Being baptized and afraid of the procedure

[JimmiGerman]

Is it necessary that one is baptized in the form the LDS church practices it or is there another way, alternatively, more symbolic and without water?

Edited December 12, 2014 by JimmiGerman

[Vort]

Honestly...nope. No other way. I'm being serious. Baptism means full immersion in water. It is the only approved ordinance for joining the Church. There is no backup plan.

 

I would suggest you talk with the missionaries to find how you can overcome your fear enough to allow baptism. You are not the first to face this issue. I have to think there are methods available that would help. I remember a boy in my ward who wanted to be baptized but had a tremendous fear of water. He was finally baptized. I was not present for his baptism, but I understand that he sort of crouched low with his head out of the water, then took a breath and ducked his head underwater for a second or two, just long enough to confirm the ordinance.

[Just_A_Guy]

In some cities of my mission in Brazil, they had "rolling blackouts"--except it was the water, not the electricity, that would be shut off.  Just before one baptismal service, the water trickled to a stop when we had barely eighteen inches of water (about half a meter ) in the font.  We wound up performing the baptism by having the convert sit on the floor of the font and, at the appropriate moment, lie down until she was perfectly flat and (barely!) completely immersed.  Not terribly elegant, but it was enough to satisfy the scriptures.

 

Perhaps some variant of that might be helpful?

Edited December 11, 2014 by Just_A_Guy

[JimmiGerman]

Honestly...nope. No other way. I'm being serious. Baptism means full immersion in water. It is the only approved ordinance for joining the Church. There is no backup plan.

 

I would suggest you talk with the missionaries to find how you can overcome your fear enough to allow baptism. You are not the first to face this issue. I have to think there are methods available that would help. I remember a boy in my ward who wanted to be baptized but had a tremendous fear of water. He was finally baptized. I was not present for his baptism, but I understand that he sort of crouched low with his head out of the water, then took a breath and ducked his head underwater for a second or two, just long enough to confirm the ordinance.

 

I see.

Edited December 12, 2014 by JimmiGerman

[Vort]

Your answer is faster than lightnings. But your words are less than brightnings. It's only water. Bloody water. Isn't the words and the way you confess more worth than diving under water? I will never let myself dived under water. It's my principle way of faith - water hathen nothing to do with my believing in the Great Spriti, and I've called HIM under this name, and I've talked to him (doesn't mean he responded me).

 

I have sympathy for your plight, JimmiGerman. But we don't set the requirements; God does. Why God insists on this particular ordinance done in this particular way, I don't know. But there is no way to modify the ordinance. It is what it is.

 

Please understand, I'm not taking your concerns lightly. I don't think "Hey, it's just water, get over it." I understand very well that this is no light thing. I'm simply trying to be as truthful and straightforward as possible.

[JimmiGerman]

I have sympathy for your plight, JimmiGerman. But we don't set the requirements; God does. Why God insists on this particular ordinance done in this particular way, I don't know. But there is no way to modify the ordinance. It is what it is.

 

Please understand, I'm not taking your concerns lightly. I don't think "Hey, it's just water, get over it." I understand very well that this is no light thing. I'm simply trying to be as truthful and straightforward as possible.

 

I understand the requirements are not from men, so it's necessary.

Edited December 12, 2014 by JimmiGerman

[omegaseamaster75]

Great thread.....lol

[Vort]

D'oh.

 

[JimmiGerman]

Great thread.....lol

 

Edited December 13, 2014 by JimmiGerman

[NeuroTypical]

Hi Jimmi,

 

My daughter had a fear of water.  So we started around age 5 - we joined the community swimming pool and went 3 days a week.  Over the years, we'd try one new thing every week.  

 

First, shallow end - splashing and rolling around.

Second, deep end - slow and safe, only what she was comfortable with.

Third, seeing how much face you could put in water before feeling uncomfortable or panicky.  Nothing helps irrational fear like repetitive boredom.  Sure, you're anxious and symptomatic now, but spend 3 months in a shallow pool trying to put your face one extra millimeter more under the water than last time, and your brain might decide the whole thing isn't worth it and give up on all the anxious.

Forth, jumping.  Into shallow water at first.  Then deeper water.  

Fifth, immersing.  Shallow end first, practicing holding nose and closing eyes.  

 

Anyway, she's 13 now and has been swimming like a fish since before age 8.  

 

I am not minimizing your fear of water or suggesting you ignore it or try to force your way through it.  I'm suggesting you try to bore it to death.

[JimmiGerman]

Hi Jimmi,

 

My daughter had a fear of water.  So we started around age 5 - we joined the community swimming pool and went 3 days a week.  Over the years, we'd try one new thing every week.  

 

First, shallow end - splashing and rolling around.

Second, deep end - slow and safe, only what she was comfortable with.

Third, seeing how much face you could put in water before feeling uncomfortable or panicky.  Nothing helps irrational fear like repetitive boredom.  Sure, you're anxious and symptomatic now, but spend 3 months in a shallow pool trying to put your face one extra millimeter more under the water than last time, and your brain might decide the whole thing isn't worth it and give up on all the anxious.

Forth, jumping.  Into shallow water at first.  Then deeper water.  

Fifth, immersing.  Shallow end first, practicing holding nose and closing eyes.  

