The People before Adam


Moksha
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I think you are assuming a lot. That is my opinion. My understanding is his voice sounds way different than ours ... rushing water, thunderous ... I believe there are several different descriptions that sound different from ours with the exception of those people that have been transfigured and have had visions after transfiguration, then that is a totally different issue.

More like 'rushing waves'.

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Descriptions of the first vision or any visions of angels tell me we look a lot like God.

I've been told that I have fair skin, but definitely not described as a brightness that defies all description. I think a broad statement like, "we look a lot like God" is accepted by all of us. But that is different than claiming that God has a nose or a voice box. Would you say He has a liver too? to sift out toxins in the bloodstream? Specifics about His body are speculation at this point. Visions are just that, visions that a human being can interpret, which includes visual information that our brains can make sense of.

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Visions are just that, visions that a human being can interpret, which includes visual information that our brains can make sense of.

I had thoughts about the same thing before I posted and just now as I'm typing I'm wondering if that might be a bit decieving if that were the case.

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I had thoughts about the same thing before I posted and just now as I'm typing I'm wondering if that might be a bit decieving if that were the case.

Is that any more 'deceptive' than watching a movie about Joseph Smith with some actor representing him or reading the cartoon version of the Book of Mormon to a child?

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Is that any more 'deceptive' than watching a movie about Joseph Smith with some actor representing him or reading the cartoon version of the Book of Mormon to a child?

:confused:

I do not think that is deceptive at all.

Esp. if the depiction is close to the mark.

Edited by JohnnyRudick
Afterthought:-)
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I have Prayed about this and through study it is possible that Adam was a Promised Savior like our Lord or Messiah for some humans , that where not Of the Priest line. Jesus was the LAST ADAM , Since we do not know that much about Adam we have to go on the stories of Jesus. Jesus was Promised For A long period of time. Adam might have been also. Because we see in the Abraham that it does say Periods of time not the usual thousand years time length. Also , in the Pearl of Great Price , we see Adam is of the Priest Line and any of other is not mentioned , like the Jaredites being mentioned in the Bible but only in one verse. The reason according to Hugh Nibley is that the Nation Of Israel Are Shemites , not Hamites , Which the Jaredites are. SO this could be a possibility. That the records we have are about Adam the king and his Line Not the Rest of the Humans families. Just as We are all Sons and Daughters of Abraham , and have access to the Abrahamic Covenant , Through Faith and Obedience not blood . Also the New Covenant , Through Faith and Obedience , Becoming Heirs with Christ, the only Begotten of Heavenly Father in the Flesh. Remember Heavenly Father Does talk in parables about things , through out the scriptures , show why not from the beginning. In Ecclesiastes Solomon , calls the Young Men , cattle and Beast , And through out the scriptures the men are refered to as beast , birds , " Creepy things " even though the beholder , Peter did not know it was man , the Lord was talking about until he was told . We must remember Heavenly Father ways of Explain Things are not our ways. The Lord is the Same Yesterday , Today , And Forever. so how he explains is the same. Now this possible, if we know what he has said to us on his terms , not our understanding .

:viking::viking::viking:

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thats another thread whether or not god is capable to be deceptive at all as we so often are.

marts he is not deceptive. Maybe cunning , smooth , but not deceptive , it is just do not understand why he does what he does some times , remember subtle as a serpent gentle as a dove, and was that a parable in it self.

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Also Isaiah 55 : 6 ¶ Seek ye the Lord while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:

7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the Lord, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

8 ¶ For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.

9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

His word is a two edge sword able to cut right and left , remember . you have to walk through the valley of death . His ways is not always popular to the Majority of the" Righteous " and can make you look like you are crazy to the Wicked.

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Also D&C 1 : 16 They seek not the Lord to establish his righteousness, but every man walketh in his own way, and after the image of his own god, whose image is in the likeness of the world, and whose substance is that of an idol, which waxeth old and shall perish in Babylon, even Babylon the great, which shall fall.

Remember that we as human all ways try to explain it so we understand , and when science goes against what we think God has done we Cry.

