What does it take to get to heaven?

[RRR1]

Ive heard from some its a combination or works and faith, and a few different things. Exactly what does it take? Thanks.

[Finrock]

Good evening RRR1. It is a pleasure to meet you and welcome to the forums! :)

Ive heard from some its a combination or works and faith, and a few different things. Exactly what does it take? Thanks.

Ultimately it takes the atonement of Jesus Christ to get to Heaven. We gain access to the atonement by having faith in Jesus Christ, by repenting, by being baptized, by receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost and then by enduring to the end. In the Book of Mormon a prophet named Nephi stated it this way:

"For we labor diligently to write, to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do" (2 Ne. 25:23).

Regards,

Finrock

[Hemidakota]

Ive heard from some its a combination or works and faith, and a few different things. Exactly what does it take? Thanks.

Which part?

[mnn727]

there are 3 divisions in heaven (different kingdoms) each have their own requirements. But ultimatly its the atonement of Jesus Christ that gets us there, if not for His atoning sacrifice we wouldn't have a chance.

[Traveler]

Good evening RRR1. It is a pleasure to meet you and welcome to the forums! :)

Ultimately it takes the atonement of Jesus Christ to get to Heaven. We gain access to the atonement by having faith in Jesus Christ, by repenting, by being baptized, by receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost and then by enduring to the end. In the Book of Mormon a prophet named Nephi stated it this way:

"For we labor diligently to write, to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do" (2 Ne. 25:23).

Regards,

Finrock

I would add that faith in Christ does not exclude but includes works and deeds commanded by G-d, reptance is another work of faith as well as baptism and living by the influence of the Holy Ghost.

The Traveler

[hordak]

Both. Faith is the foundation but works are manifestations of that faith.

Smoke detector goes off. You leave and the building burns down.

You were saved buy your "works" (leaving the building) because of your faith (that smoke means fire).

[Dr T]

Jn 3:16

[RRR1]

so it seems from the responses that it is faith alone that gets you in. I had always Mormons believed that works was also a part but I guess Im wrong. Works is a byproduct of faith and someone of faith should practice works.

I guess an example would be a person who has done terrible things in his life (murder, rape, stealing, etc) and he was on his death bed. And 10 minutes before he died, he accepted Christ. So he had no time to do any good works but he still believed, does he get in?

For what its worth and some may have figured it out, I am not Mormon but wanted to know more about it.

[FunkyTown]

so it seems from the responses that it is faith alone that gets you in. I had always Mormons believed that works was also a part but I guess Im wrong. Works is a byproduct of faith and someone of faith should practice works.

I guess an example would be a person who has done terrible things in his life (murder, rape, stealing, etc) and he was on his death bed. And 10 minutes before he died, he accepted Christ. So he had no time to do any good works but he still believed, does he get in?

For what its worth and some may have figured it out, I am not Mormon but wanted to know more about it.

James 2:19 - Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

Is belief enough?

[Hemidakota]

Some interesting articles that may shed further light (out of 226 article found on the LDS.Org website):

Parallel Prophets: Paul and Joseph Smith

in Richard Lloyd Anderson, Ensign, 1985, Apr.

... Ensign Article - Parallel Prophets: Paul and Joseph Smith Skip to Content...more exciting than the brilliant scene of the three degrees of glory in Joseph Smith’s...

Chapter 23 Alma 1-4 Chapter 24 Alma 5–7 Chapter 25 Alma 8–12 Chapter 26 Alma 13–16 Chapter 27 Alma 17–22 Chapter 28 Alma 23–29 Chapter 29 Alma 30–33 Chapter 30 Alma 34–35 Chapter 31 Alma 36–42 Chapter 32 Alma 43–51 Chapter 33 Alma 52–58 Chapter 34 Alma 59–63

in ...different kind of evidence than that gained through the senses. Paul taught that “faith is the assurance of things hoped for, ...we overcome and master ourselves” (Melvin J. Ballard, The Three Degrees of Glory, pp. 11–13). Alma ...

I Have a Question

in , Ensign, 1986, Apr.

...Doctrine, p. 762.) The Hell That Has No End The three degrees of glory provide eternal homes for the ... the numerous Christian denominations in the world today. The confusion in Paul’s writings about whether works are necessary for salvation ...

Paul: Untiring Witness of Christ

in David Rolph Seely and Jo Ann H. Seely, Ensign, 1999, Aug.

