Buffetings of Satan

[classylady]

What do you think the "buffetings of Satan" are? I've been reading D&C 82 and in verse 21 it says "And the soul that sins against this covenant, and hardeneth his heart against it, shall be dealt with according to the laws of my church, and shall be delivered over to the buffetings of Satan until the day of redemption." Just curious if anyone has any ideas?

[pam]

The way I interpret this is, this was said at a time when the United Order was in place. But as with any covenant made, those that go against it or apostasize can be turned over to the buffetings of Satan. Meaning they are subject to the all the temptations and torment that Satan can dish out.

Edited February 26, 2011 by pam
darn spelling

[slamjet]

I can assure you, on this subject it is best to say: stay close to the Lord and the Church and to avoid it because that buffeting is a lot more than it sounds. Delving into it will only bring a bad spirit and is not worth it. One needs not explore it to know it's bad.

[Seminarysnoozer]

What do you think the "buffetings of Satan" are? I've been reading D&C 82 and in verse 21 it says "And the soul that sins against this covenant, and hardeneth his heart against it, shall be dealt with according to the laws of my church, and shall be delivered over to the buffetings of Satan until the day of redemption." Just curious if anyone has any ideas?

It, in part, means that if we are carnally minded we give heed to Satan's influences more and more.

“All beings who have bodies have power over those who have not. The devil has no power over us only as we permit him. The moment we revolt at anything which comes from God, the devil takes power” (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, sel. Joseph Fielding Smith [1976], 181).

The buffetings of Satan mostly come from the desires of the body, the carnal mind. These are things like greed, desire for power, perverse sexual drives, anger and even things like hunger and thirst (like the brother who sold his birthright for food), etc.

“The spirit is pure, and under the special control and influence of the Lord, but the body is of the earth, and is subject to the power of the Devil, and is under the mighty influence of that fallen nature that is of the earth. If the spirit yields to the body, the Devil then has power to overcome the body and spirit of that man, and he loses both.

“Recollect, brethren and sisters, every one of you, that when evil is suggested to you, when it arises in your hearts, it is through the temporal organization. When you are tempted, buffeted, and step out of the way inadvertently; when you are overtaken in a fault, or commit an overt act unthinkingly; when you are full of evil passion, and wish to yield to it, then stop and let the spirit, which God has put into your tabernacles, take the lead. If you do that, I will promise that you will overcome all evil, and obtain eternal lives. But many, very many, let the spirit yield to the body, and are overcome and destroyed” (Discourses of Brigham Young, sel. John A. Widtsoe [1941], 70).

[classylady]

Being delivered over to the buffetings of Satan is definitely something to avoid. I wonder if part of the buffetings of Satan could be the heartache and problems that follow from choosing a lifestyle that is not centered on Gospel principles? Or is that just the consequences of that lifestyle?

[pam]

Being delivered over to the buffetings of Satan is definitely something to avoid. I wonder if part of the buffetings of Satan could be the heartache and problems that follow from choosing a lifestyle that is not centered on Gospel principles? Or is that just the consequences of that lifestyle?

I think it could be both. Consequences would be being turned over to Satan. The heartache and problems would come with the numerous temptations you would be forced to endure through it all. Just my opinion of course.

[slamjet]

D&C 101:2-9

2. I, the Lord, have suffered the affliction to come upon them, wherewith they have been afflicted, in consequence of their transgressions;

3. Yet I will own them, and they shall be mine in that day when I shall come to make up my jewels.

4. Therefore, they must needs be chastened and tried, even as Abraham, who was commanded to offer up his only son.

5. For all those who will not endure chastening, but deny me, cannot be sanctified.

6. Behold, I say unto you, there were jarrings, and contentions, and envyings, and strifes, and lustful and covetous desires among them; therefore by these things they polluted their inheritances.

7. They were slow to hearken unto the voice of the Lord their God; therefore, the Lord their God is slow to hearken unto their prayers, to answer them in the day of their trouble.

8. In the day of their peace they esteemed lightly my counsel; but, in the day of their trouble, of necessity they feel after me.

9. Verily I say unto you, notwithstanding their sins, my bowels are filled with compassion towards them. I will not utterly cast them off; and in the day of wrath I will remember mercy.

