America discriminates against men.


Voyager
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Take a semi-wealthy father and poor mother, both good parents. Who should have the kids? Both of course but for most of the time - the mother simply because she's the mother.

Unfortunately, wealth is not an indicator of good home environment.

But, with everything being EQUAL - that is, both can provide the loving, comfortable, stable, etc., environment... then yes, the Mother may be favored.

But if it is slightly unequal - the favor goes to the better environment.

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i think if both homes are "equal" in safety, love, etc. the kids should spend time with each parent when they are developmentally most needy of that parent.

infants usually do need mom a bit more. young boys need a daddy. during puberty it's usually good to be with the same gender parent so they can guide you through it. that kind of thing is never considered. once the courts pick a home they tend to never change it. i'm not sure that's the best plan. if they know from the get go they will be moved they can make it a special deal and help the kids transition with ease.

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I read an article once that showed a study that proves the public school system gives girls an advantage over boys.

A boy learns by experience while a girl learns by observation. But in the school system, boys are "commanded" to be quiet and be still and just observe. They end up just "spacing out" because it is difficult for them to be quiet and be still and learn.

After generations of this type of learning, the male species will eventually get re-wired and lose their male-ness.

I heard on the radio the other day some famous author of marriage books say that studies show young men now have lower male hormones than old men did back 30 yers ago. Wonder if this is part of it.

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Take a semi-wealthy father and poor mother, both good parents. Who should have the kids? Both of course but for most of the time - the mother simply because she's the mother.

I fail to see the reasoning behind that statement. :confused:

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I heard on the radio the other day some famous author of marriage books say that studies show young men now have lower male hormones than old men did back 30 yers ago. Wonder if this is part of it.

Well, not this one. This one is attributed to the fact that more women are taking birth control pills.

The premise is that (and I haven't studied this enough to have a position on it) more women, especially younger women, are on birth control pills. This gives an effect on the male population because all of a sudden female are having less need for male dominance (that is - the inherent male vs male fight for dominance).

The professionals are saying that 30 years ago, manly-men like Rambo, Bruce Willis of Die Hard, Mel Gibson of Lethal Weapon, etc were the stuff of girl idols. Now, only men appreciate those types. The women are more drawn to High School musical and Twilight stuff drawing out more of the emotional side of men than their physical dominance.

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i think if both homes are "equal" in safety, love, etc. the kids should spend time with each parent when they are developmentally most needy of that parent.

infants usually do need mom a bit more. young boys need a daddy. during puberty it's usually good to be with the same gender parent so they can guide you through it. that kind of thing is never considered. once the courts pick a home they tend to never change it. i'm not sure that's the best plan. if they know from the get go they will be moved they can make it a special deal and help the kids transition with ease.

Usually though, after a divorce, the person who has the children end up marrying somebody else and providing both the male and female figures through the step parent.

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kids don't need step parents, they need their mom or dad. i know i could never replace my stepson's relationship with his mom, there is nothing i could to to be her. i don't try. i also know his step dad could never be what my husband is to him. kids need their parents.

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kids don't need step parents, they need their mom or dad. i know i could never replace my stepson's relationship with his mom, there is nothing i could to to be her. i don't try. i also know his step dad could never be what my husband is to him. kids need their parents.

Yes, the kids need their parents, hence divorce is not accepted in the Catholic church. Unfortunately, people do get divorced in the United States. In these cases, a stable home is a better environment for a child than having to be shipped off every week somewhere else.

Usually, when there's a custody arrangement, one parent gets the children and the other parent only gets some weekends and some holidays. This is not to say that the other parent deserves only 1/10 of the kids. It is set up to provide the children with one stable home environment.

The step-parent can never replace a loving, caring biological parent. But a divorce is already less than ideal. This is just a by-product of it.

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The following article caught my attention. It deals with men being thrown in jail for not paying child support on time. The problem I think most people ignore is that the very term "deadbeat dad" makes it clear that men are less likely to get possession of their kids. I do not believe women are less likely to disolve a marriage or mess around on their husband. Maybe men need to make a better case for defending their rights.

Don’t pay support, go directly to jail

of Course theres discrimination against men/males... I just don't think they care about it as much.
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Yes, the kids need their parents, hence divorce is not accepted in the Catholic church. Unfortunately, people do get divorced in the United States. In these cases, a stable home is a better environment for a child than having to be shipped off every week somewhere else.

Just out of curiosity how does the church handle that?

Would a divorced and remarried Catholic get exed for adultery, or would it be more like a WoW violation or failing to pay tithing in the LDS church.

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Just out of curiosity how does the church handle that?

Would a divorced and remarried Catholic get exed for adultery, or would it be more like a WoW violation or failing to pay tithing in the LDS church.

From what I understand, someone who is a Catholic and divorced isn't allowed to take Communion, even if that person didn't remarry. On rare occasions, someone might get a marriage annulled, but it's a difficult thing to get as one has to prove that they never should have married in the first place.

The only people who really get excommunicated in the Catholic church are priests who decide to marry an adult of the opposite gender.

