Is There A God?


prisonchaplain
 Share

Recommended Posts

The key to a good test is getting the questions right. So, what is the basic test of life, and what are the right questions?

1. Is there a God? If the answer is no, or that God is unknowable, or that there are many gods, then I lose a great deal of interest in religion.

A. If there is no God, even if religion is healthy, I'd rather live shorter with truth. The Apostle Paul makes this point when he says that if the resurrection of Jesus is not true then Christians are the greatest of fools.

B. If God is unknowable, then why try? I might as well live my life doing what is right in my own eyes. That's probably what a "created the system and left" kind of god would want.

B. If there are many gods, then they are not all powerful, and there are probably easier ways of attaining what I want, or avoiding what I don't want, rather than trying to figure out what I have to do for which god.

Conclusion: So, the first, and most basic question is: Is there a God?

2. Is God all-powerful? If God is not at least largely in control of his creation, than his character does not matter.

3. Is God good? If Sgallan is right, that God, if he exists, is evil, then I would want to avoid him--not worship him.

I'm not offering a lot of apologetics, or "spin" here--just my understanding of what the Big Questions are. Both the Old Testament and New Testament promise that whoever seeks God will find him. However, before the seeking, one must confirm in his/her heart that there is such a God, and if so, He's strong enough, and that He's good to the core.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

First, I think it’s important to understand that there is “opposition” in everything.

For instance, if there is anything which can be called evil, there must also be something which can be called good, and vice versa.

Second, I think it’s important to understand that there are varying degrees in everything.

For instance, if there is something which can be called good, there must also be something which can be called better, and best.

And finally, I think it’s important to understand that most people use the word “God” to refer to the best form of life they can think of, which is by nature the best from the rest.

For instance, "to know, know, know Him, is to love, love, love Him, and I do, I do, I do."

Sorry, kinda felt sappy there at the end. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Too many try and create a God in their own image and when their God doesn't live up to this created image, they throw Him away.

God is above and different than anything we can create and therefore we shouldn't be trying to limit Him, manage Him, coerce or manipulate Him, testing Him to prove to us that He is what we want Him to be or else.

God's love is nothing like what we have defined as love. He sees everything from the beginning to the end and knows what we will do when given choices. He knows what will happen when we make those choices and how others will behave when we make those choices.

The bottom line is ~ What is the principle God is acting upon when dealing with His children?

This is My work and My glory, to bring to pass the imortality and eternal life of man. What that entails is really beyond most of our comprehension. Thus we need faith, trust in God and His ways.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There is most definatly a God.

I know because he has rescued me from many situations and even rescued me from custody for a crime I never commit. (believe me, the custody officer did not want to let me go :rolleyes: ) :jail:

I have recieved visions and prophetic dreams from God and even a Psalm.

He deserves so much more praise than I can ever give him and if there is a place in Heaven I would want the most, it would be to be like the Cherubim, to worship and praise God continuosly.

John 4:24 tells us :

God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

God is the almighty, the creator of Heaven and Earth.

The ultimate ruler of all things.

The three qualities of God are:

Omnipotence : All Powerful

Omniscience : All Seeing

Benevolence : All Good

Laudamus te, Benedicimus te, Adoramus te Glorificamus te

We Praise thee, We Bless thee, We Worship thee, We Glorify thee.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest funkyfool416

is there a god? i guess there must be some sort of higher power of some sort because everything in the universe is just too perfect to just be a scientific coincidence. hmmm...god must be a descent guy. He most likely loves us... good post prison man. :D

God must be an allright guy if he is all powerful...he hasnt yet struck us all with lightening...yeah bye

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree full heartedly. Thank you for such a great post! I love your little prison dude!

It is in the smilie archive on these forums.

If you click on "Show All" below the smilies a pop up will appear and it has a list of many many smilies.

hint: widen the window so you can see the image of the smilie :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The three qualities of God are:

Omnipotence : All Powerful

Omniscience : All Seeing

Benevolence : All Good

Laudamus te, Benedicimus te, Adoramus te Glorificamus te

We Praise thee, We Bless thee, We Worship thee, We Glorify thee.

There are many more than three qualities to God.

