I Am Unsure

[Christos]

When I first went to the LDS church near me and had the missionaries round I accepted everything but then I started studying my bible and kept coming across the false prophet.

The one who would come after Christ and decieve many before the end time.

The one who would appear to be a sheep but is in fact a wolf (metaphorically).

I decided that I needed a lot more time to work out the truth, it was nothing to be rushed into, being baptised.

I have asked the missionaries to get me a whole collection of the scriptures because I don't feel that I could be baptised without having a decent understantding of latter day doctrine.

I decided to give up the word of wisdom as I came to the conclusion that Joseph Smith is the false prophet but now I am questioning it again. (It was only tea and coffee, nothing else)

That very day I felt guilty yet I did not know why, the reason being I believed Smith to be a false prophet.

I am currently finding it hard to distinguish what is right from what is wrong and I could really do with your help.

Although I do not believe the churh of J.C. of L.D.S. to be true I neither believe it to be false.

I think the hardest thing for me to accept is probably the Apostacy, the idea that God would give his only son and then years later turn his back to the world is horrific.

[BenRaines]

Christos,

I am short on time but would like to discuss this further in the forum at a little later date. Maybe even tonight.

I don't believe that Heavenly Father deserted mankind but mankind rejected his son and turned from him.

What Christ offered in his birth and death went beyond the immediate to the eternal. An eternal plan is long reaching and not just for the moment, a few years or even mortality.

I will discuss further in the future.

[Christos]

Thanks for the reply.

I don't believe that mankind actually did reject Jesus as the messiah.

Inevitably the apostles died but the believers, the Christians continued on.

The very end of the Gospel according to St Matthew goes:

16Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, into a mountain where Jesus had appointed them.

17And when they saw him, they worshipped him: but some doubted.

18And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

19Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

20Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Jesus gave permission for these people to baptise. Surely it was the ones who were baptised who would continue on the church.

If it was neessary the apostles would have appointed further apostles but as I know so far they didn't.

[BenRaines]

You are correct that the Apostles did not call and ordain many after the time of Christ. As I have studied it they went on their way and went about preaching and organizing the church as established by Christ and as taught to them by Christ.

As often happens when anything new is taught if not refreshed and reviewed on a regular basis it is easy to fall back to the old ways and to old habits. This is what I believe happened with the church as established by Christ. LDS are not the only ones that believe that church has strayed from the original form established by Christ but the only one that teaches that it was necessary for a restoration of all things.

John Wesley and Martin Luther were looking for that restoration of all things but never claimed to have had it happen or experienced it. They were looking for it.

[Josie]

Christos,

If you will search the scriptures further, you will find that these 11 were baptized and called to teach of Christ by him. They did not have a chance to give their Priesthood to others to carry on their work, because each was killed by people rejecting Christ and his teaching, as well as any others they did call. This is what brought the Apostasy, because all of those bearing the Priesthood of God were killed off and no one was left to carry on the authority. When all the leaders of the church, which is what the Apostles were, were gone, there was no one to lead the people and the people wondered away to other things and forgot the gospel and the Lord.

If we were to have the gospel at all, the Lord had to raise up a prophet to restore the Priesthood(power to act in his name) back to the earth and this was done through Joseph Smith. Because God's word was basically lost when the Apostles were killed, someone had to once again be given the word so that they could teach us.

Christos, if the Book of Mormon is true, then Joseph Smith is a prophet and if it is not, then he is not a prophet. The only way to find out for yourself if it is true, is to read it and then pray earnestly about what you have read and let God let you know if it is true. You will know he is answering you by the way you feel when you are moved upon by the Holy Ghost to let you know the answer to your prayer. It probably won't be someone appearing to you and telling you it is true, it probably will be like it is for the most of us, when we pray to ask God if something is true and we are given a wonderful warm assurance and peace that it is true. I have received that assurance and have never found anything to make me doubt the validity of Joseph Smith as a prophet or the truthfulness of the Book of Mormon.

We each have to get that answer for ourselves. BenRaines will be great to answer your questions and help you understand so many of these things that you have brought up. I hope this has just gave you alittle to think about while you wait for him to answer your questions.

