Denominations?


AnthonyB
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:D

Hmm....I do worship Him as an eternal GOD and I am LDS. :D

He didn't say "AN eternal GOD" he said worshiping Jesus Christ as THE Eternal God. I think there is a big difference there. Also, I'm surprised by your answer. It seems to be a personal choice (depending upon whom LDS are speaking to). But many members of the LDS church will vehemently proclaim that we worship only God the Father in the name of Jesus Christ and that we do not worship Jesus as a distinct God. Mostly, I hear this when the conversation revolves around our being labeled as polytheists.
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I'm poking around a bit myself, now. It's certainly clear the SBC baptizes by immersion and requires "re-baptism" in the case of a sprinkled infant or child. But I don't see where the question of a believing adult who was baptized by aspersion is directly addressed. Do you have a link that specifically addresses that scenario?

It's an interesting tangent. I'm willing to concede I may have picked a poor example to illustrate my point...

Just a slight correction. Technically, it wouldn't be a "re-baptism" since the infant wasn't baptized by immersion (only sprinkled with water or having water poured on it's head). Coming from a SBC background, we never considered "infant baptism" to truly be "baptism" (since no immersion took place).
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Not having the appropriate authority from GOD. This would make baptism invalid if one wants to enter into the Celestial Kingdom.

Perhaps it would be helpful if you explained exactly how one recieves the appropriate authority from God. In other words, what actions must take place? I know what happened to me, but since you brought it up, I'll let you explain in your own words.
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Not all Christians dominations stated in the last post do believe in the catholic trinity theory. Yes! I mean theory since I use to be a Catholic.

I do "KNOW" there are three. Now, what do you say?

The word "doctrine" means teaching not theory. The tri-unity of God aka the Trinity is a doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church, the Eastern Orthodox as well as Protestant churches. Nowhere have I ever seen them call it a "theory". Your use of the word (theory) comes across to me as a pejorative. If you don't mean it that way, then please explain why you call it a "theory".
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To all: when the Master come to knock on your door, does He say, "my servant, my I come in and abide for a time?" Or..."my friend, can I stay and abide for a time?"

Is this a trick question?

"No longer do I call you servants, for a servant does not know what his master is doing; but I have called you friends, for all things that I heard from My Father I have made known to you." John 15:15

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Perhaps it would be helpful if you explained exactly how one recieves the appropriate authority from God. In other words, what actions must take place? I know what happened to me, but since you brought it up, I'll let you explain in your own words.

Unless the authorized priesthood from the Godhead by those who are appointed is given directly to a dispensational prophet and passed on by the laying on the hands of that said authority, anything beyond that is done in vain. Anything that is not of GOD, it is usually referred as priestcraft.

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He didn't say "AN eternal GOD" he said worshiping Jesus Christ as THE Eternal God. I think there is a big difference there. Also, I'm surprised by your answer. It seems to be a personal choice (depending upon whom LDS are speaking to). But many members of the LDS church will vehemently proclaim that we worship only God the Father in the name of Jesus Christ and that we do not worship Jesus as a distinct God. Mostly, I hear this when the conversation revolves around our being labeled as polytheists.

We also worshipped the Christ since He is the GOD of this world. I don't know about others in the church who would go to great lengths in denying this may have issues.

Elder Bruce R. McConkie explained why...

Ye must ... worship him] Elder Bruce R. McConkie has written that "in addition to worshipping the Father, our great and eternal Head, by whose word men are, there is a sense in which we worship the Son. We pay divine honor, reverence, and homage to him because of his atoning sacrifice, because immortality and eternal life come through him. He does not replace the Father in receiving reverence, honor, and respect, but he is worthy to receive all the praise and glory that our whole souls have power to possess." (Promised Messiah, p. 566.)

2 Nephi 25:29. And now behold, I say unto you that the right way is to believe in Christ, and deny him not; and Christ is the Holy One of Israel; wherefore ye must bow down before him, and worship him with all your might, mind, and strength, and your whole soul; and if ye do this ye shall in nowise be cast out.

30. And, inasmuch as it shall be expedient, ye must keep the performances and ordinances of God until the law shall be fulfilled which was given unto Moses.

