Is "sexual attraction" an innate characteristic of the spirit or body or both? (not gender)


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Is "sexual attraction" an innate characteristic of the spirit or body or both? (not gender)

We know that gender and sexual attraction are two different things. In the pre-earthly life we had gender. I don’t think there is anything specifically written or previously discussed by the Church authorities that says we had sexual attractions in the pre-earthly life, that would seem strange to me. Please let me know if I am wrong. We are told that our bodies are a gift in this life and allow us to participate in reproduction. It being a gift, meaning we did not have it before. And I think most would agree that procreation in the next life is given only to those with Celestial glorified bodies.

From that, I am wondering how many would go as far as saying that ‘sexual attraction’ (of any kind) is not an innate characteristic of our spirits. It is not a spiritual, personality or spiritually ‘natural’ drive. I would think that if it was, all those that end up in the Terrestrial and Telestial Kingdoms would suffer forever.

I am pondering the idea that spirits can have gender without sexual attractions, and that sexual attractions require a physical body.

This is not to say that while we were in the pre-earthly existence we saw God and wanted to be like Him in every way and therefore could have desires to someday have sexual attractions and have what He has. But, I don’t think that necessarily means that ‘sexual attraction’ is an innate characteristic of the spirit being, even though gender is. This may be hard to comprehend because I think in this existence we equate gender with sexual attraction. I think it is possible though to have ‘gender’ characteristics, whatever they are, without sexual attractions in the spirit form without a body. I also think that the physical body of those that will not have procreation power in the next life may still have gender but likely will not have sexual attractions.

I am curious if that fits with what you understand. Thanks.

Edited by Seminarysnoozer
typo
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Not that I've thought about this for any length of time at all...

But, for the split second that I thought about it to answer your question... sexual attraction is a chemical reaction requiring blood flow. So, yeah, physical. Totally. The trigger? Love. Spiritual. And love is all encompassing if exercised in purity.

And I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say... EVERYBODY is resurrected. Not just Celestial beings. So, you can be in Telestial world and still have a body.

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I would definitely say sexual attraction in its purely carnal form is attached only to bodies. This isn't to say our spirits aren't capable of true love.

But if bodies are something to be desired, it certainly means sexual attraction is a good thing.

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you are assuming a perfected body still has a sexual drive. could be like eating... you can eat but you don't get hungry or need to.... ???

That's true, I did assume that. Yet if sex is considered near unto godliness and so necessary for creation, why would a sex drive be invalid? Though I could imagine a more perfected sex drive....

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not everyone will be able to create. the point of a sex drive is for creation, to ensure the next generation. if you can't have a next generation then there is no need for the drive. we don't actually know how perfected bodies create the next generation of spirits so to assume we know what kind (if any) sex drive will exist is just.... wishful thinking?

as for the op i'd say gender is eternal and existed before, here, and will exist later. there was no sexual attraction in the pre existence because it is a function of this body. if there is a sex drive that will exist after the resurrection i don't know. if there is one it won't be like it is here. even if there is no drive i do think there will be a certain amount of sexual attraction that will exist. we will have a memory of experiences here, for those that have relationships there i think there will be an attraction and desire to continue the intimate connection we had here. possibly more of a conscious choice than a drive from the body. something we dictate rather than struggle to control.

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I would think that there would be, in some form. Especially since one has to be married and sealed eternally...why the emphasis on marriage if all aspects of marriage didn't continue? The way I see it could be we have this mortal sex drive now, which after all is said and done will go from being imperfect to perfect just like the rest of us.

But I also think the colors, tastes, ect., we have in this life time are at a telestial level, since that's the state this earth is in, and when we (if we are so judged) become a Celestial state, everything is going to get better, more fulfilled, prettier, more wonderful. I think our mortal bodies see and feel as a mortal body, not as a glorified beings, which means, to me, it's all going to be much better. That said there could be something far greater and more fulfilling for married couples to express their love once they have a resurected glorified body

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Is "sexual attraction" an innate characteristic of the spirit or body or both? (not gender)

We know that gender and sexual attraction are two different things. In the pre-earthly life we had gender. I don’t think there is anything specifically written or previously discussed by the Church authorities that says we had sexual attractions in the pre-earthly life, that would seem strange to me. Please let me know if I am wrong. We are told that our bodies are a gift in this life and allow us to participate in reproduction. It being a gift, meaning we did not have it before. And I think most would agree that procreation in the next life is given only to those with Celestial glorified bodies.

