Don't Hate Me (LDS turned Christian Protestant)


ErikJohnson
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I'm brand new to this site, but I want to say that I hope you will feel welcome. I had rather the reverse happen to me. I was raised Methodist, and was looking for a college where I could feel comfortable living the values my parents taught to me. I visited campus after campus and was so discouraged when "student ambassadors" would tell me about buying notes, underage drinking and the like. The atmosphere at BYU was completely different. Then, when I was a freshman, I "knew" the Mormons were wrong, but I respected that they knew Why they believed and What they believed. I needed to know what exactly my faith was based on. I, too, went with a non-King James Bible and read through cover to cover in about six weeks time... I needed to have a firm foundation on my belief system...so I could find the right church for me. My testimony of the Bible grew tremendously during that time. A friend took me to the Manti pagent -- The actor playing Joseph Smith went out to the grove to pray based on his reading of the Bible, "If any of ye lack wisdom" At that moment, I knew I would someday be a member because I had the Bible so close to my heart and I knew that our kind Heavenly Father would NOT ALLOW Joseph to be deceived, because he lacked wisdom and asked with a sincere heart... and in the Bible, Heavenly Father promises to answer that prayer... No way would He go back on that promise, and therefore Joseph Smith could NOT have been fooled. That being the case, the rest is true -- period. I can't honestly say that I feel any stronger toward the Book of Mormon than I do the Bible. I can't honestly say that I've read every page and I understand every story (which is sad after 18 years) -- But I've never swayed from the fact that it MUST be true.

Thank You for your testimony, its very refreshing to hear a person piece it all together and not feel as if they know more then God. Sometimes its hard to hear someone come off as if they know better , thats no different then say I know better then God.

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Why would anyone argue with you about why your leaving the church, you have clearly made up your mind , that was respect dont be confused.

Also, im not sure why you would feel the need to prove yourself like you seem to do all over the net , rejoice in your decission, pray quietly and humblie for us sinners and be an example to everyone. Dont look like a Jim Jones .

Hi jolee65--

Don't you think your reference to Jim Jones might be a little over the top? Seriously, what does Jim Jones have to do with anything I've written? (You younger posters will have to use Wikipedia, since you probably have no idea who jolee65 is referring to.)

Also, what's the bit about my being "all over the net." Are you just repeating FunkyTown and captainmoroni1265's allegations posted earlier on my thread? Do you believe them? For the record--they've been called out, both publically and via private message and they cannot substantiate their claims. Nor are they willing to acknowledge their mistakes. That speaks to character, don’t you think? The only other place I've posted on was the Mormon Apologetics and Discussion Board [MA&DB]--and I posted a link to my last thread on that venue in my previous post (feel free to read it). If you think you've seen me anywhere else, by all means--substantiate your claim, either on this thread or via private message.

Lastly, I get the impression you're not into dialogue and engagement with people who have different beliefs. Apparently those who do not share your views are supposed to limit themselves to quiet prayer, and thereby be an example. May I ask what you are doing here on this forum, if not to have dialogue and engagement with people who have differing points of view?

--Erik

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Hi jolee65--

Don't you think your reference to Jim Jones might be a little over the top? Seriously, what does Jim Jones have to do with anything I've written? (You younger posters will have to use Wikipedia, since you probably have no idea who jolee65 is referring to.)

Also, what's the bit about my being "all over the net." Are you just repeating FunkyTown and captainmoroni1265's allegations posted earlier on my thread? Do you believe them? For the record--they've been called out, both publically and via private message and they cannot substantiate their claims. Nor are they willing to acknowledge their mistakes. That speaks to character, don’t you think? The only other place I've posted on was the Mormon Apologetics and Discussion Board [MA&DB]--and I posted a link to my last thread on that venue in my previous post (feel free to read it). If you think you've seen me anywhere else, by all means--substantiate your claim, either on this thread or via private message.