...gave us a tool to measure the degree to which we are Saints. The Spirit gives spiritual...13–17 . 5. Three epistles are mentioned in Paul’s writings that have...explains that the Prophet Joseph Smith confirmed that Paul wrote Hebrews (see Doctrinal New...

Scriptural Witnesses

in Russell M. Nelson, Ensign, 2007, Nov.

... In the Bible we read this important declaration: “In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.” 5 This ... gift is again available to children of God. Paul referred to the three degrees of postmortal glory when he taught that “...

I Have a Question

in , Ensign, 1991, June

... about the doctrine has been created by a misreading of what Paul meant when he wrote about the doctrine. In the passage from ... in eternity. Those who obtain it gain an inheritance in the highest of three degrees of glory within the celestial kingdom.

Jesus and the Temple

in D. Kelly Ogden, Ensign, 1991, Apr.

...“Destroy this temple,” he said, “and in three days I will raise it up. “Then said...reach God’s presence. (See Paul’s explanation of the symbolism, Heb. 9...Presence could be manifest may be compared to the three degrees of glory: telestial, terrestrial, and...

Three Principles of Marriage

in Matthew O. Richardson, Ensign, 2005, Apr.

LDS.org - Ensign Article - Three Principles of Marriage Skip to Content Skip ... 1 Cor. 12:14 ). Paul taught that in spite of obvious differences in the various...

The Body: A Burden or a Blessing?

in Barbara Lockhart, Ensign, 1985, Feb.

... and each is of great importance to the other. Paul spoke of the glory of the body when he asked the... Skoblikova had already won the first three races; two pairs after mine ...p. 117. 10. Melvin J. Ballard, The Three Degrees of Glory (Salt Lake City:...

The Desires of Our Hearts

in Dallin H. Oaks, Ensign, 1986, June

... used to say. She taught her three children that we should pray to have ... both. In the second chapter of Romans, the Apostle Paul teaches to the same effect. He explains...3:5 .) And in respect to the three degrees in the celestial glory, modern revelation...

[Gillebre]

Ive heard from some its a combination or works and faith, and a few different things. Exactly what does it take? Thanks.

The Bible is not wrong when it says that by faith alone we can be made partakers of salvation.

However, having faith requires us to take action, to be obedient to the laws and commandments that Jesus Christ has given us.

To attain salvation unto eternal life, the first thing that is needed is a Savior, and an Atonement for the transgression of Adam, as well as our personal sins.

Such an Atonement provides for salvation from physical death, as well as spiritual death (being separated from God the Father). Without the sacrifice that Christ offered for us, paying for our sins and faults and pains and griefs, there would be no hope of salvation at all, for any of us.

Christ offers us the gift of salvation, but requires that we do certain things before He gives it to us. We must have faith in Him, in what He did for us. By that faith, we must be willing to do whatever He requires of us throughout our lives. If Christ commands, we do it. If we do what He asks of us, and we show him daily the evidence of our faith, by the end of our mortal lives, we will be ready to partake of the great gift He offers to those who obey.

That is 'what it takes' to attain salvation.

[Hemidakota]

Ive heard from some its a combination or works and faith, and a few different things. Exactly what does it take? Thanks.

To keep it simple...

By church standards, only heaven that requires an entry criteria, is the Celestial order. The lowerst portion requires a person to be baptized by the proper authority. Based on his or her baptism, remaining in humilty, repentance is kept up, and following the path of the Master, that individual will receive a glory within this realm. Anything less, there is no outside ordinance required to enter.

Murderers, thiefs, and so forth, left unrepented after thorough repentance process will inherit the lowest order called the Telestial.

Those who have apostated having the gospel with knowledge, those who were casted out, these are they that will not inherit any glory at all.

[Traveler]

so it seems from the responses that it is faith alone that gets you in. I had always Mormons believed that works was also a part but I guess Im wrong. Works is a byproduct of faith and someone of faith should practice works.

I guess an example would be a person who has done terrible things in his life (murder, rape, stealing, etc) and he was on his death bed. And 10 minutes before he died, he accepted Christ. So he had no time to do any good works but he still believed, does he get in?

For what its worth and some may have figured it out, I am not Mormon but wanted to know more about it.

You are missing some very important concepts. First - G-d is a G-d of love, compassion and mercy. Contrary to what many believe and profess - I see no reason that any Christian should believe that anyone (regardless of whatever is in their past) that desires with all their heart, might, mind and strength - to be with G-d in heaven will rejected by G-d.