Jesus Christ, after having detailed how it was that he had received divine assistance as he gave of himself to others ("grace for grace"), as well as how he as our Exemplar developed line upon line in his growth toward the fulness of the glory of the Father ("from grace to grace"), concluded: "I give unto you these sayings that you may understand and know how to worship, and know what you worship, that you may come unto the Father in my name, and in due time receive of his fulness. For if you keep my commandments you shall receive of his fulness, and be glorified in me as I am in the Father; therefore, I say unto you, you shall receive grace for grace." (D&C 93:19-20; italics added.) As set forth in the foregoing revelation, we worship the Son in that we seek to be like him. We worship him in that we strive to pattern our lives after his. That is to say, "perfect worship is emulation. We honor those whom we imitate. The most perfect way of worship is to be holy as Jehovah is holy. It is to be pure as Christ is pure. It is to do the things that enable us to become like the Father." In summary, we worship Christ "by going from grace to grace, until we receive the fulness of the Father and are glorified in light and truth as is the case with our Pattern and Prototype, the Promised Messiah." (Promised Messiah, pp. 568-69.)
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Unless the authorized priesthood from the Godhead by those who are appointed is given directly to a dispensational prophet and passed on by the laying on the hands of that said authority, anything beyond that is done in vain. Anything that is not of GOD, it is usually referred as priestcraft.

II Nephi 11 : 106 He commandeth that there shall be no priestcrafts; for, behold, priestcrafts are that men preach and set themselves up for a light unto the world, that they may get gain, and praise of the world; but they seek not the welfare of Zion

.

I fear your definition of priestcraft is rather broad my dear brother...

There are plenty of good brethren outside of your church that preach in humility, don't ask for praise, don't seek filthy lucre and DO seek the welfare of Zion.

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Many are deceived for various reasons but priestcraft is anything that is a men and not of GOD. There is but one church, one Godhead, and one gospel. If not, there is chaos. Right?

I do know that are many righteous people who are not of this church, whom do great works for this earth. But, it would be a eternal reward, if it is done under the appropriate priesthood.

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The word "doctrine" means teaching not theory. The tri-unity of God aka the Trinity is a doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church, the Eastern Orthodox as well as Protestant churches. Nowhere have I ever seen them call it a "theory". Your use of the word (theory) comes across to me as a pejorative. If you don't mean it that way, then please explain why you call it a "theory".

If critical is the term, then yes. It was never considered a doctrine from the original church before it apostated into many fragments but a theory drawn up of men who had no witnessed of the divinity of the Godhead.

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Do you really understand this quote and what the true of implications given here?

I consider myself a humble man and one who is not "all-knowing" and therefore, if you feel impressed to share with me your knowledge about this quote and it's implications I would happily receive this new found knowledge. But, I suspect it has something to do with the great plan of happiness and our own eternal progression. Edited by chriscb
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I am same way; one who thirsts for more light.

Chris, it is referring too them that received the Second Comforter or Jesus Christ. You are no longer a servant of Christ but a true friend of Christ. This is accomplished today when we our trials of fire and obeying the GOD's will are complete enough that we are presented to the Godhead by the Holy Ghost as a friend. It is done, we are instructed not just only by the Holy Ghost but by the FATHER, the Savior, and others who are assigned to instruct us doing our mortal probation.

[15]"Ye are My friends—henceforth I call you not servants, for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth. Ye are My friends, for all things which I have heard of My Father I have made known unto you."

[16]"Ye have not chosen Me, but I have: chosen you."

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I am same way; one who thirsts for more light.

Chris, it is referring too them that received the Second Comforter or Jesus Christ. You are no longer a servant of Christ but a true friend of Christ. This is accomplished today when we our trials of fire and obeying the GOD's will are complete enough that we are presented to the Godhead by the Holy Ghost as a friend. It is done, we are instructed not just only by the Holy Ghost but by the FATHER, the Savior, and others who are assigned to instruct us doing our mortal probation.

[15]"Ye are My friends—henceforth I call you not servants, for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth. Ye are My friends, for all things which I have heard of My Father I have made known unto you."

[16]"Ye have not chosen Me, but I have: chosen you."

The underlined portion I quoted above, was that a typo or did you intend to use the word "or"? According to scripture, the Comforter (paraclete) is the Holy Spirit. Who is this "Second Comforter" you speak of? The way you phrased your sentence, it comes across as if you are saying Jesus Christ is the "Second Comforter". Please explain.

ETA: Actually, I just answered my own question. Jesus is the first comforter (paraclete) and the Holy Spirit is the second. John 14:16 Jesus says "another paraclete" will come to help his disciples, implying Jesus is the first paraclete.

Edited by chriscb
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We are first taught by the First Comforter, who is the Holy Ghost. The Second Comforter is Jesus the Christ. The Savior quoted:

"I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever.".