To be turned over to the buffetings of Satan is really our choice since it's not a matter that God will not strive with us, but that he loves us enough to allow us to learn through experience. However, I truly believe that he will not allow Satan to overwhelm us if we turn back to Him and heed his warnings. I'm not sure if a lot of the Saints understand just how compassionate, just and loving our Father in Heaven is to us all.

[pam]

I'm not sure I truly have an understanding of it. I understand it but not how deeply it goes.

[slamjet]

I don't think we as mortals can understand it all. But I have found that most Christians in and out of the Church don't understand that he's here to love us, not punish us. It may be the example of earthly parental figures that get's in the way.

[classylady]

I wonder if the experiences of Job were the buffetings of Satan? Or did the Lord just allow physical nature to take its course? And of course we need to be careful not to judge. Just because calamity befalls a person does not mean they are not righteous.

[pam]

That's very true. Bad things happen to good people all the time.

[Traveler]

We learn in the garden of G-d that Satan has power to bring spiritual harm. The promise of G-d is that Satan will not have power to destroy an individual - but the protections that G-d offers will be removed allowing Satan to do spiritual harm. But in the end, as prophesied, Jesus will free the captive souls from death and hell. Until delivered the spirits in prison will be subject to the buffetings of Satan.

The Traveler

[rameumptom]

I think that the buffetings of Satan is what occurs to a person either in this life or in the Spirit World, where we stare guilt of sin in the face and suffer until we are fully and completely ready to repent of all our sins.

Alma 36 gives us an idea of what it might be like in the Spirit World for those who have yet to repent. In D&C 19, the Savior warns that if we do not repent, we must suffer even as he did. We will essentially be left alone, without the Holy Spirit to protect us, to stare Satan's power in the face and realize our wickedness. And we'll stay in that way until we humble ourselves sufficiently to fully repent. Note that Alma required 3 days to get to the point of full repentance. Others who are harder headed could take decades or centuries before they would be ready to repent. And Sons of Perdition would thrive in such pain and guilt (see Cain as Master Mahan glorying in his brother's death). For them, the atonement of Christ has no affect, and so they end up with a kingdom without glory.

I will note that I believe that Christ had to suffer this way: the presence of the Godhead (Father and Holy Ghost) removed from him (My God, why hast thou forsaken me?), so that he had to face perdition alone. He stared our sins and evil in the face, and bore the pain of it all (D&C 19). And he did this, even though he was sinless, in order to understand what the rest of us will suffer if we choose to sin and not repent.

Edited February 28, 2011 by rameumptom

[Seminarysnoozer]

I think that the buffetings of Satan is what occurs to a person either in this life or in the Spirit World, where we stare guilt of sin in the face and suffer until we are fully and completely ready to repent of all our sins.

Alma 36 gives us an idea of what it might be like in the Spirit World for those who have yet to repent. In D&C 19, the Savior warns that if we do not repent, we must suffer even as he did. We will essentially be left alone, without the Holy Spirit to protect us, to stare Satan's power in the face and realize our wickedness. And we'll stay in that way until we humble ourselves sufficiently to fully repent. Note that Alma required 3 days to get to the point of full repentance. Others who are harder headed could take decades or centuries before they would be ready to repent. And Sons of Perdition would thrive in such pain and guilt (see Cain as Master Mahan glorying in his brother's death). For them, the atonement of Christ has no affect, and so they end up with a kingdom without glory.

I will note that I believe that Christ had to suffer this way: the presence of the Godhead (Father and Holy Ghost) removed from him (My God, why hast thou forsaken me?), so that he had to face perdition alone. He stared our sins and evil in the face, and bore the pain of it all (D&C 19). And he did this, even though he was sinless, in order to understand what the rest of us will suffer if we choose to sin and not repent.

Can you tell me more of where I can find information about Satan continuing his buffetings in Spirit Prison. This is news to me. I guess I have always looked at "buffetings" as further temptations towards things that lead to misery. I didn't know that Satan had power to further tempt people even further away from what they've done here. I guess if one looked at "buffetings" as distractions from truth then I suppose that might continue, I have a hard time understanding how deception and lies will continue in Spirit Prison. If that is the case then it seems that it would be just as hard for someone to accept the truth in Spirit Prison as it was here for them.