That Why God has said in Isaiah 48 : 1 Hear ye this, O house of Jacob, which are called by the name of Israel, and are come forth out of the waters of Judah, which swear by the name of the Lord, and make mention of the God of Israel, but not in truth, nor in righteousness.

2 For they call themselves of the holy city, and stay themselves upon the God of Israel; The Lord of hosts is his name.

3 I have declared the former things from the beginning; and they went forth out of my mouth, and I shewed them; I did them suddenly, and they came to pass.

4 Because I knew that thou art obstinate, and thy neck is an iron sinew, and thy brow brass;

5 I have even from the beginning declared it to thee; before it came to pass I shewed it thee: lest thou shouldest say, Mine idol hath done them, and my graven image, and my molten image, hath commanded them.

6 Thou hast heard, see all this; and will not ye declare it? I have shewed thee new things from this time, even hidden things, and thou didst not know them.

7 They are created now, and not from the beginning; even before the day when thou heardest them not; lest thou shouldest say, Behold, I knew them.

8 Yea, thou heardest not; yea, thou knewest not; yea, from that time that thine ear was not opened: for I knew that thou wouldest deal very treacherously, and wast called a transgressor from the womb.

9 ¶ For my name’s sake will I defer mine anger, and for my praise will I refrain for thee, that I cut thee not off.

10 Behold, I have refined thee, but not with silver; I have chosen thee in the furnace of affliction.

11 For mine own sake, even for mine own sake, will I do it: for how should my name be polluted? and I will not give my glory unto another.

12 ¶ Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last.

13 Mine hand also hath laid the foundation of the earth, and my right hand hath spanned the heavens: when I call unto them, they stand up together.

14 All ye, assemble yourselves, and hear; which among them hath declared these things? The Lord hath loved him: he will do his pleasure on Babylon, and his arm shall be on the Chaldeans.

15 I, even I, have spoken; yea, I have called him: I have brought him, and he shall make his way prosperous.

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There are no indepth descriptions of God the Father. Period. We do not know exactly what he looks like, nor what his physical or spiritual bodies look like. We do not know whether he has a liver, and if he does, what function it may provide in an exalted being.

Remember, our scriptures were generally written long before anyone had any idea what a liver was for. Even in Joseph Smith's day, there was not a lot of knowledge available concerning the human body. Anyone for a good bleeding to get the "humors" and sicknesses out of you?

Egyptians preserved with mummies the internal body parts that they felt were important. However, they sucked the brains out through the nose and tossed them out, as they did not appear to provide any use to the body.Both Jacob and Joseph were mummified, so I would imagine that their brains were not kept....

I can imagine God having a nose, so that he can smell. A mouth to speak and to eat (as the resurrected Jesus did). Ears to hear, and other external body parts as we generally have. Internal organs may be another issue. We understand from Joseph Smith's teachings that resurrected beings have Spirit coursing through their veins, rather than blood. I would suggest he meant the Light of Christ, but he often used terms like this to mean a general group of related things related to light, intelligence and spirit. So, we can think that resurrected beings probably have veins, or something similar that courses through them.

Can Gods eat? Jesus did as a resurrected being, so I guess that is true. Must Gods eat? That is another issue entirely, which has not been determined by prophets. Other ancient beliefs show the Gods eating as a necessity. In some traditions, a god must eat from the Tree of Life, or some other god-life sustaining plant in order to sustain their own life. In many traditions, the gods survive off of the burnt offerings and sacrifices made by humans for them, in a kind of symbiotic relationship: humans provide sustenance to the gods, and the gods then bless the humans.

While traditional Christians believe that God is without "body, parts and passions" and therefore did not literally make us in his image; LDS do take these concepts literally. But how literally must we take them? Is God really the Creator of all things ex nihilo? Is the LDS view of God really one of an almighty Being? Or do LDS teachings of his limited power (i.e., cannot create from nothing, etc) suggest more of an advanced space alien/being, who has sprinkled his genetic seed throughout the galaxy and seeks to have us advance to the next sphere of existence with him? Or is there something in between the traditional all-powerful Spirit and the anthropomorphic holy being LDS call Elohim?

