My wife has decided to leave the church.

[Just_A_Guy]

Based on what you're telling us, it sounds like she's not trying to bond with you.  She's trying to recruit you.  (Obviously, I could be missing a part of the puzzle; but that's how it looks to me.)  IMHO, you should definitely make it clear that you will not be recruited and let her react to that however she will.  As a general proposition, it's a good idea for the two of you to set up some ground rules now that the marital structure provided by LDS theology is--from her standpoint--gone.  What behaviors are OK for her, and what are dealbreakers?  Is she still willing to commit to no alcohol in the house?  Sexual fidelity?  Financial practices/tithing? (You've already had this particular discussion, it sounds like.)

 

With regard to a divorce--she's going to do whatever she's going to do; but I'd be very hesitant about initiating a divorce myself.  You should be aware that divorce is almost certainly going to be financially painful for you, and it will likely severely limit your time with your kids--and therefore, your ability to influence their spiritual development.  Paradoxically, studies indicate that it's the father's spiritual example, not the mother's, that children will tend to follow.  (Source)  That doesn't necessarily mean you should stay together "for the kids"; but you should very, very carefully consider all factors before you run off and file a divorce petition.

 

Whatever you do, though, I would strongly urge you that (and I say this as a practicing lawyer, though probably not in your state) that anytime a spouse drops the "D" word, it's time for you to go see a lawyer immediately about protecting your legal rights.  Even if you opt to stay together--threatening divorce is a bell that cannot be un-rung; and in my experience it completely changes the dynamic of a marital relationship and introduces a sense of fatalism that sooner or later,the marriage is going to fall apart--which becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.  There are things a person--especially a husband--can and should do immediately, if he thinks divorce is becoming a real possibility even ten or twenty years down the road (I'm not talking about hiding assets or anything nefarious--again, talk to a lawyer).  Your ability to retire before the age of 80 should not depend on whether or not your wife decides to quit acting like an infant.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Just_A_Guy

[NightSG]

Is she still willing to commit to no alcohol in the house?  Sexual fidelity?  Financial practices/tithing? (You've already had this particular discussion, it sounds like.)

 

More importantly, is she willing to keep to those commitments after they're made?  My ex wife, when she was accusing me of infidelity because I would sometimes be 20-30 minutes late getting home from work or class, agreed to communication as verification; if I wasn't going to be home right away I'd text her, and she would do the same, but within a month she was back to her routine of "going to the store" for 3-4 hours, not answering her phone during that time, and coming home with a couple small bags of groceries.  Shortly after that, she started going to the bar with her brother, dressing up more than she had when we were dating and disappearing for 6 hours or more at a time.  I still got chewed out if I didn't let her know exactly what was going on within 10 minutes after my shift or class ended, but I also got chewed out if I made the mistake of asking her where she had been or why it took 4 hours to get a day's groceries from a store that was less than a five minute drive from the house.

[Litzy]

 

Based on what you're telling us, it sounds like she's not trying to bond with you.  She's trying to recruit you. 

 

 

Yesseree, this is probably what's she's trying, especially with her having joined an ex-Mormon community. My ex-husband initially tried such behaviors before I told him flat-out I was staying in the Church. The recruiting behavior may come from trying to get you to leave the Church to an honest but misguided attempt to keep the marriage strong.

 

We may not look highly on marriages where a spouse has left the Church--the reverse is true in these ex-Mormon groups.

[Litzy]

 

Based on what you're telling us, it sounds like she's not trying to bond with you.  She's trying to recruit you. 

 

 

Yesseree, this is probably what's she's trying, especially with her having joined an ex-Mormon community. My ex-husband initially tried such behaviors before I told him flat-out I was staying in the Church. The recruiting behavior may come from trying to get you to leave the Church to an honest but misguided attempt to keep the marriage strong.

 

We may not look highly on marriages where a spouse has left the Church--the reverse is true in these ex-Mormon groups.

[pkstpaul]

I gave an overly simplistic response early in your thread. I'm sticking to it. The back and forth you and your wife are displaying are demonstrating your youth and attempts to grow. As time goes, you will actually bond in these experiences. Until/unless she actually walks out the door, or hires a lawyer to walk you out the door, you are married and working things out. You can give all the details you want and people can nit-pic the behaviours and responses, but honestly you just need to be patient and live this out. She has issues, but so do you. Time is the great healer. I'm not trying to reduce this to sound-bites. I'm simply stating that marriage is work and you need to keep at it.

[000Zero000]

It's over.  There is no more reconciling.  I had determined to let her file the petition for divorce if it is going to happen.  She plans on meeting with a lawyer tomorrow to get things going. 

