Struggling On the Inside

[knitwit]

Hi, I am personally struggling with something I try hard not to show. I do my best to keep it together, but sometimes it consumes me. I am in my mid 20 and have been with my spouse from the time of first date to now for several years, but less than 10 total. We are temple married and do have children. All of my life I have yearned for and craved deep physical affection and closeness.

I am coming to realize that it's not been possible for my spouse to show me this kind of attention and it really hurts. I know it's not all about me and my children and others are important, but I am struggling to keep this inside. I hear of others that get this kind of attention from their wife/ husband and it bothers me a lot. It's like I can literally feel my heart aching and wanting more.

I do express this need in a way that won't hurt his feelings and he just laughs it off and makes everything a joke. We do have sex, that is not the problem, but the lack of deep emotional connection is. He might not need that, but I do so badly. Maybe I am more of a passionate person than he is, but shouldn't he be trying to meet my needs as I do his?

It bothers me to the point that sometimes my mind wanders down paths that it probably shouldn't, but I literally feel like a plant that is getting plenty of water, but left in the dark and just wants to bask in the warm sunshine to grow and bloom.

I always think back to the fact that most of my life I grew up without a father figure and wonder if maybe that's why I seem to crave this affection and attention?! Maybe not, but it's always in the back of my mind. I will be out and about and see a guy that is slightly older than me and attractive and just think in my mind, " I wonder if he would give me the attention I feel like I deserve?" I know this isn't right and sounds slightly crazy but it is the truth.

I do love my husband and we have faced some challenges in our marriage and had to spend time apart before that was beyond both of our control for his work. I get even worse during these times. I just feel like things are just on his terms and my needs will always be second. I have experienced closeness like this with past boyfriends so I kind of know what it is that I am missing and it's a lot for my heart to handle.

I have spent many nights with tears down my face and my heart in prayer to my Heavenly Father...I normally just get over it in the morning and spend my time and energy in service to others and my children. Any advice on this situation would be appreciated.

Edited April 3, 2013 by pam

[knitwit]

Hi, I am personally struggling with something I try hard not to show. I do my best to keep it together, but sometimes it consumes me. I am in my mid 20 and have been with my spouse from the time of first date to now for several years, but less than 10 total. We are temple married and do have children. All of my life I have yearned for and craved deep physical affection and closeness.

I am coming to realize that it's not been possible for my spouse to show me this kind of attention and it really hurts. I know it's not all about me and my children and others are important, but I am struggling to keep this inside. I hear of others that get this kind of attention from their wife/ husband and it bothers me a lot. It's like I can literally feel my heart aching and wanting more.

I do express this need in a way that won't hurt his feelings and he just laughs it off and makes everything a joke. We do have sex, that is not the problem, but the lack of deep emotional connection is. He might not need that, but I do so badly. Maybe I am more of a passionate person than he is, but shouldn't he be trying to meet my needs as I do his?

It bothers me to the point that sometimes my mind wanders down paths that it probably shouldn't, but I literally feel like a plant that is getting plenty of water, but left in the dark and just wants to bask in the warm sunshine to grow and bloom.

I always think back to the fact that most of my life I grew up without a father figure and wonder if maybe that's why I seem to crave this affection and attention?! Maybe not, but it's always in the back of my mind. I will be out and about and see a guy that is slightly older than me and attractive and just think in my mind, " I wonder if he would give me the attention I feel like I deserve?" I know this isn't right and sounds slightly crazy but it is the truth.

I do love my husband and we have faced some challenges in our marriage and had to spend time apart before that was beyond both of our control for his work. I get even worse during these times. I just feel like things are just on his terms and my needs will always be second. I have experienced closeness like this with past boyfriends so I kind of know what it is that I am missing and it's a lot for my heart to handle.

I have spent many nights with tears down my face and my heart in prayer to my Heavenly Father...I normally just get over it in the morning and spend my time and energy in service to others and my children. Any advice on this situation would be appreciated.

[Praetorian_Brow]

So...you resent that your husband is not as sexually aware as you?

[knitwit]

I'm not sure I understand the question. I am not talking about sex so much as affection and closeness.

[annewandering]

I dont know what to tell you except that a lot of men are like that. Only thing I can think of is to maybe take time when he is relaxed and just cuddle. Watching tv maybe. Its not personal attention but it might help with the physical need for comfort and touching.

I bet there is a book out there that people can recommend to help you out. I seem to recall at least one that is recommended often on here.

