Treatment of Anti-Mormons on this Forum


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A recent visitor posted multiple questions that were obviously off of some Anti-Mormon website or literature.  The knee jerk reaction was "Oh Boy!   Here's another anti-Mormon troll."  I'll admit it.  I thought it too.  As a result many of our responses were less than Christ-Like.

 

What if we were wrong?  What if we were right?  Is this the right way to respond?

 

Maybe he is just a gruff person that treats everyone like that.

Maybe the written word is just not his medium.

Maybe he's just in a bad mood.

Maybe he is just in a hurry to get right to the point without all the political correctness.

Maybe the elevator just doesn't go up to the top floor.

Maybe ... a hundred other things.

 

What is the best way to respond?  Well, we have the ability to at least ask the first question that should be asked:  Why do you ask?  then -- Where did you hear that?.  Basically, we can get some background so we can first seek to understand, then seek to be understood.

 

Absent that, I believe we can learn a lesson from "Gramps".  In that link, I believe it was clear to all that this questioner was nothing but belligerent.  Yet the first sentence in his response is: You are undoubtedly sincere in your questioning.

 

What I witnessed in the recent "festivities" was a bashing session worthy of the media - provoked RNC cage match.  What did it accomplish?  It added fuel to his fire that All Mormons are just get defensive when you ask them "tough" questions.

 

I know.  I was a part of it too.  And I'm sorry I was.

 

I was even thinking that the first screen such questions should go through is to ask PC to address it first, then go from there.

 

Thoughts?

Edited by Guest
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Guest MormonGator

Disagree totally. LDS have a right to be irritated at antis. They (not naming names) usually think they are brighter, more wonderful and more Christian than us. I know, I was one of them once.  We as LDS have a right to be slightly irritated at their arrogance. I'm still surprised how nice and wonderful LDS people are, even at those whose sole purpose is to "debunk" their faith.  

 

Don't confuse "Good Christ centered life" with "I must turn the cheek all the time at antis" 

Even Christ Himself said there is a time to defend our faith. And sometimes you need to use forceful language, not just love and cuddles.  

Edited by MormonGator
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There should be no debate on this issue....The rules of this site are posted here  http://lds.net/forums/forum-5/announcement-1-ldsnet-rules-please-be-familiar-with-these-rules-before-posting/

 

Everyone that post here agreed to follow when they created an account (You might not have paid attention to it but you did)

 

The MODS have repeatedly asked/instructed/ORDERED people to report content they think might be questionable and then stay away and not otherwise engage.  Especially if for some reason you think that their violation some how justify your own breaking of the rules by attacking them.

 

Now it is possible to respond to an offensive poster in a loving and Christ-like manner.  If you can do so them by all means go ahead (that is within the rules and purposes of this site).  But most of us (I include myself) have a hard time with this and would be better off stepping away for a bit.

Edited by estradling75
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I think that generally speaking, it's possible to predict from the first couple of posts whether someone is "anti" or not with about a 60-70% rate of accuracy--even if they're trying to conceal it. 

 

But, the rub is in that other 40-30%.  So, what I try to do (and I admit, I often fail to live up to my own standards) is to treat them as sincere unless or until they betray themselves to be otherwise.  Because that 40-30% is exactly who we (as Mormons, and as a board run by the MGF) are trying to reach.

 

Given enough time, antis eventually drop the wide-eyed-innocent-questioner schtick.  Always.  And when that happens, I personally have no compunctions about (within the bounds of common decency and civility and the rules of this forum) proceeding to squish 'em.  :satan:  In the meantime, though--it doesn't cost me anything to play nice.

Edited by Just_A_Guy
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I think a lot of it comes down to giving people the benefit of the doubt until they prove otherwise.

 

Yes, you do have a right to be irritated by anti's and this forum is a safe place from that type of stuff.  But until someone prove themselves to be anti, let's treat them with kindness and respect.  And if they are being out of line, report it and our awesome mods will take care of it.

Edited by Jane_Doe
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Having a little bit of experience with antis, I see no antagonism from this individual.  None of of the questions were insulting, but more along the line "This is what I have heard, and I would like to see your side of the story."

 

If we do get a negative anti here on the forum, I try to follow the rule -->> "if you can't be nice, just ignore them", which sums up the rules of the forum.

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I'm all for being loving, but when someone first posts what should be an obvious troll, then posts something that is so flat out stupid that I'm wondering how were even smart enough to type it (and I'm sorry Vort, the "Leaves of Grass" one was dumber than the "Jesus and Satan are Brothers" question by several thousand orders of magnitude), I have no problem slapping that person down.   Christ wasn't exactly soft when it came to people obviously trying to lay a trap for him. That the trap was quite possibly the most incompetent one I've ever seen only invites more ridicule. 

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I'm all for being loving, but when someone first posts what should be an obvious troll, then posts something that is so flat out stupid that I'm wondering how were even smart enough to type it (and I'm sorry Vort, the "Leaves of Grass" one was dumber than the "Jesus and Satan are Brothers" question by several thousand orders of magnitude), I have no problem slapping that person down. Christ wasn't exactly soft when it came to people obviously trying to lay a trap for him. That the trap was quite possibly the most incompetent one I've ever seen only invites more ridicule.

We should never ridicule.

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One trait I noticed with the most recent postings was that the OP seldom engaged the responses.  I scanned some of the strings, and did not find anything over-the-top obnoxious.  There was some directness.  Then again, there was not too much engagement from the person bringing all these questions--other than to re-assert the innocence of the inquires.  To use a word I see here, but seldom use myself, my overall response to this latest episode is:  MEH.

