You're single because....

[NeuroTypical]

2 hours ago, Hemisphere said:

Since you are asking, I do mean the Frankfurt Temple in Germany. I know a lot of people who simply basing on their deeds could possibly not pass if they were honest. And yes, come on, you really think people wanna give themselves the embarrassment of flunking their temple interview ? =) right. 

Thanks for explaining.  You are engaging in unrighteous judgment from a position of clueless ignorance, without any actual information about how said deeds are handled in TR interviews.   Here I thought you had polled people and they admitted lying, or something similar. 

I am aware of a few stories where people have lied to get a recommend.  That said, I believe these to be in a tiny, tiny minority.  See, I'm one of those guys with some of those deeds in my life.  I have indeed, over the years, brought them to the attention of my bishop.  On more than one occasion, I've brought them up during a TR interview.  

Here, let me give you a few clues so you can perhaps mitigate your ignorance:
* We're all sinners and fall short of the glory of God.  Temple attendance doesn't require perfection - otherwise nobody would be worthy.
* With a handful of exceptions, basically the only thing that will keep your leaders from signing your recommend is a lack of repentance.  
* Bishops work with people who have sinned, and quite often, these people will be encouraged to go to the temple as part of the repentance process. 

You may wish to consider Proverbs 6:  These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.

[Hemisphere]

mcome and live and germany and drop the everything is awesome glasses and you will see where i am voming from. besides i am german and know my people enough t habe quite an informed opinion, thank you and if you come around quoting me, do it completely.   I did say the dutch have their share of problems, enough to open a topic. my wife is dutch amd can tell you how she live through church with her own unique set of experiences that would make your hairs stand up.. and talking about me in a thrid person isnt particularly nice. 

 

well it as all nice to arbitrate from afar. i do happen to be lucky to be in a good ward. as a"witness" i invite you to check it out your self before you imply that  am a biased liar. which you wont do anyway, seeing for yourself that is.everyrhing is starspangled awesome and if something goes wrong the people that do have problems are deemed liars and comments like yous spring up because nobody saying something not uplifting is an apostate in eyes of people like you. if everything is so awesome in the church why is there still so much controversy and strife and i guarantee you it doesnt stem from a lack of prayer or reading  the scriptures and binging on the liahona.

 

 

[Hemisphere]

6 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

 

You may wish to consider Proverbs 6:  These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.

 ah that is a lovely one, but I do think you want to take that beam out of your own eye. I have seen some your posts where that one you can apply all to fitting to yourself, especially when people don´t share your your scientific excitements and you judge them ignorant as well as you just did me. 

as to mordorbound I extend my invitation to you to live among us and see for a change with a keener eye that there is massive problems and not just in temple recommend sense.

the way all of you froth about my experience, I wonder how much of paradise everyone not attending churches in the US is missing out in that promised land of yours. 

So far, if you are single it is not enough prayer. if you are not good enough to be aknowledges as partner ( despite your efforts to be your best ) and still end up single it must be some divine reason or your fault entirely, not because there are inehrent problems dating within or because you are an outsider or because you don´t have the infrastructure at the ready to support chruch dating. 

 

oh and heaven forbid you happen to mention that processes and and typical behavior give people a hard time in the church ... you are an "unrealiable" wittness with biased tendencies of nationalism ... 

give me a break people. there is so many screw ups and if you are fine with it , then I would say you people are fans of omission and inaction. and if you wanna fix it you get decried.  I even bet half you wouldnt even have the guts to call me the things in my face that you have been doing if I were standing in front of you and in a way it is assuring because it makes me think  there may be still some human in there instead of the projected super saint than find no fault in anything that relates to the church while he condemns the people as ignorant as you do 

[NeedleinA]

@Hemisphere

“The longer I live, the more I realize the impact of attitude on life. Attitude, to me, is more important than facts. It is more important than the past, than education, than money, than circumstances, than failures, than successes, than what other people think or say or do. It is more important than appearance, giftedness or skill. It will make or break a company...a church....a home. The remarkable thing is we have a choice every day regarding the attitude we will embrace for that day. We cannot change our past...we cannot change the fact that people will act in a certain way. We cannot change the inevitable. The only thing we can do is play on the one string we have, and that is our attitude...I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% how I react to it. And so it is with you...we are in charge of our attitudes.” 
― Charles R. Swindoll

[Hemisphere]

