Attention, fans of domestic violence! Sanctioned professional male-v-female MMA bout!


Vort
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What does Vort know about combat, besides watching MMA? I don't even know what combat is, as I haven't been in combat, but I have trained for it. The likelihood of a trained person defeating an untrained person is extremely high regardless of your estimation of the value of their training.

What you quoted, is not a pacifist statement, or proof that Anikido is on the same level as Yoga. The meaning of the quote is referring to the notion that those who are trained should be less willing to fight and seek other means to diffuse a situation. It is also urging other means and violence as a last resort.

Vort actually knows a lot about combat. But, I'll have Vort speak for himself.

Maybe I'm using the wrong word. My siblings and I grew up on Escrima and Kali. Our instructor was Yoling Canete himself! Now, of course violence is a last resort but, my brother was attending church service... the church was full so he stood just outside the door. Some guy grabbed him from behind and took a knife to his throat. Escrima helped him there. Completely. It was all very instinctive and not only was he able to deflect the knife from his throat, he was able to hold the guy there until somebody noticed (he didn't feel it necessary to yell out for help in the middle of Mass!). That's what I consider combat. Granted, a kotegaeshi in Aikido is designed for a knife disarm (okay, I'm not sure if that's regular Aikido or if that's a modified Filipino version) so in this particular case, Aikido has merit (or at least the kind of Aikido I know of).

No, I don't think Aikido is in the same level as Yoga. I think it's in the same level as Tae Kwon Do.

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I wouldn't call those type of men "men of courage and principle." :huh:
Well, again, the worry is that enough people would disagree with you, that the entire nation could be destabilized over the issue.

It was a very common, foundational belief in most societies from the dawn of time until the Greatest Generation's kids started growing up in the '60's. You protect women and children. They're the first off the sinking boat. When there's a bad guy, you put them behind you. The BoM is full of notions of defending wives and children. Joseph Smith is actually on record as calling a man who will not defend his wife and children "a coward and a *******".

Anyway, from the '60's to today, equal rights, women's advances, and all that have happened and continue to happen. The folks with these beliefs I'm describing have grown with the times - they seem content as long as the women are content. But if this country ever brings back the draft and forces women to fight wars against their will, they will have not just a big issue, but an un-reconcilable issue. Nations are only nations as long as people believe in it - and such a situation will dissolve belief for a lot of people who see things differently than Jenmarie.

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While I totally appreciate the support!!!... I actually have zero aikido training.

All my training (premarriage) was lethal.

LINE, primarilly, plus whatever was handy (aka guys I knew; cravmag from the IDF was a blast. But, again, it wasnt the less lethal versions. It was kill'em'fast.).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LINE_(combat_system)

Which I've only ever used in combat once (as the saying goes... If you're down to your bayonet & bare knuckles, you're already dead. Take as many wi you as you can). Our ride FINALLY showed up, so no worries. Although I've also used it in various bar fights, generally one wants to avoid bar fights, because its hard to explain to the police why you felt you had to kill or cripple the guy.

This, Vort, is actually WHY I put my kids in aikido.

Akido's primary job is getting enough distance between you and your assailant so that you can run away. It's 90% breaks and "eeling" out of situations, and 10% counters&strike.. Which they needed to be able to get away from their father.

MY training left me defenseless against my husband. Sure, I could kill him (blind, paralyze, etc.), but I couldn't do LESS than that. So unless I swept him and could grt him outside, and locked him out... I was stuck. All of my training was quick kills & softening techniques (fingers through eyeballs, break their knees, etc).

After my divorce, I made friends with a cop that I'd spar with from time to time (because our training was polar opposite: his was gradually increased levels of control... 4 steps before you break their shoulder. While mine was break the shoulder then sweep and put a boot heel with a head hih kick through their face, remember brains are slippery, and twist your boot so you don't get it caught on the bone. I can't even knee to groin on instinct. I have crush arch of foot as the "preset" before knee to groin, and head butting them as a synchronous thing.

The problem with lethal training... Is that it's pretty impossible to use in self defense against someone you love. So i froze. Every time. I was fine in the field, i was fine in a barfight. But i was completely helpless against someone i just wanted to get off of me. If I couldn't do it, and by the time I needed it, I half hated the guy... How could I expect my kids to be able to do it?

The ONLY thing I could do was sweep him, and drag him by his collar out the door, and lean on it to keep him out.