Some in this life may not profess such with their words because they really do not understand and realize what is at stake. Jesus was very clear that those that reject him not knowing what they do, should not be held to account for their error.

Mormons are in a very small minority that believe G-d will provide a means for all - including those that knew nothing of Christ in this life - that when they come to know the truth and desire to be with G-d will be granted access.

The standard traditional notion that Christians that know more of G-d than an infidel in a society that does not teach Christ has the more advantage though their deeds are less kind than the infidel do display that in their heart they despise a just G-d and in reality would have nothing of such a G-d will find G-d will not force them to heaven but allow them to live in hell that is presided over by a unjust G-d that believes only in rewarding those that worship him.

The Traveler

[rameumptom]

We are "saved by grace after (in spite of) all we can do" (2 Ne 25). We are saved by faith. Our faith is outwardly demonstrated by our works. Moroni and other BoM prophets speak about "intent" in regards to being righteous. Works can be righteous, but only if done with the right intent (Moroni 7, 10, 3 Ne 27).

The greater our faith, the greater our righteous works will be. Jesus stated, "by their fruits ye shall know them." We can recognize good people by watching their behaviors. Their outward efforts will match what is inside of them, as long as the intent is correct.

King Benjamin taught that we cannot be saved by our works. God repays us too quickly. It is solely by our faith and repentance that Christ's atonement takes effect in our lives. Yet works are important as they display our faithfulness. Abraham was imputed righteous because he believed God's promise, but still had to go sacrifice Isaac (Hebrews 11).

Our level of faithfulness determines the level of grace/atoning blessing we receive. D&C 93 shows us that even Christ went from grace to grace, receiving grace for grace. We are to do the same thing. We go from one level of faithfulness to the next higher level.

In 3 Ne 11, Jesus teaches that the "Doctrine of Christ" is that the Father, Son and Holy Ghost are "one God" and that we are to become one as they are by developing faith in Christ, repenting, being baptized by water and the Gift of the Holy Ghost and enduring to the end (see also 2 Ne 31). No where does it specifically mention works, as the works are understood as an outward expression of faith. And it is cyclical. We develop faith to a certain level of grace, repent of the sins attached to that level, receive ordinances (Sacrament represents baptism), and are promised a higher level of the Spirit in return. Then, we move to the next level of grace through exercising greater faith and faithfulness.

[Hemidakota]

Moroni and other BoM prophets speak about "intent" in regards to being righteous. Works can be righteous, but only if done with the right intent (Moroni 7, 10, 3 Ne 27).

What scares me more today is members who now feel, works alone will save them.

[RRR1]

What scares me more today is members who now feel, works alone will save them.

+1. This is one reason why I started this thread. I was under the assumption that this is what Mormons believed, that is was not by faith alone. Turns out Mormons are more like "traditional" Christians than I thought.

[Hemidakota]

We have our moments...but that is clearly a problem throughout all religions.

[Finrock]

Good afternoon RRR1. I hope you are having a good day! :)

First, I appreciate you taking the time to ask and to understand what we believe.

so it seems from the responses that it is faith alone that gets you in. I had always Mormons believed that works was also a part but I guess Im wrong. Works is a byproduct of faith and someone of faith should practice works.

Actually you aren't wrong about works being a part. I don't want you to misunderstand what I've written earlier so allow me to clarify further, if I can. Ultimately we gain access to Heaven because of the atonement of Jesus (and I'm purposefully using Heaven generically even though the Mormon understanding of Heaven is a bit more thorough). I emphasise "ultimately" because without Jesus Christ, there would be absolutely no possibility of us ever being saved from sin and death. However, to gain access to all of the effects of the atonement requires work on our part. Meaning, we must do something in order for us to have access to all of the effects of the atonement.

Now, I am purposefully distinguishing between having access to a part of the atonement and all of the effects of the atonement. Mormons believe that all mankind will enjoy a part of the atonement, regardless of who they are or what they do in this life. Particularly, all mortals will eventually be resurrected. By resurrection, I mean all mortals will eventually have their spirits and their bodies reunited to never be parted again. All mortals will gain immortality. This is the absolutely free gift of the atonement. It requires neither faith nor works to receive.

In Mormon speech when we speak of Heaven, we are speaking most often about what we call the Celestial Kingdom. It is the greatest degree of salvation that mankind can take part in. Again, to keep things more simple, let us just focus on the Celestial Kingdom for the time being. To be saved in the Celestial Kingdom (Heaven) requires the atonement. To gain access to the effects of the atonement that allows us to be saved in the Celestial Kingdom requires us to do our part.