[Guest]

Anne might be thinking oh "The Five Love Languages". It's likely that he's showing you love in his language so you don't recognize it, and he doesnt understand that touch is a big need for you. Reading it might help you, and would certainly help both of you if he's willing to read it as well.

[THIRDpersonviewer]

Another thing that might play a role is that he could be worn out and tired. I only say this because when I am worn out I dont take care of keeping the house clean very well. And to my wife, this communicates a lot of love for her. It's not that I dont want to do it, I just feel down and mustering the effort that i dont even feel is overwhelming and thus more stressful.

Now I feel the opposite and as was said more men tend to need or desire physical touch. If he is like my wife, then some physical things are good and seems to be enough, but more love is communicated through her love languages. So she does those other things. I do appreciate any of the ways her love is given to me, it makes me feel special. But early on I had to communicate with her and say hey, when i don't receive this, i feel unwanted, or if i am not having this then i feel more apart.

That would be my advice is just really communicating with him. You should be able to talk with your spouse about your needs.

One other thing that I've found is me being affectionate to her. Often that is really all I'll need. At first she didn't like it much but then I talked to her about my feelings and she didn't like me being affectionate, so she worked on just letting me affectionate. And at first she didnt think about it much, but now it seems to help us connect better. My point is the changes come but you have to talk about it. Can't wait until the pressure builds and then it explodes. You have to discuss it when you need it. just do it lightly, lovingly, but not timidly.

[mdfxdb]

I do express this need in a way that won't hurt his feelings and he just laughs it off and makes everything a joke. We do have sex, that is not the problem, but the lack of deep emotional connection is.

I picked this part out becaue I think you need to understand that as a man "sex" is the deep emotional connection.

If you want more from him on a touching/attention basis you need to be clear with him that is what you need. You need to tell him all the time, and you need to take afirmative action with him so he knows this is what you need. Don't assume that because you told him he heard you, make him say it back, make him promise to take action, and don't be afraid to be specific about what you want. Don't assume that "he should know" Trust me he doesn't.

[MrPickles]

I think that you need to have an open and honest conversation with your husband. It is likely that he just does not understand what your needs are.

You say " I have experienced closeness like this with past boyfriends so I kind of know what it is that I am missing and it's a lot for my heart to handle."

when you say "closeness" it is very vague.

I am sure that he would like to make you happy and feel close to him. Communication would be the key here.

[Roseslipper]

Men think different then Women, sometimes it hard to understand each other true. Men are more logical, woman more emotional, sometimes more romantic. A good book to read is men are from mars women from venus. read it better yet read it together. and of course the key to any relationship is open communcation..... You can both get what you need or want....

[knitwit]

I think that you need to have an open and honest conversation with your husband. It is likely that he just does not understand what your needs are.

You say " I have experienced closeness like this with past boyfriends so I kind of know what it is that I am missing and it's a lot for my heart to handle."

when you say "closeness" it is very vague.

I am sure that he would like to make you happy and feel close to him. Communication would be the key here.

I very much appreciate all of your comments and I did find and download the book spoken of. I read a little of it and plan to review it closer later.

As far as being open and honest, I am and I have been for years, but it doesn't seem to change things much. I try not to go over the top with my requests now but in the past I have written out to him how I am feeling. It wasn't received well. He thought it was silly mostly. That kind of hurt because I put a lot of my heart and soul into it and tried to explain myself as best I could without being negative.

I have also tried just showing him what I want by being that way to him. I will kiss him and he does not kiss back. He just holds his mouth in a straight line and lets me but does nothing in return. I wrap my arms around him or put my head on his chest and he remains still. I do not understand why it is so hard to just be affectionate in return. I can understand that men show their love mostly during sex, but to completely shut out all other forms of physical closeness completely confuses me. I mean I am assuming that most couples sleep next to each other at night in their bed. That doesn't happen here. If he does come to bed he is all the way on the other side with his own blanket and back to mine but most of the time he is on the couch or guest bed leaving me alone.

And what I mean about past relationships by closeness are things like just sitting together and watching a movie or time kissing and touching that doesn't extend past that, but then again it was just dating and sex was not involved, so maybe in those cases it just seemed different.

I have nothing against sex, but I am about so much more than that and I guess this desire that I have is my biggest strength as well as my biggest weakness and maybe I just need to learn how to channel it into something different that shows Christ like love and service and caring for others. I just feel like it's a shame that he can't do these things for me. I promise I shower and take care of myself so I don't think he is unattracted to me in anyway and it doesn't stop him from getting what he wants when he wants it to be so frank. All on his terms and even the things we talk about in conversation are all about him. I love him but I hate how self centered and absorbed that he can be.

