Justin Bieber ok for 5 y/o but not God Bless the USA

[beefche]

This principle has banned the song "God Bless the USA" from the kindergarten graduation. Apparently, the lyrics are not "age appropriate". But, they can sing "Baby" from Justin Bieber.

EXCLUSIVE: Coney Island principal refuses to let kindergarten students sing "God Bless the USA" at graduation, but Justin Bieber's "Baby" is OK - NYPOST.com

[Backroads]

This is absolutely ridiculous. How horrible that patriotism is a problem but not sensual pop songs.

[Backroads]

And if these cultures are so offended by the song, why did they come to America?

[beefche]

Read it again. It is the principal who is saying "it's offensive." The families, who are immigrants, love it.

The song has been sung at previous school events. Last year’s fifth-graders, including another Lozada child, performed it at graduation.

“Everybody applauded and whistled,” the mom said. “They gave it a standing ovation.”

Parents — many immigrants from Pakistan, Mexico and Ecuador — “love it,” Lozada said.

[Echo2002]

It doesn't surprise me. Say "God" in school and everyone freaks.

[Backroads]

Read it again. It is the principal who is saying "it's offensive." The families, who are immigrants, love it.

Yet he's attempting to say it on their behalf... go figure.

[HEthePrimate]

Seeing as how she's a Jehovah's Witness, part of it may be that she doesn't agree with the idea that God would bestow favor on a particular nation ("God Bless America"). She also doesn't stand for the Pledge of Allegiance. I don't think that she should push her religious beliefs on others by forbidding others from expressing their feelings and beliefs.

However, I do support separation of church and state, and think that as a general rule, promoting God and religion has no place in public schools. I have lots of religious friends, but I also have a number of atheistic and agnostic friends, and they don't appreciate it when people at school start pushing God on their kids. There are plenty of patriotic songs other than "God Bless America" that could be used in the program.

I've never heard Justin Bieber's song, so I can't judge whether or not it's age appropriate. He seems like a nice enough kid, but I'm not at all familiar with his music.

[Backroads]

That's a good point, HEP, yet this particular song is quite easy for that age group to learn. While I generally agree with a separation of church and state, I think banning a song because it mentioned Deity in general is taking it a little too far.

[Guest]

Maybe they should learn Toby Keith's "Angry American". That would ruffle a few feathers.

[HEthePrimate]

That's a good point, HEP, yet this particular song is quite easy for that age group to learn. While I generally agree with a separation of church and state, I think banning a song because it mentioned Deity in general is taking it a little too far.

I am not personally that sensitive about it. But I can see the point of view of those who are.

Just to do the "walk a mile in their moccasins" thing, imagine you are a Christian, but you grew up in a country where 80% of the population belongs to the Wiccan religion. At public events, swearings-in of public officials, and in school, you hear people praying to Hekate, or singing songs praising Cernunnos. It's easy to see why you might feel uncomfortable in that environment, even though they allow you to privately practice your Christian religion at home and at church.

[Backroads]

But Wicca is really quite specific a religion (one that fascinates me, so I probably wouldn't feel all that uncomfortable). "God" however, is quite general. God is not attached to one religion. In fact, most Wiccans believe in God--they just also include a Goddess.

[prisonchaplain]

However, I do support separation of church and state, and think that as a general rule, promoting God and religion has no place in public schools. I have lots of religious friends, but I also have a number of atheistic and agnostic friends, and they don't appreciate it when people at school start pushing God on their kids. There are plenty of patriotic songs other than "God Bless America" that could be used in the program.

I get this. However, an innocuous traditional song like "God Bless America," or a Country Western one like "God bless the USA" does little more than remind folks that 80% of Americans are Christian, and 92% believe in some kind of a god. To think that just saying "God" and "America" in the same lyric is going to turn all the children into Baptists is beyond absurd. No, I am sorry, but when atheists/agnostics choose to place their wet blanket of disbelief or vague references like these, I think the tail is definitely wagging the dog. It's almost like they want vengence for the fact that their personal beliefs are such a minority. So they get to tweek the nose of the majority culture by have traditional songs banned, banners pulled, invocations/benedictions denied...for what? Perhaps just because they can.

[HEthePrimate]

But Wicca is really quite specific a religion (one that fascinates me, so I probably wouldn't feel all that uncomfortable). "God" however, is quite general. God is not attached to one religion. In fact, most Wiccans believe in God--they just also include a Goddess.

Just as there are many different Christian denominations, so there are many different Wiccan traditions. It's not that specific.

Yes, most Wiccans believe in a god and goddess. The point is how a person belonging to a minority would feel, whether they believe in a different religion or are atheist.

[HEthePrimate]

To think that just saying "God" and "America" in the same lyric is going to turn all the children into Baptists is beyond absurd.

I don't think anybody is suggesting that, and it's beside the point.

