What All Mormons Should Know - Sources Needed

[ruthiechan]

So, there are a few things I have taken for granted because I grew up believing them, and hearing about them and so would like a little help with source finding.

Here's a bit of context, this is what I said:

We know that single people, and those in mix-faith marriages, can make it to the highest levels of the celestial kingdom. We also know that people who have never been Mormon in this life can also get there.

There's also the character of Christ to consider. He did not invite all of the human species to come unto him out of a sense of polite civility. He did it because he loves every single one of us and has made it possible for us to simply start from wherever we are in our life (and not from some special vantage point) on the path of perfected in him, or in other words becoming our best selves. It's also the path to becoming joint-heirs with Christ, to have all that he has, which is the highest levels of the celestial kingdom.

Thus, of course it is possible for homosexuals to make it to the highest level of the celestial kingdom.

These are things that every Mormon should know. (If some don't then they're either ill informed or conveniently looking at things through a very narrow view to support their bigotry.)

So, someone has requested reading material, (because that first paragraph was something this person never heard of before despite growing up in the church), which means it's not good enough for me to just explain why we believe what we believe, but I need more than that. I have a few scriptures but a little help with source finding would be nice.

Edited July 19, 2013 by pam

[NeuroTypical]

Here's an excellent little read about what LDS folks believe and why, written from the perspective of a fictitious Elder answering antimormon criticism:

Letters to an Anti-Mormon - Russell C. McGregor, and Kerry A. Shirts

FARMS Review: Volume - 11, Issue - 1, Pages: 90-298

A review of "Letters to a Mormon Elder: Eye-Opening Information for Mormons and the Christians Who Talk with Them" by James R. White

[ElectofGod]

Absolutely true! God is no respector of people. He will judge all according to their works according to their desires of their hearts.

D&C 137, D&C 76.

[Seminarysnoozer]

Yes, God takes into account who we really are, spiritual self and doesn't look at the outside person as self as we do to each other. God, of course, knows that this life is a temporary stewardship that does not reflect in any linear fashion the nature of our spiritual self. Who sinned, the man or his parents that he was made blind? We know the answer to that question.

One of the traps of Satan, I believe, is when people fall in love with their fallen self. If they say things like 'I am who I am because God made me this way' or 'I was born this way' is a subtle trap that all of us have to face in terms of looking at the carnal self verses the spiritual self and which side we give heed to. The more we give attention to carnal self, the harder it is to see our true spirit nature and then we act like it is not even there after a while. To some, the carnal self is all they are because they have blinded their self to spiritual influence. That is the end of the road of 'I was born this way'. We are to forsake this life and keep an eye single to the glory of God, not to our own individual glory.

[Traveler]

So, there are a few things I have taken for granted because I grew up believing them, and hearing about them and so would like a little help with source finding.

Here's a bit of context, this is what I said:

We know that single people, and those in mix-faith marriages, can make it to the highest levels of the celestial kingdom. We also know that people who have never been Mormon in this life can also get there.

There's also the character of Christ to consider. He did not invite all of the human species to come unto him out of a sense of polite civility. He did it because he loves every single one of us and has made it possible for us to simply start from wherever we are in our life (and not from some special vantage point) on the path of perfected in him, or in other words becoming our best selves. It's also the path to becoming joint-heirs with Christ, to have all that he has, which is the highest levels of the celestial kingdom.

Thus, of course it is possible for homosexuals to make it to the highest level of the celestial kingdom.

These are things that every Mormon should know. (If some don't then they're either ill informed or conveniently looking at things through a very narrow view to support their bigotry.)

So, someone has requested reading material, (because that first paragraph was something this person never heard of before despite growing up in the church), which means it's not good enough for me to just explain why we believe what we believe, but I need more than that. I have a few scriptures but a little help with source finding would be nice.

Not sure what you mean by scripture proof but here are some points.

1. I personally believe that everyone that wants to be in the Celestial kingdom will be rewarded according to "the desire of their heart". (do you require scripture?)