 

I came home after being gone for a few days to stories from my kids of her showing them anti mormon videos and trying to bribe them to not go to church.  That was of course accompanied with her own testimony of how false the church was.  They were of course extremely upset by it.    There isn't any way to stop her from doing it.  

 

It's hopeless at this point.  She has talked a lot about what divorce will look like for our kids and her.  She honestly believes it will be better for our kids.  She is hoping that the amount of child support and alimony she will be getting from me will allow her stay at home still and not work.  She of course only wants to do that until the kids are all in school and then she would get a job and build a career.  She believes that we will create this co parenting utopia where our kids lives will be so much better than they are now.  It's very disheartening.

[Jane_Doe]

She's in for a harsh dose of reality.

 

My heart goes out for you brother, keep being the best dad to your kids you can be.

Edited February 9, 2015 by Jane_Doe

[classylady]

After my husband's divorce, there was no co-parenting.  It was more like parallel-parenting.  He did his thing, she did her thing.  My husband had custody of his kids, so he had the greater influence.  His ex had been excommunicated.  Both of my step-children ended up going on missions and are still very active in the church today.

[priesthoodpower]

hang in there dude! I know that feeling but have not yet gone that far and never hope to go that far as getting a divorce, everyday is a struggle.

[pkstpaul]

I wanted to be as supportive as possible, but understand you face the day-to-day reality and only you could know what is best for your family. Nobody wants to tell you to throw in the towel.

 

In terms of custody, I found what works well is one week on, one week off.  That keeps kids in a routine they can grasp. That may be more applicable to school age children.

 

It sounds like your wife is obsessed with anti-church without supplimenting it with anything faith based. I would suggest you show your children a balanced approach at life and not try to give as much focus on church as your wife is giving as anti. Just be a good active member and find lots of other healthy physical and mental activities outside of church. That is hard for LDS to do, but I think to be fully church focused will cause a polarity in their lives and at some point they will feel to be draw to one extreme over the other. Generally, it is that anti that will win that battle. Satan is very powerful.

Best wishes

[Litzy]

I'm sorry to hear this, Zero. It's a tough place. Please keep in mind this is your wife's decision. You tried your best to make the marriage work. You need both people to work the marriage correctly.

 

Talk to a lawyer. No reason you should be working two jobs to pay alimony while she doesn't work. (Yes, she's in for a hard dose of reality.) A teacher at my school went through a divorce some years' back... and returned to teaching only because she realized the child support and welfare wasn't enough for her not to work. She'll figure it out, poor thing.

 

And poor you. Stay strong in the gospel, but avoid any polarization. We gave our kids full freedom for religious choices. My ex and I could speak for our own beliefs, but never against.

[pkstpaul]

Talk to a lawyer. No reason you should be working two jobs to pay alimony while she doesn't work. (Yes, she's in for a hard dose of reality.)

Yes, by all means, this is no time to be soft. The decisions made during the divorce may last a life time. It is not about being punitive, it is about protecting your interest and the interest of the children. You may love her and feel compassion, but the law (her lawyer) isn't going to measure that when it strips you to the bone because they know just exactly what I said; what happens now may last a lifetime and they want the most.

 

I hate that my own tone had to change from "please try to make it work" to "don't give an inch". It is only from watching others go through this process that I know you'll get the short end of the stick unless you hold tight. You can be compassionate later - literally, you can always choose to help more later.

[yjacket]

She honestly believes it will be better for our kids.  She is hoping that the amount of child support and alimony she will be getting from me will allow her stay at home still and not work.  She of course only wants to do that until the kids are all in school and then she would get a job and build a career.  She believes that we will create this co parenting utopia where our kids lives will be so much better than they are now.  It's very disheartening.

 

As others have said she is in lala land. Obviously she hasn't done research on the affects of divorce on children.  The life of hard knocks . . . 

 

Personally, I think divorce laws are messed up in this country.  IMO the filing partner should not have cause to get access to the other's financial resources unless they are divorcing for cause (i.e. abuse, adultery).  This would obviously be a no-fault divorce and I think it is ridiculous that she would be able to get access to both children and money simply because she wants to live her life with no responsibility and no strings attached. I think that is a grand injustice that she can divorce no-fault and get access to money.  

 

That's called being a gold-digger, I have no respect for individuals who mooch off the backs of others hard work.

 

So yes, protect yourself as much as possible now.  This is imperative. You seem like a good guy and while this is going to be extremely rough for you-you want to be in the position that at some point you'll be able to move on.

[notquiteperfect]

Since it's time to lawyer up - get the best one you can possibly afford.  It makes a huge difference!

 

Sorry things have gone this way.