God is:

  • Omniscient
  • Holy
  • Just
  • Love
  • True
  • Free
  • Omnipotent
  • Infinite and Eternal
  • Immutable
  • Omnipresent
  • Sovereign
That you listed only the three things you want Him to be seems to say that you create God in the image you want him to be in, instead of everything the scriptures say He is.

But more than anything else, He, alone, is worthy to be praised!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm sorry I didn't tick every box on the list. :unsure:

I think you will find that those three properties sum up everything that you said.

Remember being a Christian is not academic, if it was the means of salvation would be some sort of examination.

I could sum it up even more and simply say that God is Good!

Everything from God is good, God is Good.

I do not create my own God. I refuse to do that.

Greatest of all God is the King of Kings, Lord of Lords, Everlasting Father. :D

:bouncingclap: Laudamus Te :bouncingclap:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm sorry I didn't tick every box on the list. :unsure:

I think you will find that those three properties sum up everything that you said.

Remember being a Christian is not academic, if it was the means of salvation would be some sort of examination.

I could sum it up even more and simply say that God is Good!

Everything from God is good, God is Good.

I do not create my own God. I refuse to do that.

Greatest of all God is the King of Kings, Lord of Lords, Everlasting Father. :D

:bouncingclap: Laudamus Te :bouncingclap:

I don't think there will be a test, either, but if we leave out some of the qualities, it creates a different "God". And, while not implying that you do that (or at least not meaning to), some do. They choose the qualities they think are important and skip over others, thus distorting the picture of God that they present to others. I think the whole picture is important.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

So what "form" do you perceive God to be in now, Jenda?

And btw, I'm simply wondering if you perceive God to be without form, and without body, parts, or passions, in agreement with the doctrine from other Christians, considering the fact that you once accepted the idea that God is in form like Man... or more correctly stated, that Man is in form like God?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So what "form" do you perceive God to be in now, Jenda?

And btw, I'm simply wondering if you perceive God to be without form, and without body, parts, or passions, in agreement with the doctrine from other Christians, considering the fact that you once accepted the idea that God is in form like Man... or more correctly stated, that Man is in form like God?

I do not believe, and never have, that God has a body. I believe, and always have, that we are created in the spiritual image of God.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

So what "form" do you perceive God to be in now, Jenda?

And btw, I'm simply wondering if you perceive God to be without form, and without body, parts, or passions, in agreement with the doctrine from other Christians, considering the fact that you once accepted the idea that God is in form like Man... or more correctly stated, that Man is in form like God?

The "passion" word struck me as odd. Christians of all stripes believe God can be angered, that He is love, that He can be saddened, pleased, etc. Do you mean something different? :dontknow:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Genesis 1:27, Ex. 33: 11, John 14:9, 2Corinthians 4: 4, John 14.9, Heb. 1:3 and good ol" "Man is as God once was." :wow:

Let's start with the "Man is as God once was" quote. I believe it was from two early Mormon leaders. My understanding is that the quote is found nowhere in the Standard Works. Nevertheless, Prof. Robinson suggests that it is so pervasive in Mormon thinking, that it could be treated as such.

The conclusion of "How Wide the Divide" on this matter was: Mormons believe both that God and humanity are eternal. Therefore, to suggest that God was once a man, does not deny his eternal nature.

As information, Evangelicals, and most of Christianity, believe that God the Father, has always been spirit, and that his Son was spirit, before the incarnation (the enfleshment). We are also more than than a little discomforted about the notion of a God who changes his nature--who seems to evolve.

Genesis 1:27: So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

The fact that God created both Adam and Eve in his image, would suggest that the physical aspect of this image was not the focus. And indeed, is God then white? Middle-Eastern in appearance (like the Jews)? Why do we not all look like God (we're very different). So, how literal of an interpretation are we to have here?

Exodus 33:11: And the Lord spake unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend. And he turned again into the camp: but his servant Joshua, the son of Nun, a young man, departed not out of the tabernacle.

The whole notion of speaking to God directly is fear-inspiring in the Old Testament. Normally, the High Priest would go into the Holy of Holies once a year, on behalf of the people. If he was found unclean, he would be struck dead. So, that Moses spoke to God directly "face to face" does not necessarily imply that Moses looked literally into a physical face of God. Rather, that Moses spoke directly to him--like I would to you.

John 14:9: Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

If you know Jesus, you know the Father. There is nothing here to imply that the Father has a body.

