link to Kolob?


grahmgano
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Hi I have been doing some searching and looking for further inlightment recently including talking to my local missionaries. I have recent discovered Jesus in Latin and Greek alphabet add up to 888. As everyone is aware 666 stands for the beast or the Mark of the beast. When I studied the number 888 it also comes up in Greek as the mythical Sun God also known as Amen Ra. Taking a look at studies of Amen and his history is very similar to Jesus himself. Saying this I looked into pictures of Amen and seen a man with a bird like head holding the key of life along with a staff of some significance, above the head is the Sun with a snake wrapped around and the snakes head popping out. I thought this over and seen what people perceived. and what could be. I thought what if the Sun represented what eclipsed and the snake body represented the Sun burning behind it and the snake head actually being kolob. I heard that every 2 thousand years there is an eclipse which you can see past the Sun to a distant planet or as Abraham described it as a star. there are many other connections between these things which I won't touch on now. I would love to hear feedback and other opinions. thankyou! And please no harsh criticism be open minded as Jesus was.

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The best explanation of 666 I have heard: "Emperor Nero" (Latin: Nero Caesar) can be expressed in two ways in Hebrew: NRWN QSR or NRW QSR. Recall that written Hebrew uses consonants only, so that's why we have forms like NRW and QSR with no vowels. The Latin word Caesar was pronounced with a hard C, which is why Hebrew uses a Q. It's also the origin of "Kaiser" in German.

Anyway, if you add up the two Hebrew forms for Nero Caesar, you get 666 for the first form and 616 for the second. And, interestingly, some of the oldest manuscripts of Revelation say 616 instead of 666.

I'm not a scholar in ancient languages. I'm just repeating something interesting that I heard. As for snakes, sun gods, eclipses, and occluded planets: I would let the missionaries explain the Plan of Salvation first. It's more important. ;)

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Abraham 3:3

3 And the Lord said unto me: These are the governing ones; and the name of the great one is Kolob, because it is near unto me, for I am the Lord thy God: I have set this one to govern all those which belong to the same order as that upon which thou standest.

Abraham 3:4

4 And the Lord said unto me, by the Urim and Thummim, that Kolob was after the manner of the Lord, according to its times and seasons in the revolutions thereof; that one revolution was a day unto the Lord, after his manner of reckoning, it being one thousand years according to the time appointed unto that whereon thou standest. This is the reckoning of the Lord’s time, according to the reckoning of Kolob.

Abraham 3:9

9 And thus there shall be the reckoning of the time of one planet above another, until thou come nigh unto Kolob, which Kolob is after the reckoning of the Lord’s time; which Kolob is set nigh unto the throne of God, to govern all those planets which belong to the same order as that upon which thou standest.

Abraham 3:16

16 If two things exist, and there be one above the other, there shall be greater things above them; therefore Kolob is the greatest of all the Kokaubeam that thou hast seen, because it is nearest unto me.

Abraham 5:13

13 But of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it; for in the time that thou eatest thereof, thou shalt surely die. Now I, Abraham, saw that it was after the Lord’s time, which was after the time of Kolob; for as yet the Gods had not appointed unto Adam his reckoning.

Some may disagree, but based on these verses which is every instance of the term Kolob in the scriptures, I believe that Kolob is a symbolic term for Jesus Christ. I think these verses are describing the pre-Earth council of spirits and the great and noble ones who prepared the Earth and Christ Jehovah being the greatest of them. I do not believe it is a literal star. Jesus is also described as a star figuratively. And the planets described are not literally planets, but sons and daughters of God.

Edited by bytebear
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Abraham 5:13 he says gods? Why would God refer to others being gods unless he is among many

also the book of Abraham was translated from a scroll purchased by Abraham and decoded using seer stones in glasses much as Joseph used to translate the golden plates. And to the person about the 666 and 888. The first bibles were Greek, Latin, and Arabic correct? In which at the time the pope translated ffor the illiterate. Jesus is a Greek rooted word.

