Word of Wisdom - one more time...


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So, up at the start of this thread, I mentioned the following:

I think many teachers may also shy away from some of the parts because it will devolve the class into an arguement about whether the Lord hates vegans or not. :lol:

LM

(He doesn't, in my opinion...)

I notice this thread has now become a big arguement about whether the Lord hates vegans or not, by fighting over a section of the D&C that isn't even in the Word of Wisdom in the first place..

So, Mr. Original poster, do you see why a teacher might want to overlook some parts of the WoW, and focus on "don't drink and do drugs"?

LM

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So, up at the start of this thread, I mentioned the following:

I notice this thread has now become a big arguement about whether the Lord hates vegans or not, by fighting over a section of the D&C that isn't even in the Word of Wisdom in the first place..

So, Mr. Original poster, do you see why a teacher might want to overlook some parts of the WoW, and focus on "don't drink and do drugs"?

LM

Ms. OP, that is. :-)

But, the thread digressed. I was trying to make the comparison of one-beer-a-day getting denied entrance to the temple while 100-slices-of-pizza-a-day can walk in as they please...

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Alcohol is addictive, and can lead to the user harming those around him/her (trust the daughter of a violent alcoholic on this one). I'm not sure how a "live on pizza" type is likely to, while under the influence of pizza, turn violent toward family members, crash his/her car, lose judgment sufficiently to engage in sexual indiscretions, etc. (Side note on DUI car crashes, from police: the DUI driver is more likely to walk away than his/her victim.)

Tobacco can also have detrimental effects on people who have to be in the same room with a smoker (and smokers do have a higher risk of setting the house on fire). Addictive, too.

Tea and coffee don't much impact the people around the user, granted, but can be addictive (this from someone who really needs to cut down her caffeinated soft drinks, I must confess).

Also, all the above-named substances can be rather expensive, for negligible at best health benefits, and the resources involved in producing and consuming them could very likely be better directed into more beneficial items.

I'm not too inclined to start hyper-analyzing why the Lord has set the standards He has, since I trust Him to know what's best, what with that omniscience deal. I do worry that things like Mountain Dew and chocolate may wind up on the prohibited list, but if that happens, I'll suck it up and obey.

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Ms. OP, that is. :-)

But, the thread digressed. I was trying to make the comparison of one-beer-a-day getting denied entrance to the temple while 100-slices-of-pizza-a-day can walk in as they please...

Yes, I would agree that is an irony.

But how would you propose the church should change the temple requirements? :)

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Alcohol is addictive, and can lead to the user harming those around him/her (trust the daughter of a violent alcoholic on this one). I'm not sure how a "live on pizza" type is likely to, while under the influence of pizza, turn violent toward family members, crash his/her car, lose judgment sufficiently to engage in sexual indiscretions, etc. (Side note on DUI car crashes, from police: the DUI driver is more likely to walk away than his/her victim.)

Tobacco can also have detrimental effects on people who have to be in the same room with a smoker (and smokers do have a higher risk of setting the house on fire). Addictive, too.

Tea and coffee don't much impact the people around the user, granted, but can be addictive (this from someone who really needs to cut down her caffeinated soft drinks, I must confess).

Also, all the above-named substances can be rather expensive, for negligible at best health benefits, and the resources involved in producing and consuming them could very likely be better directed into more beneficial items.

I'm not too inclined to start hyper-analyzing why the Lord has set the standards He has, since I trust Him to know what's best, what with that omniscience deal. I do worry that things like Mountain Dew and chocolate may wind up on the prohibited list, but if that happens, I'll suck it up and obey.

But, my point is, the entire D&C 89 is supposed to be a commandment now. The Lord set the standards not only for Tobacco and Alcohol but for proper consumption of food as well. He did not say, verses 5 through 9 is a commandment, the rest is just suggestion.

I agree with you on the effects of alcohol and tobacco and caffeine to society. But, I also submit the effects of an unhealthy eating habit is just as detrimental to society, especially in an age of universal healthcare.

Case in point:

My father-in-law has Type 2 diabetes. It is not genetic, it is nothing but a result of being 100 lbs overweight. He used to drink half a gallon of soda a day. His family suffers for his choice of nutrition both emotionally and financially. Of course he has a temple recommend and held stake leadership positions.

On the other hand:

Just because a person drinks doesn't make them abusers. Go to Italy and France and you'll see what I mean. Wine is part of the meal. My entire Catholic family are responsible social drinkers. My dad works at a beer company. There is no way they can get baptized LDS unless they forsake social drinking. Regardless of whether they are of perfect health, no tendencies of abuse, without any addictions, and in good financial standing.