2. All that come unto G-d must do so according to the "Way". Jesus Christ is the Cherub that is the "keeper" of that one and only way to return to G-d. Do you need scriptures that tell us this truth?

3. The first principles and ordinances of the Gospel of Salvation are:

First: Faith in the L-rd Jesus Christ

Second: Repentance (which means both a change of mind and heart)

Third: Baptism by immersion by someone having been given the authority.

Forth. Receive the Holy Ghost by the laying on of hands.

Without obedience to these principles and these ordinances one is not following the way of Jesus Christ.

4. The word Salvation has the same root meaning as salvage which means in symbolic terms to separate the light from the darkness. In order for G-d to save anyone there must be something to salvage - the only things that will be salvaged will be those things of light that are imbedded into individual souls through covenant.

5. Even though someone may currently be possessed with the addiction to be homosexual, (or any other unholy thing or thought) they can overcome such things and become saved and exalted - it is a false notion and misleading pretense to assume that homosexuals can retain their unholy sexuality and be exalted in the Celestial Kingdom.

6. It is a false notion and misleading pretense to assume that any person can become saved and exalted while they continue to hold on to any sin (however small or seemingly insignificant). There is no salvation without repentance of all sins.

If you require the scripture testament (sources) please let me know which # above and I will gladly provide it for you.

The Traveler

[Seminarysnoozer]

5. Even though someone may currently be possessed with the addiction to be homosexual, (or any other unholy thing or thought) they can overcome such things and become saved and exalted - it is a false notion and misleading pretense to assume that homosexuals can retain their unholy sexuality and be exalted in the Celestial Kingdom.

6. It is a false notion and misleading pretense to assume that any person can become saved and exalted while they continue to hold on to any sin (however small or seemingly insignificant). There is no salvation without repentance of all sins.

I agree with your points, and especially with the word "addiction" you use here.

The "addiction" starts with saying, "God made me this way." And then it is perceived as self and that is when it starts to become difficult to let it go. It is much easier to let it go when we realize what we are now is a temporary set of stewardship that is not spiritual self. We are in a fallen, altered state barely perceptible as self, any more than the person with Down's syndrome acts or looks like her spiritual self. Do we fall in love with the treasure that turns to dust or the long lasting one?

The only way to "hold on" or retain the things of this world is to express love of them or interest in them. Like you said in the first point, anyone who wants the Celestial kingdom life qualifies. Things of dust turn to dust at the end of this life. One can make it spiritual and long lasting only by making it a desire of the heart. Like money, power, fame etc., it is the love of carnal things that cause the retention. Paul did not "overcome" his thorn in the flesh in this life. It stayed with him until death.

[Maureen]

So, there are a few things I have taken for granted because I grew up believing them, and hearing about them and so would like a little help with source finding.

Here's a bit of context, this is what I said:

We know that single people, and those in mix-faith marriages, can make it to the highest levels of the celestial kingdom. We also know that people who have never been Mormon in this life can also get there.

There's also the character of Christ to consider. He did not invite all of the human species to come unto him out of a sense of polite civility. He did it because he loves every single one of us and has made it possible for us to simply start from wherever we are in our life (and not from some special vantage point) on the path of perfected in him, or in other words becoming our best selves. It's also the path to becoming joint-heirs with Christ, to have all that he has, which is the highest levels of the celestial kingdom.

Thus, of course it is possible for homosexuals to make it to the highest level of the celestial kingdom.

These are things that every Mormon should know. (If some don't then they're either ill informed or conveniently looking at things through a very narrow view to support their bigotry.)

So, someone has requested reading material, (because that first paragraph was something this person never heard of before despite growing up in the church), which means it's not good enough for me to just explain why we believe what we believe, but I need more than that. I have a few scriptures but a little help with source finding would be nice.