Lastly, I get the impression you're not into dialogue and engagement with people who have different beliefs. Apparently those who do not share your views are supposed to limit themselves to quiet prayer, and thereby be an example. May I ask what you are doing here on this forum, if not to have dialogue and engagement with people who have differing points of view?

--Erik

I don't get the whole "Don't look like Jim Jones" thing either. Is she saying you don't look like Jim Jones? Or is she claiming Jim Jones was an anti-Mormon? Or that you should be careful not to become a Jim Jones? If it's the third does she feel that anyone who leaves the LDS church starts crazy cults that move to South America and kill themselves?

I want clarification.

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Hi jolee65--

Don't you think your reference to Jim Jones might be a little over the top? Seriously, what does Jim Jones have to do with anything I've written? (You younger posters will have to use Wikipedia, since you probably have no idea who jolee65 is referring to.)

Also, what's the bit about my being "all over the net." Are you just repeating FunkyTown and captainmoroni1265's allegations posted earlier on my thread? Do you believe them? For the record--they've been called out, both publically and via private message and they cannot substantiate their claims. Nor are they willing to acknowledge their mistakes. That speaks to character, don’t you think? The only other place I've posted on was the Mormon Apologetics and Discussion Board [MA&DB]--and I posted a link to my last thread on that venue in my previous post (feel free to read it). If you think you've seen me anywhere else, by all means--substantiate your claim, either on this thread or via private message.

Lastly, I get the impression you're not into dialogue and engagement with people who have different beliefs. Apparently those who do not share your views are supposed to limit themselves to quiet prayer, and thereby be an example. May I ask what you are doing here on this forum, if not to have dialogue and engagement with people who have differing points of view?

--Erik

Dont get me confused with someone that will go toe to toe with someone that isnt a BoM or JS believer, its not up to me to prove anything to you , nor do I want to , i dont care what choice you've made pertaining to religion. See I didnt care enough to even ask my family what they think about my choice in religion because its my choice , just like how many kids my husband and I decided to have and the type of car we decided to buy, its decissions we make everyday without asking other people what they think.

My part here on the forum is to support fellow members with anything, be it religion or personal advice, but see they ask and your not, and if you had it wasnt the right question.

Also,.its clear to me and all the others what your intentions are ,it was your aproach, A bull in a china shop kind of entrance. Your a right fighter , im right your wrong, prove to me im not, i'll prove to you, you are. boring just go ahead and assume your right . there you won.

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I don't get the whole "Don't look like Jim Jones" thing either. Is she saying you don't look like Jim Jones? Or is she claiming Jim Jones was an anti-Mormon? Or that you should be careful not to become a Jim Jones? If it's the third does she feel that anyone who leaves the LDS church starts crazy cults that move to South America and kill themselves?

I want clarification.

Its the third, and reading his post just gave me the creeps. but thats me and no it didnt have anything to do with him leaving the church I know people thats not members anymore and they are still very close to me and me to them,......its the way hes coming across.

also, hes not even close to the first ex-mormon ive talked to and they seemed less friendly. It was something he said i should have highlighted.

but im done with this post said all im going to.

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I'm having a difficult time as a Moderator figuring out how to approach this thread. Erik comes in here with his real name and picture and introduces himself. Granted, he puts out some uncomfortable religious information. And yet, we've had ex-LDS here before. He invites questions, and asks "not to be hated." Some posters read tone into that. Oh well. But then, the accusations that the OP is an ANTI, with vague allegations about other sites.

Some have been good and offered welcome, and others hostility that, imho, is a bit too personal and rather unwarranted. If a poster is uncomfortable with another's approach or background or tone, ignore. But this thing of publicly announcing suspicions about motives, heart-condition, etc. seems to border on personal attacks.

There is not enough here to blame any one person, but I'd strongly encourage that those who are uncomfortable with this string or with any posters on it consider either ignoring the threat or giving some clear, calm intention to their posts here.

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I want clarification.