I am not saying that alcohol and tobacco should be allowed. I'm saying, I don't understand the double-standard of scripture interpretation.

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Yes, I would agree that is an irony.

But how would you propose the church should change the temple requirements? :)

That's for the church leadership to figure out. But, if I'm not mistaken, the temple recommend interview doesn't specify tobacco or alcohol, it only asks if you are following the words of wisdom. It is your responsibility to say NO if you are eating 100 slices of pizza a day, is it not?

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I'm inclined to agree with anatess. If people want to get picky, the WOW doesn't even mention ALCOHOL but 'strong drink'. That could be open to interpretation, too. I could interpret that to mean no spirits, but beers and lagers are fine.

We as members tend to focus on what we SHOULDNT be doin rather than what we SHOULD (Bizarre, really)

Im really into health living. I have ALWAYS wondered how grossly overweight people can get away with saying they live the word of wisdom just because they dont smoke and drink. That is a SMALL part of it. The WOW is a LIFESTYLE not abstinence from substances.

Its scientifically proven as well as in the WOW what we need to be eating. 50% of your plate should be vegetables/salad, a quarter (preferable wholegrain) carbs, and a quarter protein. Bad fats (cakes, biscuits, all hydrogenated and sat fats) should be eaten SPARINGLY. That to me means maybe once or twice a week depending on what it is.

Obviously I am not judging overweight people for their take on the WOW. It is up to them how they interpret it. Its just weird how all we focus on is alcohol, tobacco and tea and coffee when there's so much more in it.

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Anatess,

I think the problem here is you are supposing that all commandments are very rigid and specific, when they are not. Nor are they all of the same weight (pun intended).

We have a minimum standard for certain things, such as tithes = 10%, or WoW means no coffee/tea/tobacco/alcohol. But there are higher levels of both of these commandments: law of consecration and being "prudent" in what we eat and how much we eat.

I agree that a person who sits down to eat 100 normal size pizzas has a WoW problem. The issue is, do we make the bishop's duties so much harder by requiring living the letter of every single law, or do we give people a minimal standard and have them live by the spirit of the law? Personally, I believe the letter killeth, but the "spirit giveth life."

Joseph Smith taught that we teach correct principles and let the people govern themselves. For those who overeat, simply because they have an addiction, do we really want to take each and everyone behind the woodshed? Or is it better to encourage them, and allow each of them to be accountable for their own self stewardship before God? I prefer the latter. And that is how the Church is supposed to work: give us a minimal standard to start with, and then allow each of us to grow spiritually as we prepare ourselves.

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Well we could become like the airlines and require two temple recommends for those with a weight problem.

I mean come on. It is the duty of the Leadership to teach the principles. It is on the member to do their best and be honest in their interview for the TR.

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Haha thats funny moby!

Ur right though-there are more important issues to be focusing on how people intrepret the WOW anyhow. In my opinion anyway. I know people who are drinking and have recommends. I also know people who are child abusers and still go to the temple. There's more important things to be worried about than what someone is drinking.

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Anatess,

I think the problem here is you are supposing that all commandments are very rigid and specific, when they are not. Nor are they all of the same weight (pun intended).

We have a minimum standard for certain things, such as tithes = 10%, or WoW means no coffee/tea/tobacco/alcohol. But there are higher levels of both of these commandments: law of consecration and being "prudent" in what we eat and how much we eat.

I agree that a person who sits down to eat 100 normal size pizzas has a WoW problem. The issue is, do we make the bishop's duties so much harder by requiring living the letter of every single law, or do we give people a minimal standard and have them live by the spirit of the law? Personally, I believe the letter killeth, but the "spirit giveth life."

Joseph Smith taught that we teach correct principles and let the people govern themselves. For those who overeat, simply because they have an addiction, do we really want to take each and everyone behind the woodshed? Or is it better to encourage them, and allow each of them to be accountable for their own self stewardship before God? I prefer the latter. And that is how the Church is supposed to work: give us a minimal standard to start with, and then allow each of us to grow spiritually as we prepare ourselves.

Sorry to sound pig-headed about this, Rame... I see what you're saying, but I don't understand how eating healthy is a higher level of commandment? I would think eating healthy is the easier commandment. I think of WOW in the spiritual sense - where I don't think of it as don't drink this don't smoke that, but more of a, what in the world are you doing, don't you know that's bad for you? That kind of thing.

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