I've always thought that to reach the highest level of the CK, a person would have to be sealed. Single people, LDS with non-member spouses or non-LDS are not in a position to be sealed. And I'm guessing if an LDS gay person remains un-married they too cannot be sealed. So how can they obtain the highest level in the CK if they are not sealed?

M.

[bytebear]

Maureen, you are correct, however, God will not restrict you from access to those blessings. If you choose not to marry and enter that covenant, then it will completely your choice. It will not be because of circumstance or "fate" or because God punished you by making you gay or not throwing a worthy spouse at your feet. Ultimately at some point you will be judged by Christ and you will know that you cannot blame God for the judgement you chose. Now, feel free to speculate as to how this all transpires, since there is no known answer to that.

[james12]

5. Even though someone may currently be possessed with the addiction to be homosexual, (or any other unholy thing or thought) they can overcome such things and become saved and exalted - it is a false notion and misleading pretense to assume that homosexuals can retain their unholy sexuality and be exalted in the Celestial Kingdom.

6. It is a false notion and misleading pretense to assume that any person can become saved and exalted while they continue to hold on to any sin (however small or seemingly insignificant). There is no salvation without repentance of all sins.

Amen!

While allowances will be made in the current state there will come a time when all must repent in order to enter the Celestial Kingdom. Moreover, while in this life single people are promised all the blessings reserved for the righteous at some point before the resurrection they must be married and sealed. There are no exceptions. Jesus made this clear when asked about the woman who married seven different brothers as each died in successive fashion. He said, "in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven." In other words, no marriages are initiated in the resurrected state. All will be decided before the resurrection.

[tubaloth]

We know that single people, and those in mix-faith marriages, can make it to the highest levels of the celestial kingdom.

These are both pretty broad statements, that without more clarification its not understood.

The scripture is. D&C 131 1-3

1 In the celestial glory there are three heavens or degrees;

2 And in order to obtain the highest, a man must enter into this order of the priesthood [meaning the new and everlasting covenant of marriage];

3 And if he does not, he cannot obtain it.

So like it was pointed out, this is the law that has to be followed.

Single people that know this commandment will be held to it.

We take that scripture with what Prophets have taught like Pres Ezra Taft Benson.

I also recognize that not all women in the Church will have an opportunity for marriage and motherhood in mortality. But if those of you in this situation are worthy and endure faithfully, you can be assured of all blessings from a kind and loving Heavenly Father—and I emphasize all blessings.

To the Single Adult Sisters of the Church - general-conference

Now Mix-faith marriages would be different. I guess if they knew about the commandment in D&C then they would be held accountable to it. If they didn't, maybe the second would come into play a little bit. But really to receive the highest degree a couple would need to be sealed. (no more mix faith marriage).

We also know that people who have never been Mormon in this life can also get there.

Again we need to explain how this would happen. The only way for a person who has never been a member (in this life) to get to the celestial kingdom would be to accept the Gospel of Jesus Christ in the spirit world.

Those that never heard the Gospel in this life while on earth will have the chance to accept it in the next life. They do have the chance to gain all the blessings.

But for those that had the "chance" (It's up to God to decided that) but reject it in this life, and accept it in the spirit world do not go to the Celestial Kingdom.

Thus, of course it is possible for homosexuals to make it to the highest level of the celestial kingdom.

Again back to the scriptures.

D&C 88 21-25

21 And they who are not sanctified through the law which I have given unto you, even the law of Christ, must inherit another kingdom, even that of a terrestrial kingdom, or that of a telestial kingdom.

22 For he who is not able to abide the law of a celestial kingdom cannot abide a celestial glory.

23 And he who cannot abide the law of a terrestrial kingdom cannot abide a terrestrial glory.

24 And he who cannot abide the law of a telestial kingdom cannot abide a telestial glory; therefore he is not meet for a kingdom of glory. Therefore he must abide a kingdom which is not a kingdom of glory.

25 And again, verily I say unto you, the earth abideth the law of a celestial kingdom, for it filleth the measure of its creation, and transgresseth not the law—

Its actually pretty simple. If you want the Celestial Kingdom you need to keep the Celestial Law.

