foreverafter Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 (edited) Everything I stated I learned from the teachings of Presidents of the Church from Pres. Hinckley down to Joseph Smith. Only Presidents of the Church can declare new doctrine, Apostles's statements must agree with the Presidents & if they do not we are told to consider it just their opinion & to rely on what the Presidents say. No one who is justified to be divorced & truely righteous need feel any guilt from what I said. If one is not justified to be divorced or remarried there is always repentance to heal them & their children. Edited May 10, 2009 by foreverafter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 Great question......I think you can be a Bishop after a divorce as long as you are remarried. You cannot be a Bishop if you were ever excommunicated though.....I think. I know a Branch President that has been divorced twice and excommunicated.....of course these things happened a very long time ago.Oh?The Church has had, at least one to my knowledge, a prophet, seer and revelator that had been excommunicated. If you can be an apostle and excommunicated, why not Bishop? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bytor2112 Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 Oh?The Church has had, at least one to my knowledge, a prophet, seer and revelator that had been excommunicated. If you can be an apostle and excommunicated, why not Bishop?You may notice I qualified the remark with the ever certain ......I think. Who was the PSR? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bytor2112 Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 Everything I stated I learned from the teachings of Presidents of the Church from Pres. Hinckley down to Joseph Smith. Only Presidents of the Church can declare new doctrine, Apostles's statements must agree with the Presidents & if they do not we are told to consider it just their opinion & to rely on what the Presidents say.Yet, you don't back up ANY of your statements with quotes. The quotes I provided from Elder Oaks and Elder McConkie....both men sustained as Prophets, Seers and Revelators can be found on LDS.ORG....the official Church website. Are you seriously trying to tell me that the church published false and misleading doctrine in church publications and now archives them on their web site for any and all to view?I don't quite understand your zeal to cling to these misguided notions. Perhaps you are projecting your personally held beliefs, which are certainly noble, but they do not reflect the church's policy and can lead to confusion and bruised feelings by those who have been divorced and remarried for what ever reason and repented IF it was required because of a sinful act. Elder Oaks echoed Elder McConkie's comments word for word. That was not done by accident or in error. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 You may notice I qualified the remark with the ever certain ......I think. Who was the PSR?One of the Church's great intellectuals and most influential theologians, Orson Pratt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soul_Searcher Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 No they can't. Its in the handbook. I don't know if divorced men can be branch presidents though.applepansyYes they can. Our last Bishop was a divorcee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim108 Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 They sin just like you and I do. It is all an abomination to God. Why must we give sin levels of severity. It is all sin. Black and white. A preacher man is no better than a whore and vice versa. We need to stop grading each other. We all need Jesus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prospectmom Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 (edited) I am sorry this will certanly really irk some but abomination is such an Old Testament word. We make mistakes... we sin... what we do after that is how we will be judged..... I think more than the actual sin... It's what you do with your knowledge. How you change your life... walk away from sins and change your life. Mabey I am wrong but if I am then well no matter how I changed my life the abominations will erase all the good and I am damned Edited May 10, 2009 by prospectmom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dravin Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 They sin just like you and I do. It is all an abomination to God. Why must we give sin levels of severity. It is all sin. Black and white. A preacher man is no better than a whore and vice versa. We need to stop grading each other. We all need Jesus.While I agree we don't need to be running around judging each other, in LDS Theology some sins are worse than others, killing five people in cold blood is not the same as stealing five tic-tacs. I realize this may not be your belief but we are talking about Church Policy here which is obviously going to reflect Church Doctrine.Now if your point is that any sin small or big equally damns us (makes us dependant on the atonement to be reconciled with God) I agree but even non-LDS Christians have to admit not all sins are the same. If nothing else:Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.Of course all this says is blasphemy against the Holy Ghost is unforgivable it doesn't say anything about any particular ranking of sins that aren't blasphemy against the Holy Ghost. And I think we can agree that while all sin separates us from God not all have the same effect on our spirituality (stealing a tic tac is less damaging spiritually than raping people or what have you). I'd also say easier to repent of but I don't know your position on that.A preacher man is no better than a whore and vice versa.Oh I whole heartedly agree, all are equally precious in his sight. He loves Mother Theresa no more than he loves Joseph Stalin.P.S. This is an aside to the general discussion of whether Bishops and Apostles can be currently or previously divorced in the LDS Church Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moksha Posted May 10, 2009 Report Share Posted May 10, 2009 Divorce does not disqualify a person from being a Bishop. You have to be married for five years and worthy. Can they substitute years of education for experience, since so many went to high school seminary for four years? I think the number five is in no way arbitrary, since that is the exact number of years in between the renewal of drivers licenses, as well as the number of fingers on most hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rameumptom Posted May 11, 2009 Report Share Posted May 11, 2009 I'm thinking Moksha is attempting a joke, otherwise I don't quite understand her last note.... The 5 years is just to ensure there is continuity in the marriage, and to help ensure there isn't another divorce on the horizon while the person is newly married. It allows the husband and wife to get to know each other for a while, prior to making the wife a 5 year widow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robspectre Posted May 11, 2009 Report Share Posted May 11, 2009 No they can't. Its in the handbook. I don't know if divorced men can be branch presidents though.applepansy My Branch Pres. is married to his second wife (first ended in D). I'm not sure if a man can or cannot become Bishop though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
