When is divorce recommended?


deadinside
 Share

Recommended Posts

So, are you saying that your wife wants a divorce because....you no longer have faith that the church is true? Or is there more to the story? My guess is that your/her Bishop would REALLY want you to work things out, regardless of your uncertainty about the church. I think everyone has trials of their faith and marriage. As someone that has gone through both.....hang in there...time changes people, often in very good and profound ways. Best of luck!

Edited by bytor2112
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have researched & read probably most of what the Prophets have written about marriage, divorce, abuse & adultery, etc. & I have never ever read anything where they say a spouse should divorce, they always say keep your covenants & never give up on your spouse. They have said that there may be "rare" situations where divorce might be justified, but those situations they say, are because of very serious transgressions & an unrepentant spouse & not minor things & not because people have fallen out of love, or are tired of the marriage, etc. But even when one may be justified, they still don't say to divorce, but it's left to the person to decide. I believe the Prophets have asked us to have Unconditional True Love for our spouse & keep our covenants no matter what, though sometimes a spouse may have to protect themselves for a time & live apart if necessary.

The church also would rather have marriages stay together even if one spouse is not a member or goes inactive & doesn't believe the same as the other spouse, rather than break up & marry an active member. So for her to hurt & abandon you just to find a member spouse is not what the Church teaches.

It sounds like she may not be telling you the real reason she wants a divorce.

Edited by foreverafter
Link to comment
Share on other sites

If everything else in the marriage is good, then I don't see what the problem is. This doesn't appear to be any different than a "one spouse Protestant/one spouse Catholic" type marriage and I know about a 1/2 a dozen of them and they all seem just fine. It seems that the ones that have a problem with religion in their marriages are the ones that CHOOSE to make it a problem. You do your thing in regards to the church and freely allow her to do her thing and go back to focusing on the many other positive aspects of your marriage. There's no two spouses ANYWHERE that agree on absolutely everything in a marriage, so just allow this to be that one thing. Hope everything works out for ya'.:)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hidden

Everything else in the marriage is not good .... yet. I'm just saying that I'm sure we can work on all those things, but the belief is the one thing that is not something I can just do to fix it. I can try and see, but if I don't get a different opinion, then what else can I do but lie which I won't do. I'm hoping we can just work on our issues and that will be enough. What I don't want to do is waste time fixing all these issues she has only to have her still decide it's not enough because I don't believe. That would cause big problems. I'm willing to do a lot of things to stay married, but everyone has limits.

Link to comment

It must be recognized that some marriages fail. To those in that circumstance I extend understanding because every divorce carries heartache with it. But at all costs couples should avoid covenant breaking. In my opinion, any promise between a man and a woman incident to a marriage ceremony rises to the dignity of a covenant. The family relationship of father, mother, and child is the oldest and most enduring institution in the world. It has survived vast differences of geography and culture. This is because marriage between man and woman is a natural state and is ordained of God. It is a moral imperative. Those marriages performed in our temples, meant to be eternal relationships, then become the most sacred covenants we can make. The sealing power given by God through Elijah is thus invoked, and God becomes a party to the promises.

Over a lifetime of dealing with human problems, I have struggled to understand what might be considered “just cause” for breaking of covenants. I confess I do not claim the wisdom nor authority to definitely state what is “just cause.” Only the parties to the marriage can determine this. They must bear the responsibility for the train of consequences which inevitably follow if these covenants are not honored. In my opinion, “just cause” should be nothing less serious than a prolonged and apparently irredeemable relationship which is destructive of a person’s dignity as a human being.

At the same time, I have strong feelings about what is not provocation for breaking the sacred covenants of marriage. Surely it is not simply “mental distress” nor “personality differences” nor “having grown apart” nor “having fallen out of love.” This is especially so where there are children. Enduring divine counsel comes from Paul:

James E. Faust -- LDS.org - Ensign Article - Fathers, Mothers, Marriage

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hidden

Thanks Marginoferror for the great quote. That is a very good one. I think how my wife would interpret this is that it says "But at all costs couples should avoid covenant breaking" and my wife sees my change of personal opinion as having already broken that covenant, not seeing that covenant as marriage itself, but the promises we made when getting married. I do understand her pain and wish I could just believe as easily as she does, but that is my personal trial and will take time and effort to figure that out. Even with the pain, the kids will likely be much better off IMO and also in the opinion of most church leaders, if we remain married. I will be able to respect her wishes much easier if we are still a couple vs if we are divorced. The kids will obviously want to know why this is happening and she does not like the answer to that seeing as I want to stay together and she does not.