2 Cor. 4:4: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Jesus is the image of his Father to us--the representation of Him. This does not imply that the Father has a body.

Hebrews 1:3: Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

Again, Jesus is the image or the representation of his Father.

In all these verses, if you PRESUPPOSE that the Father has a physical body, you can see it in the verses. If you assume that "God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship Him in spirit and in truth," well then, no such inference is necessary.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Let's start with the "Man is as God once was" quote. I believe it was from two early Mormon leaders. My understanding is that the quote is found nowhere in the Standard Works. Nevertheless, Prof. Robinson suggests that it is so pervasive in Mormon thinking, that it could be treated as such.

It is only that if a dog has puppies, they do not grow up to be anything less than their parentage. The scriptures do teach we are the offspring of God. How could we be anything less than our parentage. Yes some will get hit by the drunk truck, imorality truck, or apathy truck, or rationalizing truck and not make it to Godhood, but they do have the potential.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

<div class='quotemain'>

So what "form" do you perceive God to be in now, Jenda?

And btw, I'm simply wondering if you perceive God to be without form, and without body, parts, or passions, in agreement with the doctrine from other Christians, considering the fact that you once accepted the idea that God is in form like Man... or more correctly stated, that Man is in form like God?

I do not believe, and never have, that God has a body. I believe, and always have, that we are created in the spiritual image of God.

Hmm. I was under the impression that RLDS and LDS were agreed on that point.

And btw, I am simply trying to determine how far you have "fallen away" from ALL the beliefs you once had.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Genesis 1:27: So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

The fact that God created both Adam and Eve in his image, would suggest that the physical aspect of this image was not the focus. And indeed, is God then white? Middle-Eastern in appearance (like the Jews)? Why do we not all look like God (we're very different). So, how literal of an interpretation are we to have here?

Man and Woman are basically of the same "form", with a torso and head and arms and legs and all other body "parts". And yes, I am aware of the "differences" between men and women, just as I know God is "different" from Man, but the overall "form" is the same.

But instead of going through all of the Biblical quotes which you could twist and turn while stating that those scriptures don't necessarily imply that the form of God and Man is similar, I suggest that you focus more on the power of the resurrection to realize that God does indeed have a body.

Or in other words, once you know Jesus Christ does have a body, while also knowing that Jesus Christ is indeed God, there should be nothing stopping you from knowing that God does indeed have a body.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There are 5 principles I believe are necessary to understand G-d.

1. G-d will not do anything for man that man can do for himself.

2. G-d will do for man what man cannot do for himself.

3. G-d will not do anything for the eternal detriment of man.

4. G-d will do everything possible for the eternal benefit of man.

5. G-d will not do anything for man without man’s concurrence.

All of the above must be understood in the context of the other principles. It seems to me that whenever someone does not believe in G-d they do not understand how these principles operate in their life. When people do not think a prayer has been answered it is because they are trying to get G-d to violet one of these principles. I also believe these 5 principles define G-dly love.

BTW (PC) G-d is the only one I know that has ultimate power – I do not believe ultimate power ultimately corrupts. Selfishness ultimately corrupts.

The Traveler

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There are 5 principles I believe are necessary to understand G-d.

1. G-d will not do anything for man that man can do for himself.

2. G-d will do for man what man cannot do for himself.

3. G-d will not do anything for the eternal detriment of man.

4. G-d will do everything possible for the eternal benefit of man.

5. G-d will not do anything for man without man’s concurrence.

All of the above must be understood in the context of the other principles. It seems to me that whenever someone does not believe in G-d they do not understand how these principles operate in their life. When people do not think a prayer has been answered it is because they are trying to get G-d to violet one of these principles. I also believe these 5 principles define G-dly love.

BTW (PC) G-d is the only one I know that has ultimate power – I do not believe ultimate power ultimately corrupts. Selfishness ultimately corrupts.

The Traveler

I only take issue with #5. I don't know if the concurrence comes before or after with Paul/Saul and Alma the Younger. But they didn't seem to be all that willing to their call to repentence.

But then there might have been some agreement in their pre-existence that gave this concurrence in order to save them from themselves.

I do, however, heartily concur with your statement about power not being the corrupter in Gods case, and selfishness being a definite factor in corruption in man's case.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is only that if a dog has puppies, they do not grow up to be anything less than their parentage. The scriptures do teach we are the offspring of God. How could we be anything less than our parentage. Yes some will get hit by the drunk truck, imorality truck, or apathy truck, or rationalizing truck and not make it to Godhood, but they do have the potential.

