Is ISIS Evil?


srmaher
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CNN published an article by James Dawes called “Is ISIS Evil.”  In a nutshell, Mr. Dawes believes that one of the worst things we can do is to label ISIS as evil.  His solution to the problem of terrorism is to understand the circumstances that led “normal men” to become “monsters.” He asserts that when we use labels such as “evil,” it prevents us from understanding the root causes of such things as terrorism. Below are a few quotes from his article and my response to them.

 
“There is only one good reason to denounce a group as evil — because you plan to injure them, and calling them evil makes it psychologically easier to do so. “Evil” is the most powerful word we have to prepare ourselves to kill other people comfortably.”
“The flip side is that “evil” is also a word that stops us from thinking.” for example, “Jonah Goldberg tried to shame those who are trying to think seriously about ISIS. In a recent tweet, he mocked the attempt to understand ISIS in its social and political context, suggesting that we should focus instead on one fact: “They’re evil.
“They do obviously evil things for evil ends. The fact is, there are few things more dangerous now than allowing ourselves to think that way.”
 

 

 

Contrary to what Mr. Dawes thing, the reason its essential to properly label something as evil is given by Dr. Scott Peck, the author of, People of the Lie. He wrote that, “to name something correctly gives us a certain amount of power over it.” For example, what if we didn’t have proper labels for diseases such as cancer, diabetes or Aids? When a disease is referred to by its name, this implies that certain symptoms are present that justified that diagnosis. Once a patient is properly diagnoses then they can be properly treated. The same idea applies to evil. If we do not know how to define it by it’s symptoms then how can we fight it?
 
History has shown what happens when the world stands by and does nothing to confront evil. Academics like Mr. Dawes, are the product of a secular value system that permeates our Universities which hinder their ability to think clearly when it comes to moral issues.


“We must do more than bomb the believers. We must understand them. We must be willing to continue thinking.
“How is ISIS able to achieve the support it needs? What drives people into its ranks? What social pressures and needs, what political and regional vacuums, make it possible for a group like this to thrive?
“We can say they are evil people doing evil things for evil ends. Or we can do the hard work of understanding the context that made them, so that we can create a context that unmakes them.
“We can analyze the ways its violent tactics are effective for its purposes given the local power dynamics, so that we can also better understand its weak spots. And we can ask how it is that normal men — men who were not born evil — get turned into monsters, so that we can work to change the structures that produce terrorists over the long-term instead of locking ourselves into an endlessly repeated, short-term policy of “killing fanatics” until they are gone.
 

 

 

Those who believe people are inherently good, as Mr. Dawes does. Blame society and other external factors for producing individuals for their defective behavior.  Dennis Prager explains in his book, Think a Second Time, that the  defining issue that separates those on the left and the right is whether or not they believe people are inherently good or evil.  This is why the left believes in big government because it has the authority and power to make the necessary changes in society that result in making better people, or at least this is what they think.
 
His approach to dealing with terrorism is a perfect example of what happens when you believe people are inherently good. The presumption is if we can just “understand” the reasons (I.e. external factors) that lead “normal men” to become terrorists, then we could reverse the process by changing their circumstances and prevent the spread of terrorism.
 
These type of solutions  work well in the minds of academics. Maybe if this Mr. Dawes was around in WWII, understanding Hitler would have been a better strategy than crushing them!  We don’t fight to win anymore because of those in the media and academics think the same way as Dawes.  Had we leveled the cities in Iraq and brought them to their knees I would guarantee you ISIS would not exist.
Conclusion
 
Psalms 97:10, sums up well why the left is incapable of confronting evil. “Ye that love the LORD, hate evil.” A society can be measured in its “love of the Lord,” by what it considers to be evil. The western world is in great trouble for turning away from the Judeo-Christian values which have produced the greatest civilizations in history. We are seeing more and more of those in the western world loving evil, or in the very least tolerating it, and hating the God of Israel.
 
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Isaiah 5:20
  • Old Testament

¶Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! 

 

 

Luke 6:45
  • New Testament

A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.

 

 

 

Yes, they are evil, and I see nothing good in calling them anything else.

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Psalms 97:10, sums up well why the left is incapable of confronting evil. “Ye that love the LORD, hate evil.” A society can be measured in its “love of the Lord,” by what it considers to be evil. The western world is in great trouble for turning away from the Judeo-Christian values which have produced the greatest civilizations in history. We are seeing more and more of those in the western world loving evil, or in the very least tolerating it, and hating the God of Israel.