[slamjet]

The only thing I can think is that we will be taking our addictions, habits, quirks and personalities with us. Thus the need to smoke without cigarettes would be a certain type of hell. But I've never heard of Satan nor his angels inhabiting the Spirit World let alone Spirit Prison.

[jayanna]

There is an excellent chapter in the Gospel Principles book about this. Gospel Principles Chapter 41: The Postmortal Spirit World

Satan is not in the spirit world, he was sent to this world, and this world is where he must stay: however, the things that he has ensnared us with in this world (addictions, ignorance, intolerance, hate) we can carry with us into the next. Those things, inluding our guilty conciences, will torment us, therefore causing our own prison if we do not accept the atonement to pay the price for our sins.

[rameumptom]

Can you tell me more of where I can find information about Satan continuing his buffetings in Spirit Prison. This is news to me. I guess I have always looked at "buffetings" as further temptations towards things that lead to misery. I didn't know that Satan had power to further tempt people even further away from what they've done here. I guess if one looked at "buffetings" as distractions from truth then I suppose that might continue, I have a hard time understanding how deception and lies will continue in Spirit Prison. If that is the case then it seems that it would be just as hard for someone to accept the truth in Spirit Prison as it was here for them.

While they are called the "buffetings of Satan", I do not believe Satan will necessarily be involved. Instead, what will occur is we shall be placed alone with our guilt (Alma 11-12) and have no place to hide from it. It is the point where we pay for all of our unrepented of sins. And we keep paying or suffering for them until we fully and completely repent.

That is the issue here: choosing or not choosing to repent. Until we fully lay bare our soul and give it to Christ, he cannot save us. This is why Nephi tells us that even the smallest of sins can keep us from God's presence, because for that small amount of sin, we have refused to repent and turn to Christ. It is an all or nothing approach to salvation. We must fully turn completely to Christ to be saved in a kingdom of glory. And until we do, we are left to ourselves to deal with our own sins face to face.

Once we truly repent fully, THEN we are released from Spirit Prison hell, where we have tasted Outer Darkness. According to Alma, the joy is as exquisite as the pain was. And Satan wasn't there, but the sinner faces perdition alone, until he seeks a full rescue from Christ.

[Seminarysnoozer]

While they are called the "buffetings of Satan", I do not believe Satan will necessarily be involved. Instead, what will occur is we shall be placed alone with our guilt (Alma 11-12) and have no place to hide from it. It is the point where we pay for all of our unrepented of sins. And we keep paying or suffering for them until we fully and completely repent.

That is the issue here: choosing or not choosing to repent. Until we fully lay bare our soul and give it to Christ, he cannot save us. This is why Nephi tells us that even the smallest of sins can keep us from God's presence, because for that small amount of sin, we have refused to repent and turn to Christ. It is an all or nothing approach to salvation. We must fully turn completely to Christ to be saved in a kingdom of glory. And until we do, we are left to ourselves to deal with our own sins face to face.

Once we truly repent fully, THEN we are released from Spirit Prison hell, where we have tasted Outer Darkness. According to Alma, the joy is as exquisite as the pain was. And Satan wasn't there, but the sinner faces perdition alone, until he seeks a full rescue from Christ.

I think some view the "buffetings of Satan" as part of the refiners fire. It is the opposition that allows us to require the saving graces from God. Like Peter's thorn in the flesh, it can allow us to grow. So, to me, the "buffetings" must occur during a time when refinement or change of heart can take place. Can a person have a "change of heart" while in Spirit Prison or is it the same "heart" that was here on Earth, just that they never had a chance to receive the gospel?

[rameumptom]

I believe there is a difference. Refiner's fire is used to purify that which is mostly pure already. It is refining.

The buffetings of Satan are done to compel people to humble themselves, in order for them to repent.

We go to college to refine our knowledge of the things we learned in high school. We go to prison to learn the things we should have learned, but chose to rebel against, instead.

[classylady]

In the book "The Miracle of Forgiveness" Spencer W. Kimball says "A phrase that occurs several times in modern revelation should certainly be an incentive to prompt, unreserved repentance. This term talks of sinners being delivered to the "buffetings of Satan."...

To some of the Church members earlier in our dispensation who had broken their covenants and thereby come under condemnation, the Lord stated: Therefore, inasmuch as you are found transgressors, you cannot escape my wrath in your lives. Inasmuch as ye are cut off for transgression, ye cannot escape the buffetings of Satan until the day of redemption...D&C 104:8-10J...

