Why Doesn’t God Answer Prayers?

[Maxel]

*sigh* I honestly thought we had gotten past that point.

Possibly. I'm unaware of any conclusion reached, but if I missed one I apologize.

And I'm assuming the "point" that pam meant was the most recent round of offense taken on another thread, not anything older than that. Not trying to start anything...

Edited August 13, 2009 by Maxel

[Gatorman]

Possibly. I'm unaware of any conclusion reached, but if I missed one I apologize.

Maxel - I have not seen a moderator conclusion either. Rather than address the issue, those of us who have taken offense are told to get a thick skin or that our troubled faith is our own issue. This is why I sought out the ignore feature on the forum, as then I am in control of having to listen to those types of posters when the moderators appear to be unable or unwilling to moderate the forums and ensure the rules are adhered to.

[Guest missingsomething]

... and I don't see many people defending the charitable course of action (not tearing down others and their faith).

Well Max.. I cant speak for anyone else, but as for me... when I do make a post like this, I am sent msg's saying I need to ignore people that I dont agree with.... or I my view is "nit-picked" to the point I dont even feel its worth it anymore on here.

But I do agree with you and strive to take the charitable course of action... infact when I first joined, I started a thread (something like clean your own shelf ) where I made that very point.

If it is ok for people to discuss out the details of what everyone else says... then likewise it should be fine for you to question back.

Thank you for the reminder Maxel, that we should be striving to take the "charitable road". Its good for me to be reminded of this.

[pam]

Was that a public posting of issues with moderators on this thread? Or was that meant to be in private. Because heaven forbid a moderator should take issue with this breaking of the rules.

[Maxel]

Can we drop this? I'm sorry I brought it up again. Really, I am.

[Palerider]

since we are all concerned about the rules here and what does and doesn't get moderated....you must also mean yourselves....for the fact that I have allowed your posts to be here since you have all clearly broken rules just now.

Its time to let go....

[Gatorman]

Was that a public posting of issues with moderators on this thread? Or was that meant to be in private. Because heaven forbid a moderator should take issue with this breaking of the rules.

pam - As a moderator, or as a poster, you have been one to suggest that we are at fault for being insulted or otherwise concerned with the posts in question. In other words, you have publically defended the actions of some and as a moderator has stated that there is a conclusion. I merely agreed with Maxel that I had not seen a moderator based conclusion or a change in action and as such, sought a solution of my own, as I can not expect the moderators to address the real issue. No accusations. No issues. Just dealing with the problem myself.

[Guest missingsomething]

since we are all concerned about the rules here and what does and doesn't get moderated....you must also mean yourselves....for the fact that I have allowed your posts to be here since you have all clearly broken rules just now.

Its time to let go....

Pale,

To whom are you referring?

[Palerider]

Pale,

To whom are you referring?

read the rules....then read the posts....you will see what I am talking about

[pam]

pam - As a moderator, or as a poster, you have been one to suggest that we are at fault for being insulted or otherwise concerned with the posts in question. In other words, you have publically defended the actions of some and as a moderator has stated that there is a conclusion. I merely agreed with Maxel that I had not seen a moderator based conclusion or a change in action and as such, sought a solution of my own, as I can not expect the moderators to address the real issue. No accusations. No issues. Just dealing with the problem myself.

That's twice now in the same thread you have chosen to publically voice issues you have with a moderator which is against the rules.

[Gatorman]

That's twice now in the same thread you have chosen to publically voice issues you have with a moderator which is against the rules.

As you wish

[Guest missingsomething]

Yes, I do beleive that at times non-answers may be the answer.

Yes, my fretting,

Frowning child,

I could cross

The room to you

More easily.

But I’ve already

Learned to walk,

So I make you

Come to me.

Let go now—

There!

You see?

Oh, remember

This simple lesson,

Child,

And when

In later years

You cry out

With tight fists

And tears—

“Oh, help me,

God—please.”—

Just listen

And you’ll hear

A silent voice:

“I would, child,

I would.

But it’s you,

Not I,

Who needs to try

Godhood.”

(Carol Lynn Pearson, Beginnings, Provo: Trilogy Arts, 1967, p. 18.)

As presented by Elder Packer in a 1975 Fireside

Ryan the more I get to know you the more you inspire me.

[Guest Believer_1829]

Just to add..I do have to agree with Snow. If some anonymous person on the internet can completely undermine our faith and testimony..then it wasn't that strong to begin with.

That is one of the most callous things I have read on here.

Rom. 14: 13

13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a astumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother’s way.

[Snow]

Come now, Snow. Surely you understand that calling someone's opinions "dogmatic" because said opinions are based on scripture amounts to tearing down the other's faith- as does making almost any condescending remarks aimed at others' opinions based on faith.

So wrong on so many levels...