 

 

 

 

 

We are to hate the sin, and not the sinner.

 

As Matthew quotes Jesus:

 

Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them that despitefully use you, and persecute you; That ye may be the children of the Father which is in heaven...

 

Matthew 5 43-45 KJV

 

This is possibly the hardest message of the NT for any of us to take on board. It seems so contrary to a natural justice that demands an eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth. But, as the good bishop Desmond Tutu once pointed out, if we choose that route, pretty soon the whole world will be blind and toothless.

 

Jesus offers us an alternative to such a sad end. Jesus offers us the only possible way to achieve a lasting, sustainable, global peace on earth, for all people, for all time. If you truly believe that moral condemnation and the labeling of your enemies as fundamentally evil people is the right thing to do, and as a prelude to their hate-driven destruction without compunction, then I suggest you reconsider, at your leisure.

 

Because this is directly contrary to what Jesus taught, We are to forgive, seventy times seven times (Matthew 18 21,22 KJV), and the first step to forgiveness is understanding.

 

All that said, I admit that turning the other cheek to the extreme extent of belly-up pacifism is a little impractical given the current state of the world. It may be that ISIS terrorists need to be killed, and their dreams of a harsh and vicious caliphate destroyed with them. But, we should not do this out of hatred for their very natures, but as a last resort, with deep sorrow that no other way to finish their ideology could be found.

 

Or, in our own hate fuelled fervour, we are no better than them.

 

Best wishes, 2RM

Edited by 2ndRateMind
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ISIS and Al Qaeda are both latter-day groups of Gadianton Robbers.  Really, that is what we are dealing with, and they are just as evil and wicked now as they were in the Book of Mormon.  Unfortunately, we will probably see more groups like this until the Second Coming permanently ends such groups.  The Book of Mormon calls such groups evil and worthy of being destroyed, and I think it would be well if we did the same.

 

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2ndratemind

 

i don't have an answer to this question, just something I think about when I read of these kind of things. God hates evil, and there are evil people, Satan is evil and I do not believe God still loves him or his followers. It is easy to confuse evil people with those who make very bad choices and sin, they are very different. I don't know how these guys do not constitute pure evil. On the other hand we have the example of king Lamoni in the BOM who was forgiven even though had "murdered" people, thats the word the BOM uses. Now, I don't think Lamoni was cutting dudes heads off. Just a thought!  

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No worries. It has taken me 51 years to reach the above conclusion, albeit surrounded by a culture that has been Christian for nearly 1400 years, and there is no way I would expect you to take my position on board at first exposure. All I ask is that you think about it.

 

Best wishes, 2RM.

Edited by 2ndRateMind
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I hope I didn't come across that i was disagreeing with you or trying to show you that i am right. I was just sharing some of my thoughts about the subject, its something i think of often because of so much evil in the world.  King Lamoni's conversion gives me a lot of hope for many who I might judge to be pure evil. Its something that I struggle with because I hate those who kill the innocent.  To be honest i hope they burn in hell, like the communists who starved millions of Ukrainians to death (including infants and children) in the 1930's, or those who sent Jews to gas chambers and Mao who started 45 million people to death in only three years during the great leap forward. might I remind you that many tens of millions of these people were innocent women and chilren.I have to admit that i have no charity for these these people and only wish the worst to come upon them. The only thing i disagree with is your statement, "in our own hate fuelled fervour, we are no better than them." I couldn't disagree more. God is angered by evil, thats one of the reasons i love the OT is because he becomes angry when the innocent are victimized. people think he gets angry over every little thing, oh no. he gets angry when his children kill and massacre one another. Anyway, thank you for sharing your thoughts. 

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Anger is surely a valid emotion when it is righteous. But, we should not allow it to blind us, or lead us contrary to the directions Jesus has pointed out for us. The war between good and evil is a complex and subtle one, though at times it might appear simple and obvious. What is certain, though, is that we cannot defeat evil with evil.

 

Best wishes, 2RM.

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Any one or group that takes human life should be labeled as evil!  Of course there are many different levels of evil but murder , regardless of the circumstances, is an evil event!  ISIS seems to be a very ruthless form of islamic terrorists!  There is a good article at Huffington post written by Alastair Cooke (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alastair-crooke/isis-aim-saudi-arabia_b_5748744.html) that goes into the history and the connection of ISIS with the Saudis.  I recommend it as a good summary.  