If you can't keep the Celestial Law, then you get a lesser kingdom according to the Law you were able to keep.

Now God does look at our heart and desires. If we desire the Celestial Kingdom and desire to keep a Celestial Law with all our heart, but if circumstances outside our control keep us from it, it won't be held against us.

D&C 137

7 Thus came the voice of the Lord unto me, saying: All who have died without a knowledge of this gospel, who would have received it if they had been permitted to tarry, shall be heirs of the celestial kingdom of God;

8 Also all that shall die henceforth without a knowledge of it, who would have received it with all their hearts, shall be heirs of that kingdom;

9 For I, the Lord, will judge all men according to their works, according to the desire of their hearts.

10 And I also beheld that all children who die before they arrive at the years of accountability are saved in the celestial kingdom of heaven.

[ruthiechan]

I've always thought that to reach the highest level of the CK, a person would have to be sealed. Single people, LDS with non-member spouses or non-LDS are not in a position to be sealed. And I'm guessing if an LDS gay person remains un-married they too cannot be sealed. So how can they obtain the highest level in the CK if they are not sealed?

M.

Lots of sealings happen after this life. God told me to marry my husband who is not a member which surprised me because I expected a no answer. Maybe my husband will change his mind about the church, maybe he won't, but I can either be sealed to him or to someone else during the millennium. Same with singles and homosexuals.

[iinarihoudai]

5. Even though someone may currently be possessed with the addiction to be homosexual, (or any other unholy thing or thought) they can overcome such things and become saved and exalted - it is a false notion and misleading pretense to assume that homosexuals can retain their unholy sexuality and be exalted in the Celestial Kingdom.

6. It is a false notion and misleading pretense to assume that any person can become saved and exalted while they continue to hold on to any sin (however small or seemingly insignificant). There is no salvation without repentance of all sins.

I am bisexual. I assure you it is NOT an addiction. It just *is*. I cannot change it. Lucky me, I have it easy. I just don't get in relationships with women. Ta da!

General Authorities have repeatedly said that being a homosexual is not a sin, acting on it is, meaning having romantic same sex relationships. I am not sinning by being bisexual. I would be sinning if I were to get in a romantic relationship with a woman but there's no chance of that happening because I choose not to.

Will I still be bisexual in the hereafter? I have no idea. Maybe, maybe not. All we've got on that topic is conjecture.

Also, I've had an addiction problem before. The addiction prevented me from living a full life, it was an obsession always in my mind no matter what I was doing. My bisexuality causes no such issues.

[bytor2112]

Lots of sealings happen after this life. God told me to marry my husband who is not a member which surprised me because I expected a no answer. Maybe my husband will change his mind about the church, maybe he won't, but I can either be sealed to him or to someone else during the millennium. Same with singles and homosexuals.

Source? I believe this is absolutely false doctrine. If you choose to reject the blessings made available to you in this life....you have made your choice.

[ruthiechan]

Source? I believe this is absolutely false doctrine. If you choose to reject the blessings made available to you in this life....you have made your choice.

Wow. You think God lied to me? Nice.

[bytor2112]

I am bisexual. I assure you it is NOT an addiction. It just *is*. I cannot change it. Lucky me, I have it easy. I just don't get in relationships with women. Ta da!

General Authorities have repeatedly said that being a homosexual is not a sin, acting on it is, meaning having romantic same sex relationships. I am not sinning by being bisexual. I would be sinning if I were to get in a romantic relationship with a woman but there's no chance of that happening because I choose not to.

Will I still be bisexual in the hereafter? I have no idea. Maybe, maybe not. All we've got on that topic is conjecture.

Also, I've had an addiction problem before. The addiction prevented me from living a full life, it was an obsession always in my mind no matter what I was doing. My bisexuality causes no such issues.

