Failure

[Landy77]

I am in my third year of college. I have put all my math courses off but am at the point I have to take them. I have failed the course twice and am taking it a third time. I do very will in all my other subjects except math. I am thinking of accepting failure and not finishing my degree. I don't know what to do.

[HoosierGuy]

Have you tried a tutor? Does your collage have math tutors? Also, with the bad economy I figure there should be tons of people with math/teaching degrees out of work that would love to tutor in math. That's assuming you have the money for that.

[FairChild]

Do you have a place that people can go study and get tutoring and testing? There are things like math dyslexia and other problems that can effect your math abilities. If you do testing and it shows a problem or weakness in your skills, the school can come up with a plan that can aid your classroom performance. Don't quit.

[Guest mormonmusic]

I teach math myself, and I've found that in every school I've taught, there have been a lot of excellent resources (many free) to help learn math -- people too, such as student tutors and the professors themselves, depending on the school.

Failing that, try a private tutor. Someone who can deal with your questions and problems getting the right answers one-on-one.

My advice -- don't blow the degree over the math. Do everything possible to knock out those courses so you can finish your degree.

An undergraduate degree can add you an additional One Million Dollars over the course of your lifetime, said one study. Also, having that degree can also open up professions and jobs that may well be more interesting to you than jobs that don't require a degree at all.

[bl8tant]

I had a similar problem in college, except that my degree program required a lot of math. I just had to hold my nose and do my best to get through it. Not that I recommend that approach! The folks who suggested getting tutors or other kinds of help are right on the money. I wish I'd done so.

What kind of math course are you having trouble with?

[pam]

Math is the one subject I am dreading when I return to school. I've avoided math classes since I was in 9th grade and I won't say how many centuries ago that was. I will probably have to take some very basic math classes before I can even pass a college algebra class.

[Saldrin]

I squeaked by in my math classes defiantly not my best subject tutoring and lots and lots of practice are what you need to get it done. Don't bag your degree fight through you can do it.

[Landy77]

I understand math per say, but the functions and rules do not make sense. I am just doing algebra, I took a placement test and have to work my way up. I am doing linear eqations, y-y1=m(x-x1), I will have 3,0 as y2, y1 and 0, 4 as x1, x2 but the solution will have 3,0 reversed as 0-3= instead of 3-0= reversed and I dont understand why.

[Dravin]

I will have 3,0 as y2, y1 and 0, 4 as x1, x2

So your original points are 0,0 and 4,3? Or are you getting confused and your points are 3,0 and 0,4? Ordered pairs are given as X1,Y1 and X2,y2 not X1,X2 and Y1,Y2 (not trying to be patronizing, I just don't know where you are at mathematically speaking).

So if you they are telling you to find the formula for the line which goes through the points 3,0 and 0,4 then you get:

Y-0 = M(X-3)

Now M = Y2-Y1/X2-X1 or 4-0 (which is 4)/0-3 (which is -3) or -4/3

So (removing the pointless -0) you get Y=-4/3(X-3) carry the -4/3 through and you get Y=-4/3X+4.

Now if your points are 0,0 and 4,3 then you get:

Y-0=M(X-0)

M= 3-0/4-0 or 3/4

Remove the pointless -0s and carry the 3/4 through to the X and you get Y=3/4X

Note, if Y was plus or minus something other than zero you would have to move it across. So if you had something that came out to Y-4=2X+2 you'd need to move it across (add 4 to both sides) and you'd get y=2X+6.

I can't help feeling I just completely missed what was giving you trouble, also with my luck I made a mistake somewhere. Sorry if I did.

Edited September 18, 2010 by Dravin

[HoosierGuy]

Math is the one subject I am dreading when I return to school. I've avoided math classes since I was in 9th grade and I won't say how many centuries ago that was. I will probably have to take some very basic math classes before I can even pass a college algebra class.