[knitwit]

So...you resent that your husband is not as sexually aware as you?

I'm sorry I don't understand your question on the resentment.

[MrPickles]

I very much appreciate all of your comments and I did find and download the book spoken of. I read a little of it and plan to review it closer later.

As far as being open and honest, I am and I have been for years, but it doesn't seem to change things much. I try not to go over the top with my requests now but in the past I have written out to him how I am feeling. It wasn't received well. He thought it was silly mostly. That kind of hurt because I put a lot of my heart and soul into it and tried to explain myself as best I could without being negative.

I have also tried just showing him what I want by being that way to him. I will kiss him and he does not kiss back. He just holds his mouth in a straight line and lets me but does nothing in return. I wrap my arms around him or put my head on his chest and he remains still. I do not understand why it is so hard to just be affectionate in return. I can understand that men show their love mostly during sex, but to completely shut out all other forms of physical closeness completely confuses me. I mean I am assuming that most couples sleep next to each other at night in their bed. That doesn't happen here. If he does come to bed he is all the way on the other side with his own blanket and back to mine but most of the time he is on the couch or guest bed leaving me alone.

I am no expert and if we take what you are saying at face value it would seem that he has shut you out, not sleeping in the same bed raises a red flag for me. Relationships are and should be a two way street. Give and take, not one sided. Even if I give what you say a 50% discount which I am inclined to do since we are only hearing one side of the story I would say that there are some issues in the relationship.

The best advice is to seek the help of a trained professional in marital counseling. The fact that you have to ask and have already communicated to him your wants and desires point to this direction. Marital counseling does not mean that you will get divorced but will open an avenue for you and him to communicate in a meaningful manner with a 3rd person directing the conversation and questioning him and you as to why he my think you are being silly or why he is reluctant to show affection. It will also raise the level of seriousness of the conversation.

[annewandering]

How old are you both? I am wondering about his history as well. Is his family this unemotional outwardly? Something seems off kilter.

He seems as if he does love you but for some reason has some kind of barrier against the softness and touching parts of affection. Did he grow up in an abusive or disfunctional family?

[knitwit]

I am no expert and if we take what you are saying at face value it would seem that he has shut you out, not sleeping in the same bed raises a red flag for me. Relationships are and should be a two way street. Give and take, not one sided. Even if I give what you say a 50% discount which I am inclined to do since we are only hearing one side of the story I would say that there are some issues in the relationship.

The best advice is to seek the help of a trained professional in marital counseling. The fact that you have to ask and have already communicated to him your wants and desires point to this direction. Marital counseling does not mean that you will get divorced but will open an avenue for you and him to communicate in a meaningful manner with a 3rd person directing the conversation and questioning him and you as to why he my think you are being silly or why he is reluctant to show affection. It will also raise the level of seriousness of the conversation.

I wish I could do that but unfortunately he thinks this idea is crazy and not needed. He thinks it's silly and childish of me to require him to do so and feels that he has not done anything wrong. I have even suggested maybe just the Bishop and he shakes his head at that idea too. I have resorted to just holding it in. This is the first time I have opened up about it to anyone aside from him.

I have searched online and considered online counseling for just myself to start, but I don't feel that it would solve the problem but just help me cope with it maybe? I don't want to numb myself of everything that makes me the passionate person that I am, but at the same time I'm not sure it's worth the pain of wanting something so badly that you cannot have. I keep thinking that I should just be grateful for what I've got and leave it at that, but at the same time it seems dangerous to leave the problem completely unattended. It seems to come in waves with me and I am afraid of the shore that they could crash on when they fall. I just try to stay strong in my faith. I am usually the only one at church and I take the kids alone too. He does work a lot and in a position that does not allow him to take off sometimes, but he also thinks it's okay to not pay tithing and sleep in on the days that he doesn't have to work just so he can have a day off to his self. But he wants to plan trips to see temples and buys me books from deseret. It's all very confusing. I just keep thinking the bishop is probably my best course of action.

[mdfxdb]

Your Bishop is not a marriage counsler. You should seek counseling for yourself, and hopefully he will want to come with you. There may be some deeper issues that need addressed here. The fact that he will not go to counseling spells big trouble in my mind. He should at least want to address your concerns (even if he thinks they are silly).