General Authorities to my knowledge have never said being a homosexual is not a sin.And I dare say bi-sexual proclivity would be akin to say, adulterous desires and well, the Savior did have something to say about that....so perhaps SSA is a more appropriate description. They have said, that having SSA is not a sin, unless acted upon and Elder Oaks I would note stated this:

We should note that the words homosexual, lesbian, and gay are adjectives to describe particular thoughts, feelings, or behaviors. We should refrain from using these words as nouns to identify particular conditions or specific persons. Our religious doctrine dictates this usage. It is wrong to use these words to denote a condition, because this implies that a person is consigned by birth to a circumstance in which he or she has no choice in respect to the critically important matter of sexual behavior.

Edited July 23, 2013 by bytor2112

[bytor2112]

Wow. You think God lied to me? Nice.

God doesn't give revelation that is contrary to church doctrine.

[ElectofGod]

God doesn't give revelation that is contrary to church doctrine.

And did you receive revelation on that? Find me one scripture. Doesn't doctrine come from common consent? Therefore if the people desire it, even if its false doctrine, it will be voted in. Therefore Personal revelation CAN go against church doctrine. "thou shalt not kill", "thou shalt not lie", "thou shalt not...."... Yet countless examples of of the contrary. This is just one case of how it CAN.

I will always follow personal revelation over the arms of flesh. However, the scriptures do state "we shall neither be given in marriage nor taken in marriage in the hereafter". All covenants, contracts, bonds, etc.... must be entered into this life before the next life. If one dies, they must receive those, covenants, contracts, bonds, etc... before they can continue on. Though there does seem to be more to it that has not been revealed so I am not entirely sure.

[bytor2112]

And did you receive revelation on that? Find me one scripture. Doesn't doctrine come from common consent? Therefore if the people desire it, even if its false doctrine, it will be voted in. Therefore Personal revelation CAN go against church doctrine. "thou shalt not kill", "thou shalt not lie", "thou shalt not...."... Yet countless examples of of the contrary. This is just one case of how it CAN.

I will always follow personal revelation over the arms of flesh. However, the scriptures do state "we shall neither be given in marriage nor taken in marriage in the hereafter". All covenants, contracts, bonds, etc.... must be entered into this life before the next life. If one dies, they must receive those, covenants, contracts, bonds, etc... before they can continue on. Though there does seem to be more to it that has not been revealed so I am not entirely sure.

Surely you jest? False doctrine is not doctrine. Pure doctrine comes from the Lord to his anointed and in our day and time that is President Monson. Personal revelation will not be in opposition to church doctrine, "For God doth not walk in crooked paths, neither doth he turn to the right hand nor to the left, neither doth he vary from that which he hath said, therefore his paths are straight, and his course is one eternal round."

The scriptures make it clear that "this life is the time for men to prepare to meet God; yea, behold the day of this life is the day for men to perform their labors." The invitation to Come unto Christ and find in HIM Eternal Life is extended to all mankind and those that have entered in the strait gate and have the opportunity to enter into the New and Everlasting Covenant while in mortality and choose not to...... have rejected that blessing. Those that have not through no fault of their own will have that opportunity in the millennium. If you choose to be unequally yoked in this life...you still have made a choice.

As spoken by a latter day Prophet, President Kimball said:

"He says concerning these excellent people who lived worthily but failed to make their contracts binding:

“For these angels did not abide my law; therefore, they cannot be enlarged, but remain separately and singly, without exaltation, in their saved condition, to all eternity; and from henceforth are not gods, but are angels of God forever and ever”

Edited July 24, 2013 by bytor2112

[Maureen]

Lots of sealings happen after this life. God told me to marry my husband who is not a member which surprised me because I expected a no answer. Maybe my husband will change his mind about the church, maybe he won't, but I can either be sealed to him or to someone else during the millennium. Same with singles and homosexuals.

...We know that single people, and those in mix-faith marriages, can make it to the highest levels of the celestial kingdom....

...Thus, of course it is possible for homosexuals to make it to the highest level of the celestial kingdom....