Finally, does it really matter if God has a spleen? Many people on earth live without spleens, appendix, 2/3 of their liver, the second lung or kidney. Hearts are interchangeable. Millions live with birth defects or later tragic loss of limb. Many are brain damaged, blind, deaf, mute. Some do not even look human, or in the image of God.

So, for me, the details do not matter. What matters is that I am here as a spirit child of God, experimenting and learning to use a physical body, so that one day I may fully overcome the flesh and be able to live as God lives. And I am sure that in that glorious day, we shall all look much like God does now. Whether that includes a liver or nose, does not matter. What does matter is that we shall live as God lives, and be as God is.

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I seem to recall a scripture somewhere, I think it was in Moses where it says he was talking to the Spirit I think it was and it said he talked with him as a man talks to a man.

It was Nephi as he spoke with the Spirit during the vision of the Tree of Life (1 Nephi 8-15).

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There are no indepth descriptions of God the Father. Period. We do not know exactly what he looks like, nor what his physical or spiritual bodies look like. We do not know whether he has a liver, and if he does, what function it may provide in an exalted being.

There is no 'WE' here but 'I'...'I DO NOT KNOW EXACTLY what HE looks like'. Any living prophet or apostle must meet the criteria of being a personal witness of the Godhead. This means, there is a need here to have a personal visitation or multiply visitation over a lifetime. This may also include, any chooosen Saint that the Godhead deems it necessary for that individual to receive the same.

Never assume, if it had not happened to you or the masses, it had not happened to the brethren or selected Saints. :D

Edited by Hemidakota
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Also Isaiah 55 : 6 ¶ Seek ye the Lord while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:

7 Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the Lord, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

8 ¶ For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.

9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

His word is a two edge sword able to cut right and left , remember . you have to walk through the valley of death . His ways is not always popular to the Majority of the" Righteous " and can make you look like you are crazy to the Wicked.

What is the meaning of 'two edge sword'?

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I have Prayed about this and through study it is possible that Adam was a Promised Savior like our Lord or Messiah for some humans , that where not Of the Priest line. Jesus was the LAST ADAM , Since we do not know that much about Adam we have to go on the stories of Jesus. Jesus was Promised For A long period of time. Adam might have been also. Because we see in the Abraham that it does say Periods of time not the usual thousand years time length. Also , in the Pearl of Great Price , we see Adam is of the Priest Line and any of other is not mentioned , like the Jaredites being mentioned in the Bible but only in one verse. The reason according to Hugh Nibley is that the Nation Of Israel Are Shemites , not Hamites , Which the Jaredites are. SO this could be a possibility. That the records we have are about Adam the king and his Line Not the Rest of the Humans families. Just as We are all Sons and Daughters of Abraham , and have access to the Abrahamic Covenant , Through Faith and Obedience not blood . Also the New Covenant , Through Faith and Obedience , Becoming Heirs with Christ, the only Begotten of Heavenly Father in the Flesh. Remember Heavenly Father Does talk in parables about things , through out the scriptures , show why not from the beginning. In Ecclesiastes Solomon , calls the Young Men , cattle and Beast , And through out the scriptures the men are refered to as beast , birds , " Creepy things " even though the beholder , Peter did not know it was man , the Lord was talking about until he was told . We must remember Heavenly Father ways of Explain Things are not our ways. The Lord is the Same Yesterday , Today , And Forever. so how he explains is the same. Now this possible, if we know what he has said to us on his terms , not our understanding .

:viking::viking::viking:

Any of the seven arch-angels, this does include Joseph Smith, could have sat in that seat but why bother to bring this up? It is Jehovah that our FATHER had selected. I cannot fathom any other person be seated to the right of the FATHER.

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marts he is not deceptive. Maybe cunning , smooth , but not deceptive , it is just do not understand why he does what he does some times , remember subtle as a serpent gentle as a dove, and was that a parable in it self.

I was defending that he is not deceptive, however did he not command Abraham to sacrafice his son knowing that before the death blow he would stop him?

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Any of the seven arch-angels, this does include Joseph Smith, could have sat in that seat but why bother to bring this up? It is Jehovah that our FATHER had selected. I cannot fathom any other person be seated to the right of the FATHER.

Has and will never be anyone else sitting to the right of the Father

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