It is clear you are not happy, as a reasonable spouse shouldn't he want his wife to be happy? The answer is yes.

[knitwit]

How old are you both? I am wondering about his history as well. Is his family this unemotional outwardly? Something seems off kilter.

He seems as if he does love you but for some reason has some kind of barrier against the softness and touching parts of affection. Did he grow up in an abusive or disfunctional family?

I am relieved to hear some of your answers, because it is making me feel as though I am not some crazy attention demanding girl. I just want what should be mine, my husband. I never imagined that married life would be this way. I am 25 and he is 28. I have asked him about the possibility of abuse with his not wanting to touch or be touched in certain ways. His mother is more rough, out spoken,and aggressive by nature and his father is fairly passive. It was a rocky road when we first got together with her. Things in that area are much better now. Having children seems to bring the in-laws closer.

@ mdfxdb I agree with you on my bishop not being a marriage counselor, but he and his wife have told me to come to them with anything if I ever wanted too. However, I am not sure they have the experience to handle this situation.

I am just afraid that my whole life is going to be this way...him always putting himself before God (which should be 1st) and before me (which should be 2nd) and in my mind I just have these visions of what life should be like...things like kneeling down to pray together at night and going to the temple together....even other little things that don't happen. I just feel like I am missing out and one day the chance is over even though we are fairly young now, time goes so quickly. I am at least happy that he treats the children well.

[mdfxdb]

Did he do everything "right" before you were married/had kids? Was he attending church, temple, praying with you? Was there a moment of sudden change or has this been a pattern of behavior?

[knitwit]

Well, he is a convert from inactive parents. They never took him to church. He started going when we were dating. We were married and then sealed. All our children have been born after being married. He used to be more spiritual mostly during his military deployment. Used to pray with me and encourage family home evening but suddenly not so much. There is a lot of anger from him over the smallest things and he would rather go nap and be alone more often than normal but that comes and goes and I just figured he was tired from working so much.

[annewandering]

Most likely he is tired. That might be making the problem worse for you too. One thing you have going for you is that you probably have a long time to work on this.

Does he see other couples who are more openly affectionate? I wonder because when I was growing up we seldom saw open affection in our family. I knew my parents loved each other and loved us kids but I doubt my mother ever kissed me or any of us kids. My father either. I never saw them kiss or hug each other or us kids either. Maybe this is what he knew? I am lucky and have a very affectionate husband but I bet it would be harder if I were a man. I would never presume to show physical affection to anyone if they show ANY sign they are might be the slightest bit unwilling or uncomfortable. This would include my kids and grandkids. Its just the way I was raised. Sounds like he might have been too.

This is not a good thing. Especially if he is doing it and doesnt see it as an issue. What is good is if he can get to the point of being more affectionate he will be happier.

[knitwit]

Most likely he is tired. That might be making the problem worse for you too. One thing you have going for you is that you probably have a long time to work on this.

Does he see other couples who are more openly affectionate? I wonder because when I was growing up we seldom saw open affection in our family. I knew my parents loved each other and loved us kids but I doubt my mother ever kissed me or any of us kids. My father either. I never saw them kiss or hug each other or us kids either. Maybe this is what he knew? I am lucky and have a very affectionate husband but I bet it would be harder if I were a man. I would never presume to show physical affection to anyone if they show ANY sign they are might be the slightest bit unwilling or uncomfortable. This would include my kids and grandkids. Its just the way I was raised. Sounds like he might have been too.

This is not a good thing. Especially if he is doing it and doesnt see it as an issue. What is good is if he can get to the point of being more affectionate he will be happier.

I sure hope it changes with time. We are both very affectionate towards our children and I am not sure what it was like for him when he was growing up at all. I could only guess that his mother was more rough and less affectionate based on how I see her with the grandkids in the family. I just think he knows better but doesn't care. I think all the time, " I wish he could feel the desire I have in my heart for him" that would solve everything. If he could just feel it for a moment. Everytime I try to express it he just laughs it off or shuts it down. I almost think he gets some sort of joy out of the fact that he knows I want something badly so he withholds it on purpose, like it's a big joke. I don't think it's funny at all. It just hurts.

[annewandering]

I really hope that is not the case, knit. If so there are deeper worries than missed affection. You need to talk to someone in person that will listen to what you are saying. The bishop might be able to or help find you someone. The main thing is you need to talk to someone about this.

[BadWolf]

I wish I could do that but unfortunately he thinks this idea is crazy and not needed. He thinks it's silly and childish of me to require him to do so and feels that he has not done anything wrong.