The reason I say "waste of time" for the little things is because they are not fixes that I see as needing fixed if we are not together. I'm trying to make compromises so that we can both be as happy as possible given the circumstances. The things I would be doing are only for the sake of saving the marriage and making her as happy as possible, not because I see them as wrong things. Not at this point anyways.

Time to start doing some more research, but that was a good one for sure. I appreciate it.

Link to comment

When you say "work on things" do you mean that "she change something?"

That's usually what people mean.

It sounds like you're looking for something that will prove to her that she shouldn't get a divorce. When the reality is, you're the only one who can make her change her mind.

It sounds like you know what she wants. If you are unwilling to try to give her what she wants, maybe you don't deserve her. You said you just don't have the faith. I'd say start there and look for talks on how to increase your faith, and not how to convince her not to get a divorce.

Always start with yourself. Once you try to change your spouse you will fail. The change is yours to make... it's the only thing you have control over.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hidden

When you say "work on things" do you mean that "she change something?"

That's usually what people mean.

It sounds like you're looking for something that will prove to her that she shouldn't get a divorce. When the reality is, you're the only one who can make her change her mind.

It sounds like you know what she wants. If you are unwilling to try to give her what she wants, maybe you don't deserve her. You said you just don't have the faith. I'd say start there and look for talks on how to increase your faith, and not how to convince her not to get a divorce.

Always start with yourself. Once you try to change your spouse you will fail. The change is yours to make... it's the only thing you have control over.

I think you may be personalizing my response, but you are mistaken. When I say work on things, 90% are things I will be changing or doing to make her happy, not her changing. I actually want her to stay the same for the most part. We all have room for improvement. For example, I am more on a soul searching quest. I don't believe many things she does. I see nature as something to embrace, not deny. I do not see that we should be trying to overcome the natural man, but embrace it's beauty. I think if there is a god, why would he make us with so many flaws and desires, then tell us through others that it is wrong. I see no moral problem with having a drink occasionally. I have not been with my wife in over 6 weeks due to work. For the sake of our marriage and our children, I am willing to continue living life as if I am an active member for the most part so it is easier for her to deal with my decision and show the respect I have for her. These are things that without her, I would not see a need to do or not do as the case may be.

What I am looking for is more written articles on the church saying as strongly as possible without crossing legal boundaries that marriage is not something to break up just because of a difference of religious opinion. I don't want to ruin our kids future over personal issues and want to do what I can to show that I will make it as good as possible for the whole family.

I do know part of what she wants and it's not that I don't want to give it to her, but rather can't. She wants the truth and she wants me to believe the church. I can't just turn on faith and belief. I can still live the part though and that is what I am willing to still give her.

Link to comment

Deadinside,

I'm sorry to hear that your wife wants a divorce. A few years ago my husband who is not an active member had an affair. I went to see my bishop and he recommended divorce. He told me that if my husband wasn't helping me and my two children grow closer to HF then he was pulling us down. That I would be better off without him since he wasn't setting a good example to our children. I left his office sad and confused, I went in there for advice and having faith that my bishop would tell me to be forgiving and to work hard to keep my family together. My husband was remorseful, he wanted to stay and work things out, I wanted to "kill" him for all the pain he caused me and I kicked him out of the house. I prayed to my HF and I felt that even though my husband wasn't active in the church and we were not sealed in the temple, my family was still important and he that my husband was a child of god and a good person and father.

After a few weeks of counseling and a lot of prayer we got back together. He still not coming to church with me, but he is very supportive of my callings and encourages our children to be active in the youth programs. I will not force him to believe in something and live a lie just to make me happy, because I have gone through that before and it didn't bring true happiness to either of us.

