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Guest saintish

who is Almighty/ the almighty G_d?

who is almighty god?  

27 members have voted

  1. 1. who is almighty god?

    • God the Father
    • God the Son
      0
    • God the Holy Spirit
      0
    • All members of the godhead are Almighty god
    • Other (please explain)


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Guest saintish

After debating with some friends i want to see what the concensus on LDS.net is:

who is almighty god?

does the title almighty god refer to one or all members of the godhead?

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Guest saintish

Right now it is 50/50 so which is it? God the father or all members of the godhead?

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Guest saintish

Would you care to include any scripture references? Moses 2:1 is the most obvious.

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In the Old Testament it refers to Jehovah, which in Mormon theology is the Christ.

Also in Mormon theology the Father is above the Son, at least in seniority, a well as being above the Holy Ghost, who does not yet have a body.

I would say that the term Almighty God depends on the context in which it is used.

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Guest saintish

The trinitarian answer is that all members of the Godhead are Almighty God.

in a sense that they are three yet one? but does that apply moreso to one of gods identities than the others? just curious what the trinitarian view would be.

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Ancient belief shows that Almighty God (El Elyon) was the head God of the divine council of old. Jehovah/Yahweh was one of his divine sons. According to Margaret Barker and other Bible scholars, the early Christians equated Jesus with Yahweh, the Messiah.

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in a sense that they are three yet one? but does that apply moreso to one of gods identities than the others? just curious what the trinitarian view would be.

Any characteristics that can be given to God would apply to all persons of the Trinity/Godhead since all three are God.

M.

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in a sense that they are three yet one? but does that apply moreso to one of gods identities than the others? just curious what the trinitarian view would be.

They alone are co-eternal and co-equal. The Son does give honor to his Father, so, in that sense the Father is "greater." However, they are the same, and we would not hesitate to worship the Christ. Also, recall that the one unforgiveable sin is to blaspheme the Holy Spirit.

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saintish Quote:

in a sense that they are three yet one? but does that apply moreso to one of gods identities than the others? just curious what the trinitarian view would be.

I agree with PC and Maureen.

The Triune God is the one Almighty God.

Gen 17:1 Job 33:4

Rev.1:7 “Look, he is coming with the clouds,” and “every eye will see him,

even those who pierced him”; and all peoples on earth “will mourn because of him.” So shall it be! Amen.

8 “I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.”

Saintish may I ask what your answer would be?

Can there be more than one almighty God?

My thought is that would be a logical impossibility.

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Guest saintish

On the survey I voted all 3. I believe that many of us have a hard time imagining 3 separate beings being referred to as one. I think it is the organization that is the godhead that is almighty and as such all three gods are entitled to that title. IMHO anyway

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Guest saintish

This is part of the conversation that sparked my question, it is a response to me asking "how did you come to this belief?"

"Hi:

I am going by the testimony of the Holy Spirit. I have always known that Jesus Christ is our Eternal God [2 Nephi 26:12 ]; however, I was accustomed to thinking of Heavenly Father as my Father and Jesus as my Elder Brother. As I got older I was puzzled by the Lord's reference to himself as both the Father and the Son. [Ether 3:14] The standard explanation is that the Lord speaks for his Father, which is true. But it is not sufficient to explain why the Lord would say that he is the Father.

I sought answers in prayer and scripture study and discovered that the House of Israel is accustomed to calling the Lord our Father. That makes Jesus Christ the Father of scripture in most cases. [isa. 63:16]

Of course, this completely agrees with what we are taught in the church: Jesus Christ is Jehovah. We are reminded of this over and over in the temple. I finally asked my dad why it's repeated in the temple, since the members should already know this. He said I'd be surprised at how many members don't know it.

Now I see what he means. Despite the fact that latter-day saints are of the House of Israel and have been taught clearly and repeatedly that Jesus Christ is Jehovah, they will not understand what this means. This is hard-headed and hard-hearted. Moreover, I have been abused everywhere by Mormons who refuse to see it.

Respecting the Lord is no disrespect to Heavenly Father or to the Holy Spirit, for that matter. All male members of the Godhead can be considered the Father, but Jesus Christ is more specifically and accurately our Father by all scripture. Unless we know him as our Father, how can we become his sons and daughters? [Mosiah 27:25]

There are many things that we can learn from scripture if we but inquire of the Lord. I have learned that his promise is true, that he will open the very treasures of heaven to us if we but seek "

Thoughts?