 

Anyway, she's 13 now and has been swimming like a fish since before age 8.  

 

I am not minimizing your fear of water or suggesting you ignore it or try to force your way through it.  I'm suggesting you try to bore it to death.

 

Yes, thanks.

Edited December 12, 2014 by JimmiGerman

[MarginOfError]

I would disagree with most on this issue.  If an individual has a genuine phobia of the water, and forcing them under the water to be baptized would be a traumatic experience, I see no value in forcing this upon them.

 

We fudge over ordinances all of the time in the church.  I've witnessed bishops authorize a misspoken sacrament prayer to avoid humiliating the person saying the prayer (usually after a couple of attempts, or when there are learning/reading disabilities involved).  I've personally followed instruction from a temple president to permit a person to pass through the veil of the temple into the celestial room even if they didn't complete the words of the ordinance correctly.  The principle we were taught was that getting exactness in the ordinance was secondary to helping people feel the Spirit.

 

I would follow that same counsel in cases of extreme phobias that might cause the individual to relive traumas*.  

 

What ultimately matters in any priesthood ordinance is that the presiding authority has authorized that the ordinance be performed.  The presiding authority, acting on behalf of the Lord, can record an incomplete or incorrect ordinance as complete and have that recorded in heaven.  End of story.

 

That being said, good luck finding priesthood leaders that are willing to play that card.  I'm not optimistic that there are many of them out there.

 

 

* Though I would be very careful and sparse in how I applied this.  For instance, I'm with NeuroTypical on trying to work through the phobia first.  But that's easier with a child than it is with an adult.

[PolarVortex]

I don't have much to add here, but I did listen to a podcast recently where a new member asked to be baptized in some nearby creek.  The missionaries and bishop were horrified and tried mightily to talk him out of it.  One of them hit on the idea of calling the stake and asking for permission, thinking that the stake would instantly forbid it and thus drop the guillotine blade on any further creek-talk.

 

But the stake was utterly charmed by this suggestion and told them to get down to that creek pronto to baptize him.  Perhaps the water may not bother you as much if you are a shaping force behind the location and style of your baptism.  

[omegaseamaster75]

The funniest part is that people are actually responding in a serious manner to this thread....

 

Get in the water, get dunked, you will live....

[JimmiGerman]

-deleted-   by JimmiGerman

 

 

This is not a lovesong...  

Edited December 13, 2014 by JimmiGerman

[jerome1232]

Just be glad you weren't born a Jew a little over 2 thousand years ago, man you would've had troubles with your anti-ordinance thing.

[JimmiGerman]

Just be glad you weren't born a Jew a little over 2 thousand years ago, man you would've had troubles with your anti-ordinance thing.

 

Right you are. And I thank God to live now and today and not 2 thousand years ago. But as a penguin it is easy to talk about all these things. You like water and diving under - it's your nature. It's the most usual way for you, as a  penguin. I'm not a penguin, but sometimes I wish I was one. Penguins never cry - or was it icebears...?

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLX3FsSLhSA

Edited December 12, 2014 by JimmiGerman

[Vort]

Penguins never cry

 

And this is why they are the saddest of all creatures.

 

Mourn the penguins, for they cannot mourn themselves.

[JimmiGerman]

And this is why they are the saddest of all creatures.

 

Mourn the penguins, for they cannot mourn themselves.

 

Yeah! And mourn the icebears, too, just to be fair.

 

[jerome1232]

I just realized how odd it is to write 2 thousand, instead of 2000 or two thousand, or even 2k.

[Vort]

Yeah! And mourn the icebears, too, just to be fair.

 

 

So why does a Mormon list have a drink-a-huge-automatically-refilling-stein-of-beer smiley?

[JimmiGerman]

So why does a Mormon list have a drink-a-huge-automatically-refilling-stein-of-beer smiley?

 

The answer is blow'n in the wind. 

 

But who will say it's beer...?

Edited December 12, 2014 by JimmiGerman

[Vort]

 

The answer is blow'n in the wind.

 

Maybe it's simply lust for life.

 

But who will say it's beer...?

 

lol <-- drowning man

*lol* <-- drowning cheerleader

[Guest]

I don't have much to add here, but I did listen to a podcast recently where a new member asked to be baptized in some nearby creek.  The missionaries and bishop were horrified and tried mightily to talk him out of it.  One of them hit on the idea of calling the stake and asking for permission, thinking that the stake would instantly forbid it and thus drop the guillotine blade on any further creek-talk.

 

But the stake was utterly charmed by this suggestion and told them to get down to that creek pronto to baptize him.  Perhaps the water may not bother you as much if you are a shaping force behind the location and style of your baptism.  

 

My son got baptized in the Atlantic Ocean with a hurricane brewing out at sea.  My husband timed the waves, then raised his hand to say the words, then held my son as the wave went completely over the both of them... the witness fell over because he was facing the waves whereas my husband was facing sideways.

[Guest intra]

perfect love casts out fear. 

i think if anyone considers themselves or water to be greater than the Lord, they are not ready to become His disciple. 

Then Jesus said to his disciples,

"Whoever wants to be my disciple must deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me."
(Matthew 16:24) 

also, enjoy some refreshing chocolate milk . .