[Guest ToasterOfen]

Originally posted by BenRaines@Dec 29 2005, 04:38 PM

As often happens when anything new is taught if not refreshed and reviewed on a regular basis it is easy to fall back to the old ways and to old habits.  This is what I believe happened with the church as established by Christ.  LDS are not the only ones that believe that church has strayed from the original form established by Christ but the only one that teaches that it was necessary for a restoration of all things.

John Wesley and Martin Luther were looking for that restoration of all things but never claimed to have had it happen or experienced it.  They were looking for it.

←

The bible to this day has many different translations. The LDS church in the United States uses the King James version of the bible; in Germany, they use the Lutheran translation (even the LDS use it, because that is what Germans are familiar with); and other countries and other religions use other versions as well. Adding to what Ben said, over the years and centuries, the truth became "watered down", shall we say. If you have ever played the "telephone game" (I think someone may mentioned it in another post), you know that by the time the story gets down to the 10th or so person, it barely resembles the original, if at all. The same thing happened with scripture. It became changed along the way, sometimes accidentally, sometimes purposefully. But either way, it became changed. There was some truth left, but not much.

And, countries and men become corrupt. For centuries, people were not allowed to worship how they wished, or were even allowed to question. If you did, you were killed. It wasn't until people came to the United States seeking religious freedom that questioning and searching for the truth was allowed.

So then, at that time, when there was a country (the United States) safe enough to allow people to question and seek for truth, that the Lord is able to once again reveal all that had been lost over the centuries. Not all truth was lost, but it had been changed so much by corrupt men, and by time that little of it remained.

I know it's hard to understand why the Lord would let us go so long without the full truth, but as a parent, let me share with you something I have experienced with my own children that may help you understand a bit.

My children are still young, the oldest being 11, the youngest are 3 year-old twins; we try and help them and guide them, but many times they don't want to listen (I hear it only gets as they turn into teenagers) and rebel. Sometimes they are too young to understand and it has to be put in simpler terms; other times, they choose to ignore our counsel. Even before Jesus was crucified, people choose to ignore his counsel, so it isn't surprising that after he died, they choose to ignore him then too.

Anyway, as a parent, sometimes you have to wait until your children are willing to listen before you can talk to them. Sometimes, only one of my children will listen, and the others will ignore me, so it does no good to talk "to the crowd" if only one will head my warning, so I speak to the one (like I believe the Lord did to certain people during the Apostasy). It isn't until I have 2 or 3 of my children who will listen that I bother to speak to "the crowd".

I think the Lord had to wait until more than a few of us would be willing and ready to hear Him again before He was able to come forth in full power and strength. Otherwise, it is like talking to a brick wall... And, if you look at all the countries who were squashing independent religious thought up until that time, the Lord couldn't bring forth the truth on a larger scale until religious freedom was granted to all people in that country. The Lord was preparing a way for it happen...but it was slow and tedious because we, His children, can be head strong and obstinant.

Christos, this is a tough challenge you are going through, knowing what is right...but don't loose hope. Pray with all your might to feel the truth.

Also, stay away from the anti-mormon stuff. You wouldn't ask Sam's Club about the quality or practices of Cosco...they are going to tell you things to try and lead you away, just as Sam's Club doesn't want you shopping at Cosco; that is Satan's way of trying to lure you into unbelief.

My prayers are with you...ask for a blessing, and fast and pray. You are strong and have a purpose, otherwise Satan wouldn't be pulling at you so hard.

[Christos]

Thanks for the posts.

But surely the removal of the priesthood didn't really make too much difference.

One of the most popular verses in the bible state:

John 5:24

24Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

To even believe in Jesus as the messiah is enough to have eternal life. It is this belief that saves us.

If there was only one man and a bible left in a far and distant place would he perish because he never got the baptism by the priesthood?

He Believes in Jesus as the messiah, he has studied the word in great depth but is still sent to the abyss for not being baptised, surely this is wrong.

Martin Luther and John Wesley were around in the period of the Apostacy, are they saved through their faith? Through the grace of God?

Is this where the heirarchy comes in?

The Terrestial, the Tellestial and the Celestial?

Those who do greater works for the lord are rewarded greater? I believe in this as Christian doctrine for Christ did say that he who does good works for the Lord will be rewarded in heaven.

Did the Apostacy stop people from gaining a higher place in heaven but due to some peoples faith they could still get in?

These people would have believed in Jesus as the Messiah but they wouldn't have been baptised under the true authority so they did not have the baptism.