High School Level?Basic Math

I've not bought or used that math set but Teaching Company is a well respected company and I've listened to many of their history courses and they are excellent.

Go to the book store and buy a basic math review book. Study it and buy another. Little by little.

[MarginOfError]

When I was tutoring math the thing I noticed was that people were attempting to take on math classes that they weren't prepared for. If you need to finish algebra, it might save you some time to first take pre-algebra and further develop the skills that your algebra class will require. Using an analogy, we usually don't teach people to shoot a jump shot until they can dribble.

[Landy77]

So your original points are 0,0 and 4,3? Or are you getting confused and your points are 3,0 and 0,4? Ordered pairs are given as X1,Y2 and X2,y2 not X1,X2 and Y1,Y2 (not trying to be patronizing, I just don't know where you are at mathematically speaking).

So if you they are telling you to find the formula for the line which goes through the points 3,0 and 0,4 then you get:

Y-0 = M(X-3)

Now M = Y2-Y1/X2-X1 or 4-0 (which is 4)/0-3 (which is -3) or -4/3

So (removing the pointless -0) you get Y=-4/3(X-3) carry the -4/3 through and you get Y=-4/3X+4.

Now if your points are 0,0 and 4,3 then you get:

Y-0=M(X-0)

M= 3-0/4-0 or 3/4

Remove the pointless -0s and carry the 3/4 through to the X and you get Y=3/4X

Note, if Y was plus or minus something other than zero you would have to move it across. So if you had something that came out to Y-4=2X+2 you'd need to move it across (add 4 to both sides) and you'd get y=2X+6.

I can't help feeling I just completely missed what was giving you trouble, also with my luck I made a mistake somewhere. Sorry if I did.

I paired y1 and y2 together because I am finding the slope of a line. I subtract y2 from y1 etc. My problem is the arrangment is y2-y1/x2-x1. But the solution is not 3-0 but 0-3 which is a different solution.

[Dravin]

I paired y1 and y2 together because I am finding the slope of a line. I subtract y2 from y1 etc. My problem is the arrangment is y2-y1/x2-x1. But the solution is not 3-0 but 0-3 which is a different solution.

It doesn't really matter which points you label 1 and 2 in this application as long as you are consistent.

For example considering slope:

M = 3-0/4-0 = 3/4

Or

M = 0-3/0-4 = -3/-4 = 3/4

Or if you want an example that doesn't include zeros:

M = 1-3/2-4 = -2/-2 = 1

Or

M = 3-1/4-2 = 2/2 = 1

In that vein 3/-4 and -3/4 are equivalent slopes but most people (in my experience, this includes solution books and backs of books) move the negative out front/up top (and some teachers will ding you for not doing so) so you'll generally not see a negative in the denominator as in the 3/-4 all that often. Also if you kept your slope (going back up a few more examples) at -3/-4 your teacher would probably object because it wasn't simplified but it would still graph correctly as they are mathematically equivalent. As a last resort don't forget, sometimes solution books or the answers in the back of the book are wrong or if it was an example given in class it is possible the teacher did it incorrectly. If you've done it several times and double checking (preferably, but not required) with a graphing calculator (physical or online) produces valid results error on authority's part and not yours may be the reason for the discrepancy.

Edit: As always I reserve the right to have misread what is giving you trouble.

Edited June 12, 2010 by Dravin

[Guest]

I paired y1 and y2 together because I am finding the slope of a line. I subtract y2 from y1 etc. My problem is the arrangment is y2-y1/x2-x1. But the solution is not 3-0 but 0-3 which is a different solution.

Math is my easiest subject.

Science says that people are right-brained, left-brained, etc. Most right-handed people are left-brained and left-handed people are right-brained. Right-brained people have talents leaning towards the arts, left-brained people have talents leaning towards math.

Why I'm telling you this - there are 3 main reasons you are having trouble with math - 1.) you are ultra-right-brained, 2.) you had a bad elementary/high school math teacher, 3.) you had an experience in your youth that made you math-phobic.