We just had our 19th year anniversary, and I have to say that I don't regret staying together. We have to very well adjusted teenagers and overall a happy family. I know many families that are sealed in the temple, they are both active in the church and are miserable at home. Husbands that have callings in the church and treat their wives like dirt and don't respect them.

I'm sorry if this was too long but I felt that I just had to share this with you. I wish you and your wife that best.

Rain

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Here is the on-line version of the Church's CES manual, "Eternal Marriage". It will contain the mainstream LDS view on a variety of topics pertaining to marriage, and (conveniently for you and your wife) has an entire chapter on divorce.

Now for my own opinion:

When the two of you got married, you were both active members of the Church and there was most likely an underlying assumption that you would both remain so. Even if you still live your life in accordance with Church teachings, to some degree your wife is simply not getting what she bargained for. There's going to be some shock, hurt, and (probably) resentment.

That said: As long as you haven't committed adultery and aren't bringing verboten items into the house (alcohol, porn, coffee, etc), divorce isn't going to solve any of the problems that your lack of faith has (from your wife's viewpoint) caused. Does she fear your "corrupting" influence on the kids? Guess what--even if you get divorced, you will still get unsupervised visitation unless you've done something very heinous. And at the risk of sounding horribly sexist--a thirtysomething woman with four kids probably has as good a chance of reactivating her husband than she does of finding a new husband. (Marital tip: Do not make this argument to her!)

I almost suspect there's something else going on here that you have forgotten to mention. But if there isn't, then my guess is that she's just going through a phase of shock-induced irrationality. Stick it out, and she should come to her senses eventually.

Edited by Just_A_Guy
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have not been with my wife in over 6 weeks due to work.

Does that mean you've been away from home for 6 weeks? That might be one of the things you need to change. Maybe change jobs if you have to to be with your family more. Sounds like they need you right now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And at the risk of sounding horribly sexist--a thirtysomething woman with four kids probably has as good a chance of reactivating her husband than she does of finding a new husband. (Marital tip: Do not make this argument to her!)

Let me clarify, before anyone gets excessively offended, that I am not saying a woman should put up with all kinds of behavior just so that she can have a man around the house. I'm just saying that if her sole reason for wanting a divorce is because she thinks she can find a better man elsewhere--that's pretty slim odds to be betting the farm on.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am sorry to hear, that you are having this difficulty. Yes, as MarginOfError says, some marriages do fail. My wife´s first marriage failed, and I was spared that as I have only had a relationship breakdown, which was hurtful enough.

I do not know your circumstances, or the reasons behind your difficulties, but rest assured, that families that are sealed together, are under the biggest attack from SATAN and his entourage.

I have been called along with my wife, to teach "STRENGTHENING THE FAMILY" course in our ward, and if you have that course in your ward, I would recommend it, otherwise you can get the student manual from distribution, however this course is more directed at your (i.e. parents) relationship with your kids. Don´t forget, they too are a part of your family.

HOWEVER, there is also another course, called "STRENGTHENING THE MARRIAGE", which I feel The Spirit telling me is MORE appropriate for you and your wife, the student manual of which is also available from distribution.

Just remember, (and this may sound like a cliché), that the family that prays together stays together.

Ask yourself this. Are you having morning and evening prayers together (every day), as well as eating together as a family (not in front of the TV and with other distractions like football and soaps) preceeded by saying grace (food prayer) in a proper manner. Are you holding family home evenings with everyone participating and doing their thing (one person in charge of hymns, another in charge of refreshments (perhaps divided among two one does cakes/brownies and biscuits/cookies the other drinks (coolade or hot chocolate) etc. - making it a family affair.

Do you hold family councils. Do you, as a priesthood holder, excercise your priesthood in the home, by: having a one to one with your children, where they can come to you with any problem or question, similar to a worthiness interview, without fear of ridicule and judgement, do this also with your wife?

Do you give comfort blessings? Does your family, wife and children, feel comfortable enough, to bother you (even if it is 2 a.m.) to ask for a blessing because they don´t feel right?

