Polygamy

[Holly3278]

Hi everyone. I know that one of the prophets decided to ban polygamy in the late 19th century. Well, my question is why? If polygamy was fine with God at first, why did it suddenly become not fine with God?

[angelbaby]

hopefully some one more knowledgable than me will correct me, but basically it has to do with the fact that it was out lawed, and because we believe in being subject to president's rulers & magistrates etc (article of faith 12) they obeyed the law. if you have a set of scriptures with the book of mormon, doctrine & covenants & pearl of great price there is something in there at the end of D&C that explains it. so basically the men who had several dozen wives kept those wives, but no one else from that point on could take on multiple wives. also, the first wife was for time and eternity, but i believe the rest were just for times. can any one add to that?

i'll type out the declaration if no one adds anything soon. hope this helps though.

i nearly forgot sorry. i didn't really answer your question properly. it also has alot to do with the fact that up to that point that was what the lord required. then after that point he didn't, if that makes sense. there were probably 20 women to each man back then. so i think it had alot to do with them having the opportunity to be married, have children or just be looked after in general (like widows etc). alot of the marriages were just plutonic (i think that's the word i mean).

hopefully this helps too

[Holly3278]

hopefully some one more knowledgable than me will correct me, but basically it has to do with the fact that it was out lawed, and because we believe in being subject to president's rulers & magistrates etc (article of faith 12) they obeyed the law. if you have a set of scriptures with the book of mormon, doctrine & covenants & pearl of great price there is something in there at the end of D&C that explains it. so basically the men who had several dozen wives kept those wives, but no one else from that point on could take on multiple wives. also, the first wife was for time and eternity, but i believe the rest were just for times. can any one add to that?

i'll type out the declaration if no one adds anything soon. hope this helps though.

i nearly forgot sorry. i didn't really answer your question properly. it also has alot to do with the fact that up to that point that was what the lord required. then after that point he didn't, if that makes sense. there were probably 20 women to each man back then. so i think it had alot to do with them having the opportunity to be married, have children or just be looked after in general (like widows etc). alot of the marriages were just plutonic (i think that's the word i mean).

hopefully this helps too

Actually this seems like a pretty good answer although I'll appreciate further answers from you or anyone. Thanks!

[Gwen]

very good answer. just a couple of thoughts. if i understand correctly some of the subsequent marriages were for more than time only. but yes many/most were out of necesity. women in those days could not get honest work to support their families and the men were being killed regularly out of persecution. so who was going to care for all the children and widows? also would like to point out that in a day when women were descriminated, from my understanding the subsequent marriages were always discussed with the first wife. the women were included in the process.

i'm sure someone will say something if they disagree or i am mistaken. lol :)

[Dr T]

Someone once told me that it was intended for populating the church and that was the best way to do it. I don't know if that was the real reason or not. If it was, I don't think God works that way. If he did, why would He has made Adam, Eve & Sally, Lucy, etc.? I don't believe it.

[Gwen]

Someone once told me that it was intended for populating the church and that was the best way to do it. I don't know if that was the real reason or not. If it was, I don't think God works that way. If he did, why would He has made Adam, Eve & Sally, Lucy, etc.? I don't believe it.

i've never heard that one. i can see how someone could come to that conclusion. and i like your argument though. for me the protection of the widows and their children makes more since, especially considering the time period. i also beleive there was some spiritual instruction going on like obediance, both to begin and end the command.

[Holly3278]

<div class='quotemain'>

Someone once told me that it was intended for populating the church and that was the best way to do it. I don't know if that was the real reason or not. If it was, I don't think God works that way. If he did, why would He has made Adam, Eve & Sally, Lucy, etc.? I don't believe it.

i've never heard that one. i can see how someone could come to that conclusion. and i like your argument though. for me the protection of the widows and their children makes more since, especially considering the time period. i also beleive there was some spiritual instruction going on like obediance, both to begin and end the command.

