UFC and MMA

[Faded]

I'm curious if anyone else here is into Ultimate Fighting and Mixed Martial Arts?

[skalenfehl]

I am. I used to watch every UFC on PPV and will have to miss the upcoming GSP/Penn fight in March. Money just isn't what it used to be. I'm waiting for my windfall/jackpot/inheritance/bailout/share of spreading the wealth, etc.

I remember watching UFC 1. That was hilarious. This boxer came with only one boxing glove. His strategy was to grab his opponent with his free hand while pummeling with his gloved hand. He got his butt handed to him, I think in a knockout/knockdown. The early shows were much different.

[Faded]

There's the "poor man" option that I use: Youtube will have the fight up within about 48 hours.

Yeah there's some big fights coming. BJ Penn vs George St Pierre. I don't think that fight would even be happening if it weren't for the fact that it's the one loss that BJ hasn't been able to avenge in his UFC career. It think George won the fight, but BJ definitely messed him up pretty bad.

Have a crazy idea that's too late in coming: BJ should train with Brock Lesnar. Brock has almost no ju-jitzu and BJ could train him up on that. BJ is about to fight GSP -- someone so powerful that he can pretty much takedown anyone in his weight division at will. If BJ were to practice takedown defense again a monster like Brock, maybe he'd be able to stuff GSP's takedowns. That is the one reason that BJ is probably going to lose the upcoming fight -- GSP has learned that fighting BJ standing up is a recipe for disaster. I don't think BJ can stop GSP from taking him down. George is a LOT more powerful than he was in their first fight.

Ah the memories of UFC 1. Clueless referee. Clueless announcers. Everyone in the world was surprised at how bad strikers without any cross training did. The boxer in question was taken down in the first minute by none other than Joyce Gracie.

Edited January 21, 2009 by Faded

[KoalaBear]

I am a mixed martial arts journalist and actively train in the sport. I am yet to actually fight, but i am giving myself an 18 month training plan to get myself physically and mentally prepared. After that, i cannot wait to get into a cage with another human being with the sole intent to knock each other out or tear a limb off. It is exciting to think about.

[skalenfehl]

Tonight GSP fights BJ Penn. Wish I had the dough to order it on PPV. This one's gonna be dynamite!!

[KoalaBear]

There's the "poor man" option that I use: Youtube will have the fight up within about 48 hours.

Yeah there's some big fights coming. BJ Penn vs George St Pierre. I don't think that fight would even be happening if it weren't for the fact that it's the one loss that BJ hasn't been able to avenge in his UFC career. It think George won the fight, but BJ definitely messed him up pretty bad.

Have a crazy idea that's too late in coming: BJ should train with Brock Lesnar. Brock has almost no ju-jitzu and BJ could train him up on that. BJ is about to fight GSP -- someone so powerful that he can pretty much takedown anyone in his weight division at will. If BJ were to practice takedown defense again a monster like Brock, maybe he'd be able to stuff GSP's takedowns. That is the one reason that BJ is probably going to lose the upcoming fight -- GSP has learned that fighting BJ standing up is a recipe for disaster. I don't think BJ can stop GSP from taking him down. George is a LOT more powerful than he was in their first fight.

Ah the memories of UFC 1. Clueless referee. Clueless announcers. Everyone in the world was surprised at how bad strikers without any cross training did. The boxer in question was taken down in the first minute by none other than Joyce Gracie.

Its "Georges" and "Royce" to be precise. And, BJ is renowned for his takedown defence due to his amazing flexibility. Not a wrestlers sprawl.

[TheyCallMeMom]

My husband is, so by proxy I am ..

for those that dont pay per view there is a tv hosting site we use for free and the fights are up pretty quick. It has Spike TV on it.. and they usually have UFC on ..

it called TVU..

[ninjormon]

First let me state that you should try not to fight and im not trying to offend anyone. MMA is not completely useless but there are better forms of martial arts. For instance if someone shoots in at you in MMA its more like wrestling, sprawling and hoping for position, in ninjitsu you would do an underhanded eyegouge and try to rip his eyes out or grab by the head thrusting the thumb into the trechea and twisting trying to break his trechea windpipe and neck, and this is just one instance, for every MMA situation you could with ninjitsu, jujitsu, kung fu... do something better to protect yourself that is TOTALLY against the rules in the sport. For entertainment value and brawling yes but for instances that you NEED to fight no.

[TheyCallMeMom]

You are right, in the ring there are rules, but the techniques and fighting styles are valuable..and I have even learned some of those techniques.What they do in the ring can be done to protect yourself... you may have a gun but if you are holding it to my head I would hope I would be able to execute the moves I know to defend myself.. the moves would work, its my knowledge of them that may go wrong -My husband does spar with me and teaches me defense moves. I just have never actually tried to hurt him , so I dont know how my delivery would go

one fighter for example Chung Lee. He is one of my favorite. I like how he fights.. I dont like to call it fighting. fighting is where you have unresolved conflict. this is more sport. physical training .. anyhow .. he is a mental fighter.. its like he's playing chess.. and thats what makes it a good sport.. and also why it is a useful tool.

Have you ever watched the Human Weapon. I believe its on the history channel.. Those are some incredibly neat shows.

[KoalaBear]

What a ridiculous load of bile that is!

Mixed martial arts is the end result of thousands of years of martial arts and training. I would seriously doubt that a high grade ninjutsu practitioner could come close to ripping Fedor Emelianenko's eye out with out having his head knocked off before hand.

All of these arts like ninjutsu and such are such a ridiculous comparison for one reason, they do not train their death strikes. And furthermore they do not train to use them on aware opponents.

Put a ninjustu guy into an octagon with a readied MMA fighter, he'd last 30 seconds... Maximum!

[ninjormon]

Put a ninjustu guy into an octagon with a readied MMA fighter, he'd last 30 seconds... Maximum!

Youre right about the 30 seconds thing but to the wrong effect. Ninjitsu is designed to end fights guickly by using pressure points and other concepts of martial arts. In MMA the RULES would prevent a ninjitsu practioner from using ninjitsu, by that I mean shots to the throat, eye gouging, crotch shots, hammer fist,(designed to kill), certain holds, etc. Come on man, do you think that a wrestler would slug it out with Kimbo Slice? Not gonna happen. You play to your strengths and your strengths are the other persons weaknesses. Also it is a ninjas duty to study other martial arts as well.

I think its awesome supermom that you and your husband practice together, my wife and I do too. I think it's a good activity, it builds trust, teaches valuable techniques, and it's good cheap clean fun. The human weapon is a good tool here are 4 links to a collage of all of the different martial arts. Also look up Choson Ninja on youtube for a couple hundred different techniques, he trains law enforcement and marines.

[ninjormon]

I thought of a way to put it in an anology, tell a carpenter to build a house but take away his tools, the house may get built but would just take longer, the rules of the sport take away the tools of a ninja.

[TheyCallMeMom]

right.. but the point of the UFC is mostly for entertainment, but you don't lose the purpose of MMA.. Mixed Martial Arts is a wonderful and useful tool.. I am sure anyone of these fighters have the full potential to defend themselves should the situation arise.. but they are not trying to kill their opponent.. as their opponent is not trying to kill them.. its a match, to see who's can execute their skills better..

that showyou posted was a neat one.. My kids watched it a while back.. it was a physics lesson

[KoalaBear]

Youre right about the 30 seconds thing but to the wrong effect. Ninjitsu is designed to end fights guickly by using pressure points and other concepts of martial arts. In MMA the RULES would prevent a ninjitsu practioner from using ninjitsu, by that I mean shots to the throat, eye gouging, crotch shots, hammer fist,(designed to kill), certain holds, etc. Come on man, do you think that a wrestler would slug it out with Kimbo Slice? Not gonna happen. You play to your strengths and your strengths are the other persons weaknesses. Also it is a ninjas duty to study other martial arts as well.

Please, please please leave Kimbo out of this. I actually quite like the guy, but he is not to the calibre of a mixed martial artist and is at least another year of Bas' tuition before being considered as such.

In a street fight, even in such an enviroment, a skilled MMA fighter will be able to pick apart any traditionalist. Well rounded skills and the ability to switch levels, keep distance and use effective lateral movement is too much for most traditionalist to handle. Have you seen the old video of Royce Gracie fighting a Kung Fu practitioner, some one who had been trained to "kill"? Royce had him crying like a girl within a few seconds. And he wasn't even breathing hard enough to blow out a candle!

As i said, MMA is the final stages of perfecting martial arts. It is just a matter of fine tuning and further progression and mixing up different styles that will see the final results come sooner.

MIXED being the key word, and 3-4 different styles rolled into one fighter is always going to beat one style that the practitioner has never even tested his "killing" strikes to their full effectiveness.

[BenRaines]

I have not seen it but in the early days the Gracie's took on all comers. They fought black belts, judo masters and all sorts. None of them could beat the Gracies.

We trained in ground fighting with the police department. No one should stand up and box an opponent. Take them to the ground and control them is the way to defeat an opponent.

Ben Raines

[Faded]

Youre right about the 30 seconds thing but to the wrong effect. Ninjitsu is designed to end fights guickly by using pressure points and other concepts of martial arts. In MMA the RULES would prevent a ninjitsu practioner from using ninjitsu, by that I mean shots to the throat, eye gouging, crotch shots, hammer fist,(designed to kill), certain holds, etc. Come on man, do you think that a wrestler would slug it out with Kimbo Slice? Not gonna happen. You play to your strengths and your strengths are the other persons weaknesses. Also it is a ninjas duty to study other martial arts as well.

I think its awesome supermom that you and your husband practice together, my wife and I do too. I think it's a good activity, it builds trust, teaches valuable techniques, and it's good cheap clean fun. The human weapon is a good tool here are 4 links to a collage of all of the different martial arts. Also look up Choson Ninja on youtube for a couple hundred different techniques, he trains law enforcement and marines.

The Ultimate Fighting Championship signaled the death of a lot of long held Hollywood delusions. One of those delusions was that a stand-up fighter like Chuck Norris was the best type of fighter. Another is that mastery one single martial arts discipline is better than cross-training into every martial arts discipline. Ninjitsu has seen a measure of success in the UFC because it is a fairly well-rounded discipline. But the ninja tends to get over-hyped by Hollywood. Yes they are lethal ... just like every other martial arts style. They also train ground and stand-up, which is getting on the right track. But to say that they would be the most lethal discipline if you throw out all rules -- I think that is recreating the myth that the ninja is unbeatable, without having to prove any of it. Historically, if ninjitsu was as effective in comparison to other styles as it is hyped up to be, then we should see a historical record piled very very high with dead Emperors and dead Shoguns. Afterall, a ninja is nothing more and nothing less than a trained assassin. The historical success of ninjas in successfully assassinating their targets is very comparable to Europe in the Middle Ages. They had lethal skills, but so did their targets and the guards of their targets.

One thing I think you are missing here -- Brazillian jujitsu has held a dominant position in MMA for the same reasons you mention: Killing and incapacitating moves. More than that, Brazillian jujitsu represents one of the most significant and successful efforts to cross train fighters into all areas. As things have progressed, the more cross-trained a fighter was, the more successful they were. It is very interesting that Far-Eastern practitioners have seen very limited success despite being the originators of most of the martial arts being used. Much of that comes down to their stubborn tradition against cross-training. Because of the fanatical loyalty to a single style of combat, MMA is instead being dominated by the USA, Brazil, Russia, etc.

Edited February 3, 2009 by Faded

[KoalaBear]

Ok, just to clarify. Chuck Norris is a Brazillian Jiu Jitsu black belt.

If i can knock a person out before taking them down, i'm doing that.

And. Brazillian Jiu Jitsu is not a dominant style in MMA. MMA is the dominant style of MMA. If any single style could be said as MMA's most dominant, it would probably be wrestling or Muay Thai.

[Gatsby]

I can't stand UFC, MMA...can't stand it! I love boxing and I even train(not trying to become an amateur boxer or professional boxer) I just can't stand watching it. I've tried before but I perfer boxing over MMA.

[Faded]

Ok, just to clarify. Chuck Norris is a Brazillian Jiu Jitsu black belt.

Never have seen him do anything with it. At this point, he's too old to show us his jui jitsu skills in the ring, so I guess it's hard to say how good he really is/was/would be. If Chuck Norris would have been one of the all-time MMA legends, we'll never truly know.

If i can knock a person out before taking them down, i'm doing that.

That's why I love what Chuck Liddell and others like him did for MMA. They re-established the importance of stand-up fighting by finding ways to keep the best grapplers from taking them down.

And. Brazillian Jiu Jitsu is not a dominant style in MMA. MMA is the dominant style of MMA. If any single style could be said as MMA's most dominant, it would probably be wrestling or Muay Thai.

I think Brazillian Jui Jitzu is doing very well for itself -- but just like every other style, it is not the full package by itself. It has some holes that can be exploited, just like every other style.

Wrestling as the most dominant within MMA? Which kind? Greco-Roman, Freestyle, Sambo, Jui Jitzu, Judo or one of the other types of wrestling? Wrestling really better describes the category of physical combat where striking is either limited or prohibited and there are lots of types of it. So yeah, you're right, but I don't see your point.

My point on jui jitsu is simple: It is the grappling style containing the set of tools that continues to be absolutely crucial to the success or failure of any MMA fighter.

I would agree that Muay Thai has done extremely well for itself.

[echegollen]

I love training different kind of martial arts. I did compete in wrestling. However, when it comes to competing in "boxing or MMA", I question myself if I should do it being a member of the church. When you think about it, the ulimate goal, is to KO your opponent. A knock out is by definition a "concussion". Is it morally acceptable to try to KO someone?

[NeuroTypical]

Hi echegollen, welcome to the forums.

You might want to check out this thread - it discusses things in depth.

http://www.lds.net/forums/sports/34657-how-can-you-support-boxing-ultimate-fighting.html

[echegollen]

Thanks! Very good link...

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