Except that God did not "have us." God made us. We are his creation. So, just as my image might be in that lousy attempt at a drawing of an egg I did back in college (the teacher gave me a mercy C-grade), so God's image is in us, his highest creation. And yes, in glory we shall become "godlike." But, we will always be God's creation, He will always receive our worship, and I doubt that we shall ever receive worship from others. After all, we believe our God is the one true and living God over ALL creation.

Or in other words, once you know Jesus Christ does have a body, while also knowing that Jesus Christ is indeed God, there should be nothing stopping you from knowing that God does indeed have a body.

One of the doctrines that is a "divide" is this issue of whether God is three persons in one essence, or three persons in three essences. Mormons make a much more definite partition between the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, than does the rest of Christianity. Argued too rigidly, the three-essences position becomes tritheism. As FYI, most of Christianity believes that God never had a body until the incarnation of Jesus. Furthermore, we would see the "image of God" verses, of necessity, speaking of character, moral drive, etc., not a body, since we do not believe he has one. Likewise, Mormons see "image" and read "body" because they do believe he has one. The verses can be read both ways, but for the first 3300 years of Judeo-Christian practice, very few ever read of the Father as being corporeal.

BTW (PC) G-d is the only one I know that has ultimate power – I do not believe ultimate power ultimately corrupts. Selfishness ultimately corrupts.The Traveler

Lord Acton was speaking in the context of human politics. In the spiritual realm, you may be right. However, the reason I will never support a specifically Christian political party is that the Church had its crack and raw political power, and muffed up a few centuries quite badly.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

<div class='quotemain'>

There are 5 principles I believe are necessary to understand G-d.

1. G-d will not do anything for man that man can do for himself.

2. G-d will do for man what man cannot do for himself.

3. G-d will not do anything for the eternal detriment of man.

4. G-d will do everything possible for the eternal benefit of man.

5. G-d will not do anything for man without man’s concurrence.

All of the above must be understood in the context of the other principles. It seems to me that whenever someone does not believe in G-d they do not understand how these principles operate in their life. When people do not think a prayer has been answered it is because they are trying to get G-d to violet one of these principles. I also believe these 5 principles define G-dly love.

BTW (PC) G-d is the only one I know that has ultimate power – I do not believe ultimate power ultimately corrupts. Selfishness ultimately corrupts.

The Traveler

I only take issue with #5. I don't know if the concurrence comes before or after with Paul/Saul and Alma the Younger. But they didn't seem to be all that willing to their call to repentence.

But then there might have been some agreement in their pre-existence that gave this concurrence in order to save them from themselves.

I do, however, heartily concur with your statement about power not being the corrupter in Gods case, and selfishness being a definite factor in corruption in man's case.

<div class='quotemain'>

<div class='quotemain'>

There are 5 principles I believe are necessary to understand G-d.

1. G-d will not do anything for man that man can do for himself.

2. G-d will do for man what man cannot do for himself.

3. G-d will not do anything for the eternal detriment of man.

4. G-d will do everything possible for the eternal benefit of man.

5. G-d will not do anything for man without man’s concurrence.

All of the above must be understood in the context of the other principles. It seems to me that whenever someone does not believe in G-d they do not understand how these principles operate in their life. When people do not think a prayer has been answered it is because they are trying to get G-d to violet one of these principles. I also believe these 5 principles define G-dly love.

BTW (PC) G-d is the only one I know that has ultimate power – I do not believe ultimate power ultimately corrupts. Selfishness ultimately corrupts.

The Traveler

I only take issue with #5. I don't know if the concurrence comes before or after with Paul/Saul and Alma the Younger. But they didn't seem to be all that willing to their call to repentence.

But then there might have been some agreement in their pre-existence that gave this concurrence in order to save them from themselves.

I do, however, heartily concur with your statement about power not being the corrupter in Gods case, and selfishness being a definite factor in corruption in man's case.

I think God is spelled "G O D" not "G-D". There is something unsettling about that to me.

No matter what we are Father's children and those who choose to believe in a vaporous, vague, power,etc. as the father of thier souls, go for it. Somethings are true whether you believe them or not. B)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share