I think I can agree with either argument. :)

[Palerider]

They had to stop it......just think of all the Mothers in Law a Guy would have.....WOW.....enough to make anyone stop!!!!!!!!!!!!!........LOL!!!!!!!!!............

[StrawberryFields]

<div class='quotemain'>

Someone once told me that it was intended for populating the church and that was the best way to do it. I don't know if that was the real reason or not. If it was, I don't think God works that way. If he did, why would He has made Adam, Eve & Sally, Lucy, etc.? I don't believe it.

i've never heard that one. i can see how someone could come to that conclusion. and i like your argument though. for me the protection of the widows and their children makes more since, especially considering the time period. i also beleive there was some spiritual instruction going on like obediance, both to begin and end the command.

I have the same understanding as ALmom and I have never heard that polygamy was intended for populating the church.

[Maureen]

I have the same understanding as ALmom and I have never heard that polygamy was intended for populating the church.

But it could be considered a reason.

From the BofM, Jacob, Chapter 2…

23 But the word of God burdens me because of your grosser crimes. For behold, thus saith the Lord: This people begin to wax in iniquity; they understand not the scriptures, for they seek to excuse themselves in committing awhoredoms, because of the things which were written concerning David, and Solomon his son.

24 Behold, David and aSolomon truly had many bwives and concubines, which thing was cabominable before me, saith the Lord.

25 Wherefore, thus saith the Lord, I have led this people forth out of the land of Jerusalem, by the power of mine arm, that I might raise up unto me a arighteous branch from the fruit of the loins of Joseph.

26 Wherefore, I the Lord God will not suffer that this people shall do like unto them of old.

27 Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any aman among you have save it be bone cwife; and concubines he shall have none;

28 For I, the Lord God, delight in the achastity of women. And bwhoredoms are an abomination before me; thus saith the Lord of Hosts.

29 Wherefore, this people shall keep my commandments, saith the Lord of Hosts, or acursed be the land for their sakes.

30 For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up aseed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.

31 For behold, I, the Lord, have seen the sorrow, and heard the mourning of the daughters of my people in the land of Jerusalem, yea, and in all the lands of my people, because of the wickedness and aabominations of their bhusbands.

32 And I will not suffer, saith the Lord of Hosts, that the cries of the fair daughters of this people, which I have led out of the land of Jerusalem, shall come up unto me against the men of my people, saith the Lord of Hosts.

33 For they shall not lead away captive the daughters of my people because of their tenderness, save I shall visit them with a sore curse, even unto destruction; for they shall not commit awhoredoms, like unto them of old, saith the Lord of Hosts.

34 And now behold, my brethren, ye know that these commandments were given to our afather, Lehi; wherefore, ye have known them before; and ye have come unto great condemnation; for ye have done these things which ye ought not to have done.

35 Behold, ye have done agreater iniquities than the Lamanites, our brethren. Ye have broken the hearts of your tender wives, and lost the confidence of your children, because of your bad examples before them; and the sobbings of their hearts ascend up to God against you. And because of the bstrictness of the word of God, which cometh down against you, many hearts died, pierced with deep wounds.

http://scriptures.lds.org/en/jacob/2

D&C 132: 63 (61-66).

63 But if one or either of the ten virgins, after she is espoused, shall be with another man, she has committed adultery, and shall be destroyed; for they are given unto him to amultiply and replenish the earth, according to my commandment, and to fulfil the promise which was given by my Father before the foundation of the world, and for their exaltation in the eternal worlds, that they may bear the souls of men; for herein is the work of my Father continued, that he may be bglorified.

M.

[Holly3278]

<div class='quotemain'>

I have the same understanding as ALmom and I have never heard that polygamy was intended for populating the church.

But it could be considered a reason.

From the BofM, Jacob, Chapter 2…

23 But the word of God burdens me because of your grosser crimes. For behold, thus saith the Lord: This people begin to wax in iniquity; they understand not the scriptures, for they seek to excuse themselves in committing awhoredoms, because of the things which were written concerning David, and Solomon his son.

