The Bishop

[Landy77]

I was speaking with the Bishop about a few concerns I had with my wife. One day the Bishop was not available and I spoke with the second counselor. The next day my wife was questioning me about what I had said. The second counselor had told the secretary what we talked about and then the secretary asked about the details with my wife on Sunday. I have lost faith in the Bishop and do not see anything productive in meeting with him again.

[NeuroTypical]

So, ok. Is there a question or something?

[Wingnut]

I was speaking with the Bishop about a few concerns I had with my wife. One day the Bishop was not available and I spoke with the second counselor. The next day my wife was questioning me about what I had said. The second counselor had told the secretary what we talked about and then the secretary asked about the details with my wife on Sunday. I have lost faith in the Bishop and do not see anything productive in meeting with him again.

Why? The bishop didn't do anything wrong. It was his counselor that was out of line.

[Landy77]

When I said the Bishop I meant the Bishopric. Seems there is no training for how to be one.

[Guest mormonmusic]

I hate to sound cynical, but I've found there isn't the level of confidentiality I'd like to see in the Church, unfortunately. This is a case in point. However, I've found it tends to vary from ward to ward. In some Wards, it was air tight and inspiring. When I was in leadership, in one ward there were definite limits on what I could know, with strict reminders about confidentiality to all leaders from the Bishop. It was as confidential as one would expect it to be; in other wards, not so.

In other wards, I knew things as a priesthood leader I don't think I should've been privvy to. And also, leaders who may not have had much experience in leadership sometimes don't understand the need for confidentiality, and have shared things they shouldn't have with me.

Personally, I would see a marriage counselor rather than a the Bishop over marital issues. First for the confidentiality. And second, the Bishops aren't trained to give marriage counsel that I'm aware of. I don't think you even need to see the Bishop for a referral to LDS Social Services for counselling.

So, I suggest you still look at the Bishop as the leader of the Ward, and with respect for his office, but take this as one of those life experiences where you learn something....that confidentiality isn't as tight as we might hope in local Church circles.

[MormonMama]

It just backs up that saying that the Church is perfect but the people in it aren't.

I'd bring up this lack of confidentiality with your Bishop. He needs to know that his counselors are discussing things with others that they shouldn't be. He can't correct the problem if he doesn't know about it. If he won't take action, go to the Stake leadership. This is not okay and shouldn't be brushed off.

[prospectmom]

A huge breach and you should talk directly to the bishop about it . They are human and I am sure did not purposfully speak when they shouldn't of. Your faith should be in God The Bishop and his councilars are people who work fulltime jobs and devote their time to serve in the church . Do not jump tp conclusions and talk to the Bishop.

[UrbanFool]

Maybe it's because I'm a convert, but I can't imagine talking to my Bishop about anything personal that wasn't church related.

[Wingnut]

On the contrary, Landy, there is training available for bishops. Counselors, however, are not supposed to meet with ward members regarding sins, transgressions, or other worthiness issues. The help minister to the ward, but do not hold any keys to its administration. Your concerns (worthiness or otherwise) should have been discussed only with the bishop.

[Tarnished]

I agree with Wingnut on this one, there is no way I would go to one of the Bishop's counselors over something private. There are certain things that they are advised on keeping to themselves, but they are not in the same position as the Bishop, they are not to fill in for him when it comes to confessions by ward members. The counselor should not have told anyone about what you talked to him about, but he is not trained in the same way as the bishop would have been.

[john doe]

When I said the Bishop I meant the Bishopric. Seems there is no training for how to be one.

Wrong. Sometimes people with loose lips forget they have responsibilities towards confidentiality. The problem is with that single person, not bishops or bishoprics in general.

[MarginOfError]

I'm assuming when you say secretary you mean the bishop's executive secretary. I don't see the counselor sharing details of a conversation with the executive secretary to be a breach of confidentiality. When counselors, clerks, and secretaries are called, they are charged with the same responsibility for confidentiality as the bishop. Often, these are the first people the bishop will counsel with in bishopric meeting. Other times, the clerks and secretaries are just around when the bishopric needs to discuss something. At times, the secretary needs to know details about a situation to be sure that the right appointments are set up.

I'd be more concerned that the secretary opened the discussion with your wife. That never should have happened and I'm sorry it did. This should most definitely be addressed with the bishop and confidentiality should be revisited.

[jayanna]

I am very sorry this has happened to you.

I hope that it did not cause a huge rift between you and your spouse.

I am the wife of a bishopric counselor, and I would like to share with you a couple of things I have learned about that role, as for us, anyway.

My hubby has been specially trained not to deal with problems like the one you are describing, if it is an issue with sin, or temple worthiness, marriage problems, etc. he is supposed to immediately refer that person to the bishop. This can be hard for some people to understand, I had a hard time understanding this at first as well. People kind of expect him to know a lot of things that he just doesn't, he doesn't have a level of revelation except for what he is responsible for. In my hubby's case, it is the primary and the needs of the primary teachers/presidency, etc.

He does do temple interviews, but again, if a problem arises, he sets up another interview for them with the bishop. I only know this b/c he was nervous about doing interviews when he was first called, then one day someone had mention that he had interviewed several people. I didn't know that he had, so I asked him if he was doing okay at it, he said he was doing great considering if there is ever a problem, he sends them on over to the next office, and then does his best to forget what the problem was.

They do discuss issues with welfare, and missionary work, priesthood preparation, and things like that...to coordinate helps for members, and often the secretary is in some meetings for notes, etc.