1) You have a problem. Him saying "There is no problem." Does NOT make the problem go away. A lot of people think that, in a relationship both people have to "have a problem" in order for one to exist. Nope. We get it, dude. *YOU* are completely happy/problem free. *I*, however, have a real and serious problem. My problem isn't silly, i't childish, and isn't magically going to disappear by your saying "there is no spoon". So either man up and come to counseling with me to help ME with MY problem... Or I'll go by myself. Because my problems are just as important and just as worthy of being sorted.

Well, he is a convert from inactive parents. They never took him to church. He started going when we were dating. We were married and then sealed. All our children have been born after being married. He used to be more spiritual mostly during his military deployment . Used to pray with me and encourage family home evening but suddenly not so much. There is a lot of anger from him over the smallest things and he would rather go nap and be alone more often than normal but that comes and goes and I just figured he was tired from working so much.

2) Sudden change in action & personality following military deployment?

That smacks of one of several SUPER common things

- Depression (chemically missing high adrenaline work)

- Depression (grief gotten out of hand)

- Depression (guilt of several kinds gotten out of hand)

- PTSD (bet you thought this would be first, but MOST active to inactive military suffer from moderate to severe depression upon leaving the service, the military actually hosts classes & counselors to help with the transition... While only some have PTSD. But PTSD definitely makes the list of common post-deployment problems.).

Which reeeeeeally underscores why he doesn't want to go to counseling. In the military, youre supposed to "suck it up" & "dig in" & "laugh it off" & "chin up nose clean". Seeing a counselor is admitting a weakness, and is generally only reserved for those

- in trouble (possibly dischargeable trouble)

- broken.

So I cannot emphasize enough... While there MAY (probably) be issues of his at hand... Make it about YOU.

YOUR problem you need his HELP with.

White knight needed. Stat.

Same result.

In counseling.

But with H as a willing participant.

Instead if feeling in trouble or broken.

Just a suggestion.

__________________

3) Physical contact normal?

LOL.

For the record... I'm an in-your-lap, always touching, arm or leg thrown over, super physical contact kind of girl. ALL the men Ive dated (thats a bias, not all men, merely those I fancy) have been the same way (save 2). But the style of physical contact differs. I'm not a cuddler. I'm not keen to hold hands. A lot of the guys Ive dated have been. Even being super-physical-contact-girl... Its HARD to switch into forms of affection that don't come natural. Or feel "squidgy" for lack of a better term. But needs must. And when it works, its synergistic. Each meeting the others needs. So I'll hold hands if you'll throw me over your shoulder or greet me with a bear hug. (My physical go -outside of sex- being pretty heavy handed.

Its even harder to switch into a completely different "love language". Doing the dishes just does NOT warm fuzzy my heart.

Believe me, physical contact is NORMAL.

But there are also variations in that range of normal.

And then there are whole other languages completely.

STRONG 2nd (3rd/4th/5th) for the 5 Love Languages.

Because, which touchy-feely people are TOTALLY NORMAL, so are NOT touchy-feely people.

Sigh. I married one of those 2 non-touchy-feely guys. (Coulda married the massage therapist, but noooooooo ; ). That was eyes open / we dealt with my need for constant physical contact in other ways. So too, his need for "acts of service". (Seriously, the 5 love languages is the most common sense thing. Ive ever read).

One of the many things that counseling can do is to find those compromises.

Sometimes they're weird (I bought a dog, because I want that kind of greeting when I walk in the door. Bowl me over), sometimes Tgeyre hard (I HATE dishes!!!), sometimes they don't work (Um. No.), sometimes they're eye opening, and sometimes they are straight out not compromises.. But thou shalts.

Works better with 2 people (whole story)... But Im serious. Even though your needs/desires are NORMAL... If he won't go with you... Go yourself.

[knitwit]

Thank you Anne and bad wolf for your comments and kindness. A lot of points have been raised that help me assess this situation. I am going to try a few things and seek help with this if I can and alone at first if I have to.

[knitwit]

For those of you following this thread and who have given advice on this situation, I thought you might like an update. After some serious talking to him in a firm standing my ground, but also respectful way I have broken some of the ice surrounding this situation. It is starting to appear much better than before. He seems to be making small efforts to change the issues spoken of. Counseling is not something I am throwing out all together, but seeing his increased efforts gives me hope and a little more understanding of where he is coming from. Praying for the best!!