24 Behold, David and aSolomon truly had many bwives and concubines, which thing was cabominable before me, saith the Lord.

25 Wherefore, thus saith the Lord, I have led this people forth out of the land of Jerusalem, by the power of mine arm, that I might raise up unto me a arighteous branch from the fruit of the loins of Joseph.

26 Wherefore, I the Lord God will not suffer that this people shall do like unto them of old.

27 Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any aman among you have save it be bone cwife; and concubines he shall have none;

28 For I, the Lord God, delight in the achastity of women. And bwhoredoms are an abomination before me; thus saith the Lord of Hosts.

29 Wherefore, this people shall keep my commandments, saith the Lord of Hosts, or acursed be the land for their sakes.

30 For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up aseed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.

31 For behold, I, the Lord, have seen the sorrow, and heard the mourning of the daughters of my people in the land of Jerusalem, yea, and in all the lands of my people, because of the wickedness and aabominations of their bhusbands.

32 And I will not suffer, saith the Lord of Hosts, that the cries of the fair daughters of this people, which I have led out of the land of Jerusalem, shall come up unto me against the men of my people, saith the Lord of Hosts.

33 For they shall not lead away captive the daughters of my people because of their tenderness, save I shall visit them with a sore curse, even unto destruction; for they shall not commit awhoredoms, like unto them of old, saith the Lord of Hosts.

34 And now behold, my brethren, ye know that these commandments were given to our afather, Lehi; wherefore, ye have known them before; and ye have come unto great condemnation; for ye have done these things which ye ought not to have done.

35 Behold, ye have done agreater iniquities than the Lamanites, our brethren. Ye have broken the hearts of your tender wives, and lost the confidence of your children, because of your bad examples before them; and the sobbings of their hearts ascend up to God against you. And because of the bstrictness of the word of God, which cometh down against you, many hearts died, pierced with deep wounds.

http://scriptures.lds.org/en/jacob/2

D&C 132: 63 (61-66).

63 But if one or either of the ten virgins, after she is espoused, shall be with another man, she has committed adultery, and shall be destroyed; for they are given unto him to amultiply and replenish the earth, according to my commandment, and to fulfil the promise which was given by my Father before the foundation of the world, and for their exaltation in the eternal worlds, that they may bear the souls of men; for herein is the work of my Father continued, that he may be bglorified.

M.

Very interesting quotes. :)

[Traveler]

Hi everyone. I know that one of the prophets decided to ban polygamy in the late 19th century. Well, my question is why? If polygamy was fine with God at first, why did it suddenly become not fine with God?

My great great grandfather and his family were living polygamy by commandment. His personal journal on the subject is most interesting. First - He never sought a second wife but only took a second wife by commandment. Second - He indicated that most of the polygamy of the early LDS was adulterous because the multiple wives were sought out side of commandment.

Thus this is how I understand marriage. A man and a woman are commanded to marry according to the law of G-d. In this a man may take to himself a woman of his choice. But an man is never to take another wife but it be commanded of G-d.

Let me draw a parallel to the commandment “Thou shalt not Kill”. This means that man never has the right to decide to take someone’s life. That is according to the commandment. Yet we see a number of times that G-d commanded that someone be killed. This was not in violation of the commandment not to kill because it was not man that made the decision but G-d. If fact many scholars agree that the commandment should be better translated “Thou shalt not Murder.”

Since the commandment to take a second wife can only come from the president and since he has commanded that there be no second wives taken in our day is not a contradiction or change in commandment. Because our society is not able to abide polygamy; G-d does not command it. But we must all realize that those that covenant with G-d are under obligation to do what G-d commands - even and especially if we may not like it at the time.

The Traveler

[Holly3278]

<div class='quotemain'>

Hi everyone. I know that one of the prophets decided to ban polygamy in the late 19th century. Well, my question is why? If polygamy was fine with God at first, why did it suddenly become not fine with God?