I know that my hubby does not discuss personal problems between married couples and such, unless I'm really about to put my foot in it, b/c one time I was organizing a reception for a family that was getting sealed. I was planning to ask a lovely, young married sis. to sing a certain song for the event, and not take no for an answer. (I am a little pushy) and he stopped me...he told me that it would not be a good idea just then. He didn't say why, and I didn't ask, I didn't tell anyone, but I just figured that it would be insensitive for some reason. She did not come to the reception at all, which made me worry a little, she is usually such a sweet, open, friendly person. A couple of months later she shared test. of the troubles they had had recently and how they overcame them with the Lord's help...I was so glad that he had stopped me from making her feel worse. I know how hard it is to see someone talk about getting sealed when you feel like you can't be with someone for eternity, it always made me cry, too.

I am sure that they wanted to help you, but they did the wrong thing. I hope you can forgive them, and please tell the bishop what happened and how you feel about it. He can't fix it if he doesn't know what happened. I know he cares about you, please be patient.

Maybe you could just explain to your wife that you just want to make your marriage better, and ask if you could see the bishop together sometime.

Please let us know how things go.

Edited August 27, 2010 by jayanna

[BenRaines]

I have two friends that have been Bishops and I was a Branch President. None of us even talked to our wives about what we were told while in those callings.

It is unfortunate that this has happened but again the counselor should have known that it was not his role to discuss those things with you. It is only the Bishop's calling.

Ben Raines

[Suzie]

My Bishop is a family friend, has been for many years (before becoming a Bishop). However, in the past he would come home and share some of the problems he was dealing with members of the ward as well as providing information that we thought was confidential. We were very disappointed because we love him very much, however we kindly told him that we don't want to hear about other people's problems because those things are confidential but it seems that every time he would see us he would unconsciously drop a piece of information about someone. He stopped after many talks and hints, it was a sad experience.

[astral]

There is a church handbook for stake presidency and bishoprics. I got my copy from the internet. This is what is said about your particular issue.

[rubondfan2]

I was speaking with the Bishop about a few concerns I had with my wife.

Excellent choice. This is one of the roles ideally suited to a Bishop. They are called and set apart with specific keys to minister to the individual members of the ward over whom they have been called to officiate.

One day the Bishop was not available and I spoke with the second counselor.

Unfortunately, this was not the right thing to do. I will assume that you are fairly new to the church and in that case, I will say "shame on the counselor" for meeting with you. The counselor should have known better and clearly some training is needed within the Bishopric in your particular ward over what is and is not within the purview of counselors to the Bishop.

The fact that the counselor went on to not hold your discussion in confidence is further disturbing to me, but we are in fact, all of us human and mortal and we do make mistakes and make choices that hurt others. You will need to find forgiveness within your own heart for this individual's actions. And they do have a responsibility, in my opinion, to repent for their breach of confidence.

On a more general level of discussion of church organization and government; the Bishop is the ONLY person within the ward leadership who holds the keys to be able to counsel members regarding worthiness, personal or financial matters. All other leaders (Relief Society Presidents, Elders Quorum Presidents, etc.) should all be counseled not to enter into discussions of a personal nature with members of the ward regarding personal worthiness or financial matters. These topics WILL certainly come up as ward leaders and home and visiting teachers are being diligent in their duties, but thier responsibility is only to get basic information and then carry that information to the Bishop through the committee meetings or direct communication with him. The bottom line is not to shut someone off when they feel the spirit prompting them to reach out for help... but when they do and they begin to open up detail to someone other than the Bishop, then the correct step is to provide a supportive and understanding heart and to indicate that this conversation is more appropriate for the Bishop and that you will help them to get in touch with him to get the spiritual/financial/personal counsel and guidance they need.

Edited August 27, 2010 by rubondfan2

[Guest mormonmusic]

It just backs up that saying that the Church is perfect but the people in it aren't.

Be careful you don't say that one around my wife!!! For her, that statement is a licence for people in Church leadership positions to do whatever they please without any kind of accountability or impunity.

She prefers -- "the Gospel is perfect but the Church isn't" because the Church IS the people, and is merely the delivery system of the Gospel. Without the people, the Church would be a set of empty buildings....

I tend to agree with her on this one....

Edited August 27, 2010 by mormonmusic

[astral]

This is what is instructed for the stake presidency and bishoprics on how to handle confidential matters.

[wonderwoman1115]

you are only hurting yourself by not talking to the bishop.. he is there for guidence and you shouldnt be hiding from your wife anyways.. maybe your wife had to be confronted.. sounded to me that you had no plans in telling her.. you wife deserves to be confronted when you have concerns about her.. youll lose trust if you dont..

[pam]

you are only hurting yourself by not talking to the bishop.. he is there for guidence and you shouldnt be hiding from your wife anyways.. maybe your wife had to be confronted.. sounded to me that you had no plans in telling her.. you wife deserves to be confronted when you have concerns about her.. youll lose trust if you dont..

Not sure how you got the idea he was hiding from his wife. Perhaps he was going to the Bishop to discuss how best to handle the issue he was in.

I've gone to the Bishop to discuss issues I have with my kids in the past. Doesn't mean I'm hiding from them. Just wanted his spiritual guidance.

[astral]

This is how the stake presidency and bishoprics are to handle confidential matters.

[pam]

Please do not post copyrighted material.

[astral]

This is how the stake presidency and bishoprics are to handle confidential matters..

[pam]

I'm going to state it one more time. Please do not post copies of copyrighted material.