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Guest saintish

Merriam-webster says it means this:

1 Al·mighty : having complete power

▪ Almighty God = God Almighty

2 always used before a noun : having a great deal of power or importance ◊This sense of almighty is often used to suggest that something has too much power over people.

▪ All he cares about is the almighty dollar. [=all he cares about is money]

3 always used before a noun : very great or loud

▪ The dishes fell down with an almighty crash. [=a mighty crash]

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I did a quick search through the scriptures (including the modern ones) and could not find a reference to the Holy Spirit as "Almighty God" (although I could find the title referring to both the Father and the Son).

Does anyone have verses I'm missing?

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Guest

I agree with PC and Maureen.

The Triune God is the one Almighty God.

Gen 17:1 Job 33:4

Rev.1:7 “Look, he is coming with the clouds,” and “every eye will see him,

even those who pierced him”; and all peoples on earth “will mourn because of him.” So shall it be! Amen.

8 “I am the Alpha and the Omega,” says the Lord God, “who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty.”

Saintish may I ask what your answer would be?

Can there be more than one almighty God?

My thought is that would be a logical impossibility.

Soninme, I thought protestants subscribe to the Nicene Creed as well?

In Catholic faith, as expressed in both the Apostle's Creed and the Nicene Creed, the Father is God Almighty. This title is applied specifically to that person of the Triune.

In LDS faith, it is the same.

I don't even understand why this is not common understanding... I thought it was! :confused:

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Soninme, I thought protestants subscribe to the Nicene Creed as well?

In Catholic faith, as expressed in both the Apostle's Creed and the Nicene Creed, the Father is God Almighty. This title is applied specifically to that person of the Triune.

In LDS faith, it is the same.

I don't even understand why this is not common understanding... I thought it was! :confused:

Anatess, I can only speak for the evangelical wing of Protestantism. The Nicene Creed, and indeed so much of Catholic theology up to the Reformation, did carry over into our own doctrinal teachings. On the other hand, we do not cite the creeds as our authority. Church Tradition does give us some background, but our appeal for authority would always be directly to Scripture.

So why say that "Almighty God" would be a true title for all three persons?

1. We agree that the Father is Almighty God.

2. The Son is co-equal and co-eternal with the Father. Further, Isaiah's messianic prophesy describes Him as "The Mighty God." The Father addresses him as God, and commands the angels to worship Jesus.

3. The Holy Spirit, though never described as "Almighty God," is used interchangeably with God. Further, it is only blashemy against the Spirit that is unforgiveable.

4. In assigning to all three the title "Almighty God," we reaffirm the oneness of the trinitarian (tri-UNE Godhead) understanding of God's nature.

BTW, my guess is that it is this very underlying understanding that is helping some voters to realize they need to choose the Father only. ;)

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Guest

Anatess, I can only speak for the evangelical wing of Protestantism. The Nicene Creed, and indeed so much of Catholic theology up to the Reformation, did carry over into our own doctrinal teachings. On the other hand, we do not cite the creeds as our authority. Church Tradition does give us some background, but our appeal for authority would always be directly to Scripture.

So why say that "Almighty God" would be a true title for all three persons?

1. We agree that the Father is Almighty God.

2. The Son is co-equal and co-eternal with the Father. Further, Isaiah's messianic prophesy describes Him as "The Mighty God." The Father addresses him as God, and commands the angels to worship Jesus.

3. The Holy Spirit, though never described as "Almighty God," is used interchangeably with God. Further, it is only blashemy against the Spirit that is unforgiveable.

4. In assigning to all three the title "Almighty God," we reaffirm the oneness of the trinitarian (tri-UNE Godhead) understanding of God's nature.

BTW, my guess is that it is this very underlying understanding that is helping some voters to realize they need to choose the Father only. ;)

As a Trinitarian all points are correct. But "Almighty God" or "God Almighty" is more of a titular reference than a sole indication of power/oneness.

It's like this: In India, the children take on the first name of their father as their last name.

Therefore, John Doe's son, Joe is Joe John, not Joe Doe.