Yet John 5:24 states that it is faith that gets us to eternal life, to heaven.

Baptism is a much older practise than christianity. It is the cleansing of sins. Yet if a man asks for the washing of his sins in the perfect blood of Christ he will surely be cleansed?

It talks in Revelations about those who are worthy for they are washed clean in the blood of the lamb that was slain.

[Josie]

After the Apostles were killed, for the most part, the people did not have the bible. Infact the Bible was not even translated for the people for many many years and when the authority was lost, there was no one left with the word. So the people could not be taught, and as time went on they strayed very far from the gospel of Jesus Christ.

None of us have a right to condemn anyone because they have or have not been baptized or received or not received the gospel. It is Jesus Christ that is our judge and not any of us. His atonement provided for our remission of sins if we choose to be obedient to his counsel. We will be judged upon our knowledge of the gospel and not our lack of it, due to no fault of our own.

Baptism is an earthly ordinance that will be provided for all who are taught the gospel, living or dead, and accept it. It is a practice that has been practiced since ancient times to provide for those who have died without the gospel. We belong to a loving God that cares of us all and provides a way back for all that will accept it. See 1 Corinthians 15:29 Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead crise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?

[Amphiblitz]

Originally posted by Christos@Dec 29 2005, 05:59 PM

If there was only one man and a bible left in a far and distant place would he perish because he never got the baptism by the priesthood?

He Believes in Jesus as the messiah, he has studied the word in great depth but is still sent to the abyss for not being baptised, surely this is wrong.

I am not very active on this discussion board, so I apologize in advance if I do not return to this thread before it fades. But I would just like to point out a very important gospel truth that may shed a great deal of light on your questions. To do this, I will simply focus on your baptism question quoted above; however, it can be extended to many of your other questions.

It is important to keep in mind that baptism is a symbol for the death and resurrection of Christ as well as for the washing away of sins through laying down our old life and being brought forth again, taking upon us the name of Christ. Baptism is an outward expression of an inward commitment/covenant.

Would the man in your hypothetical (yet very true to life) story perish? I doubt it. Based on your description of this man, it sounds like he did take upon him Christ's name and made the inward covenant with Him.

This by no means diminishes the importance of the physical act of baptism performed by one commissioned of Christ. Physical symbols sanctioned by God give spiritual concepts a "body" in this physical world and thereby greater efficacy. If one has the chance to obtain baptism (by one with God's authority) one should absolutely do it. There is no need for anyone to judge the man who didn't get this chance. Christ will judge, and I'm sure He will be right.

[Christos]

Thanks everyone.

I was searching for the verse in the bible that talks about how to test a prophet to see if he is a true prophet of God and I have found it.

The King James version is very difficult to read in this instance so I will post the translation I found it in also. The New Living Translation which I find to be an excellent tranlsation, it looses some of the poetry of the KJV in places but it retains most of the original meaning. However I will always cross referance bibles should I be studying a passage.

I use the King James, New International Version, Young's Literal Translation and New Living Translation.

1 John 4:1-3 (K.J.V.)

1Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

2Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

3And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

1 John 4:1-3 (N.L.T.)

1Dear friends, do not believe everyone who claims to speak by the Spirit. You must test them to see if the spirit they have comes from God. For there are many false prophets in the world. 2This is the way to find out if they have the Spirit of God: If a prophet acknowledges that Jesus Christ became a human being, that person has the Spirit of God. 3If a prophet does not acknowledge Jesus, that person is not from God. Such a person has the spirit of the Antichrist. You have heard that he is going to come into the world, and he is already here.

I think this is ample proof for the truth of Joseph Smith.

After the Apostles were killed, for the most part, the people did not have the bible. Infact the Bible was not even translated for the people for many many years and when the authority was lost, there was no one left with the word. So the people could not be taught, and as time went on they strayed very far from the gospel of Jesus Christ.

True as that may be, the gospels were kept through tongue. But these people who kept the gospel had excellent memory.

Also there have been more accounts of the gospel found which were written nearer the time than the gospels in the bible.

These are known as the Gnostic gospels and I believe they should be included in the bible. They do not go against the gospel but rather fulfill what has already been said and in some cases sees the same events from a different view. The Gospel according to St Thomas is my favourite Gospel account followed closely by the Gospel according to St John.