From that, I am wondering how many would go as far as saying that ‘sexual attraction’ (of any kind) is not an innate characteristic of our spirits. It is not a spiritual, personality or spiritually ‘natural’ drive. I would think that if it was, all those that end up in the Terrestrial and Telestial Kingdoms would suffer forever.

I am pondering the idea that spirits can have gender without sexual attractions, and that sexual attractions require a physical body.

This is not to say that while we were in the pre-earthly existence we saw God and wanted to be like Him in every way and therefore could have desires to someday have sexual attractions and have what He has. But, I don’t think that necessarily means that ‘sexual attraction’ is an innate characteristic of the spirit being, even though gender is. This may be hard to comprehend because I think in this existence we equate gender with sexual attraction. I think it is possible though to have ‘gender’ characteristics, whatever they are, without sexual attractions in the spirit form without a body. I also think that the physical body of those that will not have procreation power in the next life may still have gender but likely will not have sexual attractions.

I am curious if that fits with what you understand. Thanks.

while there is some physical tie in it, a lot of (i'd say the grand majority) what becomes attractive to a person is through psychological developement, which is afffected by tons of different factors. Edited by Blackmarch
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Not that I've thought about this for any length of time at all...

But, for the split second that I thought about it to answer your question... sexual attraction is a chemical reaction requiring blood flow. So, yeah, physical. Totally. The trigger? Love. Spiritual. And love is all encompassing if exercised in purity.

And I'm not quite sure what you're trying to say... EVERYBODY is resurrected. Not just Celestial beings. So, you can be in Telestial world and still have a body.

Yes, but they are different bodies, one of Celestial glory as the sun, etc. Only one body type has the power to procreate.

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I would think that there would be, in some form. Especially since one has to be married and sealed eternally...why the emphasis on marriage if all aspects of marriage didn't continue? The way I see it could be we have this mortal sex drive now, which after all is said and done will go from being imperfect to perfect just like the rest of us.

But I also think the colors, tastes, ect., we have in this life time are at a telestial level, since that's the state this earth is in, and when we (if we are so judged) become a Celestial state, everything is going to get better, more fulfilled, prettier, more wonderful. I think our mortal bodies see and feel as a mortal body, not as a glorified beings, which means, to me, it's all going to be much better. That said there could be something far greater and more fulfilling for married couples to express their love once they have a resurected glorified body

Even though the state of the Earth is in a Telestial state, I think the gift of procreation is an additional gift beyond the "state" we are in that God gives via our bodies. If that continues in the next life as such then one would have to say there is a drive for sex but no procreation in the Telestial kingdom. I don't see that happening. That is why I wonder if "sexual drives" and attractions, even in the state we are in now, come from the body.

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Sexual attraction diminishes with age. It is a fact of nature. It is a hormone thing. Love, which is different and I think confuses some into thinking that it is sexual attraction, is different. When a man is in his teens and early twenties, love is pretty much a foreign concept. That doesn't mean he can't love. It is just that sex is as real as the day is long and to really understand love takes time. If a man is lucky enough to find a lovely daughter of Heavenly Father who can tolerate him for the first ten or fifteen years, he can then begin understand what true love is. The ability to love transcends the veil but I doubt whether in our perfected pre-mortal state would could understand it as well.

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We aren't told how FATHER procreates. Suffice to say that the means of procreation are really divinely appointed, and is either the literal process whereby FATHER procreates or is symbolic of a grander, holier process.

My opinion: as we understand it, sexual attraction is new to our physical bodies. Yet the quintessential characteristics embodied in gender are eternal, and I believe we felt an attraction to members of the opposite gender before this earth life, though not necessarily a sexual one.

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I guess the question is, are any of those factors at play before we receive a body?

As far as I can remember, no. There was a curiosity about the 'oneness' of it as described by others, I definitely remember having heard about it and being curious...but it could not be fully understood until we came here.

We also don't look the same as we did then, if that makes any difference to you in the attraction idea. We did not look anything like what we do now, really. Well, we had a bit of a shape, but not the color, or texture that we have now. We lacked definition of our finer features.

Our personalities were more prevalent than our appearances, and we were much more like children...not having an understanding of some things, and knowing that we didn't understand it. Having no experience, we mostly just knew what we were told.

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As far as I can remember, no. There was a curiosity about the 'oneness' of it as described by others, I definitely remember having heard about it and being curious...but it could not be fully understood until we came here.

We also don't look the same as we did then, if that makes any difference to you in the attraction idea. We did not look anything like what we do now, really. Well, we had a bit of a shape, but not the color, or texture that we have now. We lacked definition of our finer features.

Our personalities were more prevalent than our appearances, and we were much more like children...not having an understanding of some things, and knowing that we didn't understand it. Having no experience, we mostly just knew what we were told.