Do you feel confident and comfortable enough to offer the blessings without having them ask for it.

I have not been married long, and SATAN has had a go at this marriage like he had nothing better to do.

Since 14 Feb, We have both been taken seriously ill (I on my wedding day and my wife a week later).

I then moved house to my wife´s house. And then my wife miscarried at the end of March, and I lost my job 3 weeks later (I´m still unemployed).

It is said, that the 4 most stressful things in life, are: Getting Married, Moving House, Bereavement and Job Loss, and we´ve had them all, in 4 months. But my wife is now pregnant again, and feels comfortable enough to get me up at 2 a.m. to ask for a blessing, and we always pray together before she sets off for work, we have a sitdown meal (at least once a week (usually more often)) and we always have a prayer before we go to sleep.

Please, have your family together in the mornings and at night, and kneel in prayer, in all humility, and give thanks for what you have, and ask for guidance.

When my brother died some 15 yrs ago, a lady in The Church said to me, that she knew I might not feel like it, but if I only went down on my knees, and thanked The Lord for every moment, I had with my brother, and MENTIONED each moment individually thanking for it, THAT for every moment I´d give thanks, one weight would be removed, and I should continue in prayer and giving thanks, until that burden of sorrow was gone.

I did just that, and prayed aloud, sobbing my eyes out with a runny nose, but the burden was made light. Join with your family in prayer, and give thanks for all the happy moments, and reminice about silly things, that may have been annoying at the time, e.g. setting the living room carpet on fire, but give thanks that no one was hurt etc., and you will find that The Spirit will be with you all. It is your right to have The Spirit with you Always (in as much as you are faithful to your covenants), as this was given to you at your confirmation, but The Spirit will not force it´s way in, YOU have to INVITE it.

I know THIS CHURCH IS TRUE, and that we have the restored Gospel on the earth today, and that you and I hold the Restored Priesthood, and that Thomas Spencer Monson is a living prophet, seer and revelator, and that Joseph Smith Jr. was the same, and through the gifts of the Holy Ghost, he translated the Book of Mormon, which also is true scripture from God on high. - Remember that Gordon B. Hinckley mentioned, that since couples were asked to work things through, that the divorce rate among LDS members has dropped.

The courses I mentioned above, come from the 1st presidency, and I tell you this, that my wife and I have taken the course and teach it, and I testify that it is a work from God and it does work. All you and your family have to do, is to work through your problems. Take the courses, and STRENGTHEN YOUR MARRIAGE, & STRENGTHEN THE FAMILY.

With Brotherly Love,

Sigurjón Helgi Kristjánsson (Elder)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just a quick note on Justice´s comments.

Yes it is true, that it is often expected, that just one person change. When two people debate, it is very rare that just one is right and the other wrong.

I used to do alot of youth work on an inter Nordic and international level as well as national, and I always remember what Mrs. Björg Styrmo from Norway said (regarding changing the world): "Think Global, Work Local, BUT begin with yourself".

And that is where we all should start. Begin with ourselves.

Love,

Helgi

Edited by Helgi
Typographical error.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just a quick note on Justice´s comments.

Yes it is true, that it is often expected, that just one person change. When two people debate, it is very rare that just one is right and the other wrong.

I used to do alot of youth work on an inter Nordic and international level as well as national, and I always remember what Mrs. Björg Styrmo from Norway said (regarding changing the world): "Thinhk Global, Work Local, BUT begin with yourself".

And that is where we all should start. Begin with ourselves.

Love,

Helgi

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There are a few really good talks on Divorce. One of my favorites is by Dallin Oaks.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - Divorce

I just have a few questions for the OP.

Has your wife officially filed for divorce? Or is she talking about it trying to decide for herself?

Is the only issue driving the divorce your apparent change in beliefs? Or could this be the final blow after other pain?

Were you guys married in the temple and did she marry you with the understanding that you had a testimony and a commitment to follow the Savior til the end of your life? And if you did in fact have a testimony at that time, what has happened that caused the change? Or did you perhaps misrepresent yourself at anytime, even innocently?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think you may be personalizing my response, but you are mistaken.