Clarification you want, clarification you will get :)

( Hope I don't get this thread closed too :lol::lol:)

Jim Jones ( JJ ) Good times " Get dynomite " Yea, I think that's the guy :lol:)

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Its the third, and reading his post just gave me the creeps. but thats me and no it didnt have anything to do with him leaving the church I know people thats not members anymore and they are still very close to me and me to them,......its the way hes coming across.

also, hes not even close to the first ex-mormon ive talked to and they seemed less friendly. It was something he said i should have highlighted.

but im done with this post said all im going to.

He'll be fine. He goes to "Mars Hill Church" in Seattle. If he starts getting out of line Pastor Mark will punch him in the throat and put him back in his place.

So... no worries, mate!

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Good mormong! I have not said much yet... have I? I think it was because you been here for quite a while and I did not know what to say to an oldy in an intro ... wellcome would have been a bit lame. I also am wondering why not intro untill now? Do you feel that you needed to explain your background so you can be better understood here?

Looks like your opinions are the usual non,ex lds opinions, they should not arise a storm. No reason to get heated here. Even though you think I am not a christian, it is ok, since I know I am.

I think this thread is soon ready to be put in memories or in an other cathegory and it is time to go and find other things to talk about.

Everyone: enjoy your trip while it lasts!:D

ps and help the others to enjoy it too... and maybe to find the truth at the end.... as long as there is life there is hope!:)

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He'll be fine. He goes to "Mars Hill Church" in Seattle. If he starts getting out of line Pastor Mark will punch him in the throat and put him back in his place.

So... no worries, mate!

LOL, Thanks KristofferUmfrey! Maybe not quite like that, but yes, there is such a thing as accountability. And I'm glad your a fan of MHC. Good to hear.

--Erik

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Good mormong! I have not said much yet... have I? I think it was because you been here for quite a while and I did not know what to say to an oldy in an intro ... wellcome would have been a bit lame. I also am wondering why not intro untill now? Do you feel that you needed to explain your background so you can be better understood here?

Looks like your opinions are the usual non,ex lds opinions, they should not arise a storm. No reason to get heated here. Even though you think I am not a christian, it is ok, since I know I am.

I think this thread is soon ready to be put in memories or in an other cathegory and it is time to go and find other things to talk about.

Everyone: enjoy your trip while it lasts!:D

ps and help the others to enjoy it too... and maybe to find the truth at the end.... as long as there is life there is hope!:)

Good morning to you, Maya. Regarding why I waited until I had ~ 60 previous posts under my belt before I posted an intro, Pam asked the same thing and I responded in post #67. I definitely hoped that sharing my background would provide perspective for my posts. A particular thread in the Christian Belief's forum ("Denominations") persuaded me it would be helpful.

And it's never too late to post an introduction, in my opinion. I enjoy reading them, although I rarely post on other people's intros.

Hope that helps,

--Erik

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Good morning to you, Maya. Regarding why I waited until I had ~ 60 previous posts under my belt before I posted an intro, Pam asked the same thing and I responded in post #67. I definitely hoped that sharing my background would provide perspective for my posts. A particular thread in the Christian Belief's forum ("Denominations") persuaded me it would be helpful.

And it's never too late to post an introduction, in my opinion. I enjoy reading them, although I rarely post on other people's intros.

Hope that helps,

--Erik

I got into a heaping helping of trouble before I ever posted mine. I'm less zealous now.

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I have to say that I must believe Erik than his accusers. The same thing happened to me on RfM. Many didn't like my response to a posters thread, which I unintentionally hijacked. One poster knew that I also posted here and described me correctly in some ways but also was incorrect in other ways and would not prove their accusation. The RfM admin will delete posts if they veer off topic, so eventually the many hijacked posts were deleted (which I accepted, since its how they do things) and nothing resolved. If you can't back up your claims, its useless to make them in the first place. Although I do see why some are annoyed with Erik, since he deliberately makes a distinction between Mormon and Christian. If you want to get along with others here, you could try LDS Christian and Mainstream Christian (or non-LDS Christian). Since no one here can see into any other person's heart, it's indeed hard for us to judge based on a message board who is truely Christian. Sometimes you must give people the benefit of the doubt.