You and I think a lot alike. Thanks.

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We aren't told how FATHER procreates. Suffice to say that the means of procreation are really divinely appointed, and is either the literal process whereby FATHER procreates or is symbolic of a grander, holier process.

My opinion: as we understand it, sexual attraction is new to our physical bodies. Yet the quintessential characteristics embodied in gender are eternal, and I believe we felt an attraction to members of the opposite gender before this earth life, though not necessarily a sexual one.

I realize our words are limited in this context but why would we "feel" an attraction towards the opposite gender and not more of a need to be around the opposite gender maybe, as Jayanna puts it a "oneness"?

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Sexual attraction diminishes with age. It is a fact of nature. It is a hormone thing. Love, which is different and I think confuses some into thinking that it is sexual attraction, is different. When a man is in his teens and early twenties, love is pretty much a foreign concept. That doesn't mean he can't love. It is just that sex is as real as the day is long and to really understand love takes time. If a man is lucky enough to find a lovely daughter of Heavenly Father who can tolerate him for the first ten or fifteen years, he can then begin understand what true love is. The ability to love transcends the veil but I doubt whether in our perfected pre-mortal state would could understand it as well.

Is this kind of love you are talking about (different than the love of Christ, or love our neighbor, etc.) still there for those in the Terrestrial and Telestial kingdoms? Will there be "attractions" there?

I think part of the reason to discuss this is to "flesh out" (sorry bad joke) where attractions to a certain type of person or a single individual for that matter comes from. It doesn't seem to come from innate spiritual traits, although maybe and not yet developed in the pre-earthly life. ... and therefore, "attractions" does not really define who we truly are, our spirit self.

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some think that the Giants before the flood were the products of angels mating with earthly women: Giants, the Bible, & Enoch

that fallen angels craved to have bodies soo badly...

Where I heard or read this I can't recall but the offspring of these angel fathered beings had no soul. They were just animated organisms. To take this one more step, the act of creating a new body in the common biological way would be an impossibility for these angels. It would have had to be by some other method such as a chemistry project. :) These offspring may not have even been sentient. I certainly would not pass that on as gospel or authoritative but in one way it makes sense. If it is our spirit that makes us what we are then without one any organism is essentially a lab creation. They are not authorized by God to house one of His spirit children.

Edited by jlf9999
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some think that the Giants before the flood were the products of angels mating with earthly women: Giants, the Bible, & Enoch

that fallen angels craved to have bodies soo badly...

(New Testament | Matthew 8:31 - 32)

31 So the devils besought him, saying, If thou cast us out, suffer us to go away into the herd of swine.

32 And he said unto them, Go. And when they were come out, they went into the herd of swine

what are all the reasons that spirits want bodies so badly? it sounds to me like spirits have some of the same fleshly desires as we have, only they have no body with which to fulfill those desires - the horor of outer darkness is not having a body... without a body they cannot hurt anyone, but without a body, they seem to be pretty miserable - why else would a spirit want a body if that spirit did not have the same cravings as we do with a body?

I believe it is because Satan has been given power over things of this world, carnal things. I don't know if it is so much they crave after it as this is the only affect they have available to them for the moment. It is the only "button" they can push so to speak, to try to disrupt the plan. It's like they are saying, while if I can't mess around with this guy, at least let me mess around with those bodies. I think, they think it is "possession" when in reality it is just dominion, and only a temporary dominion.

Also, that is their expression after they experienced some of that control with the "possession" so we don't know if that is an innate desire of spirits. I think those devil spirits already made a statement in the pre-earthly counsel that they do not want to be like our God, body and spirit together. At least, they thought the risk was too high to take, it wasn't worth it in their eyes.

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changed

To take that one more step, without a body one can't live the highly sought after resurrection and to be like Father. There is no eternal life as we understand eternal life to be and therefor no joy or family.

Interestingly though, to be like our Father, we get access to this body but should lay no claim on it and be willing to give it up for righteousness sake. It's like we are taking out the Benz from the car lot only for a test drive but we can't afford it yet. We have to bring it back without any damage or too many miles on it. :lol:

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The undeniable biological truth is that sexual desire is hormonal which is not love. Love transcends the veil. Sexual desire does not. Hormones are an earthly thing. As we age our early fascination with sexual motivation diminishes, at least in healthy people. It doesn't go away entirely but it very definitely lessens - a lot. Now, in a Celestial setting, I would not be surprised if there is a lot we do not know. :)

For anyone looking for some justification for homosexuality, which is where this discussion seems headed, that dog won't hunt.

Edited by jlf9999
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