Also we should believe the gospel for it holds vital truths, also the sermon on the mount is almost identical to the sermon Christ teaches in the Americas.

[Christos]

I will be going to church this Sunday (New Years Day).

I am feeling an urge however to leave my home tomorrow, on my bike and to go out into the country where there are no distractions, there I will find the truth.

I do not know where I will go, it will have to be local as the days are short and there are no lights in the country.

I just find that there are too many distractions in the city and at home.

Only then the distractions will be myself, nature and God.

[BenRaines]

I often left my house and went out to the woods to pray and find a quiet time. Good luck on your search. Only you can do it for yourself.

[Setheus]

Originally posted by Christos@Dec 29 2005, 05:59 PM

To even believe in Jesus as the messiah is enough to have eternal life. It is this belief that saves us.

←

So what you're saying is that I can kill all the men of your villiage, rape the horses and ride off on the women, and STILL go to heaven as long as I believe that Jesus is the Messiah and Lamb of God. After all, even our fallen brother Satan will attest to you that Jesus is the Only Begotten Son of the Living God. Yet, oddly enough he isnt allowed into His Kingdom.

[begood2]

Originally posted by Setheus+Dec 30 2005, 07:00 PM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-Christos@Dec 29 2005, 05:59 PM

To even believe in Jesus as the messiah is enough to have eternal life. It is this belief that saves us.

←

So what you're saying is that I can kill all the men of your village, rape the horses and ride off on the women, and STILL go to heaven as long as I believe that Jesus is the Messiah and Lamb of God. After all, even our fallen brother Satan will attest to you that Jesus is the Only Begotten Son of the Living God. Yet, oddly enough he isn't allowed into His Kingdom.

←

Setheus,

What was in that root beer you were drinking? I think that your mind got ahead of your typing...you might want to edit your post. :)

If you're talking about "raping horses / riding off on women", then I meant what I typed. Its a quote from a movie. And if thats not it, what would you have me to edit?

Setheus was here X

LOL Setheus,

I guess I just didn't understand.

[Christos]

Originally posted by Setheus+Dec 31 2005, 02:00 AM-->

<!--QuoteBegin-Christos@Dec 29 2005, 05:59 PM

To even believe in Jesus as the messiah is enough to have eternal life. It is this belief that saves us.

←

So what you're saying is that I can kill all the men of your villiage, rape the horses and ride off on the women, and STILL go to heaven as long as I believe that Jesus is the Messiah and Lamb of God. After all, even our fallen brother Satan will attest to you that Jesus is the Only Begotten Son of the Living God. Yet, oddly enough he isnt allowed into His Kingdom.

←

May I just say that in the eyes of God all sins are equally condemnable. To sin is to fall short of the perfection of goodness.

Yes Satan does believe in Jesus, why wouldn't he? Satan fears Jesus immensly, it is Jesus who Satan hates the most yet he holds great fear for Jesus. Ever want to get Satan off your back? Read him a few verses from the bible (or scriptures) .

Tell him to flee and if that doesn't work remind him of Jesus, he will then realise the battle is lost and will leave.

As long as you have washed your sins in the blood of Christ (atonement) you are freed from sin. You may enter heaven.

The only sin that is unforgivable is to blaspheme against the holy spirit.

I haven't had a single eye shutter of sleep all night, I am up this morning as if I slept the night before. I have been studying the bible.

About the priesthood:

1Peter 2:1-5

1Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, all evil speakings,

2As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:

3If so be ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious.

4To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious,

5Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

The Priesthood is those who believe in Christ.

I know it isn't looked on highly to use other translations than the 1611 King James Version but I find it useful to use modern translations as a means of clarification.

N.L.T.

Verses 4-5

4Come to Christ, who is the living cornerstone of God's temple. He was rejected by the people, but he is precious to God who chose him.

5And now God is building you, as living stones, into his spiritual temple. What's more, you are God's holy priests, who offer the spiritual sacrifices that please him because of Jesus Christ.

And the most literal translation of he bible, translated in the 19th century by Young. Young's Literal Translation.

Young translated the bible word for word trying to get the most accurate version and here is the the fourth and fifth verse again:

4to whom coming -- a living stone -- by men, indeed, having been disapproved of, but with God choice, precious,

5and ye yourselves, as living stones, are built up, a spiritual house, a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.