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Maureen...you make a fair point. I'd start a new string on it...but it's been done so many times. To all non-LDS here: You do not even have to affirm that LDS is Christian in doctrine. You don't have to say what you don't know or believe. Just do not intentionally disrespect or attack the Church this site is dedicated to, and the people who belong to it. In other words, you don't have to say "LDS IS Christian." Just don't say, "LDS ain't Christians."

FWIW: It's safer and less inflammatory to discuss people's content than their personalities or intentions.

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To all non-LDS here: You don't have to say what you don't know or believe.

I was going to say to all my LDS friends what I don't know and was also going to say what I believe, BUT I DON"T HAVE TO. ( Na na na na na na na NA ):):):)

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Good morning to you, Maya. Regarding why I waited until I had ~ 60 previous posts under my belt before I posted an intro, Pam asked the same thing and I responded in post #67. I definitely hoped that sharing my background would provide perspective for my posts. A particular thread in the Christian Belief's forum ("Denominations") persuaded me it would be helpful.

And it's never too late to post an introduction, in my opinion. I enjoy reading them, although I rarely post on other people's intros.

Hope that helps,

--Erik

Yes it did Thank you Eric. Sorry that I seem to have missed Pams post and anyway your answer.

People do make mistakes and I believe they have to be able to get a new start. However old habbits or memories are very difficult to leave and forget. I am pretty sure that from your earlier experiences on LDS forums you know what is a red flag for LDS so you can try not Waving it in foront of us or it may be taken as a concious deed. FEX One can ponder about what is cristianity/christian, but to throw accusitions on the face to LDS that they are not christian aso is VERY clumsy and showing disrespect and the persons level of knowledge on LDS. As for myself I really do understand that someone calls us non-christians IF the line is drawn with beliefs we dont have or cant agree with. A new thread with words: LDS are not christians is a bad start, it is an attac. Are LDS christian? is a much better way of asking.

I been around for some time but I NEVER seen an LDS go on an other religious board and start attacing with threads like: Trinity is not from God aso... Truth is, if they even try to explain about their religion to someone who ASKS, they are thrown out of the boards. Still there are all teh time coming people to LDS boards telling LDS how wrong they are. We do endure to some point and FAR longer than what the other boards endure us just answering the questions.

We know, I KNOW from experience, that there are forces, that came in our boards with only one intention: to spread uncertanity among the week ones, trying to mislead LDS from their solid grounds leading them to desperation, doubt and wrong paths. I as a moderator, alike all mods here, are not only responsiple of what is written here, but also we need to defend the week. This is a pro LDS forum and it is ment to be a place for also the good but maybe week LDS. However we DO allow discusition on many things, that may even be negative for us, if discusition is kept respectful (on BOTH sides) and in bisiness we allowe it, but we do not endure digging grounds under our dears sisters and brothers feet. We believe that critisism is healty, but when it turns to negativity and bashing only LDS can decide that!

I even heard and seen that there are people that boast about going on LDS forums and digging earth from under feet of LDS people and getting so and so many out of LDS Church. That is so disrespectful. I myself have pretty tought skinn, but not all have. Luckily there is the button, that you can eliminate a person and his writtings if you do not want to read them.

Eric this was not only an answer to you so dont take it all in you, this is for EVRYBODY!

I am happy to see some softening here, on boths sides, thank you for that. We need to remember, that no one is guilty before he is proved to be and there are some new ones that come asking questions waiving the red flag give them a chanse to learn how to inquire politely. And those who come here to make myheim... dont waist your time, go home and stay there.:D

To my fellow LDS stay strong and WWJD!