The easiest way, I think, to understand this is to understand that we gain access to this part of the atonement through covenants. Covenants are promises between a person and God. When we make a covenant, we promise to do certain things. For instance, in the covenant of baptism, we promise God that we will always remember Him, that we will stand as witnesses of God, and that we will always keep God's commandments. God's promise to us in this covenant of baptism is that He will bless us with the Holy Spirit and that we can gain access to the Celestial Kingdom. Now, because this is a covenant, it requires that both parties stay true to the covenant, else the promises of the covenant are void. We know God will be absolutely true to His part of the covenant. The question becomes then will we keep our end of the covenant? Obviously, we can not and so it seems that we are doomed. However, God, knowing that we could not keep the covenant perfectly, prepared a way for the demands of justice to be fulfilled and for mercy to be extended simultaneously. This was accomplished through the atonement of Jesus Christ. But, in order for God to forgive us of breaking our covenant with Him, we must live our end of the covenant to the best of our ability. It is only on that condition, that we are fulfilling our covenant as best as we can, that God's grace is sufficient for us. This is what the scripture in Nephi means that I quoted to you in my last post.

So, in order for us to gain access to all of the effects of the atonement, requires that we enter in to a covenant relationship with Heavenly Father and that we strive to fulfill our part of that covenant. When we are striving to fulfill our part of the covenant, even though we will fail at times, the atonement of Christ will make up for our failures, and we will gain access to the full effects of the atonement, allowing us to go to the Celestial Kingdom (Heaven).

Regards,

Finrock

[Dravin]

+1. This is one reason why I started this thread. I was under the assumption that this is what Mormons believed, that is was not by faith alone. Turns out Mormons are more like "traditional" Christians than I thought.

It's an overcorrection against concepts that one can accept Christ at some point then spend the rest of their lives breaking the laws of God willy nilly and it's all good. The concept is out there, I've had people look me in the eye and tell me they could kill me where I stand and still be fine salvation wise because they've been saved. It's more a caricature than an accurate reflection of the (more common) position but we have some different stresses and both sides have a tendency to characterize the other to the extreme side of things.

So, "We are saved by faith" becomes, "if I have faith I can do what ever I want, no need to obey." And insistence that ordinances and obedience are necessary (though not the saving power) becomes "we are saved by works."

But as noted, there are those who buy into the extreme position on both sides of the fence.

[Hemidakota]

But as noted, there are those who buy into the extreme position on both sides of the fence.

Agreed! It requires a balance of both in order to be with our Master eternally.

[marts1]

Faith and repentance covers it all.

[JohnnyRudick]

so it seems from the responses that it is faith alone that gets you in. I had always Mormons believed that works was also a part but I guess Im wrong. Works is a byproduct of faith and someone of faith should practice works.

I guess an example would be a person who has done terrible things in his life (murder, rape, stealing, etc) and he was on his death bed. And 10 minutes before he died, he accepted Christ. So he had no time to do any good works but he still believed, does he get in? . . .

Keeping it simple.

In a word, Yes.

Life does not end at death.

And neither does accepting the atoning work of the Lord Jesus Christ.

See Temple work for the dead.

[JohnnyRudick]

What scares me more today is members who now feel, works alone will save them.

1 Corinthians 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the

gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received,

and wherein ye stand;

1 Corinthians 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in

memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

[Vanhin]

Salvation, in the most complete sense, comes only through the merits of Jesus Christ, to those who live according to His gospel. The first principles of the gospel of Jesus Christ, are faith in Jesus Christ, and repentance. Not only is faith, in Christ and His Atonement, necessary, but repentance (which is something we ourselves do) is made possible by the Atonement of Jesus Christ.

Without the Atonement of Jesus Christ, no amount of pleading and begging would release us from the debt of our sins. We are able to repent, to begin with, because of the merits of Jesus Christ.

So, when we repent, and engage in holy acts, such as baptism, and work hard to keep our covenants with God, it brings salvation to our souls because of the grace of God, through the Atonement of Christ. Faith, to Latter-day Saints, is more than mere belief.

Regards,

Vanhin

Edited April 28, 2010 by Vanhin

[volgadon]

Faith is what should motivate works. You see, the gospel is about intent, motivation and doing.

As for deathbed repentance, it really depends on why he repented when he did. Did he realise earlier that he needed to repent, or is it only now when he sees he is about to die and that all that talk about punishment wasn't idle so better repent fast...