My great great grandfather and his family were living polygamy by commandment. His personal journal on the subject is most interesting. First - He never sought a second wife but only took a second wife by commandment. Second - He indicated that most of the polygamy of the early LDS was adulterous because the multiple wives were sought out side of commandment.

Thus this is how I understand marriage. A man and a woman are commanded to marry according to the law of G-d. In this a man may take to himself a woman of his choice. But an man is never to take another wife but it be commanded of G-d.

Let me draw a parallel to the commandment "Thou shalt not Kill". This means that man never has the right to decide to take someone's life. That is according to the commandment. Yet we see a number of times that G-d commanded that someone be killed. This was not in violation of the commandment not to kill because it was not man that made the decision but G-d. If fact many scholars agree that the commandment should be better translated "Thou shalt not Murder."

Since the commandment to take a second wife can only come from the president and since he has commanded that there be no second wives taken in our day is not a contradiction or change in commandment. Because our society is not able to abide polygamy; G-d does not command it. But we must all realize that those that covenant with G-d are under obligation to do what G-d commands - even and especially if we may not like it at the time.

The Traveler

So the person must be commanded by God to have a second wife before they could have had one?

[Traveler]

<div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'>

Hi everyone. I know that one of the prophets decided to ban polygamy in the late 19th century. Well, my question is why? If polygamy was fine with God at first, why did it suddenly become not fine with God?

My great great grandfather and his family were living polygamy by commandment. His personal journal on the subject is most interesting. First - He never sought a second wife but only took a second wife by commandment. Second - He indicated that most of the polygamy of the early LDS was adulterous because the multiple wives were sought out side of commandment.

Thus this is how I understand marriage. A man and a woman are commanded to marry according to the law of G-d. In this a man may take to himself a woman of his choice. But an man is never to take another wife but it be commanded of G-d.

Let me draw a parallel to the commandment "Thou shalt not Kill". This means that man never has the right to decide to take someone's life. That is according to the commandment. Yet we see a number of times that G-d commanded that someone be killed. This was not in violation of the commandment not to kill because it was not man that made the decision but G-d. If fact many scholars agree that the commandment should be better translated "Thou shalt not Murder."

Since the commandment to take a second wife can only come from the president and since he has commanded that there be no second wives taken in our day is not a contradiction or change in commandment. Because our society is not able to abide polygamy; G-d does not command it. But we must all realize that those that covenant with G-d are under obligation to do what G-d commands - even and especially if we may not like it at the time.

The Traveler

So the person must be commanded by God to have a second wife before they could have had one?

Exactly - if G-d does not directly intervene and allow the second (+) wife - man cannot decide that for themselve. Abraham and Jacob are examples - note that they were the prophets at the time and the means by which commandments came. King David, on the other hand committed sin in taking to wife the mother of Solomon.

The Traveler

[Dr T]

Hey Traveler,

Do you have a reference for when God directly commanded a man to take more than one wife?

Thanks

[Traveler]

Hey Traveler,

Do you have a reference for when God directly commanded a man to take more than one wife?

Thanks

Maureen already posted a reference:

Jacob chapter 2

27 Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife; and concubines he shall have none;

28 For I, the Lord God, delight in the chastity of women. And whoredoms are an abomination before me; thus saith the Lord of Hosts.

29 Wherefore, this people shall keep my commandments, saith the Lord of Hosts, or cursed be the land for their sakes.

30 For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.

The Traveler

[Holly3278]

<div class='quotemain'>

Hey Traveler,

Do you have a reference for when God directly commanded a man to take more than one wife?

Thanks

Maureen already posted a reference:

Jacob chapter 2

27 Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife; and concubines he shall have none;

28 For I, the Lord God, delight in the chastity of women. And whoredoms are an abomination before me; thus saith the Lord of Hosts.

29 Wherefore, this people shall keep my commandments, saith the Lord of Hosts, or cursed be the land for their sakes.

30 For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.

The Traveler

These verses are no longer binding on us?

