through discussion, and since i consider learning to be a big part of why i am here in mortality, then is it quite important to me in my real life (though what some people write admittedly less so). I have yet to meet anyone who is here to take out whatever on people they don't know, and i would imagine such people are dealt with pretty quickly. I hope i never meet someone who is here just to bring others down.

While we can control whether we get offended or not, we can also control what we say, including use of sarcasm. Therefore, i reiterate, let's be careful how we use sarcasm and try to be as Christ-like as possible on a forum where we are trying to help others learn about our faith.

Having said such, i hope i have not offended anyone. I myself am not easily offended, though i do get frustrated at myself when i fail to get someone's explanation through my thick head. :)

[StrawberryFields]

Having said such, i hope i have not offended anyone. I myself am not easily offended, though i do get frustrated at myself when i fail to get someone's explanation through my thick head. :)

:flowers::flowers::flowers: