Were Adam and Eve born?

[Hemidakota]

If the speculation or assumption is that Adam did not require to eat, where he was commanded to eat, exception of one tree, he was immortal, what is the difference of that of the Savior, who was immortal who ate Fish? Interesting....there is an article that was posted sometime ago that explains why.

[KoalaBear]

I have no need to prove you wrong. I am agreeable you came from apes ha ha

Isn't it nice that you must feel you are so beyond reasoning that you are ignorant to what has been proven in black and white with years of scientific studies into evolution. Even if it is not 100% accurate, evolution can at least make a case for itself and isn't just a bed time story. What evidence do you have that god is real? What evidence do you have? Oh thats right, you don't need it because you are to ignorant to have an open mind and acknowledge others beliefs in a logical, scientific history of man.

I laugh at your ignorance, and i laugh at how blindly you follow something to the point you do not feel you need to at least try and make a person understand this theory. I can only ask if you think that war, poverty, hunger and all of the other terrible things in this world are of gods devine will? If there were a god, why does he make the world suffer? Is it just a part of his sick and twisted games? I used to like blowing up toy army men when i was a child as well... Maybe god is just trying to be a child and in turn is killing our armed forces and innocent middle eastern civilians.

Would an almighty god allow this to happen if he "loves" us all?

[georgia2]

I had a hard time understanding this but I do now.

Satan is the one who causes war and hate, which causes all of the other issues you question. God loves us and therefore does not interfere with mans free agency. Man can chose to be kind and unselfish or greedy and power hungry which cause war. All of the bad stuff here on earth had it's beginning in man's bad, selfish decisions. More men, more complicated.

On the other hand, this allows those who do want to be Godly, to be compassionate, loving, giving, which causes them to grow in strength, wisdom, character. Trials and adversity make us stronger. God wants everyone to be good and kind, but he will not make us. Forcing someone to do anything, even good is WRONG>. This is the whole purpose of our earthly life. TO CHOOSE GOOD OR EVIL. In the end, this is what we will have to give an accountability for. Those who choose to do evil will have their just reward from a God who knows ALL, HE who knows not only our every action but our thoughts as well. And he doesn't look to kindly on those who neglect and hurt children!

I don't want to, will not get in a battle or debate over these things I know are true. It creates hostile feelings, and I choose NOT to have that influence in my life. As for you or anyone else who questions or doesn't understand how anyone could believe these things has to understand it is a heart thing. You have to open your heart to receive feelings and answers to your questions. God will not force anyone to believe in Him! If you want to know if there is a God, you have to ask him if He is there, then open up to receive the answers that only He knows will have meaning for you.

[trulykiwi]

From Mormon Doctrine, page 242:

"She was placed on earth in the same manner as was Adam, the Mosaic account of the Lord creating her from Adam's rib being merely figurative. (Moses 3:20-25)."

When Adam saw Eve, that glorious being who had been sealed to him as his wife, he was filled with love for her, for she had been taken symbolically from the rib next to his heart. She was not taken from his head to stand over him, nor from his breast to go before him, nor from his back to walk behind him, nor from his foot to be trodden upon. She was taken symbolically from his side—close to his heart to stand by him as a noble companion. He said: “This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.” (Gen. 2:23.) Of marriages such as theirs, the Savior said: “Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.” (Matt. 19:6.)

Jeffrey R. Holland, However Long and Hard the Road, p.107

"...Marriage is the highest and holiest and most sacred of human relationships. And because of that, it is the most intimate. When God brought Adam and Eve together before there was any death to separate them, he said, "Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh." (Genesis 2:24.) To reinforce the imagery of that unity, the scriptures indicate that God had figuratively taken a rib from Adam's side to make Eve, not from his front that she should lead him and not from his back that she should despise him, but from his side, under his arm, close to his heart. There, bone of his bone and flesh of his flesh, husband and wife were to be united in every way, side by side. They were to give themselves totally to each other, and to "cleave unto [each other] and none else." (D&C 42:22.)