Now, Joe gets married to Jane. People then call her Mrs. Jane John. No... because, although correctly applied by authority, by virtue of titular reference, Mrs. John is John Doe (the father)'s wife. Therefore, Jane is Mrs. Jane Joe.

So, like in this example, the term "Almighty God" or "God Almighty" is a title given to God the Father even if Jesus and the Holy Spirit are also Almighty by virtue of the Trinity. It is a titular reference not meant to imply that He is the ONLY Almighty person of the Triune.

Make sense?

Now, if the question is - which of the 3 persons in the Triune is almighty (not capitalized)... then yes, all 3 are.

And yes, this is the same answer for which of the 3 persons in the Godhead is almighty.

Edited by anatess

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Guest saintish

So if all three members are infact all mighty, then logically all three are Almighty G_d or could be called so.

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Guest

So if all three members are infact all mighty, then logically all three are Almighty G_d or could be called so.

Sure. But by tradition, Almighty God is a title reserved for God the Father just like Redeemer is a title reserved for the Son.

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Guest saintish

yes but, redeemer and savior dont apply to G_d the Father the same way Almighty can apply to all members of the godhead.

what about the title Lord?

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Guest

yes but, redeemer and savior dont apply to G_d the Father the same way Almighty can apply to all members of the godhead.

what about the title Lord?

The point of the juxtaposition is that the title is applied to the PERSON in the Triune... not the Trinity itself. So that, Almighty God in the Trinity is by tradition referring to God the Father.

We are not debating the meaning of almighty. We are discussing the TITLE because Almighty God is a title. So that, when we say in the Nicene Creed, We believe in God, the Father, the Almighty, creator of heaven and earth - that is not refering to all of them - it is refering specifically to God the Father.

Edited by anatess

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I did a quick search through the scriptures (including the modern ones) and could not find a reference to the Holy Spirit as "Almighty God" (although I could find the title referring to both the Father and the Son).

Does anyone have verses I'm missing?

I agree with this. The Holy Ghost/Spirit is never addressed as "Almighty God" which I believe takes away the possibility of it referring to the Godhead as a whole. When the Holy Ghost is addressed with the term "God" it's usually addressed as "of God". Maybe an explanation of the Godhead's nature will help some.

God the Father: In a prayer to the Father, given by Jesus, the Father is addressed as being the only true God. John 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent. This does not diminish the nature of Jesus Christ and who he is nor does it diminish Christ's divinity. "the only true God, and Jesus Christ". Notice how the "and" makes it clear that the verse at that point is talking about the Father and then the Son.

Jesus Christ: Jesus is referred to as the Son of God, God of Israel, and our Lord our God. The reason for being called the Son of God is obvious. With being called the God of Israel, that's in reference to ancient Judaism as this was Christ's title as well as others such as Jehovah. Last but not least, our Lord our God. He's our Lord our God because it is Jesus whom we must follow. The "our God" part is referencing to the fact that Jesus is our connection to the Father.

Holy Ghost/Spirit: Spirit of God which testifies of all things.

Many people use "I and the Father are one" to say Jesus is the Son and the Father. It's not saying he is literally both the Son and the Father. In the Book of Mormon there is something said along the same lines but it's explained.

Mosiah 15:1 And now Abinadi said unto them: I would that ye should understand that God himself shall come down among the children of men, and shall redeem his people.

2 And because he dwelleth in flesh he shall be called the Son of God, and having subjected the flesh to the will of the Father, being the Father and the Son—

3 The Father, because he was conceived by the power of God; and the Son, because of the flesh; thus becoming the Father and Son—

Jesus is the Son of God because he was begotten of the Father. Since Jesus did/does the will of the Father it would be as if the Father Himself did/does the things that are done. That's the explanation of how the Son is the Father. I believe "I and my Father are one" and "thus becoming the Father and Son" is metaphorically speaking on Jesus simply submitting himself to the will of the Father. With that being said, I do believe, in most cases, God the Father is who the scriptures refer to when they say "Almighty God". It just depends on the context since Jesus is also referred to as "our Lord our God".

Edited by apexviper13

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Anatess...I get what you are saying. However, I never really thought of Almighty God as being a titular reference. God is a title all three persons can bear--almighty is descriptive of God, since there is only one, it all gets capitalized. Nevertheless, on reflection, It does seem true that in nearly every case i can recall in which someone mentions Almighty God, it is the Father that first comes to mind.

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