Don't get me wrong, at this point I honestly wish I'd killed him so my kids don't have to live with him half time, but I couldn't do it. It tears me up probably more than it should: I had no problem with killing (most likely) perfectly honorable people, good husbands, loving mothers... Because that's the job. I grew up military. Lessons from the cradle are that the "enemy" 99 times out of 100 you'd like, socially. Good people, doing their job, just like you. You kill them, they kill you... But meet on the street & they'd be BBQ'ing with ya or babysitting for you. Actually, this bit is driving my DV counselor nutsy cuckoo. He finally stuck me in with the men's group. Because half the DV Anthem (really, it's all my fault, it want that bad) is linked (in my, and most men's brains) with feeling like one SHOULD have been just fine/ able to stop it/ since we didn't its all our fault. Wheee. Lame.

Back on target.

Aikido, otoh, was designed for samurais without their weapons.

PURELY to shuck attackers long enough to get to their weapons or their horse, or to out them down, if necessary but not as a first reaction. (Which is part of why Aikido includes sword training, once you've gotten them off ya, and have gotten your sword, here's how to fight on the ground while you edge toward your horse).

Martial arts all have their specific focus.

For our purposes, it's perfect :D

Q

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  • 2 weeks later...

Vort you do know that the primary martial art that the Tokyo Riot police train in is aikido? There are many flavours to aikido, the soft/gentle style you and your kids have experienced and then there's the hard style like Yoshinkan (which is the style the riot police train in). You can actually go to Japan and do the Riot police senshusei course, which has been said to be one of the most brutal year long martial arts courses you can do.

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Watched UFC 168... needless to say, I had a hard time sleeping after seeing Silva's rubber leg. It's good to know my husband completely doesn't get enjoyment out of somebody getting hurt like that. He was scanning news every 15 minutes all through the night waiting for the news that Silva is okay. He woke me up in the early morning right after Silva got out of surgery to tell me he's going to be okay. And this is after rooting for Weidmann.

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Meh. Not to be too nonchalant about such a serious-looking injury, but these guys know the risk and, at that level, are compensated pretty well for doing so. Today, there is little risk of serious lasting harm from such an injury, however awful it may appear. There is a very small chance of stroke from breaking a bone, and there is always a possibility of surgical complications. But realistically, it's a nasty, ugly-looking break that will heal up within three months, and the patient will be back to 90% or better within six and, barring complications, 100% within a year.

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Meh. Not to be too nonchalant about such a serious-looking injury, but these guys know the risk and, at that level, are compensated pretty well for doing so. Today, there is little risk of serious lasting harm from such an injury, however awful it may appear. There is a very small chance of stroke from breaking a bone, and there is always a possibility of surgical complications. But realistically, it's a nasty, ugly-looking break that will heal up within three months, and the patient will be back to 90% or better within six and, barring complications, 100% within a year.

Hence the every-15-minute check for news. Because, with compound fractures, it's not always the regular set-it-and-forget-it deals. My professional goalkeeper brother fractured his shoulder which cost his career. He wears a pin until today and it bothers him daily. My husband was truly concerned for the guy! I've never seen him do that with football injuries.

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  • 1 year later...

Granted, a kotegaeshi in Aikido is designed for a knife disarm (okay, I'm not sure if that's regular Aikido or if that's a modified Filipino version)

 

Kotegaeshi is meant to be a hand control in general; considering the hand as a weapon in itself means it really doesn't change much whether it's holding a weapon or not, except that obviously if there's a knife there, you don't want to get cut.  The motion is such that it will also keep a firearm pointed away from you.

 

Aikido can be taught as an exercise or as a combat art.  I'm learning from a retired police officer who used it in the field and knows exactly what works against people who absolutely will not cooperate voluntarily.

 

His son was a closeup magician who spent a few years as a cop and now teaches weapon retention and handcuffing techniques at the police academy.  That gives an interesting perspective and ability to explain the concepts of pattern interrupt to force an opponent into a state that can then be used to your advantage.  As he explained it, think about walking up stairs and thinking there's one more step when you get to the top; if someone gave you even the tiniest push in the right direction at that moment when you try to step, you'd be on the ground with very little effort.  Misdirecting attention is a closeup magician's bread and butter, but it also sets up an opponent for those pattern interruptions.

 

Most anything can be taught in near useless ways; look at Tai Chi and the way it has been turned into nothing but a stretching dance by 90+% of the instructors.

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