Maybe you are mistaken for not personalizing it?

I see some key phrases in your comments that lead me to believe you're not seeing the picture as clearly as you think you are. I don't claim to know, but I see signs.

When I say work on things, 90% are things I will be changing or doing to make her happy, not her changing. I actually want her to stay the same for the most part.

90%? Marriage is not a 50 - 50 proposal. It is a 100 - 100 proposal. Each must be willing to give 100%. 90% is admirable, but in marriage, it's not good enough. Even with you directing 90% of the blame at yourself still leaves 10% directed at her in your mind. I think you missed the point of what I was saying.

You want her to stay the same "for the most part?" You know, it's too bad we can't make people be the way we want them, there would be no failed marriages.

Even wanting her to change "a little" is still missing the point. I hope that you can see this as an attempt to help, and give it serious thought, as opposed to me pointing fingers at you as you seem to be taking it.

Trust me, you can only change yourself. You cannot change her, so don't try. If you are 10% incompatible then it's for each of you to decide if that 10% is workable. In her mind the religion issue seems to be much higher than 10%. But, I can tell you that most marriages fail because of selfishness on the side of one or both parties, and not over any one thing like religion.

I don't believe many things she does.

My guess is she knows this as well, and she feels the differences are of a serious nature and will impact the life of your kids.

I see nature as something to embrace, not deny. I do not see that we should be trying to overcome the natural man, but embrace it's beauty.

As a member of the LDS Church, her view is diametrically opposite of yours. Frankly, I don't blame her for her concern just hearing this statement.

I think if there is a god, why would he make us with so many flaws and desires, then tell us through others that it is wrong.

It is clear you do not understand the LDS belief of "knowing good and evil." She disagrees with this, too, I'd wager.

I see no moral problem with having a drink occasionally.

She disagrees with this, too.

These are serious issues... it seems much more than 10%.

I have not been with my wife in over 6 weeks due to work.

In your OP you made it sound like you blamed her for you not being "with her."

For the sake of our marriage and our children, I am willing to continue living life as if I am an active member for the most part so it is easier for her to deal with my decision and show the respect I have for her. These are things that without her, I would not see a need to do or not do as the case may be.

You cannot live as if you believe these things, while not believing, and be worthy to take her to the temple.

Seriously, there is more here than you're seeing.

What I am looking for is more written articles on the church saying as strongly as possible without crossing legal boundaries that marriage is not something to break up just because of a difference of religious opinion.

Again, it is she that thinks the religious difference are a concern. There are no articles or talks you will be able to find that will ease her concern. This concern will only be eased by personal revelation. The two of you need to pray together, but from your side it would be a facad and she knows it.

I'm being honest here, there is a more serious problem than you realize.

I don't want to ruin our kids future over personal issues and want to do what I can to show that I will make it as good as possible for the whole family.

She is concerned for the eternal spiritual welfare of your children. It's clear that in the condition you are in you can't provide her children the spiritual guidance she wants for them.

I do know part of what she wants and it's not that I don't want to give it to her, but rather can't. She wants the truth and she wants me to believe the church. I can't just turn on faith and belief. I can still live the part though and that is what I am willing to still give her.

Then you can't give her the #1 thing on her list that she wants. And, it sounds as if you are unwilling to try. And, you are minimalizing her concern by saying it's 10%, or by saying you can live a lie and pretend to believe.

I really don't think you get it.

People are changed and converted every day. You can be too, and my impression is this is what she expects from you. Anything less and I think she will feel a strong desire to look for Priesthood leadership in her home elsewhere.

You can't pretend when it comes to faith and religion. It is good that you aren't lying about it, either. But, my feeling is this might be an irreconcilable difference, if you are unwilling to try to rekindle your testimony.

She is correct for wanting strong Priesthood in the home, especially if that was the pretense of her marrying you. Many will not divorce for this reason, but I hate to say it, she has a valid point.