I do not mean to cause offence but I think I might be better to leave for a while. It seems to be that the bible is the only scriptures necessary. No other scripture is necessary. Sure you could read the apocrypha and te Gnostic Gospels (which I have) but it all goes back to the bible. What is written in the Gnostic Gospels does not derive from the message of the good news thus not going against Galatians 1:6-9.

6I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:

7Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.

8But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

9As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

.

Should the truth be revealed to me in the form of the restoration of the church through Joseph Smith I will not ignore it, but I haven't felt the truth, only the urge to explore more.

Jesus said in John 14:6

6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

This pretty much sums it up for me. Jesus is the truth, the life and the way. It is only through him that we can obtain eternal life.

[Guest sugarbay]

Originally posted by begood2+Dec 30 2005, 07:30 PM-->

Originally posted by Setheus@Dec 30 2005, 07:00 PM

<!--QuoteBegin-Christos@Dec 29 2005, 05:59 PM

To even believe in Jesus as the messiah is enough to have eternal life. It is this belief that saves us.

←

So what you're saying is that I can kill all the men of your village, rape the horses and ride off on the women, and STILL go to heaven as long as I believe that Jesus is the Messiah and Lamb of God. After all, even our fallen brother Satan will attest to you that Jesus is the Only Begotten Son of the Living God. Yet, oddly enough he isn't allowed into His Kingdom.

←

Setheus,

What was in that root beer you were drinking? I think that your mind got ahead of your typing...you might want to edit your post. :)

If you're talking about "raping horses / riding off on women", then I meant what I typed. Its a quote from a movie. And if thats not it, what would you have me to edit?

Setheus was here X

LOL Setheus,

I guess I just didn't understand.

←

There's no need to understand. He is who he is. Accept and love him or don't, but I will tell you that you are missing out on a very interesting person with great insight, a quick mind and rapier sharp wit. B)

[Lindy]

Originally posted by Christos@Dec 29 2005, 03:43 PM

I think the hardest thing for me to accept is probably the Apostacy, the idea that God would give his only son and then years later turn his back to the world is horrific.

←

Christos...that was something that bothered me as a youth myself...that God would turn His back on the world without blinking an eye. It was finding out about the BoM and so many other things I didn't know as a youth, that helped open my eyes and my mind to things I never thought of before.

I agree that you need to get away and think...with an open heart and open mind.

Good Luck :)

[Setheus]

Originally posted by sugarbay+Dec 31 2005, 09:39 AM-->

Originally posted by begood2@Dec 30 2005, 07:30 PM

Originally posted by Setheus@Dec 30 2005, 07:00 PM

<!--QuoteBegin-Christos@Dec 29 2005, 05:59 PM

To even believe in Jesus as the messiah is enough to have eternal life. It is this belief that saves us.

←

So what you're saying is that I can kill all the men of your village, rape the horses and ride off on the women, and STILL go to heaven as long as I believe that Jesus is the Messiah and Lamb of God. After all, even our fallen brother Satan will attest to you that Jesus is the Only Begotten Son of the Living God. Yet, oddly enough he isn't allowed into His Kingdom.

←

Setheus,

What was in that root beer you were drinking? I think that your mind got ahead of your typing...you might want to edit your post. :)

If you're talking about "raping horses / riding off on women", then I meant what I typed. Its a quote from a movie. And if thats not it, what would you have me to edit?

Setheus was here X

LOL Setheus,

I guess I just didn't understand.

←

There's no need to understand. He is who he is. Accept and love him or don't, but I will tell you that you are missing out on a very interesting person with great insight, a quick mind and rapier sharp wit. B)

←

Sugar I scraped my knee today......

when I fell for you.

[Jason]

Originally posted by Setheus@Dec 30 2005, 07:00 PM

So what you're saying is that I can kill all the men of your villiage, rape the horses and ride off on the women....

The Three Amigos, right?

[Setheus]

None other than Jason! LOL Outstanding. Steve Martin, Chevy Chase.....and a third halrious guy who's name I can never remember right off.

The Three Amigos.

[Guest sugarbay]

Originally posted by Setheus@Dec 31 2005, 03:53 PM

None other than Jason! LOL Outstanding.  Steve Martin, Chevy Chase.....and a third halrious guy who's name I can never remember right off.

The Three Amigos.