Well then, let me tell you this then about my attitude. It is fine, considering that discrimination , harassment, the attempts to run me out of church, to be told not to be up to par because certain criteria could impossibly met that reduced to be seen by what I am not, while I still serve the Lord. Flawed but I still serve him while I mind the needy ( and appreciate them more then the Lifestyle members ) that I can say I am still here with him and I have a good wife that is an awesome team player especially when it comes doing our best despite people in the church and mean the nasty kind that is abundant in this part of the world trying to muck up our day. I think all in all in all considered, it is just fine and I embrace following faithfully but not blindly and that is worth certainly more than a billion bucks. I have no intention of changing the past. But I can make sure it won´t repeat itself. So while I actually admire your conviction let me some of mine in some eloquent words : 

“The best things in life are beyond money; their price is agony and sweat and devotion ... and the price demanded for the most precious of all things in life is life itself - ultimate cost for perfect value.” 
― Robert A. Heinlein, Starship Troopers

I have them, the best things in life and I am content. My attitude is to preserve that state and if being unpopular by pointhings things out that are not alright and threathen those blessings , then so be it. I certainly think that I don´t need your approval, neither do you mine and I am perfectly fine with that. I just wish in a dating sense people would realise that there is little to compromise about when you are not accepted as you are ( to come back to the threads topic). People compromise too much and frankly it makes unhappy. They want to please too much and neglegt their selfworth and self respect. I maintain that daiting in the church would be less perilous if people would bake smaller roles when it comes to their selective processes and their filter ought to be retuned. Good man and women do fall through the cracks and not just dating wise, also in the previously hotly debated comments which I also will maintain. 

In the end I can say, you do what you do far away from where I live and at the end of day when you passed your judgement about me and turn away from the screen it will not have changed a single thing because in the end, I might just do the same while thinking that it is a good thing that through agency, the Lord can be honored through my deeds elsewhere where it doesn´t bother neither each one of you. after all, it´s the internet where raving lunatics such ourselves pound the keys to "stick" it to the other person in a selfrighteous zeal. 

Ah, the joys of modern "communication". I still dare you to come and see for yourself what people go through far away from the sheltered walls of doctrine in the fair US 

 

[NeuroTypical]

It is true I live in the US.  It is true that I only know a handful of saints living outside the US, or came here from somewhere else.  But no really, I must continue to doubt Hemisphere's claim that most German temple goers are liars.  Especially since your last three posts gave not a single bit of evidence, not a single fact to back up your opinion.  

Both of the German LDS immigrants I know were of strong moral character.  One was a bishop in my youth, the other a branch president who had a 40 year friendship with my non-LDS father.  

 

[NeedleinA]

I'll admit @Hemisphere, you had me fooled for a little while. I thought, sure this guy likes to debate a little and voice his opinion... no problem. In reality your constant complaining and poor attitude are about all I can take. Your self pity, woe is me, America sucks attitude is too draining. Spin it, dice it all you like, the chip on your shoulder is so huge it is not even enjoyable to read your posts any more, there is nothing positive, nothing enriching or uplifting... it really is just overly exhausting and old now. 

I'll pass moving forward. Enjoy complaining and crying unfair to someone else. I have a happy life, because I choose to be this way despite what has or hasn't happened to me. This is one happy American who has had enough of your over the top drama queen lamenting. 

 

[Hemisphere]

@ neurotypical yeah, German migrants who left the Germany and not live there anymore for the longest time that would be like saying I know an american migrant that lives in Europe for 40 years is a typical representation of the rest of your fellow country men

Well about the evidence... a lying statistics office is not open during weekends =) or for that matter in general because how would you prove the opposite ? 

 

as for you needlein, I am having a good time here. You want uplifting, then maybe you should contribute something that would help with the inital post, All you do is dismiss and when you get personal it is suddenly drama queening when it´s trown back at you. As for the US I did not say the US sucks, I for one love the US. I just don´t love the condescending dismissal of church members and their pretense that all must be good everywhere because with them it is. Unless you are telling me, the church is aiming to make everyone american in their attitude ( which the church of course does not ) so spare me the accusation that I somewhere said that the United States suck, I referred to the church in the US. I have spent the best times in US for several years.  

As for crying for unfair, sure you can it call it that when you go ahead and dismiss concerns but since you are all above it and have all the answer ready. 

I happen to mention that I am content with my life, thank you very much. 

maybe you should grab your own nose because a lot of posts are quite denigrating to others if you wanna claim the moral high ground, you are not doing a great job. 