OK, but if a person who remained single in this life were to get sealed during the millennium, he/she would not be single anymore. Likewise, if a mix-faith couple were to be sealed during the millennium, they would no longer be mix-faith. And what would make a gay person choose to be sealed during the millennium if he/she chose not to be sealed during this life?

M.

[Traveler]

I am bisexual. I assure you it is NOT an addiction. It just *is*. I cannot change it. Lucky me, I have it easy. I just don't get in relationships with women. Ta da!

General Authorities have repeatedly said that being a homosexual is not a sin, acting on it is, meaning having romantic same sex relationships. I am not sinning by being bisexual. I would be sinning if I were to get in a romantic relationship with a woman but there's no chance of that happening because I choose not to.

Will I still be bisexual in the hereafter? I have no idea. Maybe, maybe not. All we've got on that topic is conjecture.

Also, I've had an addiction problem before. The addiction prevented me from living a full life, it was an obsession always in my mind no matter what I was doing. My bisexuality causes no such issues.

One would not think of themselves as bisexual if they had never chosen to be involved in bisexual behavior - same as someone would not be an alcoholic or drug addict unless at some point they had chosen to be involved with the use of alcohol or drugs. You are correct that having once chosen to be involved in bisexuality or the use of alcohol; that once one has repented and forsaken the addiction they are not sinful - at least for that. However, it is possible to obtain an addiction from a single indulgence.

We all obtain some addiction to various sins and without repentance we remain in the sin weather or not we continue to indulge. And we all know that having repented does not mean that we are never again tempted. I completely agree, that once we have repented; that if we continue to be tempted but do not indulge we are not guilty of the sin.

And rest assured - you will be free in eternity for all things you have repented of but without repentance - there is no freedom from any sin - ever.

The Traveler

[bytor2112]

One would not think of themselves as bisexual if they had never chosen to be involved in bisexual behavior - same as someone would not be an alcoholic or drug addict unless at some point they had chosen to be involved with the use of alcohol or drugs. You are correct that having once chosen to be involved in bisexuality or the use of alcohol; that once one has repented and forsaken the addiction they are not sinful - at least for that. However, it is possible to obtain an addiction from a single indulgence.

We all obtain some addiction to various sins and without repentance we remain in the sin weather or not we continue to indulge. And we all know that having repented does not mean that we are never again tempted. I completely agree, that once we have repented; that if we continue to be tempted but do not indulge we are not guilty of the sin.

And rest assured - you will be free in eternity for all things you have repented of but without repentance - there is no freedom from any sin - ever.

The Traveler

Indeed....choosing to identify oneself with a desire that if acted upon would be a gross transgression is not the mind set of one seeking to change...to become different...to invite the Spirit to sanctify with fire.....to turn away from..to repent.

The Gospel of Jesus Christ is the gospel of repentance .....the gospel of change.

Edited July 24, 2013 by bytor2112

[Seminarysnoozer]

One would not think of themselves as bisexual if they had never chosen to be involved in bisexual behavior - same as someone would not be an alcoholic or drug addict unless at some point they had chosen to be involved with the use of alcohol or drugs. You are correct that having once chosen to be involved in bisexuality or the use of alcohol; that once one has repented and forsaken the addiction they are not sinful - at least for that. However, it is possible to obtain an addiction from a single indulgence.

We all obtain some addiction to various sins and without repentance we remain in the sin weather or not we continue to indulge. And we all know that having repented does not mean that we are never again tempted. I completely agree, that once we have repented; that if we continue to be tempted but do not indulge we are not guilty of the sin.

And rest assured - you will be free in eternity for all things you have repented of but without repentance - there is no freedom from any sin - ever.

The Traveler

Great comment!

