Tithing, 4 months behind. Catch up or move on?

[Mudfish]

We haven't paid tithing in 4 months. I didn't know this until a few days ago because my wife handles all the bills etc, and she did not tell me she stopped paying tithing. I figured out she was literally spending all our money, including our savings, while accumulating $12k in credit cards I didn't know she/we even had. She also skipped paying several bills recently, so we're behind on many bills.

I have never missed paying tithing in my life until now. I feel sick. I know tithing is accounted for at the end of the year and it's only September, but I'm torn on what I should do. It will be near impossible to catch up and pay 4 month's worth of tithing by December, especially considering the huge credit card payments we now owe.

Am I going to loose my temple recommend? I was going to attend this week but now I don't feel worthy. I need to talk to my bishop asap. In the mean time I would appreciate any guidence or advice...

Edited September 4, 2012 by Mudfish

[Guest]

Tithing is not a loan. Now that you realized what's going on, I suggest you worry about paying tithing from this point forward instead of dwelling on the past. And yes, by all means, talk to the bishop.

[pam]

I agree with Anatess. Move forward. Now that you are aware of the situation, you can ensure that tithing is paid from this day forward.

[Sharky]

Agreed. Just acknowledged it happened and move forward. When the question comes up at tithing settlement or TR reccomend, answer with what you would say tp the Lord if he was asking.

Worthy or not worthy to attend the temple this week?

That is a very personal question that we should be asking ourselves each time we attend, in this case, for me, I would be examine if there were things I saw or knew that I ignored & should have questioned. Things I thought were strange & had I asked about would have brought this to light sooner.

While it is your income & you technically are the responsible one it still comes down to the trusting relationship between spouses, trust that she violated, not you.

You were acting in good faith, believing.

I'd probly go ahead and go, prayerfully, and without her.

The bigger concern to me is why the sudden change in your wife's spending habits? How long has she been using the credit cards?

Taking over the finances from here on out is obvious ... but will she find ssomething else to turn to? She needs to address what it was that brought about her need(s) to spend that money and to add debt. What else wa going on?

[Backroads]

Also agreeing with anatess.

If the 4 months still really bothers you, you could break up what you owe there and spread it over your next some odd tithing payments. But really, focus on the tithing principle and not the numbers. Not that that's an excuse to not be honest on your tithes, but I've been behind before and I found myself forgetting why I was paying tithing and it was becoming nothing more than a late bill.

What you should be doing is talking with your wife about the finances. What she is doing is not okay and you two need to discuss the reasoning behind it. I'm thinking the tithing stopping is merely a symptom of something else.

[Mudfish]

She has been seeing a very good LDS counselor for post partum depression and anxiety. She has always had a spending problem on and off over ten years. We have had many arguments about this, resulting in short periods of financial stability. I went to her last counseling session after discovering she spent $1600 in one week and ran our credit cards up to $9k. In the session she admitted she had secret credit cards for a total of $12k.

Due to obvious trust issues, I removed her entirely from our bank account and cancelled all of the cards but one. She is on a limited cash only allowance now, and the counselor agreed with this. It's not what I want, i want us to be equal partners, but this is how it has to be. I blocked all of the (common) shopping web sites she visits. I did not know our finances were so bad because I work two jobs to pay the bills so she can stay at home and I am gone at work long hours (basically 2 jobs). She had control of the bills because that's how we split the workload, and I trusted her and gave her too many chances.

We are ruined financially and our marriage is on the rocks. Like I said, her spending has always been excessive, but this mostly happened in the last 3-4 months. I can't explain it. The counselor (psychotherapist) said she has an addiction to shopping.

[Backroads]

Try not to feel guilty. I think what you and the counselor decided is an excellent tactic. Yes, you should be partners, but that means that sometimes one partner needs to step in and give the other extra help.

[applepansy]

I agree. Move on from here. Try to help your wife fix whatever issues she's having.

Yes, talk to the Bishop. He'll advice you to move on from here. Because you were unaware I don't know what he'll do about your temple recommend. It might be that just your wife looses hers. Oh ... and yeah, take your wife with you when you go see the Bishop.

[Wingnut]

My thoughts on catching up on tithing.

[MarginOfError]

She has been seeing a very good LDS counselor for post partum depression and anxiety. She has always had a spending problem on and off over ten years. We have had many arguments about this, resulting in short periods of financial stability. I went to her last counseling session after discovering she spent $1600 in one week and ran our credit cards up to $9k. In the session she admitted she had secret credit cards for a total of $12k.

Due to obvious trust issues, I removed her entirely from our bank account and cancelled all of the cards but one. She is on a limited cash only allowance now, and the counselor agreed with this. It's not what I want, i want us to be equal partners, but this is how it has to be. I blocked all of the (common) shopping web sites she visits. I did not know our finances were so bad because I work two jobs to pay the bills so she can stay at home and I am gone at work long hours (basically 2 jobs). She had control of the bills because that's how we split the workload, and I trusted her and gave her too many chances.

We are ruined financially and our marriage is on the rocks. Like I said, her spending has always been excessive, but this mostly happened in the last 3-4 months. I can't explain it. The counselor (psychotherapist) said she has an addiction to shopping.