Maybe I should write a book: How to survive on an LDS board as a non LDS!? With PCs story about his life on a lds board:p

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Discussions like this are impossible to resolve without the Spirit.

If Joseph Smith ever said anything that was true, this is it:

for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible.

So, if the Book of Mormon is out, and all we have is the Bible, then we're back to square one. It will endlessly be debated.

Welcome to the forum.

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Just don't say, "LDS ain't Christians."

I'll definitely comply and avoid such blunt statements. I offered a definition of "Christian" in post 31 on this thread. Perhaps I'll re-post on the Christian Belief's forum. It's a worthy topic, and I'm sure it can be discussed without running afoul of your admonition.

Thanks prisonchaplain,

--Erik

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Discussions like this are impossible to resolve without the Spirit.

If Joseph Smith ever said anything that was true, this is it:

for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible.

So, if the Book of Mormon is out, and all we have is the Bible, then we're back to square one. It will endlessly be debated.

Welcome to the forum.

Hello Justice--

I'm not a fan of everything C.S. Lewis wrote, but I think he did us all a real service with Mere Christianity. When I was LDS, the emphasis was always on differences/divisions among the Christian churches, and how this proved the need for a restoration, modern prophets, etc. I encountered Lewis's book when I was still LDS, and it startled me to learn that the various Christian denominations are actually quite united in matters of core doctrine. I highly recommend the book. It may cause you to reconsider...

--Erik

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I'll definitely comply and avoid such blunt statements. I offered a definition of "Christian" in post 31 on this thread. Perhaps I'll re-post on the Christian Belief's forum. It's a worthy topic, and I'm sure it can be discussed without running afoul of your admonition.

Thanks prisonchaplain,

--Erik

Excellent idea--as a new string. Just what is essential Christianity? On another string, someone posted 17 signs of a true Christian church. Without discussing the points--especially on your intro string--I was struck that at least a few of them were probably quite peripheral, even to staunch LDS members. In fairness, several of my church's 16 fundamental truths are probably less-than-essential, as well. So, I look forward to this discussion. :cool:

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Discussions like this are impossible to resolve without the Spirit.

If Joseph Smith ever said anything that was true, this is it:

for the teachers of religion of the different sects understood the same passages of scripture so differently as to destroy all confidence in settling the question by an appeal to the Bible.

So, if the Book of Mormon is out, and all we have is the Bible, then we're back to square one. It will endlessly be debated.

Welcome to the forum.

Far more complex than WHO is right about a particular teaching, is the question of which teachings do we have to agree upon? If I understand Joseph Smith correctly, he taught that we must agree on everything--thus the need for one church. Most Protestants would suggest that our many disagreements are mostly about non-essentials, and that there is tremendous unity on important truths. The Catholic Church believes it is the Mother Church, and yet refers to us Protestants as "seperated bretheren," rather than is hell-bound infidels. Oh...then there is the LDS teaching that people of sincere faith, and good character will mostly end up in the Terrestial Kingdom...so perhaps those truths that are obligatory are fewer than we think?

Wow...we need more strings. This is supposed to be a WELCOME ERIK JOHNSON thread. BTW, Welcome Erik! :lol:

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Far more complex than WHO is right about a particular teaching, is the question of which teachings do we have to agree upon? If I understand Joseph Smith correctly, he taught that we must agree on everything--thus the need for one church. Most Protestants would suggest that our many disagreements are mostly about non-essentials, and that there is tremendous unity on important truths. The Catholic Church believes it is the Mother Church, and yet refers to us Protestants as "seperated bretheren," rather than is hell-bound infidels. Oh...then there is the LDS teaching that people of sincere faith, and good character will mostly end up in the Terrestial Kingdom...so perhaps those truths that are obligatory are fewer than we think?

Wow...we need more strings. This is supposed to be a WELCOME ERIK JOHNSON thread. BTW, Welcome Erik! :lol:

Ummmm Yea !!! EXACTLY what my seperated brother said :):):):)

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