And one would not look at their self as anything the body dictates if they realize that this life is a probationary period full of temporary stewardship. The spirit who has the body with three chromosome 21s does not see their self as a being with Down's syndrome when this life is over even though while in this life they carry that outward, physical description. All of us are in a fallen state which does not reflect in any linear fashion the nature of our spirit. The key is the discerning of that which is spiritual versus that which is carnally born. Keeping an eye single to the glory of God in conjunction with self sacrifice and forsaking one's life would not allow any of us to internalize the temporary stewardship we have in this life as a description of self. If one falls in love with things of dust they turn to dust in the end. One quick way to discern spiritual things verses carnal is to ask oneself if God likely has that trait. If one answers with "probably not" then it likely isn't anything worth pursuing and in the end will turn to dust, and that includes certain sexual persuasions. We all face carnal traits that God does not have by having a fallen carnal body, that is the test.

[Traveler]

Great comment!

And one would not look at their self as anything the body dictates if they realize that this life is a probationary period full of temporary stewardship. The spirit who has the body with three chromosome 21s does not see their self as a being with Down's syndrome when this life is over even though while in this life they carry that outward, physical description. All of us are in a fallen state which does not reflect in any linear fashion the nature of our spirit. The key is the discerning of that which is spiritual versus that which is carnally born. Keeping an eye single to the glory of God in conjunction with self sacrifice and forsaking one's life would not allow any of us to internalize the temporary stewardship we have in this life as a description of self. If one falls in love with things of dust they turn to dust in the end. One quick way to discern spiritual things verses carnal is to ask oneself if God likely has that trait. If one answers with "probably not" then it likely isn't anything worth pursuing and in the end will turn to dust, and that includes certain sexual persuasions. We all face carnal traits that God does not have by having a fallen carnal body, that is the test.

You bring up an interesting point - Is it possible that a person with Down's syndrome repent at some point to be free of it in eternity?

The Traveler

[ElectofGod]

Pure doctrine comes from the Lord to his anointed and in our day and time that is President Monson. Personal revelation will not be in opposition to church doctrine

I agree with everything you stated, which is almost all of it. Except what I left above. I have received my own Pure doctrine that did not come through the Prophet. Also:

Section 21 verses 4-6:

"Wherefore, meaning the church, thou shalt give heed unto all his words and commandments which he shall give unto you as he receiveth them, walking in all holiness before me;

"For his word ye shall receive, as if from mine own mouth, in all patience and faith.

"For by doing these things the gates of hell shall not prevail against you."

"Whatever God requires is right, no matter what it is, although we may not see the reason thereof until long after the events transpire." (Scrapbook of Mormon Literature, Vol. 2, p. 173.)

There is a major difference between opinion and things received from the Lord. Also how can we know if someone has received it from the Lord or walking in holiness before God? Personal Revelation.

After one enters the path... 2 Nephi 32:

1 And now, behold, my beloved brethren, I suppose that ye ponder somewhat in your hearts concerning that which ye should do after ye have entered in by the way. But, behold, why do ye ponder these things in your hearts?

3 Angels speak by the power of the Holy Ghost; wherefore, they speak the words of Christ. Wherefore, I said unto you, feast upon the words of Christ; for behold, the words of Christ will tell you all things what ye should do.

4 Wherefore, now after I have spoken these words, if ye cannot understand them it will be because ye ask not, neither do ye knock; wherefore, ye are not brought into the light, but must perish in the dark.

5 For behold, again I say unto you that if ye will enter in by the way, and receive the Holy Ghost, it will show unto you all things what ye should do.

The holy Ghost will show us what to do. No-one else can show us what to do. Likewise to the original post. Tell the person to take verse 4 seriously. Tell them to Fast and pray for an answer. "because ye ask not, neither do ye knock; wherefore, ye are not brought into the light"... Get an answer from the Lord.

[bytor2112]

I have received my own Pure doctrine that did not come through the Prophet.

I have been taught pure doctrine by the Spirit but it was not contrary to that taught in the church. Doctrine, (and note that when we use the word doctrine, we are generally speaking of gospel principles enumerated by the scriptures or given through Prophets) if it is received by revelation by an individual will not be contrary to Eternal principles and if it is, it is neither doctrine nor from God.