I hope this helps clear things up.

Look at Moses 3:21

Whats so figurative about him taking his rib and closing up the flesh?

[trulykiwi]

From Mormon Doctrine, page 242:

"She was placed on earth in the same manner as was Adam, the Mosaic account of the Lord creating her from Adam's rib being merely figurative. (Moses 3:20-25)."

The Mormon Doctrine hasn't been approved by the First Presidency and Bruce R McConkie stated also that a lot of it is his own interpretation.

Moses 3:

21 "And I, the Lord God, caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam; and he slept, and I took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh in the stead thereof;"

22 "And the rib which I, the Lord God, had taken from man, made I a woman, and brought her unto the man."

23 "And Adam said: This I know now is bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of man."

Also see:

Gen. 2: 23.

23 "And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man."

Jacob 2: 21.

21 "Do ye not suppose that such things are abominable unto him who created all flesh? And the one being is as precious in his sight as the other. And all flesh is of the dust; and for the selfsame end hath he created them, that they should keep his commandments and glorify him forever."

Really quite simple isn't it?

Peace.

[georgia2]

Although Mormon Doctrine is a useful book, you are right that it is not included in the standard works. And there is reason in that, it is because each and very word is not gospel. Bruce R. McConkie wasn't perfect either. As the winding up scenes roll along, we will be given more and more truths from HEavenly Father through His servants the prophets.

And you know what? Who cares how God made Eve? That fact that He made her is all I need. Picking apart each word to find hidden meaning can be enlightening, but in the end it is not what will bring us salvation. The plain and simple truths are what we have been counseled to ponder and rely on. Everything else is a waste of time.

Edited February 3, 2009 by georgia2

[Hemidakota]

The Mormon Doctrine hasn't been approved by the First Presidency and Bruce R McConkie stated also that a lot of it is his own interpretation.

Moses 3:

21 "And I, the Lord God, caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam; and he slept, and I took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh in the stead thereof;"

22 "And the rib which I, the Lord God, had taken from man, made I a woman, and brought her unto the man."

23 "And Adam said: This I know now is bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of man."

Also see:

Gen. 2: 23.

23 "And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man."

Jacob 2: 21.

21 "Do ye not suppose that such things are abominable unto him who created all flesh? And the one being is as precious in his sight as the other. And all flesh is of the dust; and for the selfsame end hath he created them, that they should keep his commandments and glorify him forever."

Really quite simple isn't it?

Peace.

Figurative....if all fails, pray for an answer to this wonderful story.

[Hemidakota]

Although Mormon Doctrine is a useful book, you are right that it is not included in the standard works. And there is reason in that, it is because each and very word is not gospel. Bruce R. McConkie wasn't perfect either. As the winding up scenes roll along, we will be given more and more truths from HEavenly Father through His servants the prophets.

And you know what? Who cares how God made Eve? That fact that He made her is all I need. Picking apart each word to find hidden meaning can be enlightening, but in the end it is not what will bring us salvation. The plain and simple truths are what we have been counseled to ponder and rely on. Everything else is a waste of time.

It is very important to know how the creation and the hidden mysteries behind the story given in Genesis. Nothing is wasted as to seeking truths, as it is to be part of building the kingdom here upon the earth for the Savior.

[Guest tomk]

Kiwi:

Will you accept the word of a prophet of God?

Here is a talk by Spencer W. Kimball:

LDS.org - Ensign Article - The Blessings and Responsibilities of Womanhood

an excerpt from that talk:

“And I, God, created man in mine own image, in the image of mine Only Begotten created I him; male and female created I them. [The story of the rib, of course, is figurative.]

“And I, God, blessed them [Man here is always in the plural. It was plural from the beginning.] and said unto them: Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it, and have dominion over [it].” (Moses 2:27–28.)

[The story of the rib, of course, is figurative.]