Other than that, you are just some stranger in the internet ( as I am to you ) who I probably will never meet, which is perfectly fine as your ideas and mine don´t align and the world still turns and I am fine with,  who has still an exchange with someone that sure as heck can dish out but not take it in. You ever considered that you may not have all the answers ? the both of you ? =) I will leave that with you and wish you well. 

[NeuroTypical]

23 hours ago, Hemisphere said:

Well about the evidence... a lying statistics office is not open during weekends =) or for that matter in general because how would you prove the opposite ? 

Ok then - so we're both in agreement - you don't have any evidence to back up your claim that "temple worthiness is for most people a piece of paper that allows them to go there after they lied to their respective bishops".  Thank you for admitting you have no evidence. 

Perhaps now you can consider the wisdom of coming to an LDS message board (no matter what country it's members are from), and making baseless accusations about the character of most LDS temple-going members. 

As for proving the opposite - the burden of proof lies with the person making the accusation - you.  
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/burden-of-proof

 

Edited August 7, 2016 by NeuroTypical

[classylady]

Hemisphere, I have many friends from Germany.  I love your country and your countrymen. All of my German friends who are endowed members of the church are good, honest people. I don't believe any of them have lied to get their temple recommend. Are they perfect?  No.  But, they are repentant and trying their best. I think they would be dismayed at your summation of their character.

i was a missionary in Germany quite a few years ago. I have tried to stay in touch with many members of the church I met while there and grew to love with all my heart. If I could, I would be visiting Germany 2 to 3 times a year. But, sadly, funds do not allow that.  So, I get over there as often as I can. Lately, about every other year.

[Hemisphere]

@classylady

Dear Classylady

good for you, at least you have something ahead of neuro typical and needlein a. Unfortunately your German friends  don´t represent the rest and there is a great many things to be disliked or outright shunned. And as a missionary you ought to know that things aren´t going as good as they ought to be, compared to other locations where other missionaries hail from. even you will have to admit to that and it draws itself like a red line through my country.

Membership as a convert is not a joy for the most part and if you ask the question why someone is single... I can sum up, just like at the beginning,

that dating itself is a soul crushing experience especially in light of being a convert or someone who didn´t manage to generate enough clout to make himself presentable enough to be considered. Church in Europe has and simply will maintain its unique set of problems, unbeknownst to most that deny that a good portion of people will never have the awesome experience of a loving, supporting church like it ought to be. Needless to say that we lost a good many people for that. If you missed out on that, you turned a blind eye to it ( which I hope you didn´t, because I can respect that you don´t judge from afar) it would be sad.

Similar to the problems in Germany where status comes into play, you will find that membership in the Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Britain and Poland are similarly daunting or challenging with it´s own unique set of problems. I can say that the expectation of dating within the church border on outright pressure (the same could be said of pulling out children out of the hat if you happen to be newly weds)  while making it as hard it can possibly be and then some more. I have seen good people who went a different rout and got flak for it. I don´t blame them one bit for leaving if it means to be perpetually happy. 

I personally think what outrages people about the statement is, the fear that some truth may lie into that and the hope it would never come to pass near them. I know it is not uplifting so say such things but then again, not everything can be. I wish I could open my heart and put it into a projector for everyone to see, I think even neuro typical and needleina´s contest of my statement would probably soften up if they could put themselves in the shoes those that get the short end of the stick where church is not as strong as they wish it would be everywhere. The screams for proof on a subject that would be quite a challenge to prove has also the same impossibility to be disproven. After all, would you really want to start raising a statistic over a question like that ? It would be very disheartening. So I can understand all your sentiments even needleins and neuro typicals dismay, while I did not really like their vehemence or their aggressive style that they practice across the forum... but that is their own prerogative. It echoes out of the woods as you shout into and I am no exception to that, missing out on gentler words that could have made it more receptive which I pretty much gave into temptation to choose similar harsh conduct.  I just wish they and other people would understand that the church is a hospital and we are the patients and that every ward or branch elsewhere is a different annex of a building where different problems take shape that can not compare to those in another. 

I also wish that people would understand that bad things do happen outside the US in other church institutions and through my time spent inside and outside Germany in Europe that I have seen my share and accept that often it is not a battle to find your place but to remain true to your covenant and that your membership hangs on a very thin thread because some hearts have not build up the strength for a testimony to endure.

