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Mahone

Scottish Independence Referendum

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So, on the 18th September, the population of Scotland will vote yes or no to the question, should Scotland be an independent Country?

 

In the event of a yes vote, Britain would become a a meagre England and Wales, whereas the United Kingdom would only consist of only England, Wales and Northern Ireland.

 

Will such a move benefit Scotland in the long run, how will it affect the remainder of the UK and perhaps more importantly to most of you across the pond, will this separation affect the UK's political and NATO allies, such as the USA, in any adverse fashion, maybe from a political or military viewpoint?

 

From a military perspective, if Scotland becomes independent, the Scottish government wants to remove trident (the British nuclear weapons programme) from the country ASAP - not something I'd imagine the US has an interest in happening.  Barack Obama has recently stated that the USA has "a deep interest in making sure that one of the closest allies we will ever have remains a strong, robust, united and effective partner".

 

What are your thoughts on this?

Edited by Mahone

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When I served my mission in England there was a missionary there from Scotland and he was in favor of this. When I hear about this vote coming up it always makes me think of him and I wonder if he will still vote in favor of it.

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So, on the 18th September, the population of Scotland will vote yes or no to the question, should Scotland be an independent Country?

 

In the event of a yes vote, Britain would become a a meagre England and Wales, whereas the United Kingdom would only consist of only England, Wales and Northern Ireland.

 

Will such a move benefit Scotland in the long run, how will it affect the remainder of the UK and perhaps more importantly to most of you across the pond, will this separation affect the UK's political and NATO allies, such as the USA, in any adverse fashion, maybe from a political or military viewpoint?

 

From a military perspective, if Scotland becomes independent, the Scottish government wants to remove trident (the British nuclear weapons programme) from the country ASAP - not something I'd imagine the US has an interest in happening.  Barack Obama has recently stated that the USA has "a deep interest in making sure that one of the closest allies we will ever have remains a strong, robust, united and effective partner".

 

What are your thoughts on this?

while Russia is huffing and puffing it might be a good idea to put off the referendum date for a while. I think in general if we split off and become focused on our own thing, we become weaker as a whole.

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Mahone, would Scotland join the British Commonwealth, then; or would they just cut ties with the Crown completely?

 

And, aren't the English royal family also lawful heirs to the Scottish throne as well (via James I)?  How would that work out?

 

The Scots have to do what they feel is best, I suppose; but I don't see the UK holding on to Northern Ireland for long if Scotland leaves.   And if the British can't stay together after having had four hundred years to work things out, it seems a troubling harbinger of increasing balkanization worldwide.

Edited by Just_A_Guy

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The problem in Britain is that no one wanted to be part of them except England in the first place. People hold long grudges against being forced. I would like them to be come independent as countries but present a united front as a coalition for defense and trade purposes although I believe the EU does that already. 

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Whatever the scott's think is in their best interest they should do.

 

From an outsider perspective, I hope they do, if only to show that seceding from a larger country is a viable option and that it doesn't need to include bloodshed.

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Apologies, I'm on my mobile and admittedly this forum is not the easiest of websites to use on a small device.

Just_A_Guy, commonwealth membership is being debate between the SNP and the commonwealth leadership. As usual, the SNP insist having commonwealth membership as an independent Scotland is no problem, and the commonwealth leadership is saying that it's not necessarily that simple. As for royal heir to the throne of Scotland, if the SNP don't want them to have to have that inheritance any longer, they can simply remove it. As it stands though, whether or not to do this is being debated by the Scottish Government.

In my honest opinion, becoming independent will not be good for Scotland or good for the rest of the UK. I'm just glad that I'm flying to the states on a one way ticket that day so even in the event of a yes vote, I won't have to live here ever again to see the affects of the outcome.

Edited by Mahone

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while Russia is huffing and puffing it might be a good idea to put off the referendum date for a while. I think in general if we split off and become focused on our own thing, we become weaker as a whole.

Any delay on this referendum will look like London are scared of a yes vote and intentionally using delaying tactics to give themselves more time to argue against

Edited by Mahone

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The problem in Britain is that no one wanted to be part of them except England in the first place. People hold long grudges against being forced. I would like them to be come independent as countries but present a united front as a coalition for defense and trade purposes although I believe the EU does that already.

Membership of the EU would have to be sought by an independent Scotland as it would not be automatic, which is not an easy task. It takes many Country's years to gain such a privilege.

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If I did the math right, the United Kingdom would lose about 8% of its population if Scotland leaves.  That may not seem like much, but Texas has about 8% of the U.S. population, and chopping Texas out of the U.S. would hurt.

 

I predict that Scotland will leave the U.K., and that we'll see more of this in the years ahead as more "submerged" ethnic groups in various nations decide they want their own show.  Psychologists have taught us for years that humans tend to confuse improvement with change, which probably explains why some people enter and exit various religions.

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The New York Times had an article yesterday about the separatist dominoes falling in Europe if Scotland drop-kicks the United Kingdom.  Who knows, in a decade or two all the colored regions in this map might be new countries.  Some of them might even declare their local dialects to be new national languages. 

 

efa-u.png

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The New York Times had an article yesterday about the separatist dominoes falling in Europe if Scotland drop-kicks the United Kingdom.  Who knows, in a decade or two all the colored regions in this map might be new countries.  Some of them might even declare their local dialects to be new national languages. 

 

I actually think this would be a good thing.  I think it would probably be a good thing in the US too (I know crazy talk right).  The US republican system was never designed nor could the founders have envisioned the population growth.  The government that governs best is one that is as close to the people as possible.

 

Right now a Representative in Congress "represents" on average something like 700,000.  Originally it was 50k, in 250 years the amount of people a representative represents has increased over 10x.  To equal the same representation we would need over 5000 members of Congress.  It is simply too large for any type of meaningful representation.  One of the major drivers for so much money involved is the amount of power each congresscritter holds.  Reduce it by 10x and the amount of money in each race would be drastically reduced.

 

Government over large diverse populations is simply too unwieldy.

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Not being a Scot (though having, as many do, Scottish heritage) I'm on the fence with this one. I might listen to my heart and my sense of wanting to defy the odds and the powers that be and vote "Yes" for independence. But rationally, I know there would (and will be) trials that come with it, and I certainly understand and agree with the sensibility of the island of Britain being united as one kingdom - on all practical levels. So, I don't know. On the one hand, I'd be happy for Scotland if they leave, but on the other, I'd miss the union and brotherhood that the United Kingdom and its flag represents. I can see both sides.

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