Look, the best thing you can do is use this as a reality check time. You need to desire to know if God is real, and if Jesus Christ is His Son. You need to spend time reading the Book of Mormon and praying. Forget about the talks that you think might help change her and spend some time on your knees pleading for a mighty change of heart.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hidden
90%? Marriage is not a 50 - 50 proposal. It is a 100 - 100 proposal. Each must be willing to give 100%. 90% is admirable, but in marriage, it's not good enough. Even with you directing 90% of the blame at yourself still leaves 10% directed at her in your mind. I think you missed the point of what I was saying.

We will obviously not see eye to eye on many things. I completely disagree with you're 100 - 100 idea. A marriage is a union of 2 people. Both will have independent thoughts and ideas. Then you can talk things through and come to an agreement or middle ground that you can both agree on and use this for just about everything. Some things will be more of one side moving and some things may be one person doing all the moving. You can't both give 100% otherwise you will not only loose yourself, but you will become the other person and they will become you. You can only give so much. If you want an example, let's use our situation. I can't give her "belief in god". That would be pretending. I can only attempt to find that answer and I can make my actions such that it will be easier for her in dealing with this. Likewise, she can't give me 100% and not believe in the church. I want her to be happy. If the church makes her happy then she should stay. What part of this would you see as 100 - 100? I see it as compromise. You can use this on any difference. By 90%, I am saying that in all the things that need to change in our relationship. You may see things how you like, but my giving are things that I can do. Everyone has things they can change or perfect. She needs to give me toe right to have my own opinion on things. She obviously can't take away my freedom of choice and if she can't deal with our differences then divorce will happen. I think that would be going against what the church which she says she believes in recommends. That will always be her choice of course. I just think it's wrong to divorce based on a religious difference when that same religion would not want the divorce.

You want her to stay the same "for the most part?" You know, it's too bad we can't make people be the way we want them, there would be no failed marriages.

Even wanting her to change "a little" is still missing the point. I hope that you can see this as an attempt to help, and give it serious thought, as opposed to me pointing fingers at you as you seem to be taking it.

I can't control her, but as I said, everyone has room for improvement.

Trust me, you can only change yourself. You cannot change her, so don't try. If you are 10% incompatible then it's for each of you to decide if that 10% is workable. In her mind the religion issue seems to be much higher than 10%. But, I can tell you that most marriages fail because of selfishness on the side of one or both parties, and not over any one thing like religion.

I'm talking about changing things. I'm not saying that her accepting me is only 10%. I know it is more of 90% of what she is trying to deal with. In speaking of that, all of the things we have to deal with, they would all be fine if I were a good LDS man and not need discussed. I am not trying to minimize what this is to her. You misunderstand that completely. I'm saying I am willing to change whatever to make it work other than giving something that I can't control. If I can't get answers to prayers, then I can't believe the church. That is out of my control. I can do things to help get answers, but faith or belief is again, not something I can just turn on or off if it to be real faith.

My guess is she knows this as well, and she feels the differences are of a serious nature and will impact the life of your kids.

Like I said, I know it is a major issue for her, but I feel our children will be much better off with a marriage that stays together ..... just like the church teaches. Don't forget that either. You can disagree all you want, but you are disagreeing with the church and the teachings of it's prophets. Maybe you have some issues to deal with.

As a member of the LDS Church, her view is diametrically opposite of yours. Frankly, I don't blame her for her concern just hearing this statement.

I don't blame her either, but I can chose to make it a non issue within the marriage and home to be respectful of her. Part of my giving. I didn't say I would still do it. Just that I don't personally have a problem with it. Thus living that part in accordance with the religion.

It is clear you do not understand the LDS belief of "knowing good and evil." She disagrees with this, too, I'd wager.

I may not understand it, but I certainly don't agree with what I understand it to be. Knowledge and opinion are 2 different things. If you look at my words, you will see that was my opinion, not what I thought the church believed. I do know the church answer to all this stuff. You seem very judgmental of an internet thread post. It isn't meant to have every detail of every thought and problem we have. Just a basic view. I will expand though so you can see the bigger picture you obviously don't get yet.

She disagrees with this, too.