I invite you, if you have the means if you can stay for an extended period again to not be a guest but a member and not just open our eyes but also your heart and look at the people that get left out. There is a story in every ward for that in Germany  and it gets handled in different ways and even there ( wherever your served) it even depends in what state of Germany you are. The nuances change but the general attitude is quite comparable with some branches and wards standing out raking up some sad records. Not just in the converts department but also in the "I am still single ..." question. Living here is still difference from being here on a mission and rotating, surely but you have to admit that visit is usually superimposed with a joyful moment where one does not look for things that can or could have gone batter. 

I do appreciate your objection and take it in the spirit you conveyed.

 

[Lostboy289]

I converted right before I turned 25, so already my options were limited. I was engaged, but the day after I got military orders to a base in the middle of nowhere my Fiance ditched me suddenly. I started dating a friend of mine right before I left and eventually fell madly in love with her, but last year she dumped me so she could date another friend of hers who had a crush on her for awhile.

Now I'm about to turn 28. Still in the middle of nowhere with only a handful of YSAs. And there definitely comes a point in this church where you are about 26 or 27 that the music stops and you realize that you are the only one without a chair.

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

@Lostboy289 my husband was still single at 33. Like you, not for lack of trying. Then met through unusual circumstances. I don't have time to tell you the whole story, but suffice it to say that I lived in a remote part of Alaska and he lived in Portland, Oregon. 

We've now been married 23 years and have 5 great kids. 

Put your life in the Lord's hands, He can handle this.

[anatess2]

2 hours ago, Lostboy289 said:

I converted right before I turned 25, so already my options were limited. I was engaged, but the day after I got military orders to a base in the middle of nowhere my Fiance ditched me suddenly. I started dating a friend of mine right before I left and eventually fell madly in love with her, but last year she dumped me so she could date another friend of hers who had a crush on her for awhile.

Now I'm about to turn 28. Still in the middle of nowhere with only a handful of YSAs. And there definitely comes a point in this church where you are about 26 or 27 that the music stops and you realize that you are the only one without a chair.

My husband was 21 when we got married.  So, I'm really not much of an authority on this matter.  What I do know is that 28 is very young especially for a guy.  My nephew is 25 and he's not ready to settle down.  He's still panicking on how he's going to afford a wife, let alone children.  When you are hitting your 40's then yeah, maybe I'd start to worry by then...

Edited April 18, 2017 by anatess2

[seashmore]

I'm single because there are zero LDS guys within ten years and twenty miles of me.

At least, that's what I tell people who inquire into my dating life. I look at all that I've been able to do within the Church and my family because I'm single, and I find purpose to my singledom. One thing that keeps me patient is doing sealings. I often think about how long they've been waiting for their forever marriage (hint: longer than I have) and how, in a way, I can give them even more than I have. Seriously, how cool is that?

Side note: I had a roommate refer to me as a "gateway date" because so many of the guys who took me on a date married the next girl they dated. 

[NightSG]

On 5/15/2017 at 10:23 PM, seashmore said:

Side note: I had a roommate refer to me as a "gateway date" because so many of the guys who took me on a date married the next girl they dated. 

Ok, that's just creepy...I was going to ask where you are and see if I could arrange to be there and ask you out at some point, but as I continued reading your post, you're apparently just a Y chromosome short of being me.  I'm almost afraid to find out more at this point.

So far, I'm at 16 women in five years that have either married the next guy they dated after me or got engaged before our first date was scheduled to happen.  One canceled our dinner-and-a-dance first date because the other guy proposed to her at lunch that day.

Edited May 23, 2017 by NightSG

[Vort]

On 5/15/2017 at 8:23 PM, seashmore said:

I had a roommate refer to me as a "gateway date" because so many of the guys who took me on a date married the next girl they dated.

 

20 minutes ago, NightSG said:

So far, I'm at 16 women in five years that have either married the next guy they dated after me or got engaged before our first date was scheduled to happen.

Now I'm getting all tingly with anticipation! You'll be sending us the announcement, right?

[Guest MormonGator]

1 hour ago, NightSG said:

Ok, that's just creepy...I was going to ask where you are and see if I could arrange to be there and ask you out at some point, but as I continued reading your post, you're apparently just a Y chromosome short of being me.  I'm almost afraid to find out more at this point.

So far, I'm at 16 women in five years that have either married the next guy they dated after me or got engaged before our first date was scheduled to happen.  One canceled our dinner-and-a-dance first date because the other guy proposed to her at lunch that day.

You know I got nothing but love for you @NightSG, but this sort of reminds me of someone who has been divorced four times and blames everyone but themselves. Do you think maybe you have anything to do with why you burn through relationships like disposable razors? 