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One trait I noticed with the most recent postings was that the OP seldom engaged the responses. I scanned some of the strings, and did not find anything over-the-top obnoxious. There was some directness. Then again, there was not too much engagement from the person bringing all these questions--other than to re-assert the innocence of the inquires. To use a word I see here, but seldom use myself, my overall response to this latest episode is: MEH.

This was my sense too. But then again, I often offend without knowing why (except I think I do know why...We're a generation of big babies). Still, for the most part, the answers seemed pretty civil. Agreed. MEH.

Edited by The Folk Prophet
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I had my first introduction to anti-Mormons while serving in the army. I also become acquainted again with anti-Mormons on my mission. I have had face to face interface with Rod Decker to the point of threatened law suits. What I have learned is that anti’s – at least all that I have encountered – seem to have aligned themselves heavily with Satan and his minions. And because of this alignment their main goal is not a discussion but to create contention and hatred. If they can tick you off – they will be most happy for it.

Sometimes I will challenge them – that if I can demonstrate that their information is flawed that they denounce their religion. I also explain that repentance is necessary for salvation.

There are times that someone will ask an anti kind of question even though they are not really anti. I have learned we do not have to be rude with anyone – I will make an effort to ask questions that indicate if a person has any desire to explore or learn anything – If they are of the mind to avoid learning but are convinced they have all the answers – then the only point in conversing with them is to make it more obvious to anyone paying attentions for the sidelines – that one thinking they have all the answers – really does not know much at all.

I have also learned that the thing most disappointing to a troll on the internet is a no response from anyone.

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Maybe he wanted to get a kick out of trolling some stupid Mormons.

Maybe you should follow your own advice and instead of making a public spectacle with your own accusatory post and report responses that you felt violated the rules of this site.

Remember of the things that Jesus would do, flipping over tables and brandishing a whip is within the realm of responses.

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For those who feel it perfectly acceptable to bash right back...  Please remember your host for here for LDS.net have made it very clear that they do not want you to do it here.

 

Look at it this way... The people who pay for this site are also working on SEO (Search Engine Optimization) trying to get it to rank high when people search for related terms.  When the Mod let anti questions (even if we aren't sure about the poster) through, its because we have a high degree of confidence that the members of this forum will have the question dismantled (not the questioner please) and all the flaws and error pointed out in short order.  If our SEO is good enough next time someone (anyone) googles that question that thread will pop up and that person will have the question and answer at their finger tips.  This is a good thing.

 

We would hope and ask that the member of this forum when answering are putting their best foot forward.  Not their cranky foot, not their irritated foot, not their annoyed foot  Because we hope an expect it to reach a much wider group then just who post here.

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I'm all for being loving, but when someone first posts what should be an obvious troll, then posts something that is so flat out stupid that I'm wondering how were even smart enough to type it (and I'm sorry Vort, the "Leaves of Grass" one was dumber than the "Jesus and Satan are Brothers" question by several thousand orders of magnitude), 

 

It was actually an apologist who put that on a web site as a joke -- Jeff Lindsay.  I posted the link.

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These forums have the potential to be a powerful missionary tool.  And we all have the power to make it that way.

 

I've been guilty myself in the past of questioning the sincerity of some posters.  I've made comments that I later regretted making.  These days I'm more inclined to give the questioner the benefit of the doubt.  The true colors eventually come out but I think giving the person a chance is the best approach at the beginning.

 

What I have grown to really dislike are the comments made by some here on the forums. To be more honest, it's the comments of a couple of people on these forums that always have a tendency to call the person out. Their comments are rude, unfriendly and just downright hateful.  And the fact that one of them is a convert themselves, just makes it more of a dislike for me.

 

I think we all need to be a little kinder.  A little friendlier towards those asking questions.  Watch what you are typing and put yourself on the other side of the comment.  How do you think one might react to your comment?  

 

If you think a comment is highly inappropriate then report it.  If you just don't like the conversation, pass it by. But let's try and lay off the hurtful and hateful comments that many are prone to do on this site.

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It's possible the people you are tagging as "anti-Mormon" are truly seeking the truth.

 

Here I go with another personal story.

A little scary after my first experience.

Hopefully it will be taken in the spirit offered.

 

I was brought to the Church by an anti-LDS crusader.

She was the wife of my husband's co-worker.

She was very friendly to me, and called one day and asked if I would host a meeting with some missionaries.

I said sure, sounded like fun, having no idea what she had planned.

I just thought some missionaries were coming to visit.

When the LDS missionaries showed up, I thought their talk was interesting.

And then she began attacking them.

I was mortified!

When they finally left, I told her I did not appreciate being used that way,

and I asked the missionaries back - to talk to ME.

 

I DID ask them a lot of these questions, because they were in the anti-LDS literature she had left,

and I wanted to know the answers. Some of these feel like serious questions when you're seeking.

It's scary to think you might be getting into what others are telling you is "a cult."

 

So just know, not all people who come here are looking for trouble.

Some really ARE looking for answers.

That's why I asked Byron if he wanted the missionaries to visit.

He didn't respond - but that doesn't mean anything either.

 

Just the mean spiritedness of some of the responses turned him away, according to his goodbye.

 

This does not feel like friendly group.

It feels more like a social clique with a few core members

and I quickly learned that you must not disagree with that core.

 

My feeling now is that I'll never be accepted on this forum.

I'll keep poking around for a while, though.

Some of the posts are interesting.

Maybe I'll find some kindred spirits here.

 

I do like Pam's advice about being kinder to new-comers.

I hope people read it and consider the message.

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