[Dr T]

Thank you Traveler. Sorry I wasn't specific in my question. I didn't mean BOM references. I was wondering about Biblical references.

Thanks

[Traveler]

<div class='quotemain'> <div class='quotemain'>

Hey Traveler,

Do you have a reference for when God directly commanded a man to take more than one wife?

Thanks

Maureen already posted a reference:

Jacob chapter 2

27 Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife; and concubines he shall have none;

28 For I, the Lord God, delight in the chastity of women. And whoredoms are an abomination before me; thus saith the Lord of Hosts.

29 Wherefore, this people shall keep my commandments, saith the Lord of Hosts, or cursed be the land for their sakes.

30 For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.

The Traveler

These verses are no longer binding on us?

I think so - that they are binding. In essence I think it is tellling us that unless commanded otherwise a man can have one wife and that it is not up to a man to seek a second wife - ever, even if they think that G-d will command it soon. In the case of my great-great grandfather - he indicated that the first wife was as responsible for selecting the other wives as the husband.

The Traveler

Thank you Traveler. Sorry I wasn't specific in my question. I didn't mean BOM references. I was wondering about Biblical references.

Thanks

The Book of Mormon is the most direct source - the Bible gives a number of indirect references in Abraham and Jacob and then indicates that these men were acceptable to G-d. Note the role of the chosen wife in determining the additional wives.

The Traveler

[LionHeart]

Actually there were plural marriages performed after the manifesto which were instructed by the president of the Church; however, they were seperate from the Church in order to spare the Church any legal issues that might come from it. Plural marriage was not completely snuffed out among the leadership of the Church until the administration of Heber J. Grant; nearly 20 years after the manifesto.

All of them were considered "for time and all eternity". But like Traveler said, they were by way of commandment. And the wives played a big role in choosing other wives.

L.H.

[Snow]

Hi everyone. I know that one of the prophets decided to ban polygamy in the late 19th century. Well, my question is why? If polygamy was fine with God at first, why did it suddenly become not fine with God?

Sheeze. Didn't God once say that his followers could plant different crops in the same field, couldn't wear clothes made out of more than one fabric and couldn't eat pigs?

[Blessed]

Disclainer: playing devil's advocate, here, Snow.

What about the verse God is an unchanging God. Same yesterday, today and forever?

[Snow]

Disclainer: playing devil's advocate, here, Snow.

What about the verse God is an unchanging God. Same yesterday, today and forever?

Does that verse mean that God will never give one commandment and instruction to a particular people. place and time unless he gives the exact same commandment and instruction to all people in all places and times?

The god depicted in the Old Testament of the Bible is a far cry from the god depicted in the New Testament of the Bible. Does that mean that the God as described by the Bible is in contradiction with the attributes of God as described by the Bible?

People take the verse about God being the same always and contrue it to mean whatever they want it to mean.

[blazius]

I would like to ask about polygamy. I’m very interested in the LDS church but I have often wondered about this polygamous issue and why so many practiced it and then suddenly stopped.

I’ve heard many of the leaders and regular men practiced polygamy, but what was so holy about it? And since it stopped, is it now unholy? I mean, if I were a faithful Mormon living on a deserted island, would it be a holy thing for me to have several wives on that island? It seems to me that God would actually bless my little island paradise, unless He has said that polygamy is now unholy.

Anyway, just my thoughts. But also, don’t you all think that an outsider would look at someone like Brigham Young, who had many wives as just a man with a huge sexual appetite, and that’s why he did it? Couldn’t polygamy be a twice-blessed grand sexual scheme for the men involved? Blessed by the Lord for practicing it and blessed with all the women to have sex with? I don’t know, just some of my thoughts about it.

any help with this would be appreciated.

blazius

[Maureen]

I would like to ask about polygamy. I’m very interested in the LDS church but I have often wondered about this polygamous issue and why so many practiced it and then suddenly stopped.

Welcome blazius!...

I wouldn't say the practice suddenly stopped, it actually took about 14 years to really end.

M.