Thanks for stating the obvious. More of the things I would not do if staying in the marriage. Are you getting it now? Just because I don't have a problem with it doesn't mean I am trying to say I will be doing it in the marriage but I bring up the things that I know are our differences and that I am willing to live in accordance with her beliefs. GIVING! Part of my 90%.

These are serious issues... it seems much more than 10%.
In your OP you made it sound like you blamed her for you not being "with her."

I have no clue what part of any of my posts gave you that opinion. It is not the case anyways.

You cannot live as if you believe these things, while not believing, and be worthy to take her to the temple.

Again with stating the obvious and not understanding my post. I assume you could read into it a little better. I have at no point said I would pretend anything. I said I would go and live accordingly. Meaning in more detail so you can get the bigger picture, that I will attend church, have family home evening, support prayer in the home although I will not likely be the one praying, live accordingly in my daily life, no swearing, cheating, lying, drinking, etc. At no point did I say I would pretend anything. I will be more attending as an investigator type or non believing spouse that is supporting his wife and family. I don't pretend to still hold the priesthood or pretend to take the sacrament or pretend to other members that I am active or temple worthy. I can just live life in such a way that if I did actually believe, then I could just start paying tithing, praying, taking the sacrament, and become temple worthy. Clear enough?

Again, it is she that thinks the religious difference are a concern. There are no articles or talks you will be able to find that will ease her concern. This concern will only be eased by personal revelation. The two of you need to pray together, but from your side it would be a facad and she knows it.

Read the last post. I don't pretend to pray together. Maybe it would help in attempting to, but I'm not at that point yet. I can be completely supportive of her wants so she and the boys have a normal church life other than a priesthood holder in the home.

I'm being honest here, there is a more serious problem than you realize.

I do not say it is not serious. I realize it is a big deal for her, but I think it is a much bigger deal to split up the family when it could so easily work. The kids will not understand what is going on and it will hurt them far more than just not having a priesthood holder in the home. In my opinion and also that of the vast majority of church and professional type people that know the psychology of humans. I don't think there is much chance at all for her to find someone that will love and care for the kids like I can and do. Not saying it's impossible, but as someone else said, what are the realistic chances of that happening? There's not a lot of future prophets out there looking for a divorced woman with 4 kids. She is of course worthy of that kind of person, but will it happen? Doubtful and not worth risking my kids futures over. I think I can still make my wife happy, just not 100% happy at this time.

She is concerned for the eternal spiritual welfare of your children. It's clear that in the condition you are in you can't provide her children the spiritual guidance she wants for them.

But it is clear that I will not hinder that guidance and will support her in giving them this guidance. My parents are active members to and I don't want to hurt anyone, but I want to still be able to be honest with myself. I think the church teaches good things for society. I just don't know if it is truth.

Then you can't give her the #1 thing on her list that she wants. And, it sounds as if you are unwilling to try. And, you are minimalizing her concern by saying it's 10%, or by saying you can live a lie and pretend to believe.

Unwilling to try? What am I doing here then? If I can't give it to her now, at least time and staying married would allow some hope of that happening and if the church is true and I am seeking the truth, wouldn't you assume I could find that answer in my searching? Again, I never said I would live a lie or pretend anything. Being a supportive husband is pretending? How can anyone win in an argument with you. There's no right unless it's believing the same as you do. You have a problem and I'm sorry you don't see that.

I really don't think you get it.
I really don't think you get it.
People are changed and converted every day. You can be too, and my impression is this is what she expects from you. Anything less and I think she will feel a strong desire to look for Priesthood leadership in her home elsewhere.

She obviously wants this, but I can't promise it and keep that promise. I can only try and find a way to believe it, but I won't pretend. I'm sure she will feel and does feel like having a priesthood holder in the home. That is obvious. It may never be me, but certainly isn't at the moment. If she feels that is more important than everything else, then that is what the result will be. That is not in my control and she has not decided yet.

You can't pretend when it comes to faith and religion. It is good that you aren't lying about it, either. But, my feeling is this might be an irreconcilable difference, if you are unwilling to try to rekindle your testimony.