Similarly in the revelation relating to the new and everlasting covenant, the Lord emphasizes the seriousness of certain transgressions by saying that even though the offenders may be redeemed and finally be exalted, "they shall be ...delivered unto the buffetings of Satan unto the day of redemption, saith the Lord God." D&C 132:26"

Just what constitutes the "buffetings of Satan" no one knows except those who experience them, but I have seen many people who have been buffeted in life after they have come to themselves and realized to some degree the horror of their acts. If their sufferings were not the "buffetings of Satan," they must be a near approach to them. Certainly they reflect great sorrow, anguish of soul, shame, remorse, and physical and mental suffering. Perhaps this condition approaches the sufferings of which the Lord spoke when he said: But if they would not repent they must suffer even as I: Which suffering caused myself, even God, the greatest of all, to tremble because of pain, and to bleed at every pore, and to suffer both body and spirit...(D&C 19:17-18)"

In the last paragraph that I quoted by Spencer W. Kimball it sounds like even after repentance you might still be buffeted by Satan "I have seen many people who have been buffeted in life after they have come to themselves and realized to some degree the horror of their acts." Maybe, (and this is just classylady's observation) it is part of the repentance process--repentance being a process, not a single act. Because I think once the repentance process is complete, forgiveness of yourself sometimes is the last to come. Once you can forgive yourself, peace seems to come, and you're no longer "harrowed up" by the sin/sins.

[RipplecutBuddha]

What do you think the "buffetings of Satan" are? I've been reading D&C 82 and in verse 21 it says "And the soul that sins against this covenant, and hardeneth his heart against it, shall be dealt with according to the laws of my church, and shall be delivered over to the buffetings of Satan until the day of redemption." Just curious if anyone has any ideas?

Just imagine being stuck in Margaritaville as a Mormon....unable to drink alcohol....seems rough to me....

Buffetings.....Jimmy Buffet......nvm

[rameumptom]

Can we at least sway to the music and wear bright flowery shirts?

[Matthew0059]

Buffeting:

–noun

1. a blow, as with the hand or fist.

2. a violent shock or concussion.

–verb (used with object)

3. to strike, as with the hand or fist.

4. to strike against or push repeatedly: The wind buffeted the house.

5. to contend against; battle.

–verb (used without object)

6. to struggle with blows of hand or fist.

7. to force one's way by a fight, struggle, etc.

The buffetings of Satan are the blows that Satan strikes us in our constant battle against our carnal man and him. While the unrighteous and unrepentant are offered no special protection because of their wickedness, the righteous and penitant also experience such buffeting as an experience for their greater glory. The question is: will they give in to the fear and pain that Satan brings (see Moses 1, where Moses began to fear and saw "the bitterness of hell" when Satan raged against him), or will they call on GOD and the SON of GOD for deliverance (as did Moses)?

The key for enduring is to keep looking to CHRIST with an eye of faith as much as possible, and not giving into the temptations to do evil. Buffetings are always accompanied with an "out" that Satan gives- for example, he may tell you you are a social outcast and will only be popular (and have your 'outcast' status and its shame removed) if you do drugs, fornicate, etc.

The buffetings of Satan are all spiritual and often come when we are already wearied by physical trials. The buffetings are quite literally Satan and his minions raining blows onto our spirits in an attempt to get us to falter and fall.

[rameumptom]

I think we give too much power to Satan sometimes. Buffetings can come through natural means without Satan being involved. If God removes his Spirit from us, then just the fact we have lost the Spirit can cause buffetings without Satan being in the room. I've known several ex'ed members who have mourned the loss of such light, while they've worked towards full repentance and membership. And Satan wasn't involved in that struggle.

[Seminarysnoozer]

I think we give too much power to Satan sometimes. Buffetings can come through natural means without Satan being involved. If God removes his Spirit from us, then just the fact we have lost the Spirit can cause buffetings without Satan being in the room. I've known several ex'ed members who have mourned the loss of such light, while they've worked towards full repentance and membership. And Satan wasn't involved in that struggle.

Yes, I agree, that is why I think the buffetings of Satan come from our corrupted, carnal bodies. This is why the natural man is an enemy to God.