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I fail to see the reasoning behind that statement. :confused:

I don't think HoosierGuy was saying that this was the way things should be; rather he was observing how they are.

My own case fits this model exactly: I earn a great living. My wife is a stay-at-home mom. She has repeatedly decided not to take advantage of my offers to support her in finishing her college degree or working part-time outside the home.

Now she's asked for a divorce. If we left the decision up to the judge, I can almost guarantee the likely outcome: she gets to continue being a stay-at-home parent, and I get to pay for it.

That is neither right nor fair, but far too often it's what happens.

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A mother should get some special treatment because she carries the child in her belly, something men don't do.

so, am to understand that men love their children less for that reason?

seems to me that i've heard of some high profile counts of women killing their children, just like some men have. i don't think men have a monopoly on craziness and i CERTAINLY don't believe that men love their children any less because they didn't carry them.

besides, we are talking about equality UNDER THE LAW.

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Do women really never pay child support in any situation? Say both parents work and the mother is the primary wage-earner (she earns more). They get a divorce. The father is ruled to be the fit (or fitter) parent. She still makes more money than him. Does she pay child support? Why not? Because the man is the king of the household? Because he should be able to support the children just fine?

I don't see how the sexes are equal under the law unless in the right situations women also pay child support.

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Yes women pay child support. The job I work at now deals with the pay received by individual parents for child support. There are many men who are receiving child support.

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I am going to say something that is going to tick a lot of readers off. But before you go too far with your misunderstanding towards me for what I am saying – try to understand Jesus and his teachings.

Here is my statement – if there is a divorce – especially in a family with children – the blame for all the ill effects and bad things that come to the family and children lie directly with that parent that holds and harbors any bitterness towards the other parent. If there is any possibility for good to come it will be from that parent that forgives and loves the other parent as much as they love and have compassion for the children.

The Traveler

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Just a couple thoughts, based on what I've seen in Utah:

As per our state constitution, there's not supposed to be a direct preference for the mother simply because she's the mother. However, there is a preference for the parent who has been the "primary caregiver"--the person who wakes the kid, feeds him, dresses him, takes him to school, is home when he gets home from school . . . etc. In the vast majority of cases--especially in a state like Utah with many stay-at-home-mothers, that "primary caregiver" will be the mother. But it isn't always so. I just did a divorce where I represented the father of a three-year-old. He and the wife both work, but he worked nights and spent the day home with the kid while the mom worked--we wound up settling the case, but we settled on very good terms because Mom's lawyer knew that if we went to court, Mom would very probably lose.

As for child support--in Utah, the way they calculate it is that they figure out how much Mom and Dad are capable of earning together. They combine that amount and the number of kids according to the table in UCA 78B-12-301. That gives a "combined base support" amount--the amount the state thinks it should cost to raise the child. So, for example, if you and your ex are able to earn $1,000 a month, then the State of Utah says your child needs a total of $183 per month.

That figure is divvied up according to the parents' earning potential--if Dad is capable of earning $600 and Mom is capable of earning $400, then Dad is responsible for 60% of that $183 ($109.80) and Mom is responsible for the rest ($73.20). Whoever is the noncustodial parent pays his/her share to the custodial parent. The court just assumes that the custodial parent is inevitably going to spend their share on the kid anyways.

I'm not particularly fond of this system, because it ignores the fact that the noncustodial parent is still making expenditures on the child's behalf above and beyond what (s)he's paying to the custodial parent (for example, I have clients who maintain separate bedrooms for kids who visit once or twice a month, and keep completely different sets of clothes, books, toys, etc). But it is easy to calculate.

Edited by Just_A_Guy
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I know in my case they added a couple of things as well. Both parents responsible for carrying health insurance on the children. If one parent is unable to get insurance through their employment then that parent will pay 50% of the cost of the premium to the other parent. As well as 50% of childcare expenses while I was working or attending school and any out of pocket healthcare expenses, deductible, co pays, co insurance etc.

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I know in my case they added a couple of things as well. Both parents responsible for carrying health insurance on the children. If one parent is unable to get insurance through their employment then that parent will pay 50% of the cost of the premium to the other parent. As well as 50% of childcare expenses while I was working or attending school and any out of pocket healthcare expenses, deductible, co pays, co insurance etc.

Yeah, that's pretty routine. As a term of art, it's not technically the same as "child support", but functionally the legal consequences for nonpayment are pretty much the same.

I would further note that in Utah, I've seen judges be very sympathetic to dads who claim they can't find work--rather than committing them to jail forthwith, courts in Utah county often say "OK, come back in here in 120 days, and show me proof of employment or else a job search log showing me what you've been doing to find a job". I'm not sure why Texas is being so tough, if the linked article is correct--maybe they've got a lot of single moms getting welfare from the State who wouldn't need it if the dads paid their child support, and Texas thinks they can ease their budget by putting the fear of God into its deadbeat dads.

Edited by Just_A_Guy
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I think they should be sympathetic to the unemployment issue. Unless several months later there is no proof that gainful employment was even a goal. Economy and finding jobs are difficult right now. I just can't see faulting or putting into jail a man that REALLY has attempted to find a job to fulfill his obligations.

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