Already addressed. I am not unwilling and have started a few threads here to try and find these answers as my wife doesn't wish to be a part of my search for answers. I would much rather talk to her about things, but she doesn't wish to.

She is correct for wanting strong Priesthood in the home, especially if that was the pretense of her marrying you. Many will not divorce for this reason, but I hate to say it, she has a valid point.

We all want things we don't have or can't get. What is the order of things the church says to put in your life? I'm pretty sure the church puts marriage and children above church. Hmm Are you arguing that the church is wrong?

Look, the best thing you can do is use this as a reality check time. You need to desire to know if God is real, and if Jesus Christ is His Son. You need to spend time reading the Book of Mormon and praying. Forget about the talks that you think might help change her and spend some time on your knees pleading for a mighty change of heart.

Something I can and have done, but has anything changed? I can only continue to try.

Link to comment
Hidden

There are a few really good talks on Divorce. One of my favorites is by Dallin Oaks.

Thanks, I'll read it once I'm done responding to everyone!

Has your wife officially filed for divorce? Or is she talking about it trying to decide for herself?

No. She is still trying to decide if she wants to be divorced or married. I am just trying to help her see my way as I don't think divorce will make anything easier or better. She's trying to decide for herself. She is getting counseling for personal issues as well and to heal from all this stuff.

Is the only issue driving the divorce your apparent change in beliefs? Or could this be the final blow after other pain?

I don't claim this is the only issue. It is just the only one she said was a deal breaker. Everything else, I think can be repaired or changed to make the marriage work other than me believing. That will take time and she is suppose to make up this decision within 3.5 weeks from now when I go home for vacation according to your therapist. She agreed that this is a decision that my wife has to figure out assuming I will not have a change of heart. Her not knowing if she wants to stay married is weighing hard on the marriage. She wants to be treated like a wife, but isn't committed to the relationship. How would you feel if every day when you got home from work your spouse greeted you with pleasantries and always made a point of letting you know that they weren't sure if they wanted to remain married to you? That changes how I feel and act thinking I may come home any day and find out she wants a divorce so I protect myself. Protecting myself only makes things worse though, but I can't help that either. So she has to commit or not and she should know in a few weeks.

Are there other issues? Plenty. She has some reasons to hurt and worry, but only time will heal that and until she at least commits to the attempt to try nothing can progress. Being apart is certainly a strain on our relationship at the moment.

If you think it would be helpful to know these details, I have no problem talking about them, but it's not my main concern. She has just said that these details are part of the deal breaker issue so they could change that decision so now we are going to start working on the other issues. She has boundary issues and her therapist is helping her set some or giving her info to allow her to set them herself. She is making me a list of boundaries and will share that with me. That is where we will begin, but that too is still an unknown as to what they are.

Respect and trust are issues I have right now with her. We have both broken our trust in each other and I feel she also has no respect for me and she is ruining our chances of getting back together. Just today other things came up and I'm one step away from not caring what she decides and I'll just make up her mind for her and call it quits. Better yet, if you want details, PM me. Probably more than needs to be on an open forum.

Were you guys married in the temple and did she marry you with the understanding that you had a testimony and a commitment to follow the Savior til the end of your life? And if you did in fact have a testimony at that time, what has happened that caused the change? Or did you perhaps misrepresent yourself at anytime, even innocently?

Yes. I changed my views over many years. We were not married in the temple, but sealed a year later. There was no misrepresentation if you can see what that means. I never claimed to be strong in the gospel, but I did believe I believed. ^_^

What has caused the change? That's is a very long conversation that is just simplified into life events and happenings that lead me to believe things may not be as I once thought they were.

Link to comment
Hidden

We just had our 19th year anniversary, and I have to say that I don't regret staying together. We have to very well adjusted teenagers and overall a happy family. I know many families that are sealed in the temple, they are both active in the church and are miserable at home. Husbands that have callings in the church and treat their wives like dirt and don't respect them.

I'm sorry if this was too long but I felt that I just had to share this with you. I wish you and your wife that best.

Rain

Thanks for sharing. I hope we get that same chance!

Link to comment
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share