Joseph Smith taught that within the program of the gospel there are two Comforters. "One is the Holy Ghost, the same as given on the day of Pentecost, and that all Saints receive after faith, repentance, and baptism," he explained. "The other Comforter spoken of is a subject of great interest," the Prophet continued, "and perhaps understood by few of this generation." Concerning it, a revelation declared: "This Comforter is the promise which I give unto you of eternal life, even the glory of the celestial kingdom."
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We are first taught by the First Comforter, who is the Holy Ghost. The Second Comforter is Jesus the Christ. The Savior quoted:

"I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever.".

Joseph Smith taught that within the program of the gospel there are two Comforters. "One is the Holy Ghost, the same as given on the day of Pentecost, and that all Saints receive after faith, repentance, and baptism," he explained. "The other Comforter spoken of is a subject of great interest," the Prophet continued, "and perhaps understood by few of this generation." Concerning it, a revelation declared: "This Comforter is the promise which I give unto you of eternal life, even the glory of the celestial kingdom."
So the roles are reversed? Because when Jesus was physically on this earth, He was the First Comforter and the Second was the Holy Spirit. John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever".
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You noticed when the Savior was here, there was no Holy Ghost. One member of the Godhead is presence only. It was after did they finally received the First Comforter or the Holy Ghost, which is revealed in the Book of Acts.

If you could look in heaven and view the throne of GOD, you find three separate beings. Two of which have physical bodies, GOD the FATHER, Jesus Christ the Son, and the last one, having a spirit body only, is the Holy Ghost.

Going back to my previous remark, two points in this statement are of special importance: First, Jesus associated the other Comforter directly with the Spirit of truth, which is the Holy Ghost. Joseph Smith made it clear that the Holy Ghost Himself is not the second Comforter, but that He ratifies and thereby binds the promise of eternal life upon faithful saints. The Prophet and others were given this same promise in a revelation: "Wherefore, I now send upon you another Comforter, even upon you my friends, that it [i.e., the other Comforter] may abide in your hearts, even the Holy Spirit of promise; which other Comforter is the same that I promised unto my disciples, as is recorded in the testimony of John." Having identified this Comforter as that which Jesus promised to His disciples, the revelation then declared that that Comforter (i.e., the Holy Spirit of promise), which was to abide in their hearts, was "the promise . . . of eternal life, even the glory of the celestial kingdom." The other Comforter of which Christ spoke, therefore, was the divine promise or guarantee sealed in the hearts of the faithful by the revelation and power of the Holy Spirit that they would receive eternal life in the world to come, which is the glory of the celestial kingdom. This is the more sure word of prophecy, which is for a man to know "that he is sealed up unto eternal life, by revelation and the spirit of prophecy, through the power of the Holy Priesthood."

Second, Jesus stated that He would manifest Himself to those disciples who received the other Comforter, and that even the Father would reveal Himself unto them. Of Christ's promise as recorded in John 14:23, Joseph Smith wrote by revelation: "The appearing of the Father and the Son, in that verse, is a personal appearance; and the idea that the Father and the Son dwell in a man's heart is an old sectarian notion, and is false." The promise of eternal life, which is sealed in the heart of man by the power of the Holy Ghost, therefore carries with it the privilege of receiving the personal manifestations of the Father and the Son.

The Prophet indicated that the blessings of the second Comforter are also given in the spirit world to those who make their calling and election sure to eternal life by enduring faithful in the gospel to the end of their mortal probation. In referring to faithful saints who passed away in his day, he said: "Those who have died in the faith are now in the celestial kingdom of God." By this statement he did not mean that they were then resurrected, but that they dwelt in a state of celestial glory. He wrote in a revelation that "there are two kinds of beings in heaven," namely (1) resurrected beings having bodies of flesh and bones and (2) spirits "who are not resurrected but inherit the same glory." The latter group includes those who endure faithful in the gospel until mortal death. The corruption in the body which in mortality acts as a deterring force pushing man away from God is left behind as the spirit departs the physical tabernacle, and if the person has been faithful in his day of probation he then enters into a state of glory and is given the privilege of the second Comforter in the spirit world. Joseph Smith therefore taught that "the spirits of the just are exalted to a greater and more glorious work . . . in their departure to the world of spirits," and that there they are "enveloped in flaming fire" or glory.

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Joseph Smith therefore taught that "the spirits of the just are exalted to a greater and more glorious work . . . in their departure to the world of spirits," and that there they are "enveloped in flaming fire" or glory.