The 2nd and 3rd reasons are easily fixable. The 1st reason is a little tougher.

I am good in math not because I'm ultra-left-brained (I'm ambi-dextrous. I can draw pretty good too.) but because I had a very good math teacher in elementary (I'm talking 1st grade through 6th grade!)

The #1 thing I learned from my elementary math teacher is this: Don't look at math problems/equations as symbols/numbers. You'll just end up memorizing everything without really understanding what's happening. That's how you can easily get turned-around in your solutions.

She told me - every time you see a math problem, apply it to real world scenarios. Therefore, in first grade, she did not teach us 1+1=2. She taught us, you got one banana, you are still hungry so you got another banana, how many bananas do you have now?

So that, when I got to solving for slopes, I don't see the problem as m = (y2 - y1) / (x2 - x1). I see it as a mountain I'm trying to climb. The slope is how steep that mountain is from where I'm at on that mountain . Therefore, I know that to determine how steep it is, I have to determine how high that mountain is (vertical distance or rise) and how far the top point of the mountain is from my feet if I flatten that mountain like a pancake (horizontal distance or run). Then I figure out the ratio between rise and run to know how steep it is. From elementary math, I know that to get a ratio, I divide one by the other. So, in this case, I divide the rise of the mountain with the run of the mountain. So, I got this visual in my head now.

So, say I am at the bottom of the mountain. That means I start at vertical distance of 0. Now, I need to know how high that mountain is vertically. Say the topmost point is 3 miles above the ground. So, I know that I need to subtract 3 by 0 to get my height which is 3 miles.

Now, if you're climbing DOWN the mountain under the seabed, your top part is your 0 and you need to go down 3 miles so you would subract 0 by 3 which is -3 (3 miles below sea level). Did that make sense?

Now, apply this same thing with the horizontal distance and you got the 2 numbers = the rise and run distance.

Now, determine how steep it is by getting the ratio between the two = divide the rise by the run and you got the slope. Easy does it.

Now, when you get a little sophisticated, instead of seeing it as a mountain, you can just visualize your number line (x and y axis). Draw your mountain on it (yes, it helps if you physically draw the triangle that would represent your mountain) by plotting your points. X1 and Y1 is your starting point with X being your horizontal distance and Y being your vertical distance. X2 and Y2 is the other coordinates of your target.

So your drawing would look something like this:

This drawing shows that I start off at the bottom of the mountain on (2,1) coordinate, and then have to climb all the way to (4,9) coordinate.

Now, how high is that mountain (rise)? You know to subtract 9 by 1 or that would be 8.

What's the horizontal distance (run)? You know to subtract 4 by 2 or that would be 2.

Now, how steep is that mountain (slope)? That would be the ratio between rise and run = or 8/2, or that would be 4. Easy does it.

You wouldn't get yourself confused on getting the numbers turned around this way.

So, then, how about if you're climbing DOWN the mountain? So, your starting point would be (4,9) and the ending point would be (2,1). So, your rise would be negative (going down) because you're going from 9 to 1... that would be 1-9 which is -8. And your run would be 2-4 or -2.

Your slope would still be the same because -8/-2 is still 4. So, no matter if you're climbing UP or DOWN, the slope is the same because it is the same mountain.

So, think about that and see if that makes it easier for you to understand now.

Anyway, I don't think you have a problem with MATH. I think you need a GOOD TEACHER. So, as others here have said - find a tutor who can break things down very simply for you.

Don't give up on your degree. I just saw Karate Kid yesterday - take of your jacket, put on your jacket - EVERYTHING is Kung Fu. I can tell you the same thing for Math - climb up the mountain, climb down the mountain, EVERYTHING is Math.

Take your math classes with confidence. God bless.