Edited May 23, 2017 by MormonGator

[NightSG]

5 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

Do you think maybe you have anything to do with why you burn through relationships like disposable razors? 

I don't use disposable razors, but if I did, I'd at least get one shave out of each one before it's gone.  Three of those 16 I've still never even met in person, since that was going to happen on the first date.

Impressively, one actually got proposed to three days before we were going to meet by a guy she'd gone out with twice in the month she'd known him, married a few weeks later, pregnant on the honeymoon, and had filed for divorce within six months. (Has to wait until the baby is born to be finalized, though.)  Turns out the guy was abusive, hid the fact that he was only working part time, quit that job right before the wedding, (didn't tell her until after the honeymoon) and was still seeing his ex behind her back.

[zil]

17 minutes ago, MormonGator said:

You know I got nothing but love for you @NightSG, but this sort of reminds me of someone who has been divorced four times and blames everyone but themselves. Do you think maybe you have anything to do with why you burn through relationships like disposable razors? 

What, you mean like this?  (Sorry, I couldn't resist.)

[Guest MormonGator]

6 minutes ago, zil said:

What, you mean like this?  (Sorry, I couldn't resist.)

"Your first divorce could be bad luck. Your third divorce? You are the problem." 

[seashmore]

4 hours ago, Vort said:

 

Now I'm getting all tingly with anticipation! You'll be sending us the announcement, right?

Haha! This past month, I've been joking that I'll be getting married in three years.

I have two sisters, both younger. One got married at 22 with three hours notice, and one just got married at 17 with three weeks notice. (Her husband is being stationed on a Marine base overseas, and it was kind of a why wait situation. She's actually coming to live with me in a couple of weeks.)

[Flying Saint]

so let me throw this out here but is it just me or does the mythical Friend Zone actually exist. Because at least from my experience and from what i hear of my friends around this part that's what it seams to me. Now I get the whole weak link in a chain thing mentioned above and honest I am trying to figure if its me or if its something in the water because in the past 3 years after my mission I've gone on who know how many dates with just about the same amount of girls because like clockwork shortly after the 2nd date or even the first when I try to set up the next one I get the "Hey lets be friends spiel. I have herd similar stories from friends and the fact of the matter is that I try to be a gentleman on each one but apparently the saying a nice guy finishes last is fairly true. what do you all think? Also as a disclaimer I am temple recommend holder continually trying to improve myself since we all know that no one is perfect. I haven't just stayed with 1 type either these dates have been a wide spectrum of body shapes ethnicity and personalities. So I am not picky. but not desperate either I still have standards that they have to meet 1. LDS 2 temple worthy (or actively working to it) 3. a daughter of god with a sense of humor. so what do you all think I'm not trying to make this a debate just trying to get peoples opinions

[Jane_Doe]

4 minutes ago, Flying Saint said:

 I've gone on who know how many dates with just about the same amount of girls because like clockwork shortly after the 2nd date or even the first when I try to set up the next one I get the "Hey lets be friends spiel.

Would you rather them say "I don't like dating you and never want to see you ever again- get away before I call the police!"?

Really, if they are not interested in continuing to date you, their options or either to 1) kick you out of their lives completely, or 2) still be friends.  

 

4 minutes ago, Flying Saint said:

 I have herd similar stories from friends and the fact of the matter is that I try to be a gentleman on each one but apparently the saying a nice guy finishes last is fairly true. what do you all think? 

Ummm... no.  The jerk gets the police called on him when the girl doesn't want to date him.   

The nice guy gets dated longer, and if it doesn't work out she can still be friends with you.  

 

It's a simple fact that vast majority of people you date will eventually break up with you.   The one person who's not going to break up with you is the one who says "I do".  

[Flying Saint]

 

3 minutes ago, Jane_Doe said:

Would you rather them say "I don't like dating you

Kind of yes because the thing is they generally don't say they intentions completely because its like lets be friends but I'm still gonna flirt with you like dating in the future is a possibility then keep say but we are just friends so if they would come out and say exactly that look I don't think we would work out but you are an awesome guy and i would like us to be friends that would be great the fact is It's like every-time I see one of them I don't know what hat to be wearing that of a potential date or just the good friend hat.

 

9 minutes ago, Jane_Doe said:

Ummm... no.  The jerk gets the police called on him when the girl doesn't want to date him.

hahaha have you had to this before on a date? just out of curiosity? and thanks for your input