As nice as it is to think that equal partners share in all of the responsibilities equally, it is important to remember that equal partners can also mean that the responsibilities are divided in such a way that each partner is doing the work they are most capable and interested in. The work can be divided to that each partner spends equal amounts of time on their tasks, even if one is spending more time on a certain type of task than another.

An equal partnership does not value equality of access to the accounts at the expense of financial stability.

[mnn727]

Mudfish, just something to think about. If you knew she has had a problem with finances in the past, why would you let her handle the family finances without oversight?

I take care of the bills and we have no financial issues, but once a month I sit down with DW and go over our finances so she is aware of what is going on: 1.) so she can help our family make good financial decisions 2.) so she could step in and take over if I get hit by a bus on my way home from work

- - -

Talk to your Bishop but I say, go on from here.

[Guest]

I think it's good that you're cutting her off now and she's getting help. My in-laws have been through this many times just in the 15 years I've known them. She'll run up 40-50k in debt with not much to show for it, he'll work his tail off to get rid of it, and she does it again. He's never been able to get himself to take control of the situation. He's almost 80 and still always trying to make money, mostly to keep them above water because she won't stop spending it.

[Backroads]

Mudfish, just something to think about. If you knew she has had a problem with finances in the past, why would you let her handle the family finances without oversight?

I take care of the bills and we have no financial issues, but once a month I sit down with DW and go over our finances so she is aware of what is going on: 1.) so she can help our family make good financial decisions 2.) so she could step in and take over if I get hit by a bus on my way home from work

I handle all the finances in my family--my husband has access the online account and can check anytime he wants, and we also try to sit down every few weeks and see where we are. He also informs he every time he wants something pricey.

While it can be a good idea to have one partner largely in charge of finances, having that person with sole responsibility is not a good idea.

[MorningStar]

I could easily do that to my husband and he would have no idea, but I have "gently reminded" him to please sit down and look at the finances with me so he has an idea of what we're facing each pay period. He trusts me 100% because few things worry me more than finances, but I still think he should be regularly updated.

You might want to consider doing the thing where you opt out of credit card offers. I think it's optoutprescreen.com? I just did that recently because I'm sick of all of the junk mail and because we have the worst mailman in the world. We get other people's mail from our complex all the time and I would hate to think that a dishonest person would get our credit card offer.

[Sharky]

As I have read the various responses I have had a recurring thought concerning equal partners & one member of the partnership tending to always do the finances ... a comon thing in many marriages.

7 years ago I started feeling that my wife needed to step up, start taking a more active role in EVERYTHING. The farm, the finances, retirement planning, investments, taxes, insurance, the day-to-day chores, EVERYTHING.

I don't know why I felt that way, though today I have never felt more comfortable about knowing that she is well taken care of if something were to happen to me (death or disabled or illness) & that she knows everything that will enable her to step in & take over whenever, whyever, necessary.

One should always carefully consider the other consequences of just allowing their spouse to do the finances.

We don't know what the future holds or when we might be forced to step into that role. When stressed over the health or death of a spouse, paying bills is frequently the last thing you want to think of ... then try figuring out the finances that your only participation in has been earning the money.

[NightSG]

It will be near impossible to catch up and pay 4 month's worth of tithing by December, especially considering the huge credit card payments we now owe.

How are your wife's kidneys, and do you know any dishonest doctors?

[Blackmarch]

Move on. if you feel like you need to give more there's the fast offerings.

In actuality we will never be able to "Catch up"; we are blessed so much more than what we put in.

[Vort]

I would try to catch up.

[prisonchaplain]

Outsider voice on this issue. Your marriage and financial stability are the immediate issues you face. Nevertheless, you will want to talk with your bishop and get his prayer support and counsel. My own thought is that you may eventually want to make this up. Even if it is 2-3 years down the road. No, tithing is not a loan. But, somehow, it does not sit well with me to say, "Oh well...we've messed up...let's just move on, and be righteous from this point forward." I will not judge your situation. It's between you, your wife, perhaps your bishop, and, of course, God. However, if it were me, I would hope to find a way to pay those four months--even if it meant doing so over the course of many months.

[missionary0204]

My Thoughts

1. Your relationship with your spouse is the primary focus. Tithing will mean very little to most people if they are unhappy and losing their family. This does not mean that tithing doesn't matter. Its about priorities. Commandments are important, but selling yourself for crack vs. doing your hometeaching are not equal issues.

2. Our Father does not need our money. He cares about where our heart is. Forget the four months and be diligent from here on out. To take it a step further, some people restart paying tithing again and again while forgetting the missed months, and others only do this once or twice and never allow it to happen again. In the end, our Father cares about where our heart is. You make that decission and move on. If your concience is going to tear you up, setup a payment plan and pay it back. If you can honestly forgive yourself and decide to be diligent in the future, then the four months mean almost nothing. Speaking with a bishop about this is often a good channel to get his approval so one can forgive themself. If he says don't worry about the four months, it is on his head and you just need to be diligent moving forward.

I think the previous posts have given some great insight and ideas on the subject. PC, you are the man! I love your outside views and opinions as I read through the various forumns. Please keep it up. I would love to see more "outside" opinions and views.