[000Zero000]

Quick update.  We aren't done, yet.  A couple of days after my last post we had a good sit down were I begged her not to divorce me.  She reluctantly agreed.  A week ago she reiterated that she wanted to divorce again and was very matter of fact that it was happening.  I pleaded for more time and she has tentatively agreed to 6 months before pulling the trigger.  I may be delaying the inevitable, I don't know.  I hope not.  

 

She loves me but leaving the church has opened her eyes to things that she wouldn't let herself see before.  I essentially feel like I am trying to convice her that she wants me over those things.  I hope I can win out but am preparing myself for the possibility that there is nothing I can do to desuade her.  Only time will tell. 

[Vort]

Best of luck, friend. You should probably be talking to a lawyer right now. I can almost guarantee you your wife is.

 

Advice from an outsider and a stranger: Don't hold on so tightly that you strangle the relationship. if she really wants to go, you can't make her stay -- and even if you can, YOU DON'T WANT TO. If she believes she has found wonderful freedom outside the Church, let her go. If she thinks her marriage to you is stifling her, let her go. Move on with your own life, and make this seeming tragedy into an important lesson that moves you forward to happier times.

 

Again, best of luck.

Edited March 17, 2015 by Vort

[Guest]

Let it go, let it go... can't hold it back anymore. Let it go, let it go... turn away and slam the door.

Okay, just kidding.

[Pahoranite]

Must be hard.

[classylady]

I would not want to be in a relationship where I have to beg my spouse to stay.  I want a relationship where my spouse is fully engaged and desires to be with me.

[000Zero000]

classylady,  point taken.  I want her to have the time to know what she wants.  Nothing more.  I want both of us to be making decisions that are well thought out.  So many things have changed for us over these last few months I think it would be unwise to make large decisions when our lives are so unsettled.  If at the end of 6 months she still feels the same way I will accept her decision and work to make the best of it.

[classylady]

Divorce is never an easy decision.  Anyway, it shouldn't be.  It's good to take the time to really come to the best decision for all involved rather than making a hasty decision in the heat-of-the-moment.

 

With my husband's divorce from his ex, there are consequences that plague us to this day (it's been over 34 year).  Most of the problems deal with the children.  It's so hard on the kids.  Even though I feel his two children have done quite well, emotionally they have struggled.  They are both adults now, both have served missions, both are married in the temple.  But, the emotional toll on them has been tremendous--especially for my step-daughter.  She has struggled all her life in trying to make things fair, such as making sure both sides of the family are visited x times during the month, all holidays are divided up as equally as she can do it, etc.  My step-son doesn't worry about it so much.  But, I think he has attachment issues.  

 

Divorce is hard!  I've often questioned for the kids sake, if he should have remained married to the ex?  But, for my husband's sake, divorce was the only way he could survive.  His ex-wife had some of the same issues as yours.  She isn't exactly anti-mormon, but she has been excommunicated for adultery and not being repentant about it (she saw nothing wrong with that life-style).  She would have been willing to remain in the marriage if she could have maintained that life-style of an open marriage.  My husband could not abide such a marriage.  And, maybe this is answering my own question, for the children's sake they were probably better off seeing that their father took a stand, and stood up for his beliefs and morality.

 

As I mentioned in an earlier post, there was no co-parenting between my husband and his ex.  It was much more a style of parallel-parenting.  He did his thing, she did hers.  There was very little communication between the two of them.  That's the only way they could work it out.  I'm wondering in your circumstances how you can properly co-parent if she is willing to show the children anti-mormon videos and you're trying to teach them to love the gospel and gain testimonies?  Legally, I believe, there isn't much you can do about it.

 

Best of luck.

Edited March 25, 2015 by classylady

[Still_Small_Voice]

It sounds to me in my limited judgment like this marriage will end in divorce sadly.  Doesn't sound like if but when.  The wife seems very consumed with what she wants and is traveling in strange roads.

 

If you both end up with lawyers there may not be much left in assets when it is all said and done with all the legal fees (and she likely will fight you for everything). 

 

What is more important is that you remain a good example and a godly influence with your children.  I would fast and pray and fast as often as you can handle it (one meal fasts).  I would pray that you would remain a good influence in your children's lives and that your wife will be humbled.  Likely she will be unconvinced of any truth or want to come back, but a humble person usually does not seek to be nasty and cause trouble in others lives.  When someone is brought down low they usually lose the spirit of contention.  Seek the direction of the LORD and inspiration in your life.

 

God speed brother.

[blueskye]

Zero, doubt is normal. It's thinking that doubt and questioning indicates Something, whatever that Something is, that can get people spun up. Just take it easy, and not create monsters under the bed, so to speak. Be supportive, and for heck sake, never even hint that changing belief is a marital deal breaker. That alone may start a downward spiral for which there is no return.