Edited by grahmgano
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Abraham says "gods" or elohim, because early Jews and Semites believed in a divine council of gods, led by God Almighty (El Elyon). The Bible indirectly references this council in several places, including Psalms, Isaiah, and Revelation. Even Jesus quoted Psalms in stating "ye are gods."

The book of Abraham was not purchased by Abraham, but by Joseph Smith (typo?). The oldest New Testaments are in Greek and Aramaic. The oldest Old Testaments (Jewish Bible) are Hebrew and the Greek Septuagint. Latin came later, during the Christian era.

The Popes did not translate any version of the Bible until centuries after the death of Jesus. Translations were done by scribes, bishops, and other religious people.

"Jesus" is the Greek version of the Hebrew name "Yeshua" or Joshua.

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Bytebear, your interpretation may be a correct metaphor, but I believe it is based on a physical entity.

Here we have Abraham describing the cosmos, according to his best understanding (which is somewhat earth-centric). It shows planets and stars "governed" by others that are above them.

When we look at the cosmos today, we see much the same thing. Our planets are governed by the Sun, which is governed by the black hole (a type of imploded star) in the center of the galaxy. Our galaxy rotates and shifts around a group of galaxies in the neighborhood, possibly influenced/governed by a governing galaxy or planet. There seems to be a hierarchy going on here.

The concept of multiple galaxies is less than a century old. No one could imagine that the universe is made up of perhaps 200 billion galaxies, each with 200 billion stars! Yet, that is the best estimate we have today. It fits perfectly with the Lord telling Moses that he has endless creations.

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Bytebear, your interpretation may be a correct metaphor, but I believe it is based on a physical entity.

Here we have Abraham describing the cosmos, according to his best understanding (which is somewhat earth-centric). It shows planets and stars "governed" by others that are above them.

When we look at the cosmos today, we see much the same thing. Our planets are governed by the Sun, which is governed by the black hole (a type of imploded star) in the center of the galaxy. Our galaxy rotates and shifts around a group of galaxies in the neighborhood, possibly influenced/governed by a governing galaxy or planet. There seems to be a hierarchy going on here.

The concept of multiple galaxies is less than a century old. No one could imagine that the universe is made up of perhaps 200 billion galaxies, each with 200 billion stars! Yet, that is the best estimate we have today. It fits perfectly with the Lord telling Moses that he has endless creations.

in the European/western world, humanity has known an oddly large amount about the cosmos for thousands of years, the Mayans had a better method of telling time then we do, and we aren't exactly sure how they even did it.

There's a lot we don't understand about earlier humans and I have my own beliefs of history that are different then what I am told happened.

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Bytebear, your interpretation may be a correct metaphor, but I believe it is based on a physical entity.

Here we have Abraham describing the cosmos, according to his best understanding (which is somewhat earth-centric). It shows planets and stars "governed" by others that are above them.

When we look at the cosmos today, we see much the same thing. Our planets are governed by the Sun, which is governed by the black hole (a type of imploded star) in the center of the galaxy. Our galaxy rotates and shifts around a group of galaxies in the neighborhood, possibly influenced/governed by a governing galaxy or planet. There seems to be a hierarchy going on here.

The concept of multiple galaxies is less than a century old. No one could imagine that the universe is made up of perhaps 200 billion galaxies, each with 200 billion stars! Yet, that is the best estimate we have today. It fits perfectly with the Lord telling Moses that he has endless creations.

I agree that Abraham's description was based on his own understanding, which is founded on a different paradigm than modern comsological theory. Truth is found by trying to wear Abraham's glasses and see things the way he saw them, at least for the purpose of interpreting his words. Trying to fit those words into a modern cosmology just won't work.