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Any one or group that takes human life should be labeled as evil!  Of course there are many different levels of evil but murder , regardless of the circumstances, is an evil event!  ISIS seems to be a very ruthless form of islamic terrorists!  There is a good article at Huffington post written by Alastair Cooke (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alastair-crooke/isis-aim-saudi-arabia_b_5748744.html) that goes into the history and the connection of ISIS with the Saudis.  I recommend it as a good summary.  

 

It seems to me that the real battle here is not about territory, or borders, but ideas. We should not forget that Muslims, even radical, extreme Muslims, love their conception of God quite as much as we love ours. And they hate their conception of evil quite as much as we hate ours. The difference is not in evil natures, so much as mistaken ideologies. While we clearly cannot tolerate the gratuitous destruction of life meanwhile, the only long-term solution is to win this battle of ideas, and, it seems to me, the only way to do that for the long term and indefinitely thereafter is through a careful, humble, respectful, dialog with Islam.

 

Best wishes, 2RM

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ISIS, as a theology, as a religion, as an organization, are evil.  The souls that make up desperately need the LORD.  Caesar may have to come at them with the sword.  Believers in Christ may compose many of the soldiers that engage in the coming battles.  They do well to battle evil.  Nevertheless, our martyrs (those Christians executed for refusing to renounce Christ) will be honored, and it may well be that their spilled blood will bring a wave of saving faith to that troubled land. 

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Any one or group that takes human life should be labeled as evil!  Of course there are many different levels of evil but murder , regardless of the circumstances, is an evil event!  ISIS seems to be a very ruthless form of islamic terrorists!  There is a good article at Huffington post written by Alastair Cooke (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alastair-crooke/isis-aim-saudi-arabia_b_5748744.html) that goes into the history and the connection of ISIS with the Saudis.  I recommend it as a good summary.  

 

I would be very cautious about such a blanket statement.  If anyone or group that takes human life labeled evil, then we live in a very evil country.

 

http://drones.pitchinteractive.com/

 

In the Iraq war over 100k civilians lost their lives and the growth of ISIS is one of the many outcomes of that war.

 

We can pick out the mote in others, but can't pick out the beam in our own eyes.

From the perspective of many middle-eastern countries the US is one of the most evil countries that has ever existed.

 

Personally, I'd rather fight to change the evil in my own country than fight to change the evil in other countries.

 

I see acts and methods as evil.  I see the evil in beheading individuals who have not committed crimes worthy of beheading, just as I see evil in drone strikes ordered from a military officer sitting in a comfortable command post in the US that kill innocent civilians.  One is a very graphic, getting your hands dirty method of killing and the other is "civilized".

 

These groups use religion as a wrapper for their aims, which is political power.  They use religion to entice the foot soldiers to sign up, just as much as other countries use Patriotic duty, benefits, education, etc. to entice foot soldiers to sign up.

 

The tangled web of Middle-Eastern politics is something that we will never be able to figure out or solve.  The US has wars in Syrian and Libya to oust the current political leaders.  In doing so they fund the "rebels", whoever those rebels are depends on if they will do the US's bidding.  The US provides them money, weaponry and training.  Eventually those rebels splinter or have disagreements and take some of the weapons, money and training and end up using them in ways the US does not approve.

 

Does anyone believe that random "terrorists" could organize such a coordinated attack on Benghazi?  I bet bottom-dollar the spooks were involved in either gun-running, cash-running, or drug-running and deals went bad and then bad things happened.

 

The best thing is to just let it sort itself out and not get involved.

 

One of the things that will contribute to men and society becoming evil is war.  War debilitates and drains the soul.  In a war-like culture or in a war setting it is almost impossible for large groups of people to not commit evil acts; it is the nature of war.

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I would be very cautious about such a blanket statement.  If anyone or group that takes human life labeled evil, then we live in a very evil country.

 

http://drones.pitchinteractive.com/

 

In the Iraq war over 100k civilians lost their lives and the growth of ISIS is one of the many outcomes of that war.

 

We can pick out the mote in others, but can't pick out the beam in our own eyes.

From the perspective of many middle-eastern countries the US is one of the most evil countries that has ever existed.

 

Personally, I'd rather fight to change the evil in my own country than fight to change the evil in other countries.