←

Martin Short. B)

[begood2]

←

There's no need to understand. He is who he is. Accept and love him or don't, but I will tell you that you are missing out on a very interesting person with great insight, a quick mind and rapier sharp wit. B)

←

sugarbay,

You don't need to worry....I know that Setheus is a interesting and witty person. I suppose that I've led a fairly sheltered life so far. I actually thought that Setheus had made a mistake since I have never seen the movie, "The Three Amigos".

The only thing that really bothers me is how he gets all the women in his corner. Thank goodness my girlfriend doesn't know him or I'd probably have to fight to keep her.

Now maybe if I could think up lines like this...I would have some of his irresistible charm to the women. PS Happy New Year to All

Sugar I scraped my knee today......

when I fell for you.

←

[Guest Gilvisto]

What's up lately Christos? I'd like to know what you decide.

Still prayin' for you.

-Val out

[Christos]

I have just logged onto this forum again because I have had a terrible day.

I slept 19 hours, thus missing school entirely , the worst bit is that I now feel like midnight is midday .

Any way I had a dream:

I have always believed that dreams are more than just fantasies but here is my dream. It is so vivid I could draw it in pictures for you.

Stuff written in italics was not in the dream but may be a reflection or a commentary of the dream.

I was with my family, including my dad who was divorced over 5 years ago.

We were leaving an amusement park and walked to the carpark instead of taking the monorail.

My mum had an argument with my dad and my sister went missing.

It turned out that my sister went to live in the church.

(I have been praying a lot for my sister so this might be a prophecy of her acceptance of Christ).

I went to the church in which my sister was living in.

There were three churches.

One huge gothic cathedral-like church in a sandstone colour. Immense in height and beauty.

That is strange, I just looked up "Sandstone cathedral" on google and got "Ripon Cahedral" which is a cathedral which looks very similar to that in my dream and is very near to where we live.

There was also two other churches, one small white church, and another fancy cathedral in which lived my sister.

These three churches (don't ask me why there were three of them, I guess it might be to do with the three temples or it might simply be because three is a nice number) were all stood by the coast, all next to each other. With the small simple white church in the middle of the two towering cathedrals.

The other large cathedral was white, and was similar to either Westminster abbey or the Salt lake temple. I remember mainly on the outside of this cathedral like building that it had a series of six domed pinacles at the east facade.

(I think we all know what the Salt lake temple looks like )

In between these two great cathedral like buildings was a smaller building. Similar to this:

My sister was letting people in the church and then when I entered it was the time to close the church. The people would not leave.

After walking round with her we walked onto the roof of that church. And we looked out onto the sea, there were many ships there.

There were many people on the roof also.

It was on the roof that I saw the six white domed pinacles.

End of dream.

I'm not sure what this dream meant or if it was relevant but the three churches could mean the trinity.

The small white church could symbolise the small church of the chosen few of Jesus Christ. Jesus was a humble man so his church isn't on a huge scale like that of the other two, also he was clothed in white after the transfiguration as well as white being the colour of righteousness.

The other two churches were immense in comparison and could describe God and the holy spirit.

There were many people in the large white cathedral-like building.

I think this is probably very irrelevent to this topic.

But I have many dreams and can see and remember them very well.

When I prayed for a pagan friend of mine to accept Christ I had a dream where I went with him into the new jerusalem so he could talk to a man. The very next day in reality he had left paganism. And thought of it as a waste of his life.

I still do however think that I am going to stay away from the church of LDS just for the time being.

God has called me to many places, showed me many things and showered me with many gifts.

I don't want to do something out of my own heart, I submit myself to his command.

[Guest Gilvisto]

Don't leave it like that, Christos.

You tasted truth, and you liked it for awhile.

Satan tries his hardest to stop you now.

If you do decide to leave... think kinder on our religion next time.

After these testimonies come the testimonies of fire and of tempest. (It's in 3rd Nephi... but I will only paraphrase)

I'm not saying you'll die soon or anything... but this world is a crazy place. Bad things happen all the time.

Find the truth, Christos. Look hard and look deep. It's closer than you think. You've already taken your first steps... and here is where you are most vernerable. It is here you must not turn back.

I'd be glad to help you with any questions... and if you wish it, I will accompany you on this journey.

Know this though... that the path you started to walk was one of truth, and mightier beings than I will support you.

Sincerly,

Val