Those are the words of Spencer W. Kimball!!!!

The story of the rib is FIGURATIVE.

Now what do you say to that?

[Guest tomk]

Let me ask you this.

What is the easiest, simplest way for my wife and I to create a person in our own image?

Do we first try to get pregnant naturally, using the reproductive organs we've been blessed with?

OR

Do we ignore that, and go directly to cloning, artificial insemination, or test-tube techniques?

Most couples try "God's ordained method" first.

--------------

Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother are Beings of flesh and bone. Their ability to create life is the very FOUNDATION of our existense. I would assume that Heavenly Mother was capable of nurturing Adam and then Eve in her womb. Then giving birth to those children, raising them to adulthood, and then placing them in the Garden of Eden as amortal, not immortal, children.

[Justice]

trulykiwi? What did you think of that scripture I posted for you?

I can't get to this conversation like I'd prefer, because it's 11 days now that I've been without power. I'm using some precious generator juice to hop on line real quick.

[Noah18]

I think logically for me anyway, they were born physically, but unlike their parents they were the first spirit son and daughter born into mortality. They were the first "modern" humans, or Homo Homo Sapiens, given the responsibility to populate this earth with the spirit sons and daughters of God, other Homo Homo Sapiens. They were given a more perfect knowledge of good and evil, and an understanding of death being the seperation of both body and spirit. Of course these are my own little speculations, and we can't really know for sure, until we are ready to hear it from God, Adam or whoever wants to tell us in God's behalf.

[Hemidakota]

Now if GOD would reveal unto 'YOU' the creational plan, would you accept it for face value? :)

[Dr T]

To be saved by Jesus? Ok :)

[Hemidakota]

?????????????

[Dr T]

same HD

[Hemidakota]

Hmm...if I stood in Moses shoes, what would GOD reveal to me? Can I accept what is seen and write those portion allowed? Can I accept those visions that is beyond the universe, before GOD was GOD?

There are many who lived on this earth had witnessed the creational under the hands of ministering spirits or from the GODHEAD. We have the same privilidge as the prophets to be that witness but only those GOD selected are allowed to write about and not all of it. :)

[Dr T]

There NEVER was a time that God wasn't God HD. :)

[Justice]

If anyone thinks that this earth is the first, or even worse, the only, that has ever been created throughout all eternity, that person needs to do some serious pondering and praying on what "forever" means, and on the fact that God is unchangeable.

This earth did have a beginning, and we all had a beginning, but this is not the first earth, nor are we the first "man" to come into existence. This (the exalting of man) has been going on forever. The thought is staggering, that there is no beginning to man, but all other avenues fall short, and cannot allow for the infinite glory and wisdom of God.

In the beginning means the beginning of this earth and heaven. An innumerable amount (to man) of heaven and earths have been created throughout all eternity.

[Hemidakota]

There NEVER was a time that God wasn't God HD. :)

Can you prove it?

[Dr T]

Can u prove that he wasn't HD?

[Dr T]

It just makes sense since:

Not everything needs to be cause or created. Only finite things need a cause...

There can be only three possible answers to existence..three possible kinds of beings...they are either self-caused, caused by another...and uncaused. So...which are we?...and which is God?

Self-caused is impossible with respect to existence..we can't bring ourselves into existence, can we?

Uncaused would mean we are eternal infinite beings, which we are not.

Therefore, we must be caused beings. So what kind of being caused us?

Well, since self-caused is impossible and caused by another would lead to an impossible regression...He must be uncaused. God is the uncaused cause of life.

Now doesn't that make sense?

[Dr T]

K, HD-your turn to prove God wasn't

[Justice]

Uncaused would mean we are eternal infinite beings, which we are not.

We aren't?

We will exist for the rest of eternity. We cannot die. Therefore, we are eternal.

We have not existed *forever.* But, we will exist from now on, or for eternity.

See how you have to be very clear?

[Dr T]

Ok so did we have a begining and are finite or not?