 

I see acts and methods as evil.  I see the evil in beheading individuals who have not committed crimes worthy of beheading, just as I see evil in drone strikes ordered from a military officer sitting in a comfortable command post in the US that kill innocent civilians.  One is a very graphic, getting your hands dirty method of killing and the other is "civilized".

 

These groups use religion as a wrapper for their aims, which is political power.  They use religion to entice the foot soldiers to sign up, just as much as other countries use Patriotic duty, benefits, education, etc. to entice foot soldiers to sign up.

 

The tangled web of Middle-Eastern politics is something that we will never be able to figure out or solve.  The US has wars in Syrian and Libya to oust the current political leaders.  In doing so they fund the "rebels", whoever those rebels are depends on if they will do the US's bidding.  The US provides them money, weaponry and training.  Eventually those rebels splinter or have disagreements and take some of the weapons, money and training and end up using them in ways the US does not approve.

 

Does anyone believe that random "terrorists" could organize such a coordinated attack on Benghazi?  I bet bottom-dollar the spooks were involved in either gun-running, cash-running, or drug-running and deals went bad and then bad things happened.

 

The best thing is to just let it sort itself out and not get involved.

 

One of the things that will contribute to men and society becoming evil is war.  War debilitates and drains the soul.  In a war-like culture or in a war setting it is almost impossible for large groups of people to not commit evil acts; it is the nature of war.

 

The above, while filled with sound observations, appears to argue moral equivalence--that U.S. involvement in the Middle East is no better than the ISIS beheading of infidels within areas they have conquered-by-force.  We use drones to target terrorists, who have engaged in plotting/executing mass murder of civilians.  These enemies hide in countries that aid and abet.  Sometimes civilians die too.  Is this war, or are we really just as evil?  To accept this analysis is to embrace pacifism, isolationism, and, quite frankly, so much of the Old Testament.

 

The U.S. is neither a Christian republic, nor a morally pure nation.  However, if we smude everything gray, and say it's all the same, are we not lead to hopelessness and a passivity.  If so, our inaction may be rooted more in timidity than a true conviction against violence.

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The above, while filled with sound observations, appears to argue moral equivalence--that U.S. involvement in the Middle East is no better than the ISIS beheading of infidels within areas they have conquered-by-force.  We use drones to target terrorists, who have engaged in plotting/executing mass murder of civilians.  These enemies hide in countries that aid and abet.  Sometimes civilians die too.  Is this war, or are we really just as evil?  To accept this analysis is to embrace pacifism, isolationism, and, quite frankly, so much of the Old Testament.

 

The U.S. is neither a Christian republic, nor a morally pure nation.  However, if we smude everything gray, and say it's all the same, are we not lead to hopelessness and a passivity.  If so, our inaction may be rooted more in timidity than a true conviction against violence.

???

 

No, it has nothing to do with moral equivalence.  It simply is an observation that the beheading of several individuals, while an extremely evil act does not necessarily justify military involvement that can kill hundreds of thousands of innocents.

 

Have you not heard of the Just War theory?

  • the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain (nope);
  • all other means of putting an end to it must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective; (nope)
  • there must be serious prospects of success; (nope)
  • the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated (the power of modern means of destruction weighs very heavily in evaluating this condition). (maybe yes)

Not in any way can a war with ISIS be just at this point in time.  Beheading a few individuals is not lasting or certain and the use of arms can very well produce evils graver than the evil eliminated.

 

You do know that ISIS is using US military equipment?  Has anyone ever stopped to think how they acquired US military weapons?  Had the US never gotten involved in Iraq, ISIS wouldn't exist!  What evils monsters are we enabling today by weaponizing "moderate" Syrian rebels and by bombing Iraq again.  The circle goes round and round . . . .

 

"Inaction rooted in timidity" . . . .ha, the ultimate smug smearing of the non-interventionist.  Basically saying you don't want to go to war b/c you are a wimp!  I assure you, just try and enter my house uninvited and you'll find yourself on the wrong end of a .45.

 

We are most definitely at the time modern history like the end of the BoM.  The Nephites and Lamanites fight with each side believing so strongly that they are in the right, the other is in the wrong and therefore they are justified in destroying the other.   The book of Ether does a great job at describing the evil consequences of Nations so rooted in war that they are unable to comprehend what they are doing to their civilization.  If we have eyes to see and ears to hear, there are many lessons we can learn from those examples.

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