No, I am sorry, but when atheists/agnostics choose to place their wet blanket of disbelief or vague references like these, I think the tail is definitely wagging the dog. It's almost like they want vengence for the fact that their personal beliefs are such a minority. So they get to tweek the nose of the majority culture by have traditional songs banned, banners pulled, invocations/benedictions denied...for what? Perhaps just because they can.

Maybe Christians insist on singing those songs for the same reason--because they can. Just saying there're (at least) two sides to consider.

[carlimac]

We sang songs from many different cultures and religions in school choirs. My daughters are doing the same in their choirs...Indian, Jewish, Korean, etc. I can't recall ever singing a song about "No God" though. Probably because there weren't any. If aetheist feel that strongly about it, perhaps they should home school or just not attend the concert or graduation or whatever rather than making the majority bend to their will. We've become sooooo sensitive and politcally correct that soon we won't be able to sneeze in public for fear of offending someone. It's just ridiculous!

Edited June 12, 2012 by carlimac

[prisonchaplain]

I don't think anybody is suggesting that, and it's beside the point.

No not that...not exactly. But, it's not beside the point. American atheists and agnostics live in a country that is overwhelmingly Christian. They are going to run into many people who will say, "God bless you." They are going to find God in the same founding documents that grant them the freedom not to believe. And, until recently, they would run into countless incidences of vague civic religiosity. Until recently it was live and let live. Now, we must sanitize our public square of even the most vacuous expressions of religiosity? Why? I asked rhetorically, and yes ridiculously, whether they were afraid their children would become Baptists by hearing such songs. PS 90 would not be establishing a religion by having children sing "God bless the USA." If atheists are that fragile and sensitive, my goodness.

I lived in Korea for seven years. Every time I went to climb a small mountain, part of my ticket paid for the maintenance of a Buddhist temple. Some of the public ceremonies probably had Confucian rituals. This despite Christianity being tied for being the biggest religion there. Nobody seemed offended.

American government should not establish a particular religion or sect. However, broad generic nods at America's super-majority dominant faith seems more an expression of cultural reality than an oppressive conversion effort.

Maybe Christians insist on singing those songs for the same reason--because they can. Just saying there're (at least) two sides to consider.

Or because we have done so traditionally, and without constitutional challenge for 235+ years.

[carlimac]

I don't think anybody is suggesting that, and it's beside the point.

Maybe Christians insist on singing those songs for the same reason--because they can. Just saying there're (at least) two sides to consider.

I thinkt hey are singing these songs because our country has traditionally been Christian from the very beginning. Christianity is our tradition. And to really nit pick, I think even the Native Americans who were here first believed in God.

Edit: Oh PC already said that. Oops.

[Backroads]

Just as there are many different Christian denominations, so there are many different Wiccan traditions. It's not that specific.

I believe you're confusing Wicca and Pagan. Yes, there are a few electic Wiccans out there, just like any religion has its eclectics, people that like the label but want to do their own thing. But by and large Wicca is pretty solid and formal in its set-up.

[mhsmd]

I think the problem is that they are encouraging kids to sing 'Baby' as a substitute. There are a TON of other patriotic songs! Or why not alter the lyrics slightly so it doesn't say "God"? We did that for some more "adult" songs in my elementary school. 'Baby' doesn't even have a positive message.

[Forget-Me-Not]

I remember one Saturday when I was just a little girl that my father, in rare form, was actually at home. He was laying on the couch and drinking a beer as a ballgame was about to start. When the national anthem began it moved my tender child heart, but my father seemed oblivious to it, still lounging, drinking, and scratching himself as it played.

Even as such a young child I had a deep love of my country and flag and I was hurt by what I perceived as such a lack of reverence shown by my father. So wounded, in fact, that I went into the kitchen to hide behind the refrigerator to cry, as I also stood holding my little hand over my heart until the anthem finished playing.

Yet the lyrics to the song God Bless The USA are "not age appropriate" for little children? Might be "a little over the head" of your average elementary schooler? If that is so, it's the fault of adults who lack sufficient respect to instill such things in the minds and hearts of the children in their charge.

[Forget-Me-Not]

Oh, as per how I would feel or what I would do if I was in the religious minority? Well, I have great respect for people of all religious faiths, always having admired those who are devout and strive to live according to their beliefs.

So, let us say I lived in an Islamic country. Would I be offended by children singing a song that reflected that faith? No, I certainly would not. As a matter of fact, if I lived in an Islamic country, I would gladly take advantage of pausing and praying to my Heavenly Father and thanking He and my Lord whenever I heard the call to prayer.

Actually, I already do something akin to this. Nearly 25 years ago I was feeling rather sorrowful because of the isolation I was living in at the time and my inability to be of more service to others, when, I was moved upon and inspired by the realization that whenever I heard a siren, someone was potentially in trouble.

So - I took to praying whenever a siren would sound, praying for whoever was in trouble and for those being sent to help. It quickly became a habit that I've continued all the years since. Now I happen to live a stone's throw from a fire station, so, as it is, I am usually called to prayer multiple times each day.