Edited June 12, 2010 by anatess

[Elgama]

Everyone is different but personally I found Maths and physics much easier to follow when I stopped trying to understand the subject and worked at just doing it, I went from being Maths incapable to being able to do astronomy etc.

[Guest mormonmusic]

Here's another tip -- see if the textbook for the course has a "Student Solutions Manual". Usually, the main textbook will give you a couple solved problems and just the answer in the back of the book for odd or even numbered homework problems.

But a student solutions manual gives you additional problems with solutions that are explained. This additonal perspective on the problems might help you. Even if your professor says there isn't a Student Solutions Manual as part of the official course materials, check out Amazon or even call the publisher and see if they have one you can buy. If it's expensive, turn around and resell it on Amazon and get some of your money back after you're done with it, and make sure you keep it in good condition.

I'm going to school now, and I do that all the time with the overpriced books I have to buy.

I wasn't great at math when I was in High School, but in university, something clicked and I started being a sought-after tutor in Statistics. It was strange -- being bad at math actually helped me teach other people after I put in the necessary effort to master it.

So, you can do it -- I like Anatass' comment that often we approach subjects with a mental block due to bad math teachers who only imparted a hatred of math and nothing more. I see that block students' ability to learn math all the time.

Edited June 13, 2010 by mormonmusic

[mightynancy]

Have you had the same professor each time? Sometimes hearing the material presented in a different way can make a difference. I always tell my students to let me know if they don't "get" what I'm explaining, so I can say it again from a different angle. After a few months of school, I'll come to know who loves a diagram and who needs a written list of steps.

The example I share with my students is: my swim coach used to tell me my arms were too flat on my freestyle. No matter how many times she said that, I couldn't fix it. Then a teammate said, "Put your hand in the water a little closer to your face." BINGO! It wasn't that I was incapable of proper form, I just needed to receive the information in a way that clicked with my brain. I tell my kids that if they don't get it, then *I* need to do something differently.

If you do have tutoring available, try to find someone who didn't ADORE Dr. So-and-So (whoever is teaching the course). Find someone who sees the math in a different way from the prof, so you can hear it from a completely different approach.

[Moksha]

Tutors from day one are great. Use them to help with any course concepts and homework problems you are not grasping. I made extensive use of the chemistry help center in college and as a result did very well - although I was very concerned about this from the day I enrolled in that year of organic chemistry courses. Let the college's tutoring staff know exactly the problems you had experienced before, together with what deficits you have and they will help the best they can.

[Guest xforeverxmetalx]

Science says that people are right-brained, left-brained, etc. Most right-handed people are left-brained and left-handed people are right-brained. Right-brained people have talents leaning towards the arts, left-brained people have talents leaning towards math.

I am good in math not because I'm ultra-left-brained (I'm ambi-dextrous. I can draw pretty good too.)

Something that always confused me about that psychology was the fact that I'm also good at both math and artsy stuff. But I can't write with my left hand or anything. Hm.

She taught us, you got one banana, you are still hungry so you got another banana, how many bananas do you have now?

One and a banana peel, because you ate the first one already?

@topic... Another tip, have you gone to your school counselors? If your school has them, it might be worth a visit to explain your difficulties and see what options they can offer you as far as finishing your degree.

[Guest mormonmusic]

One and a banana peel, because you ate the first one already?

.

Problems involving bananas always have me questioning whether we evolved from apes.

oo, there's a scratch, ee-ee.

[Just_A_Guy]

A family member of mine failed the same class three times and finally went and got herself tested. The school declared her somehow "disabled" and waived the math requirement in her case.

Talk to your academic advisement center.

[pam]

Oh oh oh..maybe I can be classified as disabled just for the purposes of math classes. That would be awesome.

[Dravin]

Oh oh oh..maybe I can be classified as disabled just for the purposes of math classes. That would be awesome.

I dunno Pam, you're one smart cookie.

[Roseslipper]

dont give up alot of people are not good in math including myself. get a tutor and take some refresh courses. I know you can do it....