applepansy Posted May 11, 2009 Report Share Posted May 11, 2009 My Branch Pres. is married to his second wife (first ended in D). I'm not sure if a man can or cannot become Bishop though.Please read the whole thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moksha Posted May 11, 2009 Report Share Posted May 11, 2009 It allows the husband and wife to get to know each other for a while, prior to making the wife a 5 year widow. Or the husband a 5 year widower depending upon who is the craftiest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pintail Posted May 12, 2009 Report Share Posted May 12, 2009 If you can commit murder, repent and then become a prophet I'm sure you can become bishop if the lord calls you as one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted May 13, 2009 Report Share Posted May 13, 2009 If you can commit murder, repent and then become a prophet I'm sure you can become bishop if the lord calls you as one.Not, apparently, if applepansy forbids Him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Apostate Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 Snow, your misogonyst comments are an insult to all good Latter Day Saints... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the Ogre Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 (edited) Most definitely not true. Divorce disqualifies a Priesthood holder from even being a Bishop, let alone a General Authority.No, Divorce currently disqualifies a man from becoming a Bishop . . . applepansyApple, Not true. A former bishop of mine was divorced. Divorce has nothing to do with worthiness.Aaron the OgreLATE EDIT: Sorry about jumping on you there, Apple. I guess I added my girth to the dog-pile. Are you running out of breath yet. Divorce is a serious issue for the church, but it is still something that is not indicative of anyone's worthiness. I do understand why it would prevent one from being an apostle considering the criticism from within the rank and file such a call would bring (but then, maybe it would be a good idea to flush a bunch of those whiners out anyway).My son just pointed out that our current RS Pres is divorced. I don't like her at all (cussed her out in the church parking lot a while ago), but neither my opinion nor her divorce has anything to do with how she is conducting her calling now. Edited May 14, 2009 by the Ogre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dravin Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 Snow, your misogonyst comments are an insult to all good Latter Day Saints...I'm fairly sure that the tenor and substance of Snow's posts concerning Applepansy have nothing to do with the fact that she's female. If I (a male) had made the same comments he'd have hit me with the same responses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemidakota Posted May 14, 2009 Report Share Posted May 14, 2009 The handbook is the last source if one cannot reach accord or received an answer to an issue. There were a time were a person should of been excommunicated and the Spirit testified more than once - NO!. Something you will learn when you reach a leadership position and have to be a judge in Israel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palerider Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 The handbook is the last source if one cannot reach accord or received an answer to an issue. There were a time were a person should of been excommunicated and the Spirit testified more than once - NO!. Something you will learn when you reach a leadership position and have to be a judge in Israel. and I might add....its often difficult to hold these....especially when the person your holding the court on is someone very very close to you.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 Snow, your misogonyst comments are an insult to all good Latter Day Saints...1. Name-calling, while carping about me not being nice, is hypocritical.2. You, obviously, don't understand the word "misogynist" (nor can you spell it). A misogynist is a man who hate women.a. You have ZERO clue whether I hate women or not.b. I don't hate women and anyone who says I do is either ignorant of incredibly dishonest.c. I don't know if applepansy is a man or a woman.d. My issue with applepansy's posts has nothing to do with whether or not I like, dislike, love or hate applepansy. As it so happens, I have no opinion on applepansy as a person as I do not know her.e. My issue with applepansy on this thread revolves soley on her multiple false claims on this thread.You rigotorbyph you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Apostate Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 I'm at you, not with you:lol: No more replies to you, bigoted, bitter old fools, bore me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connie Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 I honestly don't get why everyone keeps picking on Apple. If one reads page 4 of this thread, one would find where rameumptom already corrected her on this. And she thanked him for it. So to reiterate what Apple said above, read the entire thread before making judgments, chances are someone already corrected it in a kind and edifying manner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misshalfway Posted May 15, 2009 Report Share Posted May 15, 2009 Just to chime in with others, I was in an interview with my bishop and the question came up. I thought divorce did prevent you from being called a bishop too. I was also concerned about the same situation for a woman and any calling that may come to her. But I was reassured that a divorce does not disqualify a person from any service in the church including bishop-hood. I was told that one could become a general authority or a bishop or a RS pres.I wonder if they don't call people to any office while in the middle or just after a divorce. I wonder if they try to let the dust settle and the Atonement work it's healing. I would think a person in this circumstance wouldn't necessarily be ready to serve in such a capacity. They would need time to get their own house in order. But that is different that disqualification. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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