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Yes it was a typo this webpage is hard to navigate on my phone for some reason and always jumps and I have to rewrite sorry. but anyways taking that into consideration. is it to hard for fellow members who have done extensive research on our past that Joseph translated the plates and made the book of Mormon more Christian considering the time in place in which he had to decipher the plates instead of pegan which is at the heart of our believe much as masonry is?

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Yes it was a typo this webpage is hard to navigate on my phone for some reason and always jumps and I have to rewrite sorry. but anyways taking that into consideration. is it to hard for fellow members who have done extensive research on our past that Joseph translated the plates and made the book of Mormon more Christian considering the time in place in which he had to decipher the plates instead of pegan which is at the heart of our believe much as masonry is?

Well, that's one possible explanation for the Book of Abraham (different than the Book of Mormon)--that at some point, someone--whether Abraham, or Joseph Smith, or some scribe along the way, took a fundamentally pagan text and "christianized" it through the translation process.

But where the Book of Mormon is concerned, I think as a Church we've hitched our wagon to a much more literalist approach. Joseph Smith claimed to have received visits from resurrected Book of Mormon characters. He (and the Church) presented the story of Jesus visiting the Nephites, as an actual event that (in his/our view) serves as a second witness for the historicity and divinity of Jesus of Nazareth. The Book of Mormon presents a concrete origin story for the gold plates, and the story is that the plates were made by Judeo-Christians and had actual Judeo-Christian theology engraved upon them.

So, no; I don't think the idea of the Book of Mormon as a co-opting and christianizing of an older pagan text that actually appeared on the gold plates Joseph Smith possessed, is going to be palatable to orthodox Mormons.

Edited by Just_A_Guy
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Yes it was a typo this webpage is hard to navigate on my phone for some reason and always jumps and I have to rewrite sorry. but anyways taking that into consideration. is it to hard for fellow members who have done extensive research on our past that Joseph translated the plates and made the book of Mormon more Christian considering the time in place in which he had to decipher the plates instead of pegan which is at the heart of our believe much as masonry is?

I don't know about making the Book of Mormon "more Christian", but you seem to have enough information to be dangerous, I've gotta say that.

HJ

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Well, that's one possible explanation for the Book of Abraham (different than the Book of Mormon)--that at some point, someone--whether Abraham, or Joseph Smith, or some scribe along the way, took a fundamentally pagan text and "christianized" it through the translation process.

But where the Book of Mormon is concerned, I think as a Church we've hitched our wagon to a much more literalist approach. Joseph Smith claimed to have received visits from resurrected Book of Mormon characters. He (and the Church) presented the story of Jesus visiting the Nephites, as an actual event that (in his/our view) serve as a second witness for the historicity and divinity of Jesus of Nazareth.

My point exactly. has anyone ever looked into the lost book of enoch (which I know should be taken with a grain of salt) and the similarity to our Joseph? Its baffling in the least. I do believe that this was Joseph calling but I fu no we our to a point where we shouldn't be afraid to reach our full potential of the priesthood much as Jesus wasn't and Joseph wasn't. if you look at the little history of pegans they were terminated much like Mormons and never the less destroyed from Vatican history. I do believe Tue crusades had something to do with this I would have to look more into it. but I feel like we are almost blind sheep at a point following our savior but we claim to be more even members of the priesthood who doubt fully grip what they have. all in all I believe we should all embrace our churches history instead of covering it up because it scares non-Mormons I see and hear this everyday when trying to share my faith with other Christians or another religion at that.

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Bytebear, your interpretation may be a correct metaphor, but I believe it is based on a physical entity.

Here we have Abraham describing the cosmos, according to his best understanding (which is somewhat earth-centric). It shows planets and stars "governed" by others that are above them.

When we look at the cosmos today, we see much the same thing. Our planets are governed by the Sun, which is governed by the black hole (a type of imploded star) in the center of the galaxy. Our galaxy rotates and shifts around a group of galaxies in the neighborhood, possibly influenced/governed by a governing galaxy or planet. There seems to be a hierarchy going on here.