Glory is one of my favorite pondering subjects. Cool. ...or actually, hot.

HiJolly

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Many are deceived for various reasons but priestcraft is anything that is a men and not of GOD. There is but one church, one Godhead, and one gospel. If not, there is chaos. Right?

I do know that are many righteous people who are not of this church, whom do great works for this earth. But, it would be a eternal reward, if it is done under the appropriate priesthood.

Yes, there is one church and one gospel...

Mosiah 11 : 129 For behold, this is my church: whosoever that is baptized, shall be baptized unto repentance.

25 Behold I have given unto you my gospel, and this is the gospel which I have given unto you, that I came into the world to do the will of my Father, because my Father sent me;

26 And my Father sent me that I might be lifted up upon the cross; and after that I had been lifted up upon the cross, I might draw all men unto me:

27 That as I have been lifted up by men, even so should men be lifted up by the Father, to stand before me, to be judged of their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil;

28 And for this cause have I been lifted up; therefore, according to the power of the Father, I will draw all men unto me, that they may be judged according to their works.

29 And it shall come to pass, that whoso repenteth and is baptized in my name, shall be filled; and if he endureth to the end, behold, him will I hold guiltless before my Father, at that day when I shall stand to judge the world.

30 And he that endureth not unto the end, the same is he that is also hewn down and cast into the fire, from whence they can no more return, because of the justice of the Father: and this is the word which he hath given unto the children of men.

31 And for this cause he fulfilleth the words which he hath given, and he lieth not, but fulfilleth all his words; and no unclean thing can enter into his kingdom;

32 Therefore nothing entereth into his rest, save it be those who have washed their garments in my blood, because of their faith, and the repentance of all their sins, and their faithfulness unto the end.

33 Now this is the commandment, Repent, all ye ends of the earth, and come unto me and be baptized in my name, that ye may be sanctified by the reception of the Holy Ghost, that ye may stand spotless before me at the last day.

34 Verily, verily I say unto you, This is my gospel; and ye know the things that ye must do in my church; for the works which ye have seen me do, that shall ye also do;

(3 Nephi 12)

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I'm assuming its a fire that don't burn or feel hot, this is a neat topic,I will pay close attention,thanks posters.

That's what I'm saying --- it does indeed feel hot. The bush that burned for Moses was not consumed, but that doesn't mean it wasn't hot. Joseph said after his First Vision that he was amazed that the trees around him did not burst into flame. If you search, you will find more.

This is how Moses, when Satan came to him and desired Moses to worship him, could tell Satan wasn't worthy of worship. He had just previously been in the presence of God, and so he well knew the difference. Moses said to Satan, "Where is thy glory, that I should worship thee?"

Read it here-- Moses 1, and note all the clues such as "endure" "remain in the flesh" "fell to the earth" "withered and died".

HiJolly

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  • 3 weeks later...

Erik.....your so arrogant and condescending. Your posts are not meant to discuss, but rather to accuse or attempt to belittle beliefs that others see as sacred and you sound like a know it all.....and Brother, reading your posts.....you don't even understand the part you think you know. You really ought to learn some manners. Were you excommunicated.....is that why your sound so bitter when you post about the church? What's the point? Just to insult?

The Bible isn't infallible and we believe all that God has revealed, all that He does now reveal, and we believe that He will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God.

Hi bytor2112--

I've been slow to respond to your rather inflammatory post. We (my wife and I) just had a baby daughter, and so I haven't had much time for message boards. But I'd like to make crystal clear to you (and anyone else reading this) that I wasn't "excommunicated" from the Mormon Church. If you'd like to know, I became a Christian in 2005 and requested my name be "removed from the records" shortly thereafter (although it took ~ 9 months and repeated calls to Salt Lake City to get the LDS Church to acknowledge it).

I'm certainly not "bitter" about how God has worked in my life and have no idea why you read bitterness into my posts. Perhaps you can elaborate. And feel free to do so in a private message (I believe that capability exists on this forum). I'll be glad to take this up with you off-line. Indeed, if you happen to live in the greater Seattle metropolitan area, we can do this in-person—and we can do it over the beverage of your choice in the venue of your choice, on me…

--Erik

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Guest ceeboo

I'll be glad to take this up with you off-line. Indeed, if you happen to live in the greater Seattle metropolitan area, we can do this in-person—and we can do it over the beverage of your choice in the venue of your choice, on me…

--Erik

Dear Erik and Bytor,

Sorry for the intrusion but may I suggest the Dairy O and grape slushies ???

Peace,

Ceeboo

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