1. dogmatic: characterized by assertion of unproved or unprovable principles, of or pertaining to or characteristic of a doctrine or code of beliefs accepted as authoritative.

Referring to dogma as dogma is not tearing down someone's opinion. It is a statement of fact. I too have a religious belief system based on dogma. My view of soteriology, for example, is entirely dogmatic. The problem is not that your (one's) religion is dogmatic. The problem is where one adheres to dogma in matters outside the realm of faith where substantial evidence exists to the contrary.

Remember that faith is a belief in thing that are unseen and true. Believing, for example, that the continents separated some 5000 years ago is not faith - it's just a bad idea in your head.

2. You condescension claim it way off base. First, if you read the posts, you'll see that I've been pretty much neutral in my posts to the poster. Second, It takes two to play that game. There must needs be a condescender and a condescendee. You, by way of illustration, could not condescend to me is a million years. Why? Because I am 1. an adult, and 2. an agent unto myself.

[Snow]

That is one of the most callous things I have read on here.

Rom. 14: 13

13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a astumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother’s way.

One of the MOST CALLOUS?

Oh please - let's drop the melodrama and post like real people.

[Guest missingsomething]

More tear are shed over answered prayers than unansered ones - Mother T.

God's will not mine be done - trust that God knows what is best for us.

we are accountable for what we know.

47 And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.

48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.

(New Testament | Luke 12:47 - 48)

we are given what we are able/mature enough to act upon. If we cannot act on it, if the knowledge would condemn us, it is merciful that it is not given to us.

Changed - very good points... and yes, I liked the Mother Teresa quote. My mother used to always say, be careful what you pray for- God may just answer it.

Edited August 13, 2009 by missingsomething

[Guest missingsomething]

That is one of the most callous things I have read on here.

Rom. 14: 13

13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a astumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother’s way.

Well if we were all perfect we 1) wouldnt go about doing anything that MAY offend... and 2) we wouldnt offend therefore 3) there wouldnt be any offended. :)

[pam]

That is one of the most callous things I have read on here.

Rom. 14: 13

13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a astumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother’s way.

Thank you. That is one of the nicest things someone has said to me on this site in a long time.

[Snow]

I did not read the entire thread, but in case it has not yet been said...

you assume that getting the job is the best thing for them. Perhaps they are a work-a-holic who value nothing but money, that they are prideful, have abandoned their family for the job.

or like another in my ward, perhaps right after they were laid off a relative got sick, and they needed the time off work to be free to go and help them.

etc. etc.

More tears are shed over answered prayers than unanswered ones- Mother T.

God's will not mine be done - trust that God knows what is best for us.

Well there you go - no matter what answer comes or doesn't come, yes - no - or indifferent, absurd or not, it's always the right answer. Makes things very neat and tidy. [sarcasm intended]

If someone needs comfort, they will recieve comfort, in or out of the church.

Could you then explain those that need comfort and DON'T get it?

there is a different reason for each amputee - we are all tried/tested with something. I would prefer a trial of living as an amputee than living with the death of a child, or living with rebellious/evil family members as an example.

amputees can inspire us:

watch this vid:

did you watch it? watch it:

this person has changed the lives of counless people. He was able to inspire because he is an amputee. If he can live with hope, then so can everyone else. Those who overcome much inspire much. Handicapps are given to show us how strong we really are.

That's nice. Let's stay on point shall we? Is it your claim that God heals some people (for whatever reason) but that he refuses to heal amputees because he wants them to inspire others?

Seriously?

we are accountable for what we know.

No, seriously - can we please stay on point?

[Snow]

Hi,

Just out of curiosity, Snow, how would you answer your own questions, satisfactorily? (It would be good to know in the event that I am assigned as home teacher of any "Snow" present in my ward.)

Cheers,

Kawazu

That's a fair question - I don't know and as many here do know, I ask these types of questions here to move my thinking along hopefully gains greater understanding... but here's a rough and unfinished thought:

It is screamingly obvious that in many matters God stays our of our way and lets us as individuals and as the body of Christ work out our own salvation. It seems reasonable that God answers some prayers, and comforts some who need comfort, and may even supernaturally intercede is man's affairs (miracles) but often does not. That is indisputable.

What also seems beyond dispute is that people mistakenly attribute all sorts of things to God and have crafted their own belief system such that whatever happens, they can always attribute the outcome to God, I got a car, I didn't get a car; God supernaturally intervened to cause the prospective employer to hire me when he/she otherwise would not have - over someone else (who may have also been praying) who would have otherwise got the job; God told me evolution was true, or told me that it was untrue, that Mormonism is keen or that Methodism or Islam is the way to go.

Whatever is or isn't going on, the promise of John 14:13 "And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son." cannot be understood literally or taken at face value.

[pam]

Hey I asked that question way back in this thread. How come I didn't get an answer? haha

[Snow]

Hey I asked that question way back in this thread. How come I didn't get an answer? haha

You are not a good tipper.

[Gatorman]

What also seems beyond dispute is that people mistakenly attribute all sorts of things to God and have crafted their own belief system such that whatever happens, they can always attribute the outcome to God

I am one of those people. I am one of those people who attributes every good thing in his life, every blessing, every trial, the growth from those trials, etc, to Heavenly Father. Everything is in his name.

Mosiah - Chapter 4 - Verse 19

19 For behold, are we not all abeggars? Do we not all depend upon the same Being, even God, for all the substance which we have, for both food and raiment, and for gold, and for silver, and for all the riches which we have of every kind?

Mosiah - Chaper 4 - Verse 21

21 And now, if God, who has created you, on whom you are dependent for your lives and for all that ye have and are, doth grant unto you whatsoever ye ask that is right, in faith, believing that ye shall receive, O then, how ye ought to aimpart of the substance that ye have one to another.

[Kawazu]

That's a fair question - I don't know and as many here do know, I ask these types of questions here to move my thinking along hopefully gains greater understanding... but here's a rough and unfinished thought:

It is screamingly obvious that in many matters God stays our of our way and lets us as individuals and as the body of Christ work out our own salvation. It seems reasonable that God answers some prayers, and comforts some who need comfort, and may even supernaturally intercede is man's affairs (miracles) but often does not. That is indisputable.

What also seems beyond dispute is that people mistakenly attribute all sorts of things to God and have crafted their own belief system such that whatever happens, they can always attribute the outcome to God, I got a car, I didn't get a car; God supernaturally intervened to cause the prospective employer to hire me when he/she otherwise would not have - over someone else (who may have also been praying) who would have otherwise got the job; God told me evolution was true, or told me that it was untrue, that Mormonism is keen or that Methodism or Islam is the way to go.

Whatever is or isn't going on, the promise of John 14:13 "And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son." cannot be understood literally or taken at face value.

So you would appreciate your home teacher to offer the answer, "There is no answer," as opposed to a pleasant anecdote? Also, how do you square John 14 with contrary evidence presented in observable reality?

If this is not too personal, do you mind sharing why you are a Latter-Day Saint instead of an atheist or an agnostic? Usually, people with strong convictions that the Scriptures do not correlate well with what actually occurs in the world tend to retire the religious experience.

Thanks.

Regards,

Kawazu

[Maxel]

Snow, I will here admit that my recent interactions with you have been largely defensive as a hold-over from months ago- for that, I apologize. I haven't been around nearly as much in the intervening time and if you changed your attitude in that time I missed it. I want to stress my apology: I fear that I've been defensive without cause and my vision is clouded regarding you.

1. dogmatic: characterized by assertion of unproved or unprovable principles, of or pertaining to or characteristic of a doctrine or code of beliefs accepted as authoritative.

Referring to dogma as dogma is not tearing down someone's opinion. It is a statement of fact. I too have a religious belief system based on dogma. My view of soteriology, for example, is entirely dogmatic. The problem is not that your (one's) religion is dogmatic. The problem is where one adheres to dogma in matters outside the realm of faith where substantial evidence exists to the contrary.

Remember that faith is a belief in thing that are unseen and true. Believing, for example, that the continents separated some 5000 years ago is not faith - it's just a bad idea in your head.

Snow, you're sidestepping the real issue. The way you use "dogma" and "dogmatic" (or have in the past) is usually as an insult used to attack those whose opinions concerning God are different than yours. However, I admit this was as of 4 months ago so you might not do that anymore- I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here.

2. You condescension claim it way off base. First, if you read the posts, you'll see that I've been pretty much neutral in my posts to the poster.

I wasn't just talking about this thread. You've been pretty brutal to Believer on another thread. Doesn't matter if he 'started it', was being blind to the evidence, whatever- the fact remains that you said some things that were rude and condescending..

Second, It takes two to play that game. There must needs be a condescender and a condescendee. You, by way of illustration, could not condescend to me is a million years. Why? Because I am 1. an adult, and 2. an agent unto myself.

I'm unclear as to the thrust of your claim. Are you saying that one cannot condescend to another unless the condescendee submits/is, in fact, crucially inferior to the condescendor? Or that an action cannot be condescending in nature unless the previously stated parameters are met? Or that an action cannot be perceived as condescending unless the stated parameters are met? Or that a condescending action cannot harm the condescendee's faith? I don't know how to properly understand your claim until I know a bit more- and I am interested in finding out what you believe concerning this topic.

To clarify my statement: acting condescending to another when discussing matters of faith is damaging to the condescendee's faith- or at the very least, their soul. Whether the condescendee's faith can handle it, whether the condescendee is gracious and perfectly humble in their response and reaction, the fact is that the condescendee has been hurt by the condescender, and the condescendee's faith may very easily be damaged.