Elder Dallin H. Oaks (Sat pm session)

[pam]

Amazing..his talk is hitting on so many of the debates we have had on this site in the past.

[Connie]

I absolutely loved it! And you're right, pam, i was thinking the exact same thing as i listened.

[beefche]

Amazing..his talk is hitting on so many of the debates we have had on this site in the past.

Don't you know, pam, that the GAs lurk here to get ideas for their talks?

[Traveler]

Elder Oaks has some very interesting qualifications in speaking on the subject of law. He was working as a justice of the Utah Supreme Court when he was called as an Apostle of the L-rd Jesus Christ. He was also a considered candidate for future appointments to the Supreme Court of the United States of America. In the past he has spoken of the call to Apostleship as the greater calling.

Undergirding his remarks, for me was an interesting link between law and love. His remarks were very explicit that G-d gives us laws only out of and because of his great love for us and that law is not given to benefit him so much as to benefit mankind.

Although he touched on the subject, I believe it could have had more emphasizes – that is that being obedient to law is also linked to our love of G-d. I believe that as a person practices and participates in G-d’s laws that they must and will engender greater love and appreciation both to the law giver and all others that live according to that law. Thus it is that all that can abide a Celestial law will abide a Celestial Kingdom and will love doing so with all their heart, might, mind and strength.

The final point is one I believe is lost to many Christians and some LSD is that when considering justice surrounding the Laws of G-d that such things are not in conflict with the mercies of G-d.

In short – I believe this talk to be one of the more significant conference talks directly impacting doctrine and the better understanding of doctrine associated with the Laws of G-d

The Traveler

[Misshalfway]

This is interesting to me, Traveler, as I had a conversation about this on another site. The person I was talking to said that "the more one lives the law of love, the more the rules fade away."

I was thinking about that and feel to completely disagree with it simply because of what the BofM says about how God must obey law or he ceases to be God. In my mind, it is the obedience of eternal principles that helps us become the ultimate definitions of love and the capacities that come with it.

I love to watch the "Iron Chef" on the food network. It always amazes me how these chef's can be given any secret ingredient and then are able to craft such beautiful cusine. How do they do it without the recipe? It must be like that with God too. Perhaps it is the recipe's that fall away as one really understands the principles and knows how to obey them in any context.

[Just_A_Guy]

My thought during this talk was "Hmm. So the GA's are listening to Affirmation."

[Traveler]

This is interesting to me, Traveler, as I had a conversation about this on another site. The person I was talking to said that "the more one lives the law of love, the more the rules fade away."

I was thinking about that and feel to completely disagree with it simply because of what the BofM says about how God must obey law or he ceases to be God. In my mind, it is the obedience of eternal principles that helps us become the ultimate definitions of love and the capacities that come with it.

I love to watch the "Iron Chef" on the food network. It always amazes me how these chef's can be given any secret ingredient and then are able to craft such beautiful cusine. How do they do it without the recipe? It must be like that with God too. Perhaps it is the recipe's that fall away as one really understands the principles and knows how to obey them in any context.

Misshalfway: I appreciate your comments a great deal. I tend to look at things a little differently than what you touch on in your post – but I came to the same conclusion. To me this is a very important conformation of truth so I am very thankful for your post.

I view law in the same way I view mathematics and the principles that govern mathematics. The more we learn about the true principles of mathematics and the more we apply those principles the “easer” it becomes to solve problems and advance our capabilities (wisdom and knowledge) in mathematics. I do not believe that rules fade away but instead become tools giving us great freedom in solving problems we face.

I believe G-d is a master at law and uses eternal principles and law to accomplish all things that he does. In giving us law and teaching us line upon line upon line and precept upon precept upon precept we learn and by practice and experience we becomes masters with G-d of the knowledge and craft.

The Traveler

[Traveler]

My thought during this talk was "Hmm. So the GA's are listening to Affirmation."

Would you explain in more detail?

The Traveler

[Just_A_Guy]

One of the frequent saws you hear out of Affirmation (the gay Mormon group that sees homosexuality as "something to celebrate") is that God's love trumps any Old-Testament-style laws.

From a theological standpoint, Elder Oaks decimated that argument. I don't think it was coincidence.