The concept of multiple galaxies is less than a century old. No one could imagine that the universe is made up of perhaps 200 billion galaxies, each with 200 billion stars! Yet, that is the best estimate we have today. It fits perfectly with the Lord telling Moses that he has endless creations.

I think Abraham was using the cosmos and their relationships as a metaphor for the pre-existence and the spirits who were there preparing. The stars are gods (or great leaders), the planets were angels (or other great contributors). Together the spiritual cosmos (our pre-existent spirits led by Jehovah) created the physical cosmos, preparing it for us to inhabit.

Job has some interesting things to say:

Job 1:6 ¶Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.

Job 38

Where wast thou (speaking to Job) when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding. When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

So basically God is telling Job that before the Earth was created or at that time, Satan and God agreed to test Job. Not too fun for Job, but listen to the symbolism that God uses to describe the beings who were part of the creation of the Earth.

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Abraham says "gods" or elohim, because early Jews and Semites believed in a divine council of gods, led by God Almighty (El Elyon). The Bible indirectly references this council in several places, including Psalms, Isaiah, and Revelation. Even Jesus quoted Psalms in stating "ye are gods."

The book of Abraham was not purchased by Abraham, but by Joseph Smith (typo?). The oldest New Testaments are in Greek and Aramaic. The oldest Old Testaments (Jewish Bible) are Hebrew and the Greek Septuagint. Latin came later, during the Christian era.

The Popes did not translate any version of the Bible until centuries after the death of Jesus. Translations were done by scribes, bishops, and other religious people.

"Jesus" is the Greek version of the Hebrew name "Yeshua" or Joshua.

I want to touch on this comment. Read Genesis 1 and then 2. Pay very close attention to chapter 2. You will see that Genesis, even without the JST Moses, very clearly talks about a premortal council. Genesis 1 is NOT an account of the actual creation. Chp. 2 helps us understand its the spiritual creation of all things being determined by the premortal council. Just some food for thought.

Edited by apexviper
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My point exactly. has anyone ever looked into the lost book of enoch (which I know should be taken with a grain of salt) and the similarity to our Joseph? Its baffling in the least. I do believe that this was Joseph calling but I fu no we our to a point where we shouldn't be afraid to reach our full potential of the priesthood much as Jesus wasn't and Joseph wasn't. if you look at the little history of pegans they were terminated much like Mormons and never the less destroyed from Vatican history. I do believe Tue crusades had something to do with this I would have to look more into it. but I feel like we are almost blind sheep at a point following our savior but we claim to be more even members of the priesthood who doubt fully grip what they have. all in all I believe we should all embrace our churches history instead of covering it up because it scares non-Mormons I see and hear this everyday when trying to share my faith with other Christians or another religion at that.

You are overlooking some very important historical facts. It is interesting in both traditional Christianity as well as LDS theology - that there are currently very few original scripture text - especially considering the canon or standard scriptures. The Book of Enoch is an enigma and paradox among ancient text. Including; of all ancient scripture text it is the most quoted scripture text in the New Testament - I am interested in why you believe this particular text should be taken with a grain of salt?

The Traveler

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apexviper,

That is one way to look at it. The way most scholars look at it is we are given two different Creation stories, one from J and the other from P.

Later, we get other Creation stories in the Bible, including one from Isaiah, where God must destroy the sea dragon. And again, the other Creation stories in Moses and Abraham are also different. Clearly they cannot all be historically true, but most (if not all) are metaphorical creation stories.

Traveler: I agree with your assessment of 1 Enoch. It currently is part of the Ethiopian Bible. When we look at which books of the Bible were actually written by the purported author, we find that Daniel and various other books were written centuries later, Paul only wrote 1/2 his epistles, and the apostle John did not write the gospel or Revelation. In fact, none of the gospels